Preview Round 9: Essendon vs The Orange Team, Marvel Stadium, Saturday 11th May, 4:35pm

[Andronicus]

Hind is such an uninspiring inclusion.

 

[resurrector]

Hind is such an uninspiring inclusion.

Agreed. Did Shiel get caught pouring sand in B.Scotts petty tank or something?
How the **** is Hind getting a game over him!?

 

[Laverdeee]

Martin would be the all Australian half back if it were announced tomorrow, yet we want to move him to a wing…

 

[ghostdog]

Martin would be the all Australian half back if it were announced tomorrow, yet we want to move him to a wing…

Well played.

 

[MiguelM]

Frustrating that we were well on top of Pies & West Coast at times but failed the impact the scoreboard. Last week in particular should have been an easy 30+ win. We let them back in then the crowd were a factor.

Must take advantage of any dominance in the game this week, even if it is a short period. We are a chance but must be at or near our best for 4 quarters. At least we have the crowd on our side for once.

That we jump to 3rd if we win is amazing with the Draw we had.

 

[yodellinhank]

Agreed. Did Shiel get caught pouring sand in B.Scotts petty tank or something?
How the * is Hind getting a game over him!?

What has Shiel played, 1½ - 2½ reserve games?

 

[Red Black and Blue]

Roberts very stiff to not get a debut with Duursma out. Been killing it on the wing. Could even slot to half back if Scott wanted to move Martin up. Hard to see what more he could have done at this stage. Scotts long time aversion to playing kids still showing.

 

[ant555]

I don't get what you mean.

If you know 4 or 5 won't be part of the long term future, that is literally the reason to try a new player here or there. Our wins have been far from convincing, perhaps save WB and Hawthorn is negligible. I don't think playing Hayes or Roberts ahead of Hind this week would constitute 'messing around' with what we're building, because, we are building. It would actually have been beneficial to find out.

The only fact in this instance that makes it a moot point is that we had a VFL bye on the weekend.

I might be missing something, but I'm not getting your angle here.

Where we are at now they play who they think is the best side . No point tacking a wrecking ball to what you are building as far as form and attitude goes simply because there are some guys who will not be there next year . You say our wins have been far from convincing . Winning is winning. My angle is you do not mess with what is working even if you are a building side. There has to be some sort of reward for winning games just as much as there is reward for good VFL form.

 

[ant555]

Roberts very stiff to not get a debut with Duursma out. Been killing it on the wing. Could even slot to half back if Scott wanted to move Martin up. Hard to see what more he could have done at this stage. Scotts long time aversion to playing kids still showing.

Fake news.
Fact is he does play kids. He simply doesn't play all of them all the time.

 

[jdstorm]

Martin would be the all Australian half back if it were announced tomorrow, yet we want to move him to a wing…

Because he’s an all Australian there too

 

[Red Black and Blue]

Fake news.
Fact is he does play kids. He simply doesn't play all of them all the time.

Not fake news. He only plays the kids he has to. Facts are we don't have 22 fit mature age players on the list at any one time so there are some that must play. Playing the kids which is referring to a development style of rewarding kids with games when form is good for 3-4 weeks for senior players whose form is bad.

Last year equal lowest amount of debuts, this year equal lowest. This is indicative of his career.

 

[boncer34]

Roberts very stiff to not get a debut with Duursma out. Been killing it on the wing. Could even slot to half back if Scott wanted to move Martin up. Hard to see what more he could have done at this stage. Scotts long time aversion to playing kids still showing.

It was his career Killer at North. Refused to play the kids so when the board killed the experience and he had to play the kids none of them were ready.

 

[boncer34]

We are already playing Perkins, Durham, Caldwell, Cox, Jones and Davey Jr as youngish players in a winning side, and we play Reid every opportunity we get.

Playing a debutant against the best team in it (arguably) after having not played VFL the previous week is setting them up to fail. Roberts and Hayes will get their shot.

Very arguable since they were comprehensively dismantled last week.

 

[JayJ20]

Roberts very stiff to not get a debut with Duursma out. Been killing it on the wing. Could even slot to half back if Scott wanted to move Martin up. Hard to see what more he could have done at this stage. Scotts long time aversion to playing kids still showing.

Yeah Hind is in but he is probably going to be sub to give us run late in the game. I don't want Roberts to debut as a sub.

If I had a choice between playing Roberts vs a premiership contending team in GWS off the back of no VFL or vs the wooden spooners North after a VFL game, I'd choose the North game.

To counter the point about Scott, Davey hasn't been playing well for some time yet he is still picked ahead of Shiel and Hind. The midfield is also led by young players.

Hayes for Laverde is the only one that I would have done but I suspect Laverde makes way when Ridley and Reid return. Tsatas is probably going to play full time mid in the VFL for his development and come to the AFL in that position.

He should however debut next week.

 

[MiguelM]

If we played all the kids we would get beaten like north.

VFL has never been further from AFL level IMO.

Just look at the Cats model, they bring in the kids when they are totally ready and that is what Scott has said from the start. Some of the kids at Geelong wait years. Yeah, there are the exceptions in Harley Reid, Walsh for Blues, but they are outliers.

 

[andleanback]

I’d bet it’s Martin to Wing Hind to HB

Martin stays at half back. Hind will be the sub
Why would you change 2 positions when you only really have to change one.

 

[andleanback]

Yeah Hind is in but he is probably going to be sub to give us run late in the game. I don't want Roberts to debut as a sub.

If I had a choice between playing Roberts vs a premiership contending team in GWS off the back of no VFL or vs the wooden spooners North after a VFL game, I'd choose the North game.

To counter the point about Scott, Davey hasn't been playing well for some time yet he is still picked ahead of Shiel and Hind. The midfield is also led by young players.

Hayes for Laverde is the only one that I would have done but I suspect Laverde makes way when Ridley and Reid return. Tsatas is probably going to play full time mid in the VFL for his development and come to the AFL in that position.

He should however debut next week.

If they’re ready they’re ready. Doesn’t matter who they debut against. I’d rather see how he goes against a team like the giants tbh

 

[boncer34]

If we played all the kids we would get beaten like north.

VFL has never been further from AFL level IMO.

Just look at the Cats model, they bring in the kids when they are totally ready and that is what Scott has said from the start. Some of the kids at Geelong wait years. Yeah, there are the exceptions in Harley Reid, Walsh for Blues, but they are outliers.

Nobody has said play all the kids. There is a balance to maintain and whilst we're close, selections like Hind over Roberts demonstrates to me we're still on the conservative side.

 

[MiguelM]

Nobody has said play all the kids. There is a balance to maintain and whilst we're close, selections like Hind over Roberts demonstrates to me we're still on the conservative side.

Fair point but he is hardly refusing to play the kids. Shiel still cant get in but isn't tearing it up in the VFL either.

I think Roberts, Hayes etc may get a chance against North, Tigers maybe.

Tsatas, Davey have had a tatse too.

 

[ghostdog]

Where we are at now they play who they think is the best side . No point tacking a wrecking ball to what you are building as far as form and attitude goes simply because there are some guys who will not be there next year . You say our wins have been far from convincing . Winning is winning. My angle is you do not mess with what is working even if you are a building side. There has to be some sort of reward for winning games just as much as there is reward for good VFL form.

We'll have to agree to disagree. Playing a guy like Roberts this weekend would hardly have been a wrecking ball.

 

[Vander18]

Fake news.
Fact is he does play kids. He simply doesn't play all of them all the time.

Yeah, it’s not a playing kids thing.

He does seem to have settled on his core 25-26 guys however and I guess Roberts, Hayes et al will have to absolutely smash the door down to earn a game.

 

[ant555]

We'll have to agree to disagree. Playing a guy like Roberts this weekend would hardly have been a wrecking ball

What messages does it send if you drop a guy from a winning side for a bloke who has played 4 VFL games and didn’t play last week ?
My experience in coaching says it is a way to erode what you re building.
We do not know what set KPI’s are or are not being set by the players.

 

[boncer34]

Fair point but he is hardly refusing to play the kids. Shiel still cant get in but isn't tearing it up in the VFL either.

I think Roberts, Hayes etc may get a chance against North, Tigers maybe.

Tsatas, Davey have had a tatse too.

Not playing a senior guy isn't proof he doesn't play kids.

Fair points about Davey and Tsatas, especially Davey. Tsatas I'd argue has been stiff at time compared to others.

I mean look I'm really only disappointed in the Hind selection, I'd agree that Brad has been better at blooding youth this year.

My main original point was its a well documented weakness of his.

 

[faible]

That's fine but it doesn't address the premise of my post.

Playing kids is all well and good so long as they're playing in the actual position they need to be in, and are in form.

GWS off a VFL bye is probably not the best time to be bringing a debutant in if you don't absolutely need to, so whilst I would have liked to see Roberts in, if he plays a solid game in the VFL this week and debuts next week against North I think it's fine. Similar for Hayes.

We're still playing a significant amount of guys U24:

1. Caldwell
2. Jones
3. Martin
4. Durham
5. Cox
6. Perkins
7. Hobbs
8. Davey

Following this game we have:

North
Richmond
Gold Coast
Carlton
Bye

My hope is that we see Roberts and Hayes put in a good game at VFL level this weekend and get a shot in that run.

 

[jannissary]

i feel a bit disappointed that he's not debuting, but i can't imagine brad wouldn't give a couple of players a rest next week to blood hayes & roberts, especially if they perform well this week.

i could see that jye gets managed for a week to rest his calf to bring in tsatas, hind dropped and lavs rested in place of roberts and hayes.