Star Wars movie

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What a steaming pile of a movie.

So cheesy and clearly designed to sell merchandise.

Was there even a story worth telling in this movie? I forgave the shortcomings of the Force Awakens because I could see that they were trying to set up a new story arc, but this was pure indulgent shit with no purpose.

About 3/4 of the way through I was hoping Kylo Ren would kill everyone and the New Order take over the Universe to put me out of my misery of having to watch another garbage Star Wars movie like this one.

They have just killed Star Wars!!!
 
Saw it for the 2nd time last night, was actually better than the first time I saw it.

Tried to find the issues people are talking about but just can't see them. The story arcs work in the story, and lets be honest they are not super complicated. The character work is where the complexity comes in and that is what you pick up on more the 2nd time. Canto Bight is still a little slow but didn't drag as much this time (12 min of scenes to be precise). The superman moment also played a little better but could have done without.

Going
 
Moti said:
Saw it for the 2nd time last night, was actually better than the first time I saw it.

Tried to find the issues people are talking about but just can't see them. The story arcs work in the story, and lets be honest they are not super complicated. The character work is where the complexity comes in and that is what you pick up on more the 2nd time. Canto Bight is still a little slow but didn't drag as much this time (12 min of scenes to be precise). The superman moment also played a little better but could have done without.

Going
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The more I think about the movie days later, the more I like it. It is the first SW film that made me question a few things about the SW universe and movies in general, so at least the director did that. I'm still annoyed at the Marvel like one-liners, but I suppose that is the trend to attract the kids to the films, so I am all for it, as long as gags and completely change characters like Hux to make them work, doesn't become the norm of SW.
 

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Saw it last night, really enjoyed it.

My friend who is the same level of fan as me disliked it.

Problem? He went in with preconceived notions of what he wanted to happen (like most seem to have) and was annoyed when he didn't see what he wanted.

My recommendation is to go in with an open mind and you'll enjoy it more.

The out and out worst part of it is the shoe horned comedy similar to what they did in episode 7.

Absolutely no need to do that. They swing wildly from traditional star wars humour to unrequired Disney level humour.

After discussion with a few friends on what happened it seems a lot of people are angry at the major twists and are completely missing the point of what they are trying to accomplish.

As I've said since episode 7, don't judge them on a movie by movie basis, stuff that happens in 7 and 8 is to set up 9, they can't treat each movie as a stand alone.

If you sit back and think how each twist affects the next movie and each characters progression it's far more logical.
 
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DarkPhoenix said:
Saw it last night, really enjoyed it.

My friend who is the same level of fan as me disliked it.

Problem? He went in with preconceived notions of what he wanted to happen (like most seem to have) and was annoyed when he didn't see what he wanted.

My recommendation is to go in with an open mind and you'll enjoy it more.
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Problem is you needed to say that 2 years ago!

Seems to be the fan reaction, love it or hate. Only seen a few people going into grey territory.
 
Moti said:
Problem is you needed to say that 2 years ago!

Seems to be the fan reaction, love it or hate. Only seen a few people going into grey territory.
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The most overwhelming reaction I'm seeing from people is

"I don't know how to feel about it, I think I need to view it again to digest"
 
Kangaroos4eva said:
The more I think about the movie days later, the more I like it. It is the first SW film that made me question a few things about the SW universe and movies in general, so at least the director did that. I'm still annoyed at the Marvel like one-liners, but I suppose that is the trend to attract the kids to the films, so I am all for it, as long as gags and completely change characters like Hux to make them work, doesn't become the norm of SW.
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I think the main issue for a lot of people is the director went out of his way to physically squash a lot of the more popular fan discussions:
Rey's parents
Who is Snoke?
etc etc

That in itself has pissed a lot of people off.
 
I’m not enough of a fan to care about story arcs and the like. I just thought it was less entertaining than it could have been if it was tightened up a bit.

And Gasometer I think you meant “sack Star War”
 
DarkPhoenix said:
The most overwhelming reaction I'm seeing from people is

"I don't know how to feel about it, I think I need to view it again to digest"
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So its really a plot by Disney to fleece punters by making things overly convoluted and ambiguous? I haven't seen it yet and dunno when I will so don't mind me.

But usually having to see/read/listen to something again to have an opinion/sort out what you really think is the sign of a well made piece of work.
 
I reckon, thinking more about it, the only real issue I have with this movie are two things. One (and most importantly) Luke's character just isn't right, Mark Hamill himself has said it. Its like they wrote him as a different person to the originals, not the same person but older. Its a subtle thing and more of a feeling than anything concrete, but it just felt off. Secondly, I thought the main 'rebels vs First Order' plot was really boring to me, just didn't seem like a story worth telling. But, on the other hand, I loved Rey and Kylo's parts in this movie, though the acting in general was great, and like the way they went in a new direction.
 
Tas said:
Similar with the new Star Trek reboot, thrusts a minority female lead, a gay couple as major characters and intentionally making the nationalistic Klingons more grotesque (even rapey) than the original, especially when compared to the globalist federation. The director made a comment that he modelled the Klingons based on Trump and his supporters and the medium is being abused for political manipulation to make nationalism seem abhorrent.
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Agree with parts of what you have to say, but this is just ridiculously stupid. How is casting Sonequa Martin Green (who is a fantastic actress) as the lead in a series 'thrusting' anything on anyone?? Is it 'thrusting' upon us the fact that black women exist?? Similarly with the gay couple, why are you phrasing this statement in order to imply that having a gay couple as major characters is somehow a problem? Again, this might not be intentional, but it reads like you're saying that its ok to have gay characters in a show, as long as they aren't in the foreground too much, which is pretty ugly. And, once again, Anthony Rapp is a fantastic actor in his own right which, as you acknowledge later in this post, is the only thing that matters.
 

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Gasometer said:
Luke was a whinny biatch in the original series.

He became a whinny old man in LJ.

Get with it.
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Its a Skywalker thing. Anakin was no better.

Ben isnt whinny so much as throws temper tantrums at the drop of a hat.

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk
 
remfan101 said:
One (and most importantly) Luke's character just isn't right, Mark Hamill himself has said it. Its like they wrote him as a different person to the originals, not the same person but older. Its a subtle thing and more of a feeling than anything concrete, but it just felt off.
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I had some issues with it but that was one that went away on rewatching it.
Not sure on the need for tags so it's getting them anyway.
I felt:
On first watching, they've turned Luke into a joke(r).
That the humour within the film broadly didn't sit right

On second watching they turned him into Yoda on Dagobah, however instead of hiding from the Empire he's hiding from himself.

The exiles are different in that Luke shut down, Yoda did not. Both wind up kooky as f***.

I barely even noticed the humour the second time. Some of it actually made me appreciate how hard Luke was trying to push Rey away. The green tiddie milk scene to be specific.

Contextually that works for me, not only did he fail, he failed with his Nephew and he failed Leia. He wants nothing to do with it because he doesn't want to fail again. Is doing anything to try and push Rey away. If you take away confrontation this leaves him as a Jedi with few avenues to push away a persistent wannabe trainee.

In terms of it 'not being right' whilst Hamill may not have liked it it echo's his master. Which is pretty Star Wars.
QuiGon questions as Dooku questioned.
ObiWan goes against the will of the council as QuiGon went against the will of the council.
Luke goes into exile and gets a bit weird as Yoda went into exile and got a bit weird.

Question for you, does the scene in Empire where Luke cuts the arm off the wampa suit Luke's character?

Hamill didn't think so.

I would really like to see kooky force ghost Luke just hanging out feeding Ben's doubt.
 
I loved it. As a young teen when the first film came out, I am besotted by Star Wars but also don't look to it for emotional or any kind of depth. Moments like Leia and Holdo are just an unexpected cherry on top, although of course everything to do with Leia carried emotional punch way beyond what was initially meant. I am just so relieved they finally gave her more to do while they could.

And I love the democratisation of the Force - not all about the skywalker royal family.
 
As per the last two Star Wars releases, we'll be taking the kids to see it at the Drive-In on NYE. I'm just hoping the car battery can last the whole film unlike the last two, utterly ruining the experience as the radio cut out and we had to listen to the sound from nearby cars FFS.
 
remfan101 said:
Agree with parts of what you have to say, but this is just ridiculously stupid. How is casting Sonequa Martin Green (who is a fantastic actress) as the lead in a series 'thrusting' anything on anyone?? Is it 'thrusting' upon us the fact that black women exist??
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I liked her in Walking Dead and am glad she is in the show, but if in the lead up to a shows release they promote that the lead is this identity or that identity and make a focus of it to me it comes off as a token rather than speaking about the actor or actress' talent. When i see a movie lead by Morgan Freeman they don't say hey look, here is a PoC as a lead, this is a diverse cast, blah, blah, blah. You know Morgan Freeman is a good actor and his talent speaks for itself, i just happen to respect him even more because he is totally against identity politics. Perhaps it is more the media's fault, I am not sure.

Similarly with the gay couple, why are you phrasing this statement in order to imply that having a gay couple as major characters is somehow a problem?
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I didn't say it was a problem. I mean it is a problem if it is just a token, I am not sure if it is or isn't at this point in time. When you watched a show like STNG for example, they went into painful detail (almost unwatchable at times) about the relationships of all the major characters, it was part of the show's style, it was a drama in space so you knew everything about everyone's private lives. So far this show hasn't really gone into much detail about the private lives of most characters but there is a lot of focus on the gay couple's relationship. To me, this sticks out more as a token because this show doesn't have that same style. Perhaps in following seasons they will give as much air time to the other characters' relationship, but at present it feels like it is just a token to hit progressive ticking points and at present it wouldn't have made a significant difference to the characters or story in general if their private life ended up on the cutting room floor.

Again, this might not be intentional, but it reads like you're saying that its ok to have gay characters in a show, as long as they aren't in the foreground too much, which is pretty ugly. And, once again, Anthony Rapp is a fantastic actor in his own right which, as you acknowledge later in this post, is the only thing that matters.
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I am not saying that at all. I don't mind if they delve deeply into relationships, if just doesn't seem that it is part of this show in general so feels a bit forced to me. At the end of the day, it wouldn't matter to me if the only relationships in a show are not heterosexual, it kind of feels weird that the only two things we focus on with Rapp's character is his lore-breaking engine shenanigans and his relationship with the doctor, his character is paper thin in terms of depth, we don't really know pretty much anything about the character... other than he is gay and that seems to require a significant amount of his character's air time. To me that is bad writing. It is hard to relate to his character and it is not because of his orientation.

Even though we are starting to cop a bit more of the love interest with the main character, it is relatively speaking a very minor investment of her character time and we get to explore her character on many different levels and in a lot of depth which is why we can appreciate the character a lot more imo, it seems to be written a lot better than most of the others.

My favourite is captain Malfoy, perhaps it is his acting more than the writing, but it seems to be well done and the extent of his relationship aired was one scene were he was involved with the admiral, and just that small snippet showed a lot of depth about his character based on how he reacted towards her when he realised she was an obstacle and he couldn't manipulate her any longer. That one short relationship scene was critical in terms of showing us what his character was like and what he was capable of doing. To me that was a strong use of the relationship time. I just don't feel they got much out of the time they invested into showing Rapp's relationship.

I just have an issue with bad writing and forced identity politics used to attempt to promote something.
 
The real reason Kylo hates Luke.

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Tas said:
I liked her in Walking Dead and am glad she is in the show, but if in the lead up to a shows release they promote that the lead is this identity or that identity and make a focus of it to me it comes off as a token rather than speaking about the actor or actress' talent. When i see a movie lead by Morgan Freeman they don't say hey look, here is a PoC as a lead, this is a diverse cast, blah, blah, blah. You know Morgan Freeman is a good actor and his talent speaks for itself, i just happen to respect him even more because he is totally against identity politics. Perhaps it is more the media's fault, I am not sure.



I didn't say it was a problem. I mean it is a problem if it is just a token, I am not sure if it is or isn't at this point in time. When you watched a show like STNG for example, they went into painful detail (almost unwatchable at times) about the relationships of all the major characters, it was part of the show's style, it was a drama in space so you knew everything about everyone's private lives. So far this show hasn't really gone into much detail about the private lives of most characters but there is a lot of focus on the gay couple's relationship. To me, this sticks out more as a token because this show doesn't have that same style. Perhaps in following seasons they will give as much air time to the other characters' relationship, but at present it feels like it is just a token to hit progressive ticking points and at present it wouldn't have made a significant difference to the characters or story in general if their private life ended up on the cutting room floor.



I am not saying that at all. I don't mind if they delve deeply into relationships, if just doesn't seem that it is part of this show in general so feels a bit forced to me. At the end of the day, it wouldn't matter to me if the only relationships in a show are not heterosexual, it kind of feels weird that the only two things we focus on with Rapp's character is his lore-breaking engine shenanigans and his relationship with the doctor, his character is paper thin in terms of depth, we don't really know pretty much anything about the character... other than he is gay and that seems to require a significant amount of his character's air time. To me that is bad writing. It is hard to relate to his character and it is not because of his orientation.

Even though we are starting to cop a bit more of the love interest with the main character, it is relatively speaking a very minor investment of her character time and we get to explore her character on many different levels and in a lot of depth which is why we can appreciate the character a lot more imo, it seems to be written a lot better than most of the others.

My favourite is captain Malfoy, perhaps it is his acting more than the writing, but it seems to be well done and the extent of his relationship aired was one scene were he was involved with the admiral, and just that small snippet showed a lot of depth about his character based on how he reacted towards her when he realised she was an obstacle and he couldn't manipulate her any longer. That one short relationship scene was critical in terms of showing us what his character was like and what he was capable of doing. To me that was a strong use of the relationship time. I just don't feel they got much out of the time they invested into showing Rapp's relationship.

I just have an issue with bad writing and forced identity politics used to attempt to promote something.
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Again, I agree with a lot of what you have to say, just not in regards to ST discovery. I really enjoyed it, and found both of the elements you raised nothing that took away from the story. I definitely have an issue with bad writing, but don't see how you can have an issue with having minorities in prominent roles. For me, the only real question should be in regards to the quality of the writing, directing, acting and storytelling; not the ethnic background or sexual orientation of characters. In this case, ST discovery tells the story of an African-American woman and a gay couple, and that has absolutely 0 bearing on the quality of the show.
 
remfan101 said:
Again, I agree with a lot of what you have to say, just not in regards to ST discovery.
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It didn't bother me too much as I try to tune out the white noise when it comes to politics, however, I find it disturbing that entertainment media is being used for political manipulation, even if I am fine with the message of diversity they are using it for now (and I am), it is very dangerous to be ambivalent towards excusing that kind of behaviour because it may be used in the future for negative type of propaganda. I just wish they keep current day political posturing out of entertainment media.

I really enjoyed it, and found both of the elements you raised nothing that took away from the story. I definitely have an issue with bad writing, but don't see how you can have an issue with having minorities in prominent roles. For me, the only real question should be in regards to the quality of the writing, directing, acting and storytelling; not the ethnic background or sexual orientation of characters. In this case, ST discovery tells the story of an African-American woman and a gay couple, and that has absolutely 0 bearing on the quality of the show.
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Not sure how many times I can say I do not have issue with minorities in prominent roles before you stop using it as an argument. I said I do not like if a minority is a token and you can generally identify a token when there is a lot of promotion towards "see how progressive we are by using minorities".
 
Yeah... I'll say that after the thing that was new Ghostbusters they better leave Caddyshack the hell alone.

As for TLJ... so many things they should have left for the final movie. Kind of takes the sails out of it to make so many "whammies" happen so early.
 

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