- Dec 2, 2014
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AFLW 2024 - Round 8 - Chat, game threads, injury lists, team lineups and more.
Ok, so was it as bad as you thought?
- Thread starter Lavender Bushranger
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SBYM
Fish, chips, cup o' tea, Mary @#? Poppins. London!
Used this exact thread title in bed once...
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- #53
No one ever stops barracking for a football club. Not in this generation anyway.
Changing teams is taboo. Always has been.
The AFL was always going to control the damage. We knew that. Essendon folding or being banished from the AFL was never going to happen. We knew that.
Essendon being punished as a club for team wide doping was never going to happen. We knew that.
4 years ago, The worst possible scenario was that WADA would wrestle control of the situation from the AFL and ban the 34 players for 2 years.
Sponsors would walk and the club would be propped up financially by the AFL as a result. They'd get top-ups and free hits at the draft to limit the damage, but would ultimately be banished to the wastelands of on-field mediocrity for 10 years. Members would go cold for a year or two then start to come back as the doom started to lift.
That was the doomsday scenario.
That was the worst it could realistically ever have been.
Sounds pretty ****ing close to the scenario that has actually panned out! The only difference obviously is that the members didn't go cold and sponsors didn't walk.
That's the only difference. And really, that's a difference that no one really gives a stuff about.
The Best case, was nothing at all would come of it. Hird would walk but the players and club never missed a beat. They'd continue their rise up the ladder and be a flag threat as per their projectory suggested.
That was the best case.
The realistic best case, was that Hird and everyone else involved would go, the club would cop a slap on the wrist as punishment and the players do a deal to miss 6 games. After which they'd carry on as if nothing ever happened and be in the top 4 as early as the very next season.
That is what actually could have happened!
Now look at what has actually occurred.
It is very close to the doomsday scenario. And very, very far from the best case!
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- Aug 23, 2011
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- Grand Finals at the Gabba
2011: 11 wins, 11 losses, 1 draw, 8th
2012: 11 wins, 11 losses, 11th
2013: 14 wins, 8 losses, 9th
2014: 12 wins, 10 losses, 1 draw, 7th
2015: 6 wins, 16 losses, 15th
2016: 1 wins, 3 losses, currently 16th, likely spooners
That's not good. It's being celebrated because it could've been so much worse.
We'll wait and see which of the 12 stay at the end of the year. In terms of priorities, I doubt Collier was near the top of the list in terms of re-signings.
2012: 11 wins, 11 losses, 11th
2013: 14 wins, 8 losses, 9th
2014: 12 wins, 10 losses, 1 draw, 7th
2015: 6 wins, 16 losses, 15th
2016: 1 wins, 3 losses, currently 16th, likely spooners
That's not good. It's being celebrated because it could've been so much worse.
We'll wait and see which of the 12 stay at the end of the year. In terms of priorities, I doubt Collier was near the top of the list in terms of re-signings.
- Aug 23, 2011
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Holy **** the non-Vic inferiority complex has no bounds. The non-Vic clubs are far more necessary than the Vic ones from the AFL's point of view. They could live with 8 teams in Melbourne, they couldn't live with one team in Perth, Adelaide or Sydney.
less than zero
Team Captain
- Jun 18, 2014
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Not a member of the "James Hird super Viagra Jizz Project" I take it? (I'm marrying two threads here)
- Dec 2, 2014
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Most Essendon fans had him 4th most important. Hurley/Heppell equal 1st. Hooker 2nd then Colyer.
This, IMO, is far from over, and it won't be restricted to Essendon. The worst parts to the club won't hit until the final appeal option is gone, and the only way forward for players is to tip someone else in it. When some of the anger from within EFC finally gets directed where it should have been from day one if their duped story was to be believed, there are some egos to be protected (and limbs protected from bikies etc).
When the players and club finally start questioning Dank (which they will need to if they want to get the payouts they want), he'll throw grenades everywhere, but will forever be mindful of the consequences if the splash hits the more dangerous suppliers. Any time any of the players involved gets the slightest health issue that could in any way be tied to the supplements, this will be back at the fore. Once more players retire, they might be looking for more of a nest-egg. Once the tests are developed further, more players are likely to be dropped right back in.
The penalties given to the club were harsh for missing records, but were pathetic for a team-wide doping program. The excuses were laughable with the lack of action toward the "mastermind" Dank. The years that this has dragged on for EFC is of their own doing. This story could have been dead and buried in 2013 if the club followed Evans and said "Crap. Looks like someone screwed up, but we didn't know. We accept that something has gone wrong and will accept a penalty. 2014 would have seen the triumphant return of a fit Bombers team, and most would have moved on by now (besides the obvious calls of "drug cheats" to counter the Bomber's fans insults about things that happened at other clubs over 20 years ago.
Instead, every person in the club is tainted. Every player, coach and administrator were at the club during the worst doping scandal in Australian sport. The most ridiculous denials, and pathetic weaselling that will never be forgotten.
EFC, and the AFL will forever be tainted from this, and the worst is yet to come.
(All of course IMO)
When the players and club finally start questioning Dank (which they will need to if they want to get the payouts they want), he'll throw grenades everywhere, but will forever be mindful of the consequences if the splash hits the more dangerous suppliers. Any time any of the players involved gets the slightest health issue that could in any way be tied to the supplements, this will be back at the fore. Once more players retire, they might be looking for more of a nest-egg. Once the tests are developed further, more players are likely to be dropped right back in.
The penalties given to the club were harsh for missing records, but were pathetic for a team-wide doping program. The excuses were laughable with the lack of action toward the "mastermind" Dank. The years that this has dragged on for EFC is of their own doing. This story could have been dead and buried in 2013 if the club followed Evans and said "Crap. Looks like someone screwed up, but we didn't know. We accept that something has gone wrong and will accept a penalty. 2014 would have seen the triumphant return of a fit Bombers team, and most would have moved on by now (besides the obvious calls of "drug cheats" to counter the Bomber's fans insults about things that happened at other clubs over 20 years ago.
Instead, every person in the club is tainted. Every player, coach and administrator were at the club during the worst doping scandal in Australian sport. The most ridiculous denials, and pathetic weaselling that will never be forgotten.
EFC, and the AFL will forever be tainted from this, and the worst is yet to come.
(All of course IMO)
Hal says hi
That's not actually why I said that. Perhaps I didn't express it that well, but I think it would be far more likely for say a Norf or WB to go under or be transplanted than a side from outside of Victoria.
So if we accept your point on the importance of the Interstate clubs (which I do pretty much) then yeah they wouldn't go to the wall. But they would have the head of their pee-pees whacked with the edge of a steel rule. And I doubt that there would be anything like the narrative of support which has been shown in this case.
haha this from a Geelong supporter
and despite all that we'll still be out of the wilderness quicker than Carlton
- Thread starter
- #65
Where do you think they would have had Crameri, Ryder, Carlisle and Melksham?
From the outside looking in, if Collyer is the 4th most important then that may well mean that of the12 banned players, 8 of them are pretty much a bunch of spuds.
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- #66
I don't think it COULD have been much worse.
The AFL were never going to allow that to happen. We all know that, and know why.
We can't be confused between COULD have been worse, and SHOULD have been worse.
Very different things.
- Dec 2, 2014
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Crameri out gave us Merrett. We are well in front here.
Ryder out gave us Cooney and Langford. Which forced us to get Luenberger as well. If Langford comes on how we think we will win here as well.
Carlisle gave us Francis (Possibly Parish, Only Dodoro would know who he had higher if we only had 1 pick) Plus Hurley and Hooker made his loss less of an issue.
Melksham gave us - Redman/Morgan can't remember - Not a big loss either way.
Bark Maguley
All Australian
- Jun 2, 2013
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We are better than you with 12 players out, we don't need our players back at the same level to beat you. ROFL i'd rather our position.
- Thread starter
- #69
?
That doesn't answer the question.
If those guys were on the list still and serving their bans - Where would you rate their importance?
Not with your list, and certainly not with those players suing you. You haven't even won a final in the past decade. And suddenly you're going to leapfrog past us while we'll remain stagnant? Right. Keep thinking that. Your pain is only just beginning.
So? You can hardly talk.
We ruin ourselves with list mismanagement incompetence, yours is on another level that has also damaged the sport's reputation. At least we're not the first Australian team pinged for doping, that's going to be a legacy that'll be with you forever.
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- #72
I've gotta say, this sort of attitude from Essendon supporters is pretty close to completely outrageous.
You guys have spent the past 4 years crying about the AFL being out to get you, but then turn around and gloat about Carlton's predicament!
One club cheated and was punished accordingly. They were excluded from the draft and as a result they're still hurting.
The other club cheated at a level beyond anything ever seen in Australia before - yet the AFL gave them a punishment half of what they gave the other club and as a result the hurt has been managed and controlled to a timeframe half of what the other club copped!
You guys should be meekly sitting there thanking the AFL and feeling genuine empathy for Carlton.
You did far worse, but had the AFL in your corner ensuring what should have happened, didn't happen.
Yet you're here doing the 'Nah nah na nah nah!' to Carlton supporters!
If Carlton had half the support from the AFL that Essendon got, it'd be a vastly different story. Not that they deserved the support.
But **** me dead, neither did Essendon.
What happened in 2002 has nothing to do with Malthouse's appointment or how badly the list has been developed and managed in the past few years. So no, it's not due to cheating, it's due to incompetence. At least the club managed to partially recover in that time period, reaching the finals a few times and winning a couple of them. When was the last time your mob won a final? Yeah we might be shit but at least we're not drug cheats.
- Dec 2, 2014
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Ryder and Carlisle would be top tier. Crameri would be in the Colyer/Hibberd/Myers group. and Melksham would be in the Howlett/Bellchambers/Pears group.
Let's just wait for the next round champ.
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