Mobile TV Coverage - Optus Won

[IanW]

Its also the precedent it sets for streaming near-live feeds over the wired internet, not just wireless.

 

[Furn]

I've got a mobile with Optus and I can barely make a phone call. LOL at live tv.

I'm with Vodafone and I can be somewhere where I can't make a call or load a web page but I can get the live cricket and it's perfect. Not sure how that works.

Could be the same with Optus.

 

[Dry Rot]

From the link...

Optus TV Now allows you to record and watch later free to air TV shows on either your mobile or your PC

So presumably 5 of the 9 games each round aren't affected by this at all.

And the other 4 games will be live on the nearest flat screen TV anyway.

Is it really such a big deal?

Agreed.

Let's take a FTA game. Currently you can watch it in real time on your TV or TV enabled PC or record/tape or whatever it and watch it later on your TV or PC or stream it wirelessly to a notebook or tablet or phone in your home.

With OptusNow, you can watch it in real time on your TV or TV enabled PC or upload/record/tape or whatever it up in the cloud and watch it later on your TV or PC at home or notebook or tablet or phone anywhere.

Can't see why this should affect the status quo in a big way.

 

[jim boy]

It does put into perspective the comments by Brian Cook the other day when he pointed out that after the current tv deal was over, the landscape would change and with change comes disruption. It turns out he was wrong, the landscape has started to change before the new deal has even commenced.

 

[Tas]

It does put into perspective the comments by Brian Cook the other day when he pointed out that after the current tv deal was over, the landscape would change and with change comes disruption. It turns out he was wrong, the landscape has started to change before the new deal has even commenced.

The sky is falling!

Nothing is going to change in a negative manner, Cook will be proven to be wrong in time like Costa was when he was bleating years before him.

People who are footy mad are going to want access to all the games, who is going to go to Optus' shitty network to get just the FTA games delayed and have them constantly dropping out during the streaming.

 

[scottwade]

Let's take a FTA game. Currently you can watch it in real time on your TV or TV enabled PC or record/tape or whatever it and watch it later on your TV or PC or stream it wirelessly to a notebook or tablet or phone in your home.

With OptusNow, you can watch it in real time on your TV or TV enabled PC or upload/record/tape or whatever it up in the cloud and watch it later on your TV or PC at home or notebook or tablet or phone anywhere.

Can't see why this should affect the status quo in a big way.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/live-sport-win-for-optus/story-e6frf9jf-1226259694084

The verdict comes as a huge blow to the nation's top sporting codes, with the decision making Telstra's $153 million "exclusive mobile" deal with the AFL virtually worthless.

It may not affect how people watch a game, but it certainly has financial implications regarding the status quo.

Now obviously it doesn't make the rights to all games "worthless", but it does impact on the exclusivity for Telstra and it would be reasonable to assume that if this judgement stands, Telstra would want to re-negotiate the contract.

 

[Stewies Power]

The AFL will win this case once it's appealed. The AFL always wins

 

[Rod Stroker]

Its also the precedent it sets for streaming near-live feeds over the wired internet, not just wireless.

How? It's being streamed over the internet, why would the access network - fixed or wireless - make any difference?

 

[Dry Rot]

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/live-sport-win-for-optus/story-e6frf9jf-1226259694084


It may not affect how people watch a game, but it certainly has financial implications regarding the status quo.

Now obviously it doesn't make the rights to all games "worthless", but it does impact on the exclusivity for Telstra and it would be reasonable to assume that if this judgement stands, Telstra would want to re-negotiate the contract.

But how does it really impact on Telstra's exclusivity?

An Optus customer could record a FTA game last season and watch it when they want and how they want in their home. If they didn't record it, they couldn't watch it subsequently.

That hasn't changed now. All that has changed is a bit more flexibility re how the Optus can watch what they have taped. Either way, they wouldn't watch that game on Telsta BigPond.

 

[scottwade]

But how does it really impact on Telstra's exclusivity?

An Optus customer could record a FTA game last season and watch it when they want and how they want in their home. If they didn't record it, they couldn't watch it subsequently.

That hasn't changed now. All that has changed is a bit more flexibility re how the Optus can watch what they have taped. Either way, they wouldn't watch that game on Telsta BigPond.

This has to do with mobile phone viewing.

Optus TV live;
http://www.optus.com.au/home/digital-life/tv-now/

Record and watch TV on your phone.
With TV now, you can record and watch TV on your Optus 3G compatible phone and enjoy the convenience of your favourite shows when you're on the go.

Telstra paid for exclusive mobile phone rights.

Under this judgement Optus customers will now have access to the FTA broadcasts on their phone. They did not have this previously.

 

[jim boy]

How? It's being streamed over the internet, why would the access network - fixed or wireless - make any difference?

I think he was making the point that consumer internet at home would be included.

It lays the legal foundation for broadcasts such as those found on Justin TV to be legitimised with just a bit of tweaking. It means that as long as the game you want to watch is on tv somewhere on free tv, then it can be rebroadcast with no benefit being passed on to the clubs or afl. This affects not only Telstra, but Foxtel as well, as the number of matches that are exclusive to Foxtel dwindle.

 

[scottwade]

This affects not only Telstra, but Foxtel as well, as the number of matches that are exclusive to Foxtel dwindle.

Why would the number of exclusive games on Foxtel dwindle?

I would have thought that only the anti-siphoning laws are keeping any games on FTA TV.

The major competition I see going forward for Foxtel is streaming on the NBN, but new entrants would need very deep pockets to challenge Foxtel.

 

[Tas]

This has to do with mobile phone viewing.

Optus TV live;
http://www.optus.com.au/home/digital-life/tv-now/


Telstra paid for exclusive mobile phone rights.

Under this judgement Optus customers will now have access to the FTA broadcasts on their phone. They did not have this previously.

Telstra HAS exclusive mobile phone broadcasting rights.

Optus' TV Now just allows people to record and play back free to air television. It is a generic service. Optus is not broadcasting AFL football.

It is like saying you have exclusive rights on the freaking internet, people have ways around it, both legally and illegally. Question is how many people can be arsed to go to that effort just for FTA games which will be on TV anyway and who in their right mind would want to be on Optus' network.

Telstra should utilise the football and offer the service relatively cheaply to get people to switch from other carriers to Telstra, if they use their rights properly it will still be a significant boon for them, if they plan to flog it off as an expensive addition then Optus is the least of their worries.

 

[scottwade]

Telstra HAS exclusive mobile phone broadcasting rights.

Optus' TV Now just allows people to record and play back free to air television. It is a generic service. Optus is not broadcasting AFL football.

Why would Telstra pay $153 million for mobile phone exclusivity, when the same product (at least in regard to AFL FTA games) is available to Optus, without Optus paying anything?

 

[Tas]

Why would Telstra pay $153 million for mobile phone exclusivity, when the same product (at least in regard to AFL FTA games) is available to Optus, without Optus paying anything?

It is not available to Optus and Optus is not charging their customers for access to football. TV Now is just a limited recording and playback of FTA content service. If you don't understand the difference then this discussion is pointless.

Telstra is live, it is access to every game and other content. They are also meant to incorporate a more interactive element, allowing you to access statistics and other shit you do not get from a usual broadcast.

Telstra and the AFL have made this into a big deal because they want to be the Gestapo and control what everyone does and thinks. They are getting what they are paying for, the fact some people on a shitty network can pay $10 a month to record 20 hours of FTA and replay it should have no real impact on their market if they do not manage to **** it up.

All this has been is very expensive free promotional work for Optus and TV Now.

 

[compass]

The judge: Free to air means FREE to air.

The media: Landmark case! The sky is falling! It's the end of the world as we know it!

 

[Rod Stroker]

The judge: Free to air means FREE to air.

Not with Optus though - the TVNow service is not free, so you still need to pay to watch free to air television. It's also capped at 20 hours/mth so the most you'd be able to watch is 20 divided by 2.5hrs/game = 8 games per month, and with 4 games on FTA per week that would be 2 weeks worth of games.

And LOL at Vodafail now considering to offer a similar service! The speed would be like trying to get a basketball through a garden hose!

 

[stmookeyj]

Why would the number of exclusive games on Foxtel dwindle?

I would have thought that only the anti-siphoning laws are keeping any games on FTA TV.

The major competition I see going forward for Foxtel is streaming on the NBN, but new entrants would need very deep pockets to challenge Foxtel.

Games involving Qld, NSW, SA and WA clubs are broadcast on FTA (including multichannels) for those states, so Optus could just tap into Channel 7 in those caps to record their content.

 

[seanoff]

i think the judge is wrong here.

Optus are charging for a carriage service to broadcast the recording to members of the public. this makes it illegal as far as i can recall.

 

[scottwade]

Games involving Qld, NSW, SA and WA clubs are broadcast on FTA (including multichannels) for those states, so Optus could just tap into Channel 7 in those caps to record their content.

Good point.

I'll admit I was thinking in the context of Foxtel 'losing' games rather than games being simulcast.

 

[Perry Pie]

It is not available to Optus and Optus is not charging their customers for access to football. TV Now is just a limited recording and playback of FTA content service. If you don't understand the difference then this discussion is pointless.

Telstra is live, it is access to every game and other content. They are also meant to incorporate a more interactive element, allowing you to access statistics and other shit you do not get from a usual broadcast.

Telstra and the AFL have made this into a big deal because they want to be the Gestapo and control what everyone does and thinks. They are getting what they are paying for, the fact some people on a shitty network can pay $10 a month to record 20 hours of FTA and replay it should have no real impact on their market if they do not manage to **** it up.

All this has been is very expensive free promotional work for Optus and TV Now.

Two mins delay is near as damn it live. It destroys the value of the product Telstra has bought from the AFL. If you don't understand that then discussion with you is pointless.

$150m over 5 years translates to a little less than $1m per club per year - your club needs that money (and so do many others).

It also creates a precident for the TV rights if they are "stored and played back" - Free TV replays on the internet for everyone! Yippeeee! Shame the clubs will be broke.

The content belongs to the Clubs (via the AFL), it should not be given free to a company for their own benefit.

If the law does not protect the clubs it is wrong and needs to be changed. This will totally knacker sports rights for all sports in Australia.

 

[dan warna]

i think its pretty disappointing, one company is paying for or subsidising the cameras, the staff, infrastructure, the other company is just scumming off the feed.

Pretty weak by Optus, but then again its all about profits.

I think the only thing they can do is start ripping of Optus feeds maybe like the tennis.

I wonder how much the value of the Australian open would devalue of Telstra ripped off the tennis and the Golf?

That would be great eh? watch the australian open on a 1 minute delay for free after optus pumped in a couple of million for the sponsorship rights?

as for FTA, it still makes money through advertising.

SO basically optus gets money from advertising for just running a router and rebroadcasting service, would like to see Tennis Australia get told their exclusive contract with ch7 and optus isn't worth anything, and you can watch the tennis with NO optus advertising (ok, you'll have to deal with telstra advertising).

or ch9 being told their deal with vodaphone and bupa is rubbish because ch10 is now rebroadcasting the cricket with a 1minute delay (worth it to get rid of slats and heals, would miss benaud and lawry though). Throw in the fact you'd probably have to put up with Dodo commercials.

Open the doors and let optus suffer the consequences of their actions.

 

[pazza]

Financially, this poses big problems for the AFL down the track.

Effectively, Telstra may now choose not to pay the full amount of trhe Internet/Mobile rights package as part of the broadcast rights. That could leave the aFL short of funding fro the sale of the rights, which could in turn affect the CBA with the AFLPA.

This thing is far from over.

 

[IanW]

I think he was making the point that consumer internet at home would be included.

It lays the legal foundation for broadcasts such as those found on Justin TV to be legitimised with just a bit of tweaking. It means that as long as the game you want to watch is on tv somewhere on free tv, then it can be rebroadcast with no benefit being passed on to the clubs or afl. This affects not only Telstra, but Foxtel as well, as the number of matches that are exclusive to Foxtel dwindle.

Yup. You know that 'Free Streams are Banned' thread ... once some website or other does the neccessary legals, those streams of FTA games will be legal.

For long-suffering fans outside their code's state, this decisions potentially frees them from the shackles of broadcast schedulers.

Now, as far as whether this will be upheld, note that Telstra et al had costs awarded against them. This meant the judge awarded a big win to Optus - not them sneaking over the line, but a solid, eight to ten goal victory.

Right now, Telstra's $154m has paid for a two minute head start, and note it would be possible for re-broadcasters to add their own value - for example, their own stats tracking service, live Dreamteam points on a tab or an alternate audio track with radio commentary.

This decision is big, and is going to require some tough decisions regarding the interaction of the anti-siphoning list, pay TV, the copyright act and the interests of the players, the clubs and the leagues.

My feeling is that Parliament wont be particularily sympathetic, as "so the voters get to see more footy, and voters like footy" is a powerful argument.

 

[Perry Pie]

...............

Right now, Telstra's $154m has paid for a two minute head start, and note it would be possible for re-broadcasters to add their own value - for example, their own stats tracking service, live Dreamteam points on a tab or an alternate audio track with radio commentary.

This decision is big, and is going to require some tough decisions regarding the interaction of the anti-siphoning list, pay TV, the copyright act and the interests of the players, the clubs and the leagues.

My feeling is that Parliament wont be particularily sympathetic, as "so the voters get to see more footy, and voters like footy" is a powerful argument.

Could be the end of free to air if this get ugly.
If the only way to protect revenue for the game is to put it all behind a pay for view wall then that is what may happen. When a poli gets a choice between a blackout of all major sports (NRL and AFL) because free to view is unsellable and protecting rights holders a bit, they may take the view that a time shift as Optus propose is little different from illegal streaming.

I cant see this sticking - within days every sport will start to lobby on this.