The Law PSO's - what the hell?

[PottSie2]

Perhaps he is so poor he can't afford a fine?

Perhaps he is a refugee whose usual experience of the police is incredibly unpleasant?

Whatever the case, there are more stories in the world than "he's the dregs of society".

Lots of perhaps.

Perhaps he just didn't have a ticket because he gets away with fare evading regularly ?
Perhaps he was a tagger ?
Perhaps he is a refugee from a group that are known to cause issues around the Flemington and North Melbourne areas ?

Perhaps Perhaps Perhaps. (but yeah, dregs on society is the wrong term).

 

[radiojake]

LOL. Great generalisations and falsifications. This thread was started on one, and seems to be general form in here.

So this Kid who just really happened to be 30-years old, who stupidly tried to re-board a moving train and had his arm severed is somehow everyone's fault but his own.



PS. When disaster happens, it will be on people like you who make it okay for the dregs of society to be classed as victims.

Were you at the station? Did you see it happen?

Are you going to trust a newspaper report or an eyewitness?

 

[Chief]

Lots of perhaps.

Perhaps he just didn't have a ticket because he gets away with fare evading regularly ?
Perhaps he was a tagger ?
Perhaps he is a refugee from a group that are known to cause issues around the Flemington and North Melbourne areas ?

Perhaps Perhaps Perhaps. (but yeah, dregs on society is the wrong term).

Yes people should take responsibility for their actions, but laying degrading names on them without knowing the facts is not a good look. Responsibility and blame are two different things.

 

[PottSie2]

Were you at the station? Did you see it happen?

Are you going to trust a newspaper report or an eyewitness?

Well considering I used a newspaper reference in my post .........

You were there though right ?

 

[radiojake]

Well considering I used a newspaper reference in my post .........

You were there though right ?

"He saw police walking towards him at about 6.20pm. He tried to re-board the moving train...."


The PSO ticket scabs were chasing him and then suddenly the police were there - The news report makes it sounds like it was all standard procedure - There was nothing 'standard' with what happened on that train platform that day, and someone lost their hand over it

 

[PottSie2]

"He saw police walking towards him at about 6.20pm. He tried to re-board the moving train...."


The PSO ticket scabs were chasing him and then suddenly the police were there - The news report makes it sounds like it was all standard procedure - There was nothing 'standard' with what happened on that train platform that day, and someone lost their hand over it

So he was completely innocent then ? You were an eye witness ? Do tell.

 

[radiojake]

So he was completely innocent then ? You were an eye witness ? Do tell.

I have no idea what he was alleged to have done to warrant being chased, but I do know chasing after someone on a train platform isn't the safest thing to do -

If it was over a $3.80 train fare not being paid, it's straight out a travesty that he lost his hand; if he was wanted on other police matters, I have a feeling they would have mentioned what it was in regards to in the article. The fact that this incident got so little media coverage is also weird....

But don't worry, Potise... he was one of the 'dregs', yeah? You wouldn't normally bother yourself with details of such people -

 

[PottSie2]

I have no idea what he was alleged to have done to warrant being chased, but I do know chasing after someone on a train platform isn't the safest thing to do -

If it was over a $3.80 train fare not being paid, it's straight out a travesty that he lost his hand; if he was wanted on other police matters, I have a feeling they would have mentioned what it was in regards to in the article. The fact that this incident got so little media coverage is also weird....

But don't worry, Potise... he was one of the 'dregs', yeah? You wouldn't normally bother yourself with details of such people -

So you have no idea who he was, what he did, whether he was being chased down or not (you weren't there), yet you have the audacity to call the PSO's and Police scum.

Well done.

Go tag something.

 

[radiojake]

So you have no idea who he was, what he did, whether he was being chased down or not (you weren't there), yet you have the audacity to call the PSO's and Police scum.

Well done.

Go tag something.

He was being chased down and I can categorically confirm that -

Even if this incident didn't happen, I would still feel comfortable to call PSO/Ticket scabs and cops scum, because that is what they are.

I'm not particularly fond of tagging myself, I've never quite got the appeal - It seems odd you would be encouraging me to violates someone else's property considering your conservative views.

 

[PottSie2]

He was being chased down and I can categorically confirm that -

Even if this incident didn't happen, I would still feel comfortable to call PSO/Ticket scabs and cops scum, because that is what they are.

I'm not particularly fond of tagging myself, I've never quite got the appeal - It seems odd you would be encouraging me to violates someone else's property considering your conservative views.

Until you need them of course.

Fight the power.

You can categorically confirm he was being chased down. But can't say for what reason. Seems pretty stupid for him to run, but then, always the victim aren't they.

Edit: You said he was a kid, reports put him at 30. What does your source say ?

 

[Snake_Baker]

People in general who perpetrate crime, but cry victim.

Tell me, if police officer were approaching you, would you attempt get on board a train already departing?

Answer: YES

I seem to remember my grand parents, parents and myself paying for the ****ing rail system before the ****s in government went and sold it to raise more revenue for their bullshit.

 

[DivideandMultiply]

I just found out today you can get a $207 fine for putting your feet on the seat (not me).

This is pure insanity. There is something deeply unhealthy about a system that fines more for discourteous behaviour, than genuinely dangerous behaviour like speeding.

Fines, fines for everything to keep the coffers full.

 

[PottSie2]

Answer: YES

I seem to remember my grand parents, parents and myself paying for the ****ing rail system before the ****s in government went and sold it to raise more revenue for their bullshit.

LOL. How old are you ? How much tax do you pay ? Do you receive any Govt. entitlements ? I didn't realise track maintenance was free ? Train drivers worked for nothing ? Station upgrades just happen for nothing.

EDIT: And running from the cops on a train station, stupidly, but predictably, falling onto the tracks trying to get onto a moving train, getting your hand severed and still being the victim ...... and you'd still do it. heck me.

I just found out today you can get a $207 fine for putting your feet on the seat (not me).

This is pure insanity. There is something deeply unhealthy about a system that fines more for discourteous behaviour, than genuinely dangerous behaviour like speeding.

Fines, fines for everything to keep the coffers full.

I found the answer DnM .... don't put your feet on the seats ? Some common courtesy for someone else that will have to sit on the shit your shoes leave behind .... what ... courtesy .... FK DA POLICE.

The youth of today.

 

[Snake_Baker]

LOL. How old are you ? How much tax do you pay ? Do you receive any Govt. entitlements ? I didn't realise track maintenance was free ? Train drivers worked for nothing ? Station upgrades just happen for nothing.

EDIT: And running from the cops on a train station, stupidly, but predictably, falling onto the tracks trying to get onto a moving train, getting your hand severed and still being the victim ...... and you'd still do it. heck me.

I found the answer DnM .... don't put your feet on the seats ? Some common courtesy for someone else that will have to sit on the shit your shoes leave behind .... what ... courtesy .... FK DA POLICE.

The youth of today.

You're prepared to hide your corporate whoredom statist bullshit under that crap?

I honestly wish you and your type would just **** off to some penal colony and leave the rest of us alone to continue evolving.

 

[skilts]

You're prepared to hide your corporate whoredom statist bullshit under that crap?

I honestly wish you and your type would just **** off to some penal colony and leave the rest of us alone to continue evolving.

I detect a distinct hatred of penal colonies and their inhabitants here.

 

[Chief]

Let's chill out a bit. Thanks.

 

[DivideandMultiply]

I found the answer DnM .... don't put your feet on the seats ? Some common courtesy for someone else that will have to sit on the shit your shoes leave behind .... what ... courtesy .... FK DA POLICE.

The youth of today.

Don't be such a div.

$207 fines for putting ones feet on the seat, no matter how briefly, serves no practical purpose other than revenue raising.

It is state sanctioned theft and logically indefensible.

 

[And_ROOS]

I just found out today you can get a $207 fine for putting your feet on the seat (not me).

This is pure insanity. There is something deeply unhealthy about a system that fines more for discourteous behaviour, than genuinely dangerous behaviour like speeding.

Fines, fines for everything to keep the coffers full.

Yup and twice ive been threatened with that because i was slouched in my chair with a leg crossed over the other so that my toe was near the seat. Apparently near enough is good enough.

 

[Snake_Baker]

Don't be such a div.

$207 fines for putting ones feet on the seat, no matter how briefly, serves no practical purpose other than revenue raising.

It is state sanctioned theft and logically indefensible.

It's an unsustainable position if people choose to fight it.

Our freedoms have become the inconsequential factors of business models.

Don't pay the fine.

 

[Helicopter Punt]

It's an unsustainable position if people choose to fight it.

Our freedoms have become the inconsequential factors of business models.

Don't pay the fine.

I can't speak for PSOs (could hazard a guess though) but AO training is inadequate. Sadly, I speak from prior experience. I too was once a cash collecting tool of the state.

These guys aren't born with this authority. It is dependent upon two things: Delegation from the Secretary of DOI and an understanding of the words they are using against you.
They also have a saying 'What colour is your house?' referring to the ever-present fear of being sued they live with - especially when straying too far from a regular/vanilla booking.

I asked one if he knew what a 'person' is legally speaking - Transport Act 1983 is a statute and applicable to 'persons'. He didn't. Claimed he didn't need to.
I then asked him if his job was to compare my actions to a body of words to determine whether my actions were legal how could he do his job if he didn't understand the words?

'Don't you have a duty to understand the words in your own mandate? You've already proven you don't. Are you going to argue you don't have to in court?
Turned around, tucking invoice book in back pocket and muttering to his partner in commerce 'I don't need this shit'

Probably got lucky, maybe he had a bad day or had already got his (supposedly non-existent) quota.
A twist on Robert Menard's work. Carry a copy of Transport Act. When asked for ticket point to the word Act on front cover and ask them if they know what that word means. When answer isn't forthcoming with a suitably concerned tone 'Ouch. What just happened to your authority?'

 

[DivideandMultiply]

Yup and twice ive been threatened with that because i was slouched in my chair with a leg crossed over the other so that my toe was near the seat. Apparently near enough is good enough.

It really is ridiculous. The carriage was empty and the guy I am referring to had just put the heel of his foot onto the metal edging between chairs and bam booked.

Now a few questions, why not stop him before he has fully stretched out and placed the foot on the chair, instead of watching it happen then booking him after?

Why not just tell him to take it off? It was on the metal edging, had just happened and the carriage was empty, so no chance of damage or denying someone a seat.

Finally, why such an unnecessarily steep fine, for a victimless action?

Worse still is the situation in regards to student concession myki. Surely you would think a valid student card should be enough, but no this is not the case. In WA the situation is, that your student smartrider doubles as proof of concession and changes in enrollment, change the fare structure of your smartcard.

Not so in Victoria, where despite having an entirely unique myki for concession fares, you still have to carry your student concession card on your persons. Worse than this, the offence has changed from traveling without a valid concession, to traveling without a valid concession on your persons. Also unlike WA, you can only appeal once if you have forgotten your student concession card, more than this and they won't waive the fine unless there is what I imagine are extenuating circumstances. My brother for instance was booked a second time after he had his wallet stolen, on his way to the police station in the city to file a report. Sent the report, a photocopy of his new concession card and a written note when he appealed and was denied. Every chance he would have been successful had he decided to take the matter to court, but like many people was put off and chose to pay an exorbitant $200+ (over twice the amount of fines for a more serious offence in WA).

In fact, I know with the previous photographic transport concessions, they kept all of your information on file. I once asked a PSO why they couldn't just walk the few feet to the service desk to confirm that the person being booked has a valid concession. The answer I received, it is a violation of blah to not carry a valid concession whilst traveling on the trains. Stupefying. -_-

The truth is though, that I make and have made the mistake in the past in thinking that the purpose of fines was in any way logical and aimed at enforcement of necessary rules, or as a preventative measure against dangerous, destructive or costly behaviour. Also that the punishment or fine, would be commensurate with the infringement. This is not at all the case, in fact it is the opposite. Many fines are simply exploitative, with no real purpose other than to raise revenue for various government departments. Victoria is cash strapped, the state has flogged off most of its public infrastructure and suffered under years of mismanagement, so because our public officials have been incapable or unwilling to do the jobs they are paid for, it falls on the public to be gifted out of what little they may have to make up for the shortfall.

 

[PP34]

A bunch of them told off a group of footy goers in round one for finishing off their stubbies as they headed up the tunnel towards the platform.

Since when is that protecting commuters?

 

[Tigger Please!]

this thread reminds me how i ran into trouble with psos in melbourne a number of years ago.
often, in sydney (where i live), suburban train stations will leave their gates open so that one may simply walk through the gates without scanning his ticket.
in this particular instance, southern cross station's gates were open for some reason so i simply walked through without scanning my ticket, assuming the same principle applied. when i went to exit at frankston station, the machine swallowed my ticket without letting me through and, the next thing i know, i was roughly shoved aside by three psos and aggressively questioned and threatened for fare evasion.
eventually i was able to explain to them that i was from sydney and that i was unfamiliar with the machinations of melbourne's rail network. only after they had scanned my drivers' license for proof of residence and called security at southern cross station for footage of me purchasing a ticket without "validating" it was i allowed to go. i was farewelled with the stern warning that if i failed to validate my ticket in the future i would be issued with a $300+ fine.
it was quite a bizarre occurrence and i've never experienced anything like it before or since in all my years using sydney's pts.

 

[And_ROOS]

Welcome to Melbourne haha. I was in the city the other day and apparently one of the PSO's was watching me, but got distracted for a minute and didnt see me touch off, so he assumed i did a dodgy and jumped the gate. Got approached by 3 PSO's about fare evasion, basically guilty straight off the bat, and after they scanned my card and found it was legit and i demanded an apology they told me they were "doing their job". F**kers.

 

[Snake_Baker]

According to the Hun, you are now a "snitch" if you report on the government and its corporate cronies.

Herald Sun

Thousands of Melbourne fare evaders are dodging ticket inspectors with the help of social media snitches that track their whereabouts --> http://hsun.info/110S4eJ


Do you think it's fair to warn fare evaders?