Opinion Mick Malthouse

[HARKER]

Reneging on the public statement that Mick will coach until end of season isn't a good look.

But keeping this charade going until round 23 would be unbearable. If Mick is gone, just get it over & done with so we can move on. Every week that we wait is just a wasted week.
Ange Postecoglou said recently - 1 gap year (wasted year) can take 3 years to recover from.
Prolonging this any longer is just causing more damage.

What does it say? I can't work it out.

Scenario 1: We win...............................then what?
Scenario 2: We lose in a tight one..........Let's give it a couple more weeks?
Scenario 3: We get flogged...................."Oh well, we had no choice and you members can see exactly why we're doing this"

It's weak whichever way you look at it.

I don't even feel sorry for Mick as I have to feel sorry for Trigg..............I'd love to hear his honest version of what he's being dragged through.

 

[lachie charm]

What does it say? I can't work it out.

Scenario 1: We win...............................then what?
Scenario 2: We lose in a tight one..........Let's give it a couple more weeks?
Scenario 3: We get flogged....................."Oh well, we had no choice and you members can see exactly why we're doing this"

It's weak whichever way you look at it.

I don't even feel sorry for Mick as I have to feel sorry for Trigg..............I'd love to hear his honest version oif what he's being dragged through

IMO (and I'm probably wrong) it says they regret making the statement.

It was a mistake to say so early that Mick will coach out the season no matter. That gave them no room to move no matter what transpired.

And as much as it's a bad look to publicly backflip - I just think getting rid of Mick ASAP (if he is indeed going to be sacked) is essential. As soon as Mick is identified as not the coach to coach 2016 - it's time to cut ties.

We need to look to the future. We need to have undertaken a proper process for a replacement & have a coach appointed in time for the trade period IMO.

 

[HARKER]

IMO (and I'm probably wrong) it says they regret making the statement.

It was a mistake to say so early that Mick will coach out the season no matter. That gave them no room to move no matter what transpired.

And as much as it's a bad look to publicly backflip - I just think getting rid of Mick ASAP (if he is indeed going to be sacked) is essential. As soon as Mick is identified as not the coach to coach 2016 - it's time to cut ties.

We need to look to the future. We need to have undertaken a proper process for a replacement & have a coach appointed in time for the trade period IMO.

Exactly and this is the point.............Mistake after mistake after mistake.

Maybe MLG should take out a Kings Parking franchaise.................."All care and no responsibility" Great motto

 

[gbatman]

The attack on the board is because all of them are somehow or another locked into various camps belonging to the rich benefactors or they are the rich benefactors (Jeanne Pratt... wasn't she supposed to be the vice president in change of memberships or something equally redundant???).

The board hires Mick Malthouse, and most of the board that did that job are still there, because Mathieson had some of his people tapping him up all season. There was no due diligence done on whether Malthouse was the one to take us forward. He was a quick fix because Mathieson wanted a premiership coach to take us the rest of the way... something that Mathieson said that Ratten couldnt do... despite the team of nobodies taking us to within a kick of a PF. Except that Mathieson was severely overrating the depth of talent available to the club and the fact that the club had been locking average players into 2 year contracts during that year which meant that we couldnt clear the list and get in a bunch of new players for Malthouse to start his tenure at the club with.

The next big thing was LoGuiduce going after the head of recruiting from Hawthorn... once again after a Mathieson rant in the paper... it suddenly pops that Carlton have tried to headhunt the Hawks guy. LoGuiduce tried to do an Elliott and get in a highly credentialed footballing person just before he took over as the president. So that when he took over the reins, he would have something to wave about to all the supporters.

The club hasnt embraced the modern era... the board and the rich benefactors are still stuck back in the 80s where we would win shit by throwing money at the best players around the country.

There lies an issue. Mathieson who is a bit of an outsider with influence. We've gotten rid of a few out of our recruiting department, basically the two heads and our senior coach over the last few seasons. Many on here are suggesting that these move were pushed from outsiders like Mathieson. It certainly looked that way. Firstly there were warning signs in around 2010, this was obvious, despite us being reasonable on field, and us as supporters being very satisfied with this after the last 10 years, alarm bells should have been ringing around this period in regards to our drafting. Our strategy in regards to bringing players to our list and trading was also an issue. Our direction and strategy to build a team seemed ok because we seemed to be improving but we weren't. Why did Mathieson have to step in when he did? It was too late then, we already had 3 or 4 years of horrendous drafting and trading behind us by 2012 we we're already ruined without really knowing it and now look at us.

Would Mathieson have stepped in if things were being ran right? Getting a coach to take you to greatness, never works, you need the players and we never got there in that regards. There are incompetence being shown from both sides here. Our previous board who were slow to identify list management and drafting issues and allowing a person like Mathieson to force decisions.

If we sack Malthouse it better be because we have someone good lined up.

NOT because of fan/media pressure. Not from results (because again we are deluded and over rate our list) and not from outside pressure.

Coach isn't the problem. With SOS in that position we have more security with choosing a new coach you would think.

Anyway I think Mathieson was on the right track. People on here don't like him, that doesn't mean what he did or the decisions he forced were wrong. IMO he was absolutely right but it was really all too late to make a difference. The damage was already done at Carlton 5 years ago and has continued to an extent.

 

[Dramoth]

Facts are Mick was brought into the the club to get a flag with the list. He said he could do it. The club paid him huge money to do it and for whatever reasons he failed
Miserably. Whether or not it's his fault he accepted a job with a huge price tag and hasn't completed it.

Just for the people in the back row who might not understand what happened when Carlton appointed Malthouse.

Malthouse was approached by agents of Bruce Mathieson to sound him out on taking over Carlton early in the 2012 season. They were telling him that the side that was currently under-performing was only an experienced premiership coach away from the top 4 and competing for premierships.

Mick allowed himself to be convinced that was actually the current state of play at the club and signed on.

When he arrived at the club, he found that players that were barely VFL standard let alone AFL standard had been given 2 year contracts instead of being allowed to run down their contracts so that he could clean out a lot of the deadwood at the club right from the get go.

Once he got to training with the club, he saw that he had been lied to but by that stage his ego had taken over and he was committed to trying to achieve what the powerbrokers who got him appointed wanted... a premiership. So when his first clean chance to clean out the deadwood arrived, he started delisting all the VFL quality players on our list and started trying to get in experienced players to replace them.

And now... after 2.5 years, the powerbrokers have realised that the list was shit and that they are wasting money on Malthouse... so they are going to waste yet another chunk of the clubs money to get rid of him.

Now... I hope that helps and that whatever issues you have come good and you can actually think properly for a change.

 

[1981]

Didn't MLG say initially second had of the year? Think he said this before saying end of year?
So R11 is second half of the year right?

The bye is just an excuse.

Two weeks or whatever it is means either sorting sheet out or someone has been given time to make a decision, and I suspect the club has already made their decision.

 

[BM123]

[QUOTE="lachie charm, post: 38742881, member: 159870"]Reneging on the public statement that Mick will coach until end of season isn't a good look.

But keeping this charade going until round 23 would be unbearable. If Mick is gone, just get it over & done with so we can move on. Every week that we wait is just a wasted week.

Ange Postecoglou said recently - 1 gap year (wasted year) can take 3 years to recover from.

Prolonging this any longer is just causing more damage.[/QUOTE]

We are 18th on the ladder with a 1-7 record.

Exceptional circumstances considering our mild optimism before the season started.

 

[ODNBlue]

I think everything started going wrong when that advertising genius came up with...

"Can you smell what the Blues are cooking?"

We can smell it alright.

 

[Dramoth]

Anyway I think Mathieson was on the right track. People on here don't like him, that doesn't mean what he did or the decisions he forced were wrong. IMO he was absolutely right but it was really all too late to make a difference. The damage was already done at Carlton 5 years ago and has continued to an extent.

No no no no no... Mathieson is the problem! What he did 3 years was wrong when he was agitating for Malthouse to come in and he had had his people already talking Malthouse halfway through the season when our injury problems had really started to crank up.

He had his numbers on the board for the sacking of a coach and a bunch of assistant coaches with all the payout money coming from the club. He has put the club under financial pressure... but he doesnt care about the club... he cares more about the ego rush of being a "mover and shaker" at Carlton. If he really cared about the club, he wouldnt have forced the board to sack Ratts and have the club payout 3 million in severance packages.

 

[Broadside]

Its important for the image of our club that Mick leaves with some semblance of his standing in the game left in good stead. He shouldn't be discarded casually like a banana peel.

I never discard my banana peels casually but I can't speak for others.

 

[Paulski19]

Facts are Mick was brought into the the club to get a flag with the list. He said he could do it. The club paid him huge money to do it and for whatever reasons he failed
Miserably. Whether or not it's his fault he accepted a job with a huge price tag and hasn't completed it.

No one could have completed it. He came in with an outsider perspective and was told the list would be able to go top 4 by people inside the club. It didn't take him long to publicily change his tune

 

[BM123]

Just for the people in the back row who might not understand what happened when Carlton appointed Malthouse.

Malthouse was approached by agents of Bruce Mathieson to sound him out on taking over Carlton early in the 2012 season. They were telling him that the side that was currently under-performing was only an experienced premiership coach away from the top 4 and competing for premierships.

Mick allowed himself to be convinced that was actually the current state of play at the club and signed on.

When he arrived at the club, he found that players that were barely VFL standard let alone AFL standard had been given 2 year contracts instead of being allowed to run down their contracts so that he could clean out a lot of the deadwood at the club right from the get go.

Once he got to training with the club, he saw that he had been lied to but by that stage his ego had taken over and he was committed to trying to achieve what the powerbrokers who got him appointed wanted... a premiership. So when his first clean chance to clean out the deadwood arrived, he started delisting all the VFL quality players on our list and started trying to get in experienced players to replace them.

And now... after 2.5 years, the powerbrokers have realised that the list was shit and that they are wasting money on Malthouse... so they are going to waste yet another chunk of the clubs money to get rid of him.

Now... I hope that helps and that whatever issues you have come good and you can actually think properly for a change.

Ratten had this list performing well enough before 2012's horrid injuries. Unfortunately MM was compromised by his mistaken belief that his old gameplan was still viable. He has changed the list to suit his gameplan instead of the other way and we are only getting worse.

MM inherited a strong running side with great scoring potential and decent KPD's, rucks in 2013. He took that team and forced them to play slow boundary line football and 1 on 1 football. The only time Carlton has looked decent is when we have discarded MM's gameplan for corridor football.

 

[HBF]

Yes it does HBF and maybe some clarity will come out of the Mad Max dust-storm, but one does have reason to be skeptical.

It's a shame that we're again having to be invested in the politics as opposed to what really counts......................the game.

Let's lose if we're not good enough. No problem..............but not at the expense of ******* with everyone's head. It doesn't work that way.

I've changed my mind that many times on this situation I really can't decide one way or another now.
I don't think Mick should coach next year, but I don't particularly think sacking him mid year is good for anyone.

Help.........

 

[HARKER]

I've changed my mind that many times on this situation I really can't decide one way or another now.
I don't think Mick should coach next year, but I don't particularly think sacking him mid year is good for anyone.

Help.........

Mick has to go. That ship has sailed and the bigger question is............................what's next?

Just throwing up the names of possible coaches is pointless unless we have s system that adopts a common goal and mutual growth..................Can the Carlton football Club be party to such a method? ................. ??? .................... ?????

 

[BluesRule]

There lies an issue. Mathieson who is a bit of an outsider with influence. We've gotten rid of a few out of our recruiting department, basically the two heads and our senior coach over the last few seasons. Many on here are suggesting that these move were pushed from outsiders like Mathieson. It certainly looked that way. Firstly there were warning signs in around 2010, this was obvious, despite us being reasonable on field, and us as supporters being very satisfied with this after the last 10 years, alarm bells should have been ringing around this period in regards to our drafting. Our strategy in regards to bringing players to our list and trading was also an issue. Our direction and strategy to build a team seemed ok because we seemed to be improving but we weren't. Why did Mathieson have to step in when he did? It was too late then, we already had 3 or 4 years of horrendous drafting and trading behind us by 2012 we we're already ruined without really knowing it and now look at us.

Would Mathieson have stepped in if things were being ran right? Getting a coach to take you to greatness, never works, you need the players and we never got there in that regards. There are incompetence being shown from both sides here. Our previous board who were slow to identify list management and drafting issues and allowing a person like Mathieson to force decisions.

If we sack Malthouse it better be because we have someone good lined up.

NOT because of fan/media pressure. Not from results (because again we are deluded and over rate our list) and not from outside pressure.

Coach isn't the problem. With SOS in that position we have more security with choosing a new coach you would think.

Anyway I think Mathieson was on the right track. People on here don't like him, that doesn't mean what he did or the decisions he forced were wrong. IMO he was absolutely right but it was really all too late to make a difference. The damage was already done at Carlton 5 years ago and has continued to an extent.

This is exactly the process that failed last time. The faceless men organised MM and got rid of Ratten without considering all available options. We really need a proper process now and we must find the best possible coach for Carlton. And we must not get it wrong. Hence make it public take some time and lets get the best one possible.

 

[DaVillaBlues]

Mick has to go. That ship has sailed and the bigger question is............................what's next?

Just throwing up the names of possible coaches is pointless unless we have s system that adopts a common goal and mutual growth..................Can the Carlton football Club be party to such a method? ................. ??? .................... ?????

Frankly its much more important to fix our recruiting dept then our next coach, the next gaffer really hasn't got much to work with, does he ??

 

[Broadside]

This is exactly the process that failed last time. The faceless men organised MM and got rid of Ratten without considering all available options. We really need a proper process now and we must find the best possible coach for Carlton. And we must not get it wrong. Hence make it public take some time and lets get the best one possible.

if they get it wrong this time and we fail another 5 years we could be in serious strife as a going concern. Arguably one of the biggest decisions in a hundred years.

 

[chipzac]

I've changed my mind that many times on this situation I really can't decide one way or another now.
I don't think Mick should coach next year, but I don't particularly think sacking him mid year is good for anyone.

Help.........

How about creating a new position for him then? ... like a very passive (and silent) director of coaching. He might have already turned a job like that down, but he may have had a change of heart

 

[AndyLucimitis]

Ratten had this list performing well enough before 2012's horrid injuries. Unfortunately MM was compromised by his mistaken belief that his old gameplan was still viable. He has changed the list to suit his gameplan instead of the other way and we are only getting worse.

MM inherited a strong running side with great scoring potential and decent KPD's, rucks in 2013. He took that team and forced them to play slow boundary line football and 1 on 1 football. The only time Carlton has looked decent is when we have discarded MM's gameplan for corridor football.

This is ridiculous. The opportunity to coach at senior level is something that comes along rarely. I would think any of the young candidates would queue up to coach Carlton.

Correct - they will more than likely have 4 top 20 picks to work with as well given most of the rumours.

 

[passmark]

Just for the people in the back row who might not understand what happened when Carlton appointed Malthouse.

Malthouse was approached by agents of Bruce Mathieson to sound him out on taking over Carlton early in the 2012 season. They were telling him that the side that was currently under-performing was only an experienced premiership coach away from the top 4 and competing for premierships.

Mick allowed himself to be convinced that was actually the current state of play at the club and signed on.

When he arrived at the club, he found that players that were barely VFL standard let alone AFL standard had been given 2 year contracts instead of being allowed to run down their contracts so that he could clean out a lot of the deadwood at the club right from the get go.

Once he got to training with the club, he saw that he had been lied to but by that stage his ego had taken over and he was committed to trying to achieve what the powerbrokers who got him appointed wanted... a premiership. So when his first clean chance to clean out the deadwood arrived, he started delisting all the VFL quality players on our list and started trying to get in experienced players to replace them.

And now... after 2.5 years, the powerbrokers have realised that the list was shit and that they are wasting money on Malthouse... so they are going to waste yet another chunk of the clubs money to get rid of him.

Now... I hope that helps and that whatever issues you have come good and you can actually think properly for a change.

You're telling me MM signed on not knowing anything about the list?

Seriously? He hadn't even spent a year out of the game.

I'd say it's most likely that a lot about the approach is true, but MM just saw what he wanted to see. Collingwoods arch rival and truck load of cash.

It appealed to his ego. He then decided to go on a book tour instead of getting to know the list and making a game plan that worked.

He's been an abject failure.

 

[The_Wookie]

Ratten had this list performing well enough before 2012's horrid injuries. Unfortunately MM was compromised by his mistaken belief that his old gameplan was still viable. He has changed the list to suit his gameplan instead of the other way and we are only getting worse.

MM inherited a strong running side with great scoring potential and decent KPD's, rucks in 2013. He took that team and forced them to play slow boundary line football and 1 on 1 football. The only time Carlton has looked decent is when we have discarded MM's gameplan for corridor football.

So very much this.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

No one could have completed it. He came in with an outsider perspective and was told the list would be able to go top 4 by people inside the club. It didn't take him long to publicily change his tune

If Malthouse spent years coaching against some of our players, and a year watching Carlton games in the media ... and so many BF experts say they knew we were crap even when we were playing finals, then it's a pretty poor reflection on Mick that he took his cues from people at the club as to what sort of list we had.

When Carlton were looking to replace Jesaulenko at the end of 1990, they spoke to a few coaches. The general theme from them was that we were an underperforming finals side. They interviewed David Parkin for his second stint at the club after 2 years away from coaching. He told them the list was bad and just getting worse. He got the job.

And yeah, it took way too long for Mick to publicly change his tune. No matter which way you slice it, Thomas came to Carlton to top up for a finals campaign.

 

[HBF]

How about creating a new position for him then? ... like a very passive (and silent) director of coaching. He might have already turned a job like that down, but he may have had a change of heart

Not so sure about this. Suspect he'd either want to be head coach or nothing.
Reading between the lines I dare say we're going to overhaul the entire coaching panel.

 

[MrsEddieBetts]

Perhaps he shouldn't have taken a job in the middle of a book tour so he could have fully committed to the role...

 

[BluesRule]

No no no no no... Mathieson is the problem! What he did 3 years was wrong when he was agitating for Malthouse to come in and he had had his people already talking Malthouse halfway through the season when our injury problems had really started to crank up.

He had his numbers on the board for the sacking of a coach and a bunch of assistant coaches with all the payout money coming from the club. He has put the club under financial pressure... but he doesnt care about the club... he cares more about the ego rush of being a "mover and shaker" at Carlton. If he really cared about the club, he wouldnt have forced the board to sack Ratts and have the club payout 3 million in severance packages.

And he would put enough $ into the club so the financial pressure on the club could ease. CFC's dependence on these people and need for the $ means we make bad decisions too often to please them IMO.