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Port or Collingwood: which is the better club?
- Thread starter Portia
- Start date
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2nd rate or not, besides being the breeding ground for a large amount of vfl stars over the decades, the sanfl was the league dominated by port.
put simply, any team/club that continually dominates their respective competition/league is undoubtedly, the better club.
what more could be said?
im sorry that collingwood has never dominated anything - its a wonderful feeling to support a winning team.
a tad simplistic me thinks.
Tere are a ouple of possible trains of thought.
a. Port and Collingwood competed in different leagues for most of their history and therefore cannot be compared (what does 34 SANFL premierships mean in the context of 14 VFL premierships ?). If the answer is "you cannot compare them" then you have answered the question. We can only compare 7 years of history and conclude that both clubs are probably about the same.
b. The question talks about "club" not "side". My personal view is that you can compare across leagues. Both the SANFL and the VFL were pinnacle leagues for about 100 years. This means that if you are a kid in S.A. then you ultimate aspiration is to play league football in the SANFL. And similarly for a Victorian kid in the VFL. For most of their history they poached players from more junior state leagues but not from each other. The best talent in the country generally was playing in the SANFL, WAFL and VFL.
Now...in the SANFL you had 8 clubs which expanded to 10 in 1964....ignore the expansion for a minute. Port had 1/8th of the resources of the comp (zone, money, supporters etc) when they set out in 1870....and they one about 1/3rd (33%) of the flags. Collingwood had 1/12th (1/10th for a while) of the resources of the comp and won 14% of the flags in the VFL. Still good compared to other VFL clubs but nothing like Port. Port were not a Victorian team with Victorian resources playing the SANFL and dominating. They were a S.A. team with SA resources dominatingthe SANFL.
In terms then of being a successful club in scenario (b) there can be only one answer....Port made better use of the resources it had compared to the competition and that is what being a successful club is all about.
Both clubs today have similar resources. They have a salary cap, and a certain number of draft picks. I would advocate that Port have been marginally more successful in the 7 years they have in common. They have won more games, started with nothing (whereas COllingwood started with a list in 1997) and a couple of pre-season cups thrown in. Collingwood have made a couple of GF's but lost.
port adelaide's clubrooms, social events & training facilities will always be at alberton. unfortunately due to its age & location it will never host an afl fixture, but it remains the home of the port adelaide football club.
for a club "so steeped" in tradition, i was amazed to hear the collingwood was leaving vic park, rather than redeveloping it & staying put.
El Kapitain
Senior List
Hence many of the exVFL clubs that have become irrelevant in the AFL continually argue that the AFL is the VFL.
I had a caterpillar named Fred. My sister stole it and renamed it Barney. I went crying to my mother who said I had Fred and since this was Barney my sister could keep caterpillar adn I should look in tree for Fred. I thought it was unfair until my sister had to do all the excavation. I was wronged but at least I got the last laugh.Originally posted by El Kapitain
You idiot.i will try and keep it simple by using a metaphor - a caterpillar is not a butterfly. If something evolves or transforms it is not what it previously was. The caterpillar (VFL) transformed into the butterfly (AFL). The only reason that Collingwood, and some other vic clubs, supporters hang onto the theory that the AFL is the VFL is because otherwise their club's history becomes irrelevant and embarrassing.
excellent response.
we've just evolved
THis pretty much hits the nail on the head in a lot of aspects. Still... i think they are both great clubs in so many ways - especially if you compare them to many other clubs. But they are pretty well impossible to compare.
- Banned
- #136
got to move with the times just like you guys play your games at AAMI - makes sense the only way to go.
our home ground is MCG now. irrelevant where we train imo. important we have the best facilities though - which is the reason we are moving to our little collingwood on the river - once its open come and visit - you will be impressed.
El Kapitain
Senior List
Good argument.
Cant argue with facts. But i bet some will try.
it hits the nail in the head.
full stop.
- Banned
- #139
Originally posted by captain ebert
we've just evolved
and we've still got the black and white stripes.
- Apr 27, 2002
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I don't know about other supporters, but for about the 20th time - I couldn't give a flying rat's fig about the black and white stripes - I used to like them when we were playing in the SANFL - but now they look kinda dated and passe'Originally posted by understudy
and we've still got the black and white stripes.
Please keep 'em.
im sure it will be impressive, but it wont have that lived in feeling & i wont be visiting.
to be in an environment like a sporting club where so much happened over many, many years involving many people who gave their all to the cause is beyond comparison.
the tradition rubs off on you.
- Banned
- #142
magpie museum, gallery and hall of fame thank you very much.
each to their own.
each to their own.
a museum? to study the relics of an age gone by?
that would be nice. do you have to pay an entrance fee?
but i'd still prefer the real deal club rooms, the grand stands, the score board, the players race.
true, each to his own.
- Banned
- #144
viccy park will still be there as well.
win win.
win win.
Here's the rub:
We never make the comparrison because we don't have the issues.
And Tassie? More players left Tassie in the 20's? Maybe, maybe not. Where does the ,line start and end? Is it black and white? I like black and white.
I like the attempt at applying amateur science to the unnatural phenomena that is Collingwood but there is a hole in the theories.
When the VFL was armature and in your view comparable to the SANFL Collingwood were the most dominant team. Now the VFL/AFL or preeminent competition if you like is fully professional and both clubs are competing in it the score at the business end is 2/0 to Collingwood. We can't win grand finals but you can't win finals.
Angry Dragon
Club Legend
At least you agree with me.
If Collingwood were competing in the SANFL until recently then they may have 50 premierships, who knows? They'd still count for nought in this league.
7 years = nothing so far.
How unfortunate. Won't you ever get a president with foresight and a TV show to get you somewhere decent to train and host "The Way We Were" parties?
Simple 21st century economics. We chose not to end up like Carlton.
Originally posted by understudy
viccy park will still be there as well.
win win.
ghost town
the club should still use it somehow.
dont worry, ull never come close to our success
Angry Dragon
Club Legend
This is where you are incorrect. It has only been since the 80s when big dollars came into the game and SANFL players started getting wooed across to the real league. Prior to that players mainly went because of job opportunities, even the occaision VFL star bobbing up in the SANFL in the 'good old days'.
Players were quite content to be local heroes, whichever side of the border the were born and bred in.
Research your history, you clearly have no clue.
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