Review Round 6, 2024 - Brisbane Lions vs. Geelong

Who were your five best players against Geelong?

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does he like movies?
martinson said:
I guess there's truth in that.

But when you're under the pump and your players aren't in prime form and there aren't too many other choices you can't just flick on a switch and implement new ideas and strategies and hope they might work.

We got ourselves primed for Melbourne ,had it in us to execute perfectly and naturally came out with the same fire for the first quarter last night but executed terribly and then had the letdown that was coming and just couldn't get it going again against a disciplined opposition.

It's too late now for fresh ideas this year. We will go with what we've got until we're competitive in the top 8 , or we fail and look at a new plan for 2025.
Click to expand...
Fagan did say at the start of the season , we have worked on getting more uncontested ball working through our system.
I think the Melbourne game was probably the best we've had in terms of those tactics.
Unfortunately in our other losses , and I might say they were in dry conditions, we over handballed .
Remember when Lochie commented after the Freo game, he didn't play as injured.
He said in frustration , some of those handballs , screwed his face up.
We have over adjusted it seems, and Saturday only made it look worse with the sodden weather.

It's probably why I've lost a bit of patience , it took too many years to make this change.
Cause the teritiory style football has rarely worked against top 4 teams , or not very well anyway and when it came to playing teams that played with possession style footy we got shown up.

But got to still hope the realization has sunk in .
For this plan to work we have to be prepared to run then run some more and more.
Overlapping runs, run into space , create space.
If we don't we end up handballing ourselves into trouble. Handballing just for the sake of it.

So again it seems like work in progress, so hopefully we keep working on this tactic.

Having said that.
This game on Saturday night was never a game where you want to over handball, so frustrating , if ever there was a time to go back to territory style footy it was this night.
And we we did try and kick it forward, straight to them.
you have to have players set up for the dump kick or kick to spaces that are predictable for our players.
You can't just kick it as far as you can, there has to be some purpose .
Anyways.
I actually think Fages is on the right track when it comes to dry weather footy , he just had a mare with preperation for Saturday and the weather and lacks ability to change tactics.
I think the last part is on the coaching staff and Fages , more so than the players as it came down to our set up as has been said by others here.
 
Monkey Daniel said:
The free kick and then 50 metre which resulted in a goal to Geelong, Jezza Cameron was fined for tripping Hugh
Click to expand...
A bit more on the incident.
When i saw it i only noticed the Cameron tackle slipped down around McCluggage legs. That is not mentioned in the article.
That was not paid either. I also missed the chin hit because of the angle.
Then of course Cameron was awarded a 50-meter penalty just to rub it in.

So, three free kicks missed in the one incident then a 50-meter penalty against a frustrated player.
At least now Cameron cops a fine.


 

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we were leading 23 to 14 when Oscar went off in the first 10 minutes of the 2nd Q. Whilst it was not a night for KPF's, having our key forward ruck for the rest of the game had an effect on not just the hitouts in the middle but importantly our forward line structure. I believe we scored only two goals after we lost Oscar.

As for some of the whipping boys, Hippy, Payne and to a lesser extent Berry.

With Joe rucking, Geelong were able to team up on Eric. Yes that miss in the first Q that would have got us to 18 nil wasn't great but it was a wet night. Having watched the replay he was still competing for the ball but not the night to be taking big marks. I saw him bust through a number of attempted tackles on a couple of occasions.
Payne fumbled the ball a few times, (there were many players on both sides who did), obviously missing that mark in the first Q lead to a goal, and any error by a fullback gets amplified. He did however, stick like glue to Hawkins who did not have one shot at goal, had two goal assist and a total of 8 disposals (he also plays forward ruck so probably collect a few disposals there). Yes Payne got out muscled once in the centre square in a contest, but geez Hawkins has done that for his entire career.
Berry was working up and down the ground and put himself in a position where he got a few shots at goal and competed in at least one marking contest deep in defence (where he worked back to help out). If he is being judged for kicking the ball out three or four times, then there are many players from both teams that did that in the wet conditions.

Eric, Jack or Jarrod will not be dropped for the GWS game and nor should they. I don't see how they are responsible for the loss. IMO the loss of Oscar who was dominating a three game player (Conway) had a determinantal effect and to a lesser extent the 'Geelong weather'
 
On the quiet said:
we were leading 23 to 14 when Oscar went off in the first 10 minutes of the 2nd Q. Whilst it was not a night for KPF's, having our key forward ruck for the rest of the game had an effect on not just the hitouts in the middle but importantly our forward line structure. I believe we scored only two goals after we lost Oscar.

As for some of the whipping boys, Hippy, Payne and to a lesser extent Berry.

With Joe rucking, Geelong were able to team up on Eric. Yes that miss in the first Q that would have got us to 18 nil wasn't great but it was a wet night. Having watched the replay he was still competing for the ball but not the night to be taking big marks. I saw him bust through a number of attempted tackles on a couple of occasions.
Payne fumbled the ball a few times, (there were many players on both sides who did), obviously missing that mark in the first Q lead to a goal, and any error by a fullback gets amplified. He did however, stick like glue to Hawkins who did not have one shot at goal, had two goal assist and a total of 8 disposals (he also plays forward ruck so probably collect a few disposals there). Yes Payne got out muscled once in the centre square in a contest, but geez Hawkins has done that for his entire career.
Berry was working up and down the ground and put himself in a position where he got a few shots at goal and competed in at least one marking contest deep in defence (where he worked back to help out). If he is being judged for kicking the ball out three or four times, then there are many players from both teams that did that in the wet conditions.

Eric, Jack or Jarrod will not be dropped for the GWS game and nor should they. I don't see how they are responsible for the loss. IMO the loss of Oscar who was dominating a three game player (Conway) had a determinantal effect and to a lesser extent the 'Geelong weather'
Click to expand...

Awesome summation of the night.
 
On the quiet said:
we were leading 23 to 14 when Oscar went off in the first 10 minutes of the 2nd Q. Whilst it was not a night for KPF's, having our key forward ruck for the rest of the game had an effect on not just the hitouts in the middle but importantly our forward line structure. I believe we scored only two goals after we lost Oscar.

As for some of the whipping boys, Hippy, Payne and to a lesser extent Berry.

With Joe rucking, Geelong were able to team up on Eric. Yes that miss in the first Q that would have got us to 18 nil wasn't great but it was a wet night. Having watched the replay he was still competing for the ball but not the night to be taking big marks. I saw him bust through a number of attempted tackles on a couple of occasions.
Payne fumbled the ball a few times, (there were many players on both sides who did), obviously missing that mark in the first Q lead to a goal, and any error by a fullback gets amplified. He did however, stick like glue to Hawkins who did not have one shot at goal, had two goal assist and a total of 8 disposals (he also plays forward ruck so probably collect a few disposals there). Yes Payne got out muscled once in the centre square in a contest, but geez Hawkins has done that for his entire career.
Berry was working up and down the ground and put himself in a position where he got a few shots at goal and competed in at least one marking contest deep in defence (where he worked back to help out). If he is being judged for kicking the ball out three or four times, then there are many players from both teams that did that in the wet conditions.

Eric, Jack or Jarrod will not be dropped for the GWS game and nor should they. I don't see how they are responsible for the loss. IMO the loss of Oscar who was dominating a three game player (Conway) had a determinantal effect and to a lesser extent the 'Geelong weather'
Click to expand...

I don’t blame Payne for that first goal since the whole reason he was in the position is Zorko making the horrible decision to try a lace out kick near the corridor which unsurprisingly resulted in a turnover and heading straight back to goal.

Other times though he was probably one of the biggest strugglers to adapt to the wet. Mainly, he kept running at the ball with high speed while in front position and got caught out when it slipped past him. Needed to slow down and give himself the extra time to read the ball and not zoom last making it harder to collect.

I agree Payne shouldn’t be dropped, but it’s definitely something I hope he learns from.

Eric to me at the ground seemed to be one of the only players playing to the conditions. Most times when he attacked the ball he looked to be doing it with the mindset of getting it forward at all costs.

Not really anyone on the team played much worse than each other. Tackling was a biggest issue for me. Too many broken tackles which just made it ten times easier for them to gain territory without extra handballs to get out of congestion.
 
buttermuffs said:
I don’t blame Payne for that first goal since the whole reason he was in the position is Zorko making the horrible decision to try a lace out kick near the corridor which unsurprisingly resulted in a turnover and heading straight back to goal.

Other times though he was probably one of the biggest strugglers to adapt to the wet. Mainly, he kept running at the ball with high speed while in front position and got caught out when it slipped past him. Needed to slow down and give himself the extra time to read the ball and not zoom last making it harder to collect.

I agree Payne shouldn’t be dropped, but it’s definitely something I hope he learns from.

Eric to me at the ground seemed to be one of the only players playing to the conditions. Most times when he attacked the ball he looked to be doing it with the mindset of getting it forward at all costs.

Not really anyone on the team played much worse than each other. Tackling was a biggest issue for me. Too many broken tackles which just made it ten times easier for them to gain territory without extra handballs to get out of congestion.
Click to expand...
Yes, a lot of broken tackles in the wet.
I suppose oil and water make it a bit harder for our guys.
 
On the quiet said:
we were leading 23 to 14 when Oscar went off in the first 10 minutes of the 2nd Q. Whilst it was not a night for KPF's, having our key forward ruck for the rest of the game had an effect on not just the hitouts in the middle but importantly our forward line structure. I believe we scored only two goals after we lost Oscar.

As for some of the whipping boys, Hippy, Payne and to a lesser extent Berry.

With Joe rucking, Geelong were able to team up on Eric. Yes that miss in the first Q that would have got us to 18 nil wasn't great but it was a wet night. Having watched the replay he was still competing for the ball but not the night to be taking big marks. I saw him bust through a number of attempted tackles on a couple of occasions.
Payne fumbled the ball a few times, (there were many players on both sides who did), obviously missing that mark in the first Q lead to a goal, and any error by a fullback gets amplified. He did however, stick like glue to Hawkins who did not have one shot at goal, had two goal assist and a total of 8 disposals (he also plays forward ruck so probably collect a few disposals there). Yes Payne got out muscled once in the centre square in a contest, but geez Hawkins has done that for his entire career.
Berry was working up and down the ground and put himself in a position where he got a few shots at goal and competed in at least one marking contest deep in defence (where he worked back to help out). If he is being judged for kicking the ball out three or four times, then there are many players from both teams that did that in the wet conditions.

Eric, Jack or Jarrod will not be dropped for the GWS game and nor should they. I don't see how they are responsible for the loss. IMO the loss of Oscar who was dominating a three game player (Conway) had a determinantal effect and to a lesser extent the 'Geelong weather'
Click to expand...

Great summary.

Where is the "Like a lot" option?
 


Jeremy Cameron's dangerous trip on Clugga resulting in a free kick to Cameron, 50m penalty to Cameron and a goal to Cameron followed up by a fine to Cameron from the MRO....heaven forbid!
 
T Rick said:
Jeremy Cameron's dangerous trip on Clugga resulting in a free kick to Cameron, 50m penalty to Cameron and a goal to Cameron followed up by a fine to Cameron from the MRO....heaven forbid!
Click to expand...

I literally lost my mind when this happened.

Hugh was bumped before the ball probably was within 5 m (marginal), Cameron kicks him in the shin (free kick and report), follows with a rugby league ankle grab (free kick) and jumps on his his back (marginal). HTB paid to Cameron (very quick whistle but apparently Hugh dived on the ball LOL). Cameron pushes Hugh's head into the ground. Hugh struggles to get up and 50 meters paid for not giving the ball back.

This proved to be the decisive point of the game.

Edit: I just watched Cameron knocking out Andrews in 2018 on YouTube. This is one of the most sickening hits I have ever seen and yet seems to be have forgotten once he moved to Geelong.
 

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Jeremy Cameron will always be a pathetic sniper in my eyes after that Andrews incident. He's always been partial to a dog act/snipe.
 
T Rick said:


Jeremy Cameron's dangerous trip on Clugga resulting in a free kick to Cameron, 50m penalty to Cameron and a goal to Cameron followed up by a fine to Cameron from the MRO....heaven forbid!
Click to expand...


Don't forget the banging his head into the turf with that repetitive jumper punching action. Much more force, intent and malice than most of the dreaded "sling" tackles that you see.

There are three free kicks to Clug there.

The initial, willful trip, the tackle around the ankles and then the head banging.

The first and the third actions are dangerous.....where was the citing from the MRO?

How did TWO umpires that were in close proximity to the incident totally miss (or ignore) the obvious free kick(s) to McCluggage?

Absolute howler of a decision, made worse by the ridiculous 50 just to rub it in.

Never mind......I feel so much better now that Cameron has been "fined".

That'll teach him.
 
3KZ is Football said:
Lyons had 11 disposals in a half of football.

In the Second Half Midfield Dunkley had 11 disposals and Rayner had 7.

Rayner had 14 for the entire game.
Ah Chee 13 for the entire game.
Tunstill 11 for the entire game.
Gardiner 10 for the entire game.
Lohmann 9 for the entire game.
Starcevich 9 for the entire game.

Lyons was not the problem.
Click to expand...
6 of Lyons disposals were in the last 7 or so minutes of the game - ie once the game was done and dusted. When it was on the line the guy who plays inside mid did nothing offensively or defensively. He was a significant problem for the whole time he was out there and was a failure as a sub and senior big body in a game that we got spanked in the middle and wet.

I'll give you Rayner and Ah Chee. Both were disappointing.

Tunstill in his first full game for a long time (that he well deserved getting a shot), I'll give a mulligan. He wasnt bad but wasnt the best.

But once again quoting raw disposal numbers for a tall forward (Gardiner), a small lockdown back (Starc) and a small forward in Lohman in comparison to an inside mid in the wet is completely stupid. The roles they are playing do not equate to big numbers and comparing them like that is nonsensical.
 
Elixuh said:
Awesome summation of the night.
Click to expand...
yep i suppose I could have stated the obvious, that we at times overdid the handballing considering the conditions and Geelong just seemed to receive a couple of favourable decisions and were more competitive at the contest, ran harder and were more accurate on goal...but we all knew that ;)
 
Finally ready emotionally to post about that. just such a flat loss and i traveled to watch it!

THE GOOD

Answerth - just tried really hard and think he is improving each week

Zorko - what exceptional form he is in. Right now no reason he can't play on but the end can come quickly when you are 35.

Berry's Effort - tried his guts out all match and got involved

THE BAD

Berry's kicking - i know it was wet but it was both skill errors AND decision errors. so many turnovers and OOF.

Payne's skill errors - it was never made for him but when this bloke stuffs up it's just so stark.

Starcevich on dangerous players - i thought he was starting to have a good season. Got torn to shreds against stengle. There was a moment which was just like the GF in which starce left stengle (last time Hill) in about 50m of space. it was inexplicable. maybe answerth needs to be the go to man. Starce seems to want to ball chase too much

THE UGLY

Our tactics - has to be a combination of coaching and players. the wetter it got the more we seemed to chip. we kept trying to pinpoint to the pocket in attack, even when we had no ruckman for the ensuring boundary throw in (no point in this tactic if you are so unlikely to get a goal from the ball-in). we kept letting the cats get rebound goals through our defensive press. and there forward line all night was so spacious comparted to ours.

Failing to adapt - to the wet as per above. to the lost ruck - daniher was looking dangerous and needed to be forward, and dunkley was missed / stuffed at having to ruck. why not try gardiner in there? or hipwood? we just don't try things.

Second half umpiring - we got a good run early and i thought it would cost us - the play with mccluggage was just farcical. kick that and scores level 3qt, but....

The last quarter - all on the line and we just looked uninterested. we had so much to play for. geelong were going for a bonus win. we are just not there mentally this year

HAVING SAID ALL THAT....

The amount of rain made it impossible to evaluate us in this game. But we are so far back now. Big night at the tribunal. GWS will be majorly depleted if all of coniglio, taylor, greene and hogan are out. suspect one or both get off. just a vibe. If we lose this weekend and go 2-5, then i will start the

SILVER LINING THREAD - Every side other than the lions has missed the finals at lease once. We have been up for a long time. Maybe this is the down year and mental break the club and players need. Finish say 10th having had a relaxed end to the year. Get a mid 6 draw rather than top 6 draw. Get a full pre season for the first time since 2019. Coleman and Doedee back, Will Aschroft fully fit, Levi Ashcroft added. Hopefully at least one more top tier season out of Daniher, Neale, Cameron. Going down to go up? Seemed to work wonders for the dees in 2021, pies in 2022, port in 2023.
 
luthor said:
Don't forget the banging his head into the turf with that repetitive jumper punching action. Much more force, intent and malice than most of the dreaded "sling" tackles that you see.

There are three free kicks to Clug there.

The initial, willful trip, the tackle around the ankles and then the head banging.

The first and the third actions are dangerous.....where was the citing from the MRO?

How did TWO umpires that were in close proximity to the incident totally miss (or ignore) the obvious free kick(s) to McCluggage?

Absolute howler of a decision, made worse by the ridiculous 50 just to rub it in.

Never mind......I feel so much better now that Cameron has been "fined".

That'll teach him.
Click to expand...
On top of all that, I don't see how Clug had prior in the first place
 
twhowler said:
Finally ready emotionally to post about that. just such a flat loss and i traveled to watch it!

THE GOOD

Answerth - just tried really hard and think he is improving each week

Zorko - what exceptional form he is in. Right now no reason he can't play on but the end can come quickly when you are 35.

Berry's Effort - tried his guts out all match and got involved

THE BAD

Berry's kicking - i know it was wet but it was both skill errors AND decision errors. so many turnovers and OOF.

Payne's skill errors - it was never made for him but when this bloke stuffs up it's just so stark.

Starcevich on dangerous players - i thought he was starting to have a good season. Got torn to shreds against stengle. There was a moment which was just like the GF in which starce left stengle (last time Hill) in about 50m of space. it was inexplicable. maybe answerth needs to be the go to man. Starce seems to want to ball chase too much

THE UGLY

Our tactics - has to be a combination of coaching and players. the wetter it got the more we seemed to chip. we kept trying to pinpoint to the pocket in attack, even when we had no ruckman for the ensuring boundary throw in (no point in this tactic if you are so unlikely to get a goal from the ball-in). we kept letting the cats get rebound goals through our defensive press. and there forward line all night was so spacious comparted to ours.

Failing to adapt - to the wet as per above. to the lost ruck - daniher was looking dangerous and needed to be forward, and dunkley was missed / stuffed at having to ruck. why not try gardiner in there? or hipwood? we just don't try things.

Second half umpiring - we got a good run early and i thought it would cost us - the play with mccluggage was just farcical. kick that and scores level 3qt, but....

The last quarter - all on the line and we just looked uninterested. we had so much to play for. geelong were going for a bonus win. we are just not there mentally this year

HAVING SAID ALL THAT....

The amount of rain made it impossible to evaluate us in this game. But we are so far back now. Big night at the tribunal. GWS will be majorly depleted if all of coniglio, taylor, greene and hogan are out. suspect one or both get off. just a vibe. If we lose this weekend and go 2-5, then i will start the

SILVER LINING THREAD - Every side other than the lions has missed the finals at lease once. We have been up for a long time. Maybe this is the down year and mental break the club and players need. Finish say 10th having had a relaxed end to the year. Get a mid 6 draw rather than top 6 draw. Get a full pre season for the first time since 2019. Coleman and Doedee back, Will Aschroft fully fit, Levi Ashcroft added. Hopefully at least one more top tier season out of Daniher, Neale, Cameron. Going down to go up? Seemed to work wonders for the dees in 2021, pies in 2022, port in 2023.
Click to expand...
I should have added Tackling to the ugly. we were out-tackled all night. most disappointing part of it all.
 
McIvor said:
I still don’t get why we don’t train some nights between 730 - 1030 at night when we actually play games - appreciate most club’s probably don’t- but why not when you play so many games in that time slot
Click to expand...
Agree with this. I'm sure sport science says you don't have to but my understanding of the Gabba is it gets pretty dewy etc and conditions are a bit different at night.
 
T Rick said:
Mind boggling miss by the umpires and nil media comment or exposure. It was actually a very dangerous trip that could have caused serious injury.
Click to expand...
Surely someone who was at the game can answer but was the vision at the ground impaired with how it was bucketing down? Much easier to see on TV with the cameras being so good now than on a rainy night game.
 
twhowler said:
The amount of rain made it impossible to evaluate us in this game. But we are so far back now. Big night at the tribunal. GWS will be majorly depleted if all of coniglio, taylor, greene and hogan are out. suspect one or both get off. just a vibe. If we lose this weekend and go 2-5, then i will start the
Click to expand...
Cannot see how Hogan who at the very least attempted to punch another player twice or Green who after jumping made no attempt to look like he was taking a mark can get off. It's the tribunal so anything can happen.
 

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