Oppo Camp Non-Essendon Football Thread XVII

[Agronomus]

North (and previous rabble sides) having to pay 95% of the cap no matter how s**t / inexperienced their list is means they have no choice but to overpay the spuds on their list to get there.

It happened at Gold Coast, Melbourne, Carlton and now North.

Lowering the floor means they don't have to overpay players in order to meet the cap floor, and can (in theory) have more room to throw a genuine godfather offer at a star FA.

This year the cap is ~ $15.79m

So North have to pay $15.0m whilst a team like Geelong, Collingwood or Brisbane with a mature list who should be genuine GF chances are paying only $790k more.

The AFL average wage is ~$450k so North have like 1.5 AFL players less payment despite having complete trash on their list.

Lowering the floor means you pay the spuds the spud wages they deserve and can save that $1.5m (or more if you went to say 85% floor) to offer a genuine star $2m a season, or a couple of good players $1m a year.

Didn't they offer Dusty and a few others godfather deals and they were all knocked back? Do they still even belong in the AFL?

 

[fairbump_playon]

Nice, a few years ago I was in Pasadena ticking off a college football game at the Rose Bowl from my bucket list ... unfortunately I had eaten too many tacos that day and I s**t myself walking through the never ending car park and we had to leave

Underpants Derby

 

[yodellinhank]

Small domestic sport versus giant powerhouse just before the olympics with Russia already banned.

WADA don’t have the interest in pursuing this IMO

Not just about the sport/country/league you play in. Nathan Bock said he took the banned substance CJC-1295 and they turned around and said "you can't prove that". Mark McVeigh said he took IV Vitamins and Melatonin, they said "no you didn't" and that the Melatonin was Bad Thymosin; because he didn't experience the side effects Hird did when he took Melanotan (under the understanding it was Melatonin). Guess there's just not enough strands in a confession.

 

[yodellinhank]

I'm sure I said at the time that we should appeal based on 'insufficient force' and was shouted down with claims that that defence doesn't exist.

Can we please change the law firm that has done absolutely nothing for this club since time immemorial?

Redman's wasn't even a strike, it was a push.

 

[jannissary]

for those confused about the toby greene

4

Toby Greene

Age

31

Ht

182cm

Wt

85kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

22.7

5star

K

12.5

5star

HB

10.2

5star

M

4.8

5star

T

3.0

5star

G

1.2

4star

D

17.5

4star

K

9.5

4star

HB

8.0

4star

M

4.8

4star

T

1.0

2star

G

2.3

5star

D

26.6

5star

K

12.4

5star

HB

14.2

5star

M

4.8

5star

T

3.6

5star

G

0.0

1star

case, it's simple.

GWS is a premiership favourite

we're not, no point in running interference for a team that doesn't matter, call me a cynic but that's how it'll be til the end of time, no one at AFL house can be impartial, all that matters is money

 

[sameolds33]

When does "courage" and "bravery" become reckless behaviour? I think the AFL and the commentators should stop characterising reckless behaviour as bravery.

 

[Old man fletch]

Yeh I agree with that, should be able to pay 70-80% some years if you want and be able to bank it. At the same time smart teams would front end a lot instead of over paying players that don’t deserve the money

Think that's a good option instead of priority draft picks.

If you're deemed to be struggling, you can pay 5/10% less in the next year or 2. If this is too difficult due to the pre existing nature of contracts, the AFL could add an extra 5-10% on your salary cap for a following year to attract a mature player or players. This would have a more immediate impact, and I'd suspect more effective than giving a pick that ends up leaving in a few years because the club is still a basket case

 

[TheGreatBarryB]

What a farce and a joke..

 

[P Money]

What a farce and a joke..

View attachment 1968597

One thing I'll say - you can't really blame the tribunal for not letting Redman off on the same evidence when our brilliant lawyers didn't think of contesting the MRO decision at the tribunal with that very same (and pretty flipping obvious) argument.

 

[jmoo wan]

so it seems at the tribunal that actually putting up a defence might be the way to go in future? who'd have thought?

 

[fairbump_playon]

so it seems at the tribunal that actually putting up a defence might be the way to go in future? who'd have thought?

Revolutionary. Feels like Essendon is still in good citizen mode on the off chance they can still dock us more draft picks

 

[Yoda_]

Unpopular opinion but Hogan should have copped a fine ($5,000), Lewis Young

33

Lewis Young

Age

26

Ht

202cm

Wt

99kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

11.6

3star

K

7.5

3star

HB

4.1

3star

M

4.4

4star

T

1.6

4star

MG

197.9

3star

D

4.0

1star

K

3.0

1star

HB

1.0

1star

M

3.0

3star

T

0.0

1star

MG

26.0

1star

D

14.4

4star

K

8.2

4star

HB

6.2

4star

M

6.4

5star

T

2.0

4star

MG

181.6

3star

should have copped something as well ($1,500) for being a rite twat in the situation



The Greene incident? Well, if its not even close to the Wright suspension then the AFL is not fooling me by playing off the result and not the action

 

[Zach Package]

Didn't they offer Dusty and a few others godfather deals and they were all knocked back? Do they still even belong in the AFL?

Imagine how bad they would look if Gaff took them up on their godfather offer.

He would still have a couple years to go on a million dollar plus a year deal and he would be playing VFL.

 

[KnaveyBlue]

The Greene incident? Well, if its not even close to the Wright suspension then the AFL is not fooling me by playing off the result and not the action

I’d be absolutely filthy if I was Wright. Greene actually went past the ball and let it bounce off his shoulder before making high contact. GWS fans saying it’s the Toby Greene tax are absolutely delusional.

 

[EnolaGay]

agreed

Free agency was meant to equalise the competition. Hardly working. in fact, imho, making the higher end FAs wider than before

FA was more the AFLPA pushing for player freedom and $, than equalisation, wasn’t it?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[eth-dog]

I’d be absolutely filthy if I was Wright. Greene actually went past the ball and let it bounce off his shoulder before making high contact. GWS fans saying it’s the Toby Greene tax are absolutely delusional.

The ball literally hits him on the way through. There is a bit of the Toby tax there but neither should have missed any games but both are.

 

[MiguelM]

I’d be absolutely filthy if I was Wright. Greene actually went past the ball and let it bounce off his shoulder before making high contact. GWS fans saying it’s the Toby Greene tax are absolutely delusional.

Both incidents on par but AFL will shit the bed whenever the outcome is concussion. That is the problem with outcome penalties.

TBH, I think both could be 2 weeks. Remember at the time some commentators were were wanting 6 for Wright! It is a lottery. Hell, you get 3 weeks for calling someone a name which is massive overkill.

The one I am more annoyed about is Cameron getting off. Opened up a can of worms. The AFL are good at that.

 

[Vindicater]

The AFL need to dismantle the tribunal. It has actively become a joke now.

 

[Nifft]

‘World’s gone mad’: Greats fume as AFL declares ‘end of skinfold testing’ for draftees

‘World’s gone mad’: Greats fume over AFL’s shock testing decision for draftees

www.foxsports.com.au

 

[eth-dog]

‘World’s gone mad’: Greats fume as AFL declares ‘end of skinfold testing’ for draftees

‘World’s gone mad’: Greats fume over AFL’s shock testing decision for draftees

www.foxsports.com.au

So who cares? The clubs will still be able to get the data.

 

[Nifft]

So who cares? The clubs will still be able to get the data.

That was my thought, that the clubs would still find a way to get the measurements.

 

[eth-dog]

That was my thought, that the clubs would still find a way to get the measurements.

Only the AFL or junior clubs (Sandy, Oakleigh etc) sports scientists and doctors will be allowed to test them for skinfolds.

They will be able to ask those places to get them. Storm in a teacup

 

[faible]

If you're able to physically assess the player does skinfolds actually tell you a lot?

It's not that hard to tell if a draftee is fairly lean or carrying some extra weight. You don't want young athletes focusing (too) much on weight and ending up with an eating disorder or underfueling for training - which has been a massive problem in athletics, particularly for women - in order to be 'lean'.

At that age you want players to be physically fueled and able to meet the training requirements, recovering properly and fully without compromising their health or risking injury.

You can pretty easily tell by eye if a player is in the single digits, teens, or twenties. A percentage or two difference isn't a big deal there. Weight is something that's relatively easy to manipulate in a professional setting, whereas developing physically capable and robust players from a young age is far more important IMO and a focus on skinfolds or body fat % could detract from that.

 

[andleanback]

for those confused about the toby greene case, it's simple.

GWS is a premiership favourite

we're not, no point in running interference for a team that doesn't matter, call me a cynic but that's how it'll be til the end of time, no one at AFL house can be impartial, all that matters is money

He got a week?
The only difference is he didn’t knock out Boyd, if he did he would’ve got the same suspension as wright. It’s all outcome based

 

[I Remember Bluey]

Small domestic sport versus giant powerhouse just before the olympics with Russia already banned.

WADA don’t have the interest in pursuing this IMO

Allan Hird agrees with you.

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/allan-hird-why-were-chinese-swimmers-treated-differently-to-bombers/news-story/727c65fd31d3a4da8ee212292d894cc9

Allan Hird: Why were Chinese swimmers treated differently to Bombers?​

The news Chinese swimmers were allowed to compete at Tokyo Olympics despite positive tests paints a picture worlds apart from WADA’s treatment of Essendon players in 2013.


Are Chinese swimmers valued more highly than Essendon footballers? Interesting question.
The answer would be yes.
Certainly, they are by their respective government agencies for drugs in sport and sporting bodies. And certainly, they are by the World Anti-Doping Agency.

The Chinese equivalent of Sports Integrity Australia, CHINADA, has taken a different position compared with ASADA’s (SIA’s predecessor) back in 2013 when it relentlessly pursued the Essendon players.

First a few facts.
The 23 Chinese each returned positive results to a banned substance when tested by CHINADA.
The 34 Australians were tested numerous times by ASADA and always returned negative results.
The different approaches become stark once we look at what happened.

CHINADA argued the swimmers were “inadvertently exposed to the substance through contamination”.
Nothing to see here right? WADA said fair enough, we’ll let the swimmers compete at the Tokyo Olympics. No problems, even though the WADA website says this in its guide – athletes are ultimately responsible for any banned substance found in their system, regardless as to how it got there or if there was an intention to cheat
.
This is the principle of strict liability, which is not so strict after all (so long as you don’t play for Essendon, that is).


Allan Hird asks why Chinese swimmers were allowed to compete at the Olympics despite positive tests when Essendon’s players were treated so harshly.
ASADA argued that even though the Essendon players kept returning negative results, they were guilty because Stephen Dank had worked at Essendon.

Based on a joint investigation done with the AFL, ASADA charged the players at an independent tribunal comprising two retired judges and a barrister. The tribunal cleared the players, stating ASADA’s case “lacked an evidentiary basis”. End of story? No, ASADA chief executive Ben McDevitt, eager to prove himself, gave WADA $US100,000 to prosecute the players.

WADA gladly accepted the cash and retried the players at the Court of Arbitration for Sport. The minutes of the WADA Foundation Board Meeting of May 13, 2015 at page 30 explain why: “The initial decision had been questioning the ability to pursue non-analytical cases, and the level of proof required to win the cases and, at a time when the new Code was entering into force and putting a lot of emphasis on non-analytical cases, it was important to set the right precedent”.

So, in WADA’s own words, the Essendon players were low-hanging fruit that WADA used to set a precedent in order to ping helpless athletes in the future.

But as we see from the Chinese example, WADA is not interested in pursuing athletes from countries that will fight their corner.
Finally, let’s look at CAS, the body that convicted the 34 Essendon players after two Australian judges and a barrister found the case against them “lacked an evidentiary basis”
.
CAS and WADA are creations of the International Olympics Committee. The governance of each is linked. For example, in 2019, John Coates was president of the International Council of Arbitration for Sport (the body that runs CAS) and the president of WADA was Sir Craig Reedie. Mr Coates represented Australia on the IOC, and Sir Craig represented the UK on the IOC.

Unlike democratic countries, where the separation of powers underpins the law, the IOC ‘jurisprudence’ unites the powers of the prosecutor and the judiciary by appointing its own directors to run its prosecution and judicial agencies.
WADA’s treatment of the Chinese swimmers has exposed its double standards.

Surely, SIA and our Minister for Sport, Annika Wells, would have a view?
But their respective websites are silent.