Racist Aussies?

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Just a word on the difference between racism and discrimination. This is really just my opinion, but I think I'm also allowed to have one of them, strangely enough.

I have a friend who happens to have red hair and also has brown eyes. When someone asks me "Which one of your friends is Jess?" I say 'the one with the red hair" because her red hair distinguishes her and her brown eyes don't. That doesn't make me hairist, because I don't think that people with black or brown hair are better than those with red hair. It means I've discriminated, because I have to discriminate between people or else everyone is exactly the same. Just like many of my friends play netball, but one is a gymnast, I might describe that person as a gymnast, but it doesn't mean that I'm being sportist. If that gymnast is a blonde, I don't then go on to say that all blondes are gymnasts.

All of the isms such as sexism, racism, ageism, do include discrimination, but it's not discrimination alone - it's discrimination as well as excluding, attacking, belittling, or judging in some way.

By the way, I'm yet to see any evidence racism is something that's natural, and so I see no reason why it can't change
 
By the definitions of racism given here, I'm not racist.

I am, however, clubbist. :eek:
 
Originally posted by evade28
so when u see an aussie BTige, u think "oh they are prolly racist". when you are being racist yourself.

people are racist through sterotyping and prejudice. everyone is whether they admit it or not. so too bad.
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I don't meet many Aussies, but I wouldn't label them any more racist than most.

My question was originally designed to stir up some debate on the serious matter.

And even if I did accuse Australians of being racist, that wouldn't label me a racist. You can't be racist against those with the same racial charcteristics as yourself.

Racism often get's mistaken for discrimination.

Race - group of humans: any one of the groups into which the world’s population can be divided on the basis of physical characteristics such as skin or hair colour
 

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Originally posted by Fat Red
Scarily, I sort of agree with Frodo. I try as hard as I can not to be prejudiced, but if I see say a Maori guy coming down a dark lane I will be more scared than if I see a white guy. I'm sorry if that offends anyone, I know that perception is ugly, but it is my reaction.
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Interesting statement. But I think what you are saying that you'd rather not meet some bloke six foot across at the shoulders with balck tshirt in dark alley, rather than some skinny runt. And that is fair enough, I would prefer it that way as well. But the underline problem is that you're assuming that a maori will fit that description and that a white guy won't.

But ask yourself, would you rather meet a skinny maori runt in an alleyway, or a white bloke who might double as a body guard for Mike Tyson.

If you'd still rather meet the white guy (and I don't think you would) then I'd be worried for you.

On the general topic, yeah there are plenty of ozzie racists, not as many as a lot of countries, but it still really needs to be worked upon. Unfortunately Howard is working on it, by encouraging racism through working on and stoking the electorate's fears of 'outsiders'.
 
Originally posted by BTige
You can't be racist against those with the same racial charcteristics as yourself.
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I disagree. There are many examples different cultures with very little tangible difference between each other, who have extremely "racist" views towards each other.

Likewise, even within some cultures, racism may occur between levels of "castes".
 
Originally posted by Stocka


I disagree. There are many examples different cultures with very little tangible difference between each other, who have extremely "racist" views towards each other.

Likewise, even within some cultures, racism may occur between levels of "castes".
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Disagree all you like. What you percieve as a type of racism is really another form of discrimination/prejudice - Nationalism, regionalism, culturalism.

The caste system has nothing to do with race. It's no more than a form of a rigid class system. It's like saying the British class system is racist.
 
Originally posted by Bomber Spirit
To identify someone as an aborigine isn't necessarily racist. But to then assume that because they're an aborigine that they are inferior to a white person is racist.
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old definition methinks.

The dictionary says exactly that but it's not accepted any more. The mere mentioning of anything concerned with race is now considered to be racism.

I don't think any race is inferior to another but I'm often labeled racist because I mention a race. Now I just accept that by popular opinion I am.
 
Originally posted by Blue'n'Gold


being able to identify someones nationality or race doesn't automatically make you racist...

if I listen to someone speak and think... "they are welsh" .. does that mean i am racist?

All it means is they have a welsh accent and i have recognised it... no different when you are able to see cultural differences ... just because you are able to recognize them doesn't mean you think less of them than any other nationality or race
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Good opinion but not supported.

If I see an aboriginal gang beating up some pensioners and i think 'they are aboribinal' because i recognise their looks and I write here what I saw then I am called a racist.
Now, as a race I don't see aboriginals as being inferior but my comments are interpreted nonetheless as being racist.

The word 'rasism' is now being used as an effective curb on freedom of speech. ie we are being manipulated and the sheep just keep on baaaa.......ing
 
Originally posted by aggels
Just a word on the difference between racism and discrimination. This is really just my opinion, but I think I'm also allowed to have one of them, strangely enough.

I have a friend who happens to have red hair and also has brown eyes. When someone asks me "Which one of your friends is Jess?" I say 'the one with the red hair" because her red hair distinguishes her and her brown eyes don't. That doesn't make me hairist, because I don't think that people with black or brown hair are better than those with red hair. It means I've discriminated, because I have to discriminate between people or else everyone is exactly the same. Just like many of my friends play netball, but one is a gymnast, I might describe that person as a gymnast, but it doesn't mean that I'm being sportist. If that gymnast is a blonde, I don't then go on to say that all blondes are gymnasts.

All of the isms such as sexism, racism, ageism, do include discrimination, but it's not discrimination alone - it's discrimination as well as excluding, attacking, belittling, or judging in some way.

By the way, I'm yet to see any evidence racism is something that's natural, and so I see no reason why it can't change
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Good addition.

The whole point is that what used to be seen as 'unwanted' is

UNFAIR RACIAL DISCRIMINATION


and it is the word 'unfair' that is the key word.

And that should still stand today.
 
There is a trend to reduce the amount of descriptive words we speak or write. This typifies what has happened.

20 years ago UNFAIR RACIAL DISCRIMINISM

10 years ago RACIAL DISCRIMINATION

now RACISM

It's all about the same thing but we've bastardised the English
 
Originally posted by Frodo
There is a trend to reduce the amount of descriptive words we speak or write. This typifies what has happened.

20 years ago UNFAIR RACIAL DISCRIMINISM

10 years ago RACIAL DISCRIMINATION

now RACISM

It's all about the same thing but we've bastardised the English
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My original question was aimed at the problem of racism. If others wish to bring in other forms of discrimination and prejudice, that's their problem.

Having lived in the southern USA and area's of the UK where the ghetto is part of everyday life, I think I know a bit of what I'm talking about. However, that doesn't mean I have nothing to learn on this subject.

There are some with the most bizarre (Medieval) idea's about who should live where and do what with who.
 

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Originally posted by BTige
Disagree all you like.
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Yes, I will, if I want to. That's the whole point of the board . . . to have a discussion in which people can feel free to agree or disagree.

Although, I find that particular comment of yours a bit strange (in fact, your response tends to have 'troll' written all over it). If you can't handle someone debating a particular point in question with you, then perhaps this isn't your place . . .

Originally posted by BTige
What you percieve as a type of racism is really another form of discrimination/prejudice - Nationalism, regionalism, culturalism.

The caste system has nothing to do with race. It's no more than a form of a rigid class system. It's like saying the British class system is racist.
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A touch pedantic, I think. I actually never commented on what I perceive as "racism", and in fact, the terminology was hardly the point of my post, and it certainly doesn't really relate to how my response related to your comment.

At any rate, I also tend to think that you've decontextualised one or two comments that I made (while ignoring others) pertaining to my point, and applied some sort of 'negative' judgment via the appraisal of your own (unsupported) personal perspective, which really has not aided the discussion at all.

You originally commented that people of the same racial background could not be racist towards each other, to which I replied that there are many arguable examples of such. I hardly think your questioning of terminology used, or the circumstances you applied to my particular point were appropriate in regards to the point in discussion (more of a deflection, than a debate).
 
Originally posted by Stocka


At any rate, I also tend to think that you've decontextualised one or two comments that I made (while ignoring others) pertaining to my point, and applied some sort of 'negative' judgment via the appraisal of your own (unsupported) personal perspective, which really has not aided the discussion at all.
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Is that an entry for the Campagn For Real English or what?

I've never either deliberately contextualised or decontextualised a thing in my life. I suppose there's a first time for everything.

If I'm a pedant, where does that put you?
 
Aussie are not that racist what is misunderstood about Australians is that we are a culture where we joke about things alot and prefer things to be out in the open. If you can't have a laugh then don't bother having a life.

Being racist is not about making a comment it is about your actions. The parts of the community who say that they are being discrimminated against are actually some of the most racist part of the community themselves. The Vietnamese community is not what I would call an open community willing to accept outsiders nor are some othe asian groups, they congregate in the own social groups inter-marry and do not try to assimilate so who is racist. I have travelled and hae found that the English, French, Greeks, many Asian cultures are more racist than us.

Their is always the point that they have come here and must adapt to more of our customs than us to theirs if they don't like it then go home. I will not change my ways and I will still tell ethnic jokes as I tell them for a laugh, if some has a problem with that then f*ck off.
 
Originally posted by Slax
Aussie are not that racist what is misunderstood about Australians is that we are a culture where we joke about things alot and prefer things to be out in the open. If you can't have a laugh then don't bother having a life.

Being racist is not about making a comment it is about your actions. The parts of the community who say that they are being discrimminated against are actually some of the most racist part of the community themselves. The Vietnamese community is not what I would call an open community willing to accept outsiders nor are some othe asian groups, they congregate in the own social groups inter-marry and do not try to assimilate so who is racist. I have travelled and hae found that the English, French, Greeks, many Asian cultures are more racist than us.

Their is always the point that they have come here and must adapt to more of our customs than us to theirs if they don't like it then go home. I will not change my ways and I will still tell ethnic jokes as I tell them for a laugh, if some has a problem with that then f*ck off.
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It's quite possible that many Asians, Africans etc, are more racist than white Australians.

Being a racist can be about comments if those comments are designed to stir up hatred. Dr Goebbels would know about all that.

Are the Poms anymore racist than Aussies?
 
It can be difficult to generalise and brand a whole nation as racist, it's much easier (rightly or wrongly) to brand a Government as racist however. Within a nation or even within cities there can be varying levels of racism due to many factors. I'd consider the UK as having overall quite a good reputation as being a culturally diverse and inclusive society, particularly in London and other larger cities but last year there were riots between Causasian and (South) Asians in the northern cities of Bradford, Leeds and Oldham.

London overall has a good record as being a culturally diverse and inclusive society but when my sister was living in the East End for a while a couple of years ago, she had a window smashed and it was believed a motive could have been the fact that her landlady was Jamaican and there had been a lot of friction and similar incidents between the West Indian community and Cauasian community in that area (it was area with a history of poor race relations, being a National Front stronghold where a lot of white youths in the area where pro-nationalist skinheads).

Australia overall is a culturally inclusive and diverse nation but there are definitely places where if you were black you'd be likely to experience discrimination, country NSW and country Queensland for example. Sydney also is a culturally inclusive and diverse city but there's parts of Sydney where the race relations between certain races are strained, for example the Canterbury-Bankstown area between the Causasian and Arab communities.

Australia does have a racist past but in the last thirty years has done a lot to eliminate its racism, but some racism stills lingers, and there's always going to be a segment of any community who are racist.

In conclusion, some Australians are racist, most are not. I think that Australia would be less racist than most countries of the world. Canada seems to be one country however, which like Australia has very high levels of immigration but seems to have quite low levels of racism, and is possibly less racist than Australia, but then again there's still some lingering strains and tension between the Anglo- and French-Canadian community, so no place is perfect! ;)
 

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