Stats observations

[emuboy]

Tonight's Port Adelaide vs. Western Bulldogs Preliminary Final is a bit of an unusual one.

These teams were in the 1999 finals series together but did not meet, however after this were not in the same finals series again for 21 years until both qualified in 2020 again without playing each other. This is remarkable as both the Power and Dogs made the finals fairly regularly in these seasons, just never at the same time. Tonight is the first time these teams have ever played a final against each other.

 

[X_box_X]

Bailey Smith

3

Bailey Smith

Age

24

Ht

185cm

Wt

86kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

18.3

5star

K

8.5

3star

HB

9.8

5star

M

2.3

2star

T

3.8

5star

CL

2.7

4star

D

19.8

5star

K

9.6

4star

HB

10.2

5star

M

1.8

2star

T

3.2

4star

CL

3.2

4star

D

14.8

4star

K

7.6

3star

HB

7.2

5star

M

2.0

3star

T

3.4

5star

CL

1.6

4star

his kicked the final goal in all three finals he has played this year.

I wonder how this stacks up. Have any players kicked the final goal in more than three consecutive finals?

 

[Ron The Bear]

Number of players still alive from grand finals (taken mostly from australianfootball.com)

1962 28
1961 26
1960 23
1959 20
1958 19
1957 17
1956 15
1955 11
1954 13
1953 6
1952 7
1951 4
1950 2
1949 -
1948 2
1947 1
1946 1

Would be good to hear recollections from the surviving players of 1954 if they're up to it.

 

[X_box_X]

Number of players still alive from grand finals (taken mostly from australianfootball.com)

1962 28
1961 26
1960 23
1959 20
1958 19
1957 17
1956 15
1955 11
1954 13
1953 6
1952 7
1951 4
1950 2
1949 -
1948 2
1947 1
1946 1

Would be good to hear recollections from the surviving players of 1954 if they're up to it.

Martin Flanigan's "A Wink from the Universe" written after the Bulldogs' 2016 flag mentions there were six surviving members of the '54 premiership team. I think all six players were interviewed for the book. I have the book at home and I'll be able to have a look in more detail tomorrow.

 

[Ron The Bear]

Martin Flanigan's "A Wink from the Universe" written after the Bulldogs' 2016 flag mentions there were six surviving members of the '54 premiership team. I think all six players were interviewed for the book. I have the book at home and I'll be able to have a look in more detail tomorrow.

I'll have a look around for it. Obviously it's the same six still with us.

 

[North park]

GWS have now played in 5 finals series. They have won at least 1 match and lost at least 1 match in each finals series - the first team to do so.

They have some way to go in order to beat the all-time records though.

Geelong lost at least 1 match in its first 14 finals series, stretching from 1897 - 1934. 1937 was the first finals series where Geelong did not lose a match.

North Melbourne lost at least 1 match in its first 19 finals series, stretching from 1945 - 1995. 1996 was the first finals series where North Melbourne did not lose a match.

St. Kilda have lost at least 1 match in all 26 finals series it has played in. In its 1966 Premiership year, St. Kilda lost the Second Semi Final before winning the Preliminary Final and Grand Final.

Conversely, Hawthorn won at least 1 match in its first 17 finals series, stretching from 1957 - 1989. 1990 was the first finals series where Hawthorn failed to win at least 1 match - losing the Elimination Final to Melbourne.

 

[Ron The Bear]

Highest ratio of finals:total games (min. 50 games)

Ratio	Player	Gms	Fnls	Clubs	Career
21.21%	Lambert, Harold L.	99	21	Es	1940-1951
17.19%	Twomey, Bill P.	64	11	Co,Ha	1918-1934
16.67%	Randall, Brian	54	9	Ri	1941-1945
16.39%	Miers, Gryan	61	10	Ge	2019-2021
16.13%	Bradley, Bob	62	10	Es	1947-1950
15.87%	Hassell, George	63	10	Es	1946-1950
15.79%	Harper, Bert	76	12	Es	1943-1952
15.56%	McClure, Bob	90	14	Es	1946-1951
15.00%	Weston, Paul	60	9	Es	1983-1985
15.00%	Jinks, Fred	60	9	Ca	1906-1909
14.93%	Fergie, Clive	67	10	Fi	1915-1924
14.78%	Cable, Barry	115	17	NM	1970-1977
14.68%	Menegola, Sam	109	16	Ge	2016-2021
14.52%	Andrew, C. Bruce	62	9	Co	1928-1934
14.47%	Todd, Ron	76	11	Co	1935-1939
14.41%	Fisher, Charlie	111	16	Ca	1914-1921
14.29%	Graham, Jack	77	11	Ri	2017-2021
14.29%	Graham, Ian L.	63	9	Co	1963-1969
14.29%	Hammond, Charlie	154	22	Ca	1905-1918
14.14%	Drummond, Tom	99	14	Co,Sy	1916-1926
14.13%	Green, Gordon V.	92	13	Ca	1911-1921
14.04%	Colechin, Bert	57	8	Co	1916-1921
14.00%	Hiskins, Fred	50	7	Es	1900-1906
14.00%	Fenton-Smith, Dick	50	7	Me	1957-1959
13.94%	Rohan, Gary	165	23	Sy,Ge	2010-2021

 

[stemline]

Highest ratio of finals:total games (min. 50 games)

Could you please do this for finals wins:total wins?

 

[Ron The Bear]

Could you please do this for finals wins:total wins?

Min. 50 wins

Ratio	Player	Wins	Fnls Wins	Clubs	Career
18.67%	Lambert, Harold L.	75	14	Es	1940-1951
16.98%	Graham, Jack	53	9	Ri	2017-2021
16.13%	Broad, Nathan	62	10	Ri	2016-2021
16.00%	Jinks, Fred	50	8	Ca	1906-1909
15.94%	Nankervis, Toby	69	11	Sy,Ri	2015-2021
15.07%	Freeborn, Glenn	73	11	NM,Co	1995-2003
14.71%	Cable, Barry	68	10	NM	1970-1977
14.58%	Pike, Martin	144	21	Me,Fi,NM,Br	1993-2005
14.00%	Harper, Bert	50	7	Es	1943-1952
13.85%	Capuano, Matthew	65	9	NM,St	1994-2003
13.79%	Adams, Frank	116	16	Me	1953-1964
13.75%	Norris, Charlie	80	11	Co,Fi	1910-1918
13.70%	Caine, Frank	73	10	Ca,Es	1905-1914
13.70%	Rioli, Daniel	73	10	Ri	2016-2021
13.64%	Keating, Clark	88	12	Br	1996-2006
13.21%	Dunkley, Josh	53	7	WB	2016-2021
13.21%	McEwin, Ron	53	7	Es	1948-1952
13.04%	May, Wally	69	9	Es	1947-1952
12.96%	Chandler, Neil	54	7	Ca,St	1968-1974
12.82%	Castagna, Jason	78	10	Ri	2016-2021
12.79%	Case, Geoff	86	11	Me	1953-1962
12.66%	Fontaine, Fred	79	10	Fi	1898-1907
12.50%	Marquis, Peter	64	8	Me	1953-1958
12.50%	Gumbleton, Frank	72	9	NM	1970-1979
12.50%	Green, Gordon V.	64	8	Ca	1911-1921
12.50%	Hammond, Charlie	120	15	Ca	1905-1918
12.50%	McClure, Bob	72	9	Es	1946-1951

Dunkley rises to 7th if the Bulldogs win the GF.

 

[X_box_X]

 

[X_box_X]

 

[RedmanWasHere]

Swampy is a gun.

 

[Goggin Our Best]

Min. 50 wins

Ratio	Player	Wins	Fnls Wins	Clubs	Career
18.67%	Lambert, Harold L.	75	14	Es	1940-1951
16.98%	Graham, Jack	53	9	Ri	2017-2021
16.13%	Broad, Nathan	62	10	Ri	2016-2021
16.00%	Jinks, Fred	50	8	Ca	1906-1909
15.94%	Nankervis, Toby	69	11	Sy,Ri	2015-2021
15.07%	Freeborn, Glenn	73	11	NM,Co	1995-2003
14.71%	Cable, Barry	68	10	NM	1970-1977
14.58%	Pike, Martin	144	21	Me,Fi,NM,Br	1993-2005
14.00%	Harper, Bert	50	7	Es	1943-1952
13.85%	Capuano, Matthew	65	9	NM,St	1994-2003
13.79%	Adams, Frank	116	16	Me	1953-1964
13.75%	Norris, Charlie	80	11	Co,Fi	1910-1918
13.70%	Caine, Frank	73	10	Ca,Es	1905-1914
13.70%	Rioli, Daniel	73	10	Ri	2016-2021
13.64%	Keating, Clark	88	12	Br	1996-2006
13.21%	Dunkley, Josh	53	7	WB	2016-2021
13.21%	McEwin, Ron	53	7	Es	1948-1952
13.04%	May, Wally	69	9	Es	1947-1952
12.96%	Chandler, Neil	54	7	Ca,St	1968-1974
12.82%	Castagna, Jason	78	10	Ri	2016-2021
12.79%	Case, Geoff	86	11	Me	1953-1962
12.66%	Fontaine, Fred	79	10	Fi	1898-1907
12.50%	Marquis, Peter	64	8	Me	1953-1958
12.50%	Gumbleton, Frank	72	9	NM	1970-1979
12.50%	Green, Gordon V.	64	8	Ca	1911-1921
12.50%	Hammond, Charlie	120	15	Ca	1905-1918
12.50%	McClure, Bob	72	9	Es

Dunkley rises to 7th if the Bulldogs win the GF.

One player on your list their Neil Chandler - i can remember him when i was a kid

Carlton had a gun side back then - but he seemed to be the permanent 19th or 20th man for the Blues - especially in finals

 

[worbod]

It has been mentioned in the media that the grand final this year between Melbourne and Western Bulldogs is to be played on September 25, which is the same date as when the two teams met in the grand final of 1954. The only other time this has happened between two teams is when Carlton and Collingwood played on September 26 in the grand finals of 1970 and 1981.

 

[emuboy]

Ollie Wines has become the first Port Adelaide player to win the Brownlow since the team commenced in 1997, the Power's 25th season.

 

[Ron The Bear]

Field umpire Raymond King, officiating in his 7th match in a career total of 19, caused a 1967 Brownlow vote to be declared informal when he attempted to split the "1" vote between Hawthorn's Ian Bremner and Collingwood's Len Thompson. Thompson might've been unlucky going by the stats.

AFL Tables - Collingwood v Hawthorn - Sat, 24-Jun-1967 2:20 PM - Match Stats

 

[emuboy]

While many people (myself included) are thrilled for Melbourne breaking their long premiership drought tonight, there is one party that might not be too pleased, and this party is the St Kilda football club, who have been given back an unwanted record they had for a long time but not since 1966.

This record is the longest premiership drought. In the early years of the competition 6 of the 8 foundation clubs won premierships in the first 10 years except Geelong and St Kilda. The Cats and Saints held the longest premiership drought until 1925 when the Geelong won the GF, and from there it was the Saints record alone for 41 long seasons until St Kilda finally won their first flag in 1966.

The record then went to North Melbourne which the Kangaroos held until breaking through for their first flag in 1975, and was in turn passed on to South Melbourne which hadn't won a premiership since 1933. The Swans held the longest premiership drought until 2005 when they defeated West Coast, and with no premiership since 1954 the longest drought was then held by the Bulldogs for 11 seasons until they defeated Sydney Swans in 2016.

Melbourne, its last flag in 1964 therefore inherited the longest premiership drought after the Bulldogs win, but now the Demons have won the 2021 premiership the unwanted record goes back to St Kilda. And knowing St Kilda, I get the feeling it will stay there for a long time.

 

[North park]

Melbourne scored 16.5.101 in the second half of the 2021 Grand Final. This is the highest score ever in the second half of a Grand Final - Tom McDonald

25

Tom Mcdonald

Age

32

Ht

195cm

Wt

101kg

Pos.

D/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

16.4

4star

K

9.7

4star

HB

6.7

4star

M

5.6

5star

T

1.9

4star

MG

261.8

4star

D

8.0

2star

K

5.0

2star

HB

3.0

2star

M

3.4

3star

T

0.6

1star

MG

135.6

2star

D

13.8

4star

K

6.8

3star

HB

7.0

5star

M

4.4

4star

T

1.4

4star

's after the siren goal taking Melbourne past the 15.5.95 Essendon scored in the second half of the 1985 Grand Final.

The highest score in the first half of a Grand Final is 18.6.124 by Carlton in 1972.

 

[RedmanWasHere]

Melbourne scored 16.5.101 in the second half of the 2021 Grand Final. This is the highest score ever in the second half of a Grand Final - Tom McDonald's after the siren goal taking Melbourne past the 15.5.95 Essendon scored in the second half of the 1985 Grand Final.

The highest score in the first half of a Grand Final is 18.6.124 by Carlton in 1972.

18.6 gives us a score of 114.

IIRC, Richmond's score was 69.

 

[North park]

In 2021, Melbourne finished on top of the ladder and won the premiership after missing finals in 2020, to end a 57 year premiership drought.

The previous team to finish on top of the ladder and win the premiership the year after missing finals was Geelong in 2007. That ended a 44 year premiership drought for the Cats.

 

[worbod]

Had Western Bulldogs won the grand final this year they would have taken the premiership after having lost their last three home and away games. This has happened only once before (ignoring 1916 where Fitzroy lost their last 9 in a row before becoming premiers). The Melbourne team of 1960, having made it to top of the ladder with a 14-1 record, lost their last three home and away games by margins of 9, 8 and 13 points and still finished on top. They then proceeded to win the second semi-final by 62 points and the grand final by 48 points.

 

[emuboy]

Three clubs this year ended long droughts for individual awards.

Ollie Wines won the Brownlow Medal, the first Port Adelaide player to win the award since they commenced in 1997.

A Melbourne player had never won a Norm Smith Medal before, but Christian Petracca

5

Christian Petracca

Age

29

Ht

187cm

Wt

94kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

19.4

5star

K

9.5

4star

HB

9.8

5star

M

3.5

4star

T

3.0

5star

CL

2.5

4star

D

24.4

5star

K

10.4

4star

HB

14.0

5star

M

3.5

3star

T

3.6

4star

CL

3.4

4star

D

19.0

5star

K

7.8

3star

HB

11.2

5star

M

3.0

3star

T

3.8

5star

CL

2.0

4star

was best afield in Melbourne's drought breaking premiership win over the Western Bulldogs the Demons finally won the award named after their legendary coach.

Since the merger of Woodville and West Torrens after the 1990 SANFL season, the Magarey Medal had eluded the WWT Eagles in 30 years since. West Torrens had not had a Magarey Medal winner since Lindsay Head way back in 1963, while the only Woodville player to ever win the award was Malcolm Blight in 1974. However when James Tsitas tied with South Adelaide's Bryce Gibbs for this years award he became the first Eagle to win a Magarey Medal.

 

[Interceptor]

Since the merger of Woodville and West Torrens after the 1990 SANFL season, the Magarey Medal had eluded the WWT Eagles in 30 years since. West Torrens had not had a Magarey Medal winner since Lindsay Head way back in 1963, while the only Woodville player to ever win the award was Malcolm Blight in 1974. However when James Tsitas tied with South Adelaide's Bryce Gibbs for this years award he became the first Eagle to win a Magarey Medal.

Blight won in 1972.

 

[emuboy]

When North Melbourne finished last this year after a dismal season, it was a good omen for Melbourne's premiership. This is the fourth time that Melbourne has claimed the premiership while North Melbourne languished at the bottom of the ladder and subsequently collected the wooden spoon - 1926, 1940, 1956 and 2021.

There have also been four seasons where Hawthorn won the premiership and St Kilda ran last - 1983, 1986, 1988 & 2014.

While big rivals from the 1980s onwards, there are five years where Essendon were premiers while Hawthorn finished last, mainly due to the Bombers doing well and the Hawks badly in the 1940s - 1942, 1946, 1949, 1950 and 1965.

The record seems to be Essendon and St Kilda. Six times Essendon have won the flag while St Kilda ended up at the bottom of the ladder - 1897, 1901, 1924, 1984, 1985 and 2000.

 

[North park]

In the last 50 years, there has only been one Grand Final where neither coach had won a premiership during their V/AFL playing career - 2013 Alastair Clarkson (Hawthorn) v Ross Lyon (Fremantle).

All of the other 49 Grand Finals involved at least one coach who had won a premiership as a player, with 14 having both coaches with a premiership win as a player.

Of the 50 Grand Finals, 33 have been won by a coach who also won a premiership as a player, while 17 have been one by a coach who did not win a premiership as a player. So a ratio of nearly 2 to 1.