Pies take complaint to the top.

[Trojan82]

Apologies if this has already been posted!

Collingwood set to take umpiring complaints to AFL boss Demetriou
By Greg Denham
March 30, 2009
Collingwood are set to go straight to AFL boss Andrew Demetriou over the standard of umpiring after their four-point loss to Adelaide Crows at the MCG on Saturday.

Because of Magpies coach Mick Malthouse's widely known lack of faith in the head of the AFL umpiring department Jeff Gieschen, it is understood the Magpies want to take their grievances to a higher level.

A source close to Collingwood president Eddie McGuire said the Pies were preparing a case to present to AFL chief executive Demetriou on Monday. It is more likely that any grievances would be referred to AFL general manager of football operations, Adrian Anderson.

Collingwood chief executive Gary Pert was unavailable for comment on Sunday and it was unclear precisely what the Magpies were angry about.

McGuire was non-commital on Sunday about which course of action Collingwood would take, though he was fuming after Saturday's loss.

"We haven't even sat down as a club yet to discuss it," McGuire said.

"I'm sure we'll sit down and have a chat about it, but it's a matter for the coach and the football director."

An Adelaide official said he was bemused by Collingwood's reaction to the umpires.

"We probably got a couple of decisions that went our way, but then there were a few that we didn't get and we thought we should have," the official said.

The game's free-kick count was 18 to 14 in favour of the Crows.

After the game, Pert said he would have discussions with football manager Geoff Walsh to establish what steps the Pies would take.

"All anyone is talking about is the umpiring," Pert said. "We just need to understand the interpretations. We need explanations."

At his post-match interview, Malthouse blamed the skill errors of his players, and not umpires, for the loss.

"I was very disappointed by the fact that we created the opportunities but weren't able to execute," he said.

AFL spokesman Patrick Keane said clubs would usually advise any concerns arising from a match on the following Monday.

- additional reporting: Michael Horan

I don't know how I feel about this....On one hand it seems like we are whinging on the other hand there were a couple of decisions that made no sense at all. I don't think our loss was the umpires fault our 1st quarter was atrocious and it took way too long to get McLeod under control....I also don't think umpires intentionally give opposition teams more free kicks (If you've ever umpired a game of anything you'll know that its actually ridiculously difficult to give frees that aren't there. But it'd be interesting to know what the AFL says about this.

 

[spartan-magpie]

the club is doing the right thing by makng an offiicial complaint.. itll be funny to watch next week as we get get paid free kicks that arent there...

my theory is we made the afl look like the idiots that they are when we found a loophole for nick maxwell... there has (ok conspiracy theory time) been a directive to punish collingwood where it counts.. in games!

 

[HFF]

I love how the Adelaide official is "bemused".

From my count, there were 5 free kicks Adelaide gained that resulted directly in goals, that clearly weren't there. That takes a heavy toll on any team.

Also, Paul Medhurst mark disallowed for a push out with his legs (WTF?), Daisy's inconclusive goal from the boundary and Leon's 50m penalty for not receiving the ball back properly, particularly after Cloke was penalised for failing to give the ball back, when the ball was already on the deck and he did NOT have to bend over, pick it up and give it back!

There's your 7-8 goal turnaround.

I too am "bemused".

 

[afc1991]

I love how the Adelaide official is "bemused".

From my count, there were 5 free kicks Adelaide gained that resulted directly in goals, that clearly weren't there. That takes a heavy toll on any team.

Also, Paul Medhurst mark disallowed for a push out with his legs (WTF?), Daisy's inconclusive goal from the boundary and Leon's 50m penalty for not receiving the ball back properly, particularly after Cloke was penalised for failing to give the ball back, when the ball was already on the deck and he did NOT have to bend over, pick it up and give it back!

There's your 7-8 goal turnaround.

I too am "bemused".

I'll agree for once we were on the better end of the umpiring.

BUT

DT was clearly out of bounds, his left leg was out of bounds & he was carrying the ball in his right hand- clearly further over the line than his left leg. (if that makes sense)

The non paid 50- You could argue Leon shouldnt have gotten the free kick in the first place, the commentators thought it was going adelaide's way. Indeed it was a 50/50.

The free kick before knights kicked the goal was there, douglas was in a head lock. Both players had their heads down, Id let it go, but technically it was there.

Anyway, move on, was only round 1. The dees this week, im sure they will feel your wrath.

 

[Sloth]

It's not just one game, Collingwood are constantly on the wrong site of the free kick tally. The NAB cup final was about 30 to 10 FFS!
I don't think the umpires do it deliberately, but there is definitely something subconscious going on there. Maybe the unpires just need to be made more aware of what they are actually doing.

 

[Dogs_Playing_Poker]

Good move I reckhon. We always seem to have a bad run with the umpires. It worked for Essendon after Hirdy made the comment on the footy show about mclaren! Best $20,000 Essendon ever spent.

 

[Dogs_Playing_Poker]

Sorry for double post, but there was also a decision where Thomo took a hanger, and it was called that Thommo put his hand's on the adelaide players back, when his hands were nowhere near his back. Always seems that when we get free kicks given against us its in our defensive 50 and results in a goal. Should also be something done about getting some different Commentators on Foxtel when we play. They get 3 of the most anti Collingwood commentators in Dunstall, Dwayne Russell and Gerard Healy with their subtle digs at our club. Makes me sick! F%#kers!

 

[Glees]

I'll agree for once we were on the better end of the umpiring.

BUT

DT was clearly out of bounds, his left leg was out of bounds & he was carrying the ball in his right hand- clearly further over the line than his left leg. (if that makes sense)

The non paid 50- You could argue Leon shouldnt have gotten the free kick in the first place, the commentators thought it was going adelaide's way. Indeed it was a 50/50.

The free kick before knights kicked the goal was there, douglas was in a head lock. Both players had their heads down, Id let it go, but technically it was there.

Anyway, move on, was only round 1. The dees this week, im sure they will feel your wrath.

Sorry, can't agree with this.

I was sitting in the second tier of olympic stand in opposite pocket to Daisy so had the perfect view straight down that part of the boundary line. It was clearly in. The two Adelaide supporters next to me also agreed.

 

[Old Spice]

Yes, a 20k Hird t*rd would about hit the spot. On the 5th quarter on Saturday night they showed the frees for and against the Pies in the last five games and the discrepancy was substantial.

In and of itself, that shouldn't matter if the frees are there, but there have been so many poor decisions, especially on Saturday, that they need to be looked at. Forget Geischen as well, go for a pat response from the AFL. I hope some footage is shown on some AFL shows of all the woeful decisions against us and those not given. You can excuse 1 or 2, but not a tidal wave of effluent - not good enough. Cheap free kicks against opposition in our back half and in junk time flatter the ledger too.

 

[Dylz48]

I love how people say we shouldn't complain about the umpires. If you get short changed at the supermarket do you not complain because the sales assistant was trying there best? Hell no If the umpiring is crap we should be able to say it was crap.

 

[magpie_militia]

Do you think we would be bringing this to the AFL's attention if we had won?

I doubt it.

 

[smiddaz123]

If we are unclear as to what the interpretation of some rules are, we have every right to ask for an explanation.

I'm at a loss to some rules as well.

 

[hotpie]

I'd prefer the club went through official channels first, ie through Geishen. If they fail to get satisfaction AFTER having done that, then they should take it higher. Going over Geishen's head only serves to fuel the fire rather than fix any problem we may have with the umpires.

 

[damochandler]

I'd prefer the club went through official channels first, ie through Geishen. If they fail to get satisfaction AFTER having done that, then they should take it higher. Going over Geishen's head only serves to fuel the fire rather than fix any problem we may have with the umpires.

they did didnt they. i am not having a go at the clubs suporters. but when ever the pies seem to lose. it's always the umpire fault. noone elses. would mick and co be bitching about the umpires if they won the game. they cant have it both ways

 

[joshprice69]

if we are to complain, then the umpire director is just going to come and say all decisions were correct, even if they werent

 

[mattys123]

My interpretation of this whole "affair" is that Collingwood are confused mainly over the way the holding the ball decision is made this season.

Because we are a top tackling side, we are concerned we are not getting rewarded for our efforts, and are in fact being punished for holding on to players after they have clearly dropped (not disposed off) the ball.

The Tyson Edwards free kick that turned the tide in the 3rd quarter, creating a goal for Adelaide, was a classic example of this. Edwards got tackled, he dropped the ball, and the Collingwood player held on for too long.

Last year, that would have been holding the ball, this year it's a free kick to the player with the ball, seems they changed the rule without telling anyone.

 

[Old Spice]

I don't even think interpretation is the main question but justification for some outlandish decisions and the trend over the last little while.

Would this have gone up the line if we had won, I'd certainly hope so. It's fine to point to and address issues that we control as a club, but that should not mean we are indifferent to crap umpiring and seek to have some impact there too.

Certainly it can't turn back the clock, but it can make umpires aware that they are under the spotlight, and if uncertain, it's best to leave off making decisions. The consistency was terrible.

 

[the_fresh]

I think its time the AFL start doing what the NRL does.

The refs face the media.

Our umpires get away with far too much at times. Make them face the media.


Also I got very p!ssed off at what Nathan Thompson said yesterday on the footy show.
He said "if you're first to the ball you get more frees"
Now we were first to the ball in the NAB Cup, we won 3 games and still the count was way against us.

 

[jd1991]

Question: If you go straight to Demetriou to complain without going first to Umpire director, what will Demetrious response be?
If it was me, it would be, no I havent got time to look at umpiring issues as I am trying to run a multi million dollar business in tough economic times, (whether he is doing it well is another issue) so go and see the person who does this day in day out and if that doesnt satisfy you take it to the football operation boss.

What else will Demetriou do? He cant sit there and watch every decision for a game and disect it, as this would take a day out of his working week.

 

[Old Spice]

I think there might be some bad faith there with Geischen, so it is a case of taking it a step further - not as a week to week proposition with Demetriou reveiwing every game - but going there with some clear points in a 1/2 meeting.

Maybe the umpires have the sense that Collingwood play a harder, one on one style so look out for frees, or maybe they have been drawn from Victoria and have a 9/10 chance of having despised the Pies for 9/10 of their lives. Who knows, but the trend doesn't look good and was certainly repellant on Saturday.

 

[Alexander323bc]

Did Eddie have anything to do with Jeff Geischen loosing his job at the Tigers? Its a long bow but .....

 

[Invigoration]

I love how people say we shouldn't complain about the umpires. If you get short changed at the supermarket do you not complain because the sales assistant was trying there best? Hell no If the umpiring is crap we should be able to say it was crap.

Haha, umpiring is subjective, you can't compare the two simply because they are both jobs.

Amazingly stupid comparison, funny nonetheless.

 

[Dave The Man]

C10 we did not and I disappointied that we didn't they where some shocking descions in the 2nd half of the game which help bring the Crows back into the game.

Those I guess if we wen't through with it nothing would happen anyway

 

[Chief Ten Beers]

The Tyson Edwards free kick that turned the tide in the 3rd quarter, creating a goal for Adelaide, was a classic example of this. Edwards got tackled, he dropped the ball, and the Collingwood player held on for too long.

But didn't he drop the ball in the first place? Isn't it holding the ball for lack of clean disposal?

Our umpires get away with far too much at times. Make them face the media.

Personally, I think the AFL should have an umpire "tribunual". I mean if an AFL player makes a really bad decision and costs a game or is completely out of form, then he is usually dropped to VFL before his consistency goes up again.

What's wrong with dropping AFL umprires to a lower level before they're allowed to come back to AFL? Scott McClaren wouldn't even get a game with my system.

 

[Optimax]

But didn't he drop the ball in the first place? Isn't it holding the ball for lack of clean disposal?

yeah that was a horrible horrible decision