The Contested Ball

[scroda]

From today's Age

Club vs Opposition

Richmond...................+108
Adelaide....................+79
Western Bulldogs........+75
Geelong....................+65
Collingwood...............+47
Sydney.....................+37
North Melbourne.........+2
Brisbane Lions.............-2
West Coast................-9
Carlton.....................-23
Hawthorn.................-38
Melbourne................-50
Essendon.................-55
St Kilda...................-69
Fremantle................-80
Port Adelaide...........-87


If only the Tigers could use the ball efficiently and with skill. But that's been the "If Only" since I can remember...

 

[InCase]

They only get so much contested ball because they kick it to the opposition and have to go retrieve it

 

[chelseacarlton]

They only get so much contested ball because they kick it to the opposition and have to go retrieve it

agreed if you dont hit targets its always gunna be in the oppositions hands
start hitting targets tiges and youll start winning those tight games

 

[Bollox]

Most stats truly pale into insignifcance compared to the true decider of where your team is on the ladder in a relatively even comp.

GOAL KICKING ACCURACY

Noone talks about it coz its so basic in principle....but in these days of fast rebound and set attacking plays out of defence it is truly the most important factor by a country mile.

I dont give a rats arse if your midfielder uses baseball bats to get the ball fwd...if u kick a pt the chance are it'll go staright back the other end in a hurry for a goal.

 

[the_interloper]

From today's Age

Club vs Opposition

Richmond...................+108
Adelaide....................+79
Western Bulldogs........+75
Geelong....................+65
Collingwood...............+47
Sydney.....................+37
North Melbourne.........+2
Brisbane Lions.............-2
West Coast................-9
Carlton.....................-23
Hawthorn.................-38
Melbourne................-50
Essendon.................-55
St Kilda...................-69
Fremantle................-80
Port Adelaide...........-87


If only the Tigers could use the ball efficiently and with skill. But that's been the "If Only" since I can remember...

I'm guessing that a lot of that is due to "Axel" Foley?

 

[Splash]

From today's Age

Club vs Opposition

Richmond...................+108
Adelaide....................+79
Western Bulldogs........+75
Geelong....................+65
Collingwood...............+47
Sydney.....................+37
North Melbourne.........+2
Brisbane Lions.............-2
West Coast................-9
Carlton.....................-23
Hawthorn.................-38
Melbourne................-50
Essendon.................-55
St Kilda...................-69
Fremantle................-80
Port Adelaide...........-87


If only the Tigers could use the ball efficiently and with skill. But that's been the "If Only" since I can remember...

Just another example stats are overused

 

[xamol]

From today's Age

Club vs Opposition

Richmond...................+108
Adelaide....................+79
Western Bulldogs........+75
Geelong....................+65
Collingwood...............+47
Sydney.....................+37
North Melbourne.........+2
Brisbane Lions.............-2
West Coast................-9
Carlton.....................-23
Hawthorn.................-38
Melbourne................-50
Essendon.................-55
St Kilda...................-69
Fremantle................-80
Port Adelaide...........-87


If only the Tigers could use the ball efficiently and with skill. But that's been the "If Only" since I can remember...

Lol, well done P Burgoyne. The king of uncontested possessions.

 

[Power King]

^Despite getting more contested ball than anyone else (at least on the DT) last weekend

Consider his role in the team, and that will tell you why he gets a lot of uncontested ball. Having said that, he still gets more contested ball than most.

 

[AngelEyes]

From today's Age

Club vs Opposition

Richmond...................+108
Adelaide....................+79
Western Bulldogs........+75
Geelong....................+65
Collingwood...............+47
Sydney.....................+37
North Melbourne.........+2
Brisbane Lions.............-2
West Coast................-9
Carlton.....................-23
Hawthorn.................-38
Melbourne................-50
Essendon.................-55
St Kilda...................-69
Fremantle................-80
Port Adelaide...........-87


If only the Tigers could use the ball efficiently and with skill. But that's been the "If Only" since I can remember...

Sounds like a team that enjoys hard contested football like you expect in finals...

 

[AngelEyes]

Just another example stats are overused

Why because it suggests Hawthorn are soft?

Its not too different to how one would expect and despite a couple of glarring differences such as Hawthorn - it roughly depicts where clubs are on the ladder.

I don't see how its irrelevant like you pan to suggest.

 

[Harry Yorkie]

Why because it suggests Hawthorn are soft?

Its not too different to how one would expect and despite a couple of glarring differences such as Hawthorn - it roughly depicts where clubs are on the ladder.

I don't see how its irrelevant like you pan to suggest.

The team that are last on that table made a grand final last year and Hawthorn beat your lot in a final last year as well as beating you this year.

Maybe not an irrelevant stat but not as important as the one on the scoreboard.

I don't know if it suggests a team is soft, in all honesty would you label Mitchell, Hodge, Sewell and Lewis as soft? We play a brand of football that best suits our players kicking, handballing and running skills ie uncontested. Seems to be working ok so far.

 

[Walsh Bay]

The Hawthorn stat shows just how vital, irreplaceable even, Sam Mitchell is in that side.

 

[IddyBiddy]

The Hawthorn stat shows just how vital, irreplaceable even, Sam Mitchell is in that side.

Easily accounted for us without him...

 

[Exhale You]

GOAL KICKING ACCURACY

Noone talks about it coz its so basic in principle....but in these days of fast rebound and set attacking plays out of defence it is truly the most important factor by a country mile.

Fremantle and Essendon had vastly superior 'goal kicking accuracy' in 2007 than the premiers.

They finished 11th and 12th respectively.

 

[Wallaby]

People get a bit hung up on contested possessions - it's still just one possession, and worth as much as an uncontested possession. In fact, an uncontested possession is probably more valuable, since then you are likely to be able to dispose of the pill better, not being under pressure.

It's like the cover-drive to the boundary versus nudging the ball down to fine leg four times - both worth four runs - one looks much better - the other is much less risky.

I would rather have 10 uncontested possessions inside the forward 50 than 8 contested.

 

[jonoman89]

a lot of those teams in the minus territory dont have as many hardball gets because they simply don't lose posession as much i.e. hawthorn.

 

[Bollox]

Fremantle and Essendon had vastly superior 'goal kicking accuracy' in 2007 than the premiers.

They finished 11th and 12th respectively.

And the team that wins the most contested ball isnt even in the top 8...and by the time u've added up all the other stats there's only ever one or two that stand out between 1st on the ladder and 16th...and they can reverse the following year and the result is still the same.

Sydney alone have a lost a minimum of 6 and likely 10 premiership pts just for starters simply by poor kicking at the death ALREADY this yr. We can win the contested possessions all game and lose...we can lose the contested possessions yet win.

The entire game in a nutshell involves kicking a higher score than the other mob...what people never factior in is that everytime u miss and it goes up the other end for a goal it isnt just 6 pts...its ELEVEN PTS against you.

Some things decide many more games than others. Something as obvious as accurate kicking is STILL the most important stat over the course of a season.

 

[jesterwester]

People get a bit hung up on contested possessions - it's still just one possession, and worth as much as an uncontested possession. In fact, an uncontested possession is probably more valuable, since then you are likely to be able to dispose of the pill better, not being under pressure.

It's like the cover-drive to the boundary versus nudging the ball down to fine leg four times - both worth four runs - one looks much better - the other is much less risky.

I would rather have 10 uncontested possessions inside the forward 50 than 8 contested.

It really depends on the player. What made Chris Judd a superstar was his ability to make contested possessions look uncontested. He could break tackes, break the lines, then place it onto a player in a better situation. Everyone at West Coast used to look for him for that exact reason, he was a class above with his disposal.

It really depends on the cattle you have in the middle really, as to the effectiveness of your contested ball.
I would think that of geelongs tally, how much contested ball would be turnovers?
I would think that the percentage would be alot less than Richmonds, and although Foley is very good, he isn't in the class of bartel, or Ablett yet.

 

[InCase]

People get a bit hung up on contested possessions - it's still just one possession, and worth as much as an uncontested possession. In fact, an uncontested possession is probably more valuable, since then you are likely to be able to dispose of the pill better, not being under pressure.

It's like the cover-drive to the boundary versus nudging the ball down to fine leg four times - both worth four runs - one looks much better - the other is much less risky.

I would rather have 10 uncontested possessions inside the forward 50 than 8 contested.

But if you don't get any contested possesion, you are waiting for a turn over to get the ball.

A contested possesion is the starting block to getting uncontested possessions, you need to get the ball out of a pack into the free (uncontested) players hands.

 

[Stig O'Hara]

Obvious motivator and been around since year dot.

Beats the pants off "Clearances"
- whatever in the blue fk that means.

 

[Beau_Waters for PM]

a lot of those teams in the minus territory dont have as many hardball gets because they simply don't lose posession as much i.e. hawthorn.

You mean "e.g." hawthorn (not i.e.). That is, unless you believe Hawthorn is the only example supporting your argument.

 

[Simon_Nesbit]

Just a quick question - is this in comparison to the league average, or cumulative for/against from each game?

 

[bomberstomake8]

Most stats truly pale into insignifcance compared to the true decider of where your team is on the ladder in a relatively even comp.

GOAL KICKING ACCURACY

Noone talks about it coz its so basic in principle....but in these days of fast rebound and set attacking plays out of defence it is truly the most important factor by a country mile.

I dont give a rats arse if your midfielder uses baseball bats to get the ball fwd...if u kick a pt the chance are it'll go staright back the other end in a hurry for a goal.

i disagree completely. take essendon for example. probably one of the best teams in terms of goal kicking accuracy with lucas and lloyd leading the charge and yet we have been getting belted.. if you dont get it inside 50 you cant kick goals...

i dont think you can pinpoint one most important area they all are important, obviously you need to win the contested ball, but you also need to be accountable and use the ball well..

i would disagree that goal kicking accuracy is the most important aspect

 

[Wallaby]

It really depends on the player. What made Chris Judd a superstar was his ability to make contested possessions look uncontested. He could break tackes, break the lines, then place it onto a player in a better situation. Everyone at West Coast used to look for him for that exact reason, he was a class above with his disposal.

Hey, no argument from me - a Chris Judd contested possession is clearly better than say, a Shane Tuck contested possession. But uncontested, not much difference (Judd is still better, just not so much).

Richmond can obviously win the contested possessions - it's what they do with them that counts. At the moment, Foley and Deledio are probably our best at using the ball after winning it - players like Tuck, Raines, King can win it, and then put it straight back into a contested situation.

We all hate it, but possession footy is the game today - the team that does it and moves forward fastest (while maintaining possession) will win.

Footskills, running skills, structure, team plan. If you do those well, you don't need to win a heap of contested ball - you'll be efficient with the possessions you get.

 

[cs61]

The Hawthorn stat shows just how vital, irreplaceable even, Sam Mitchell is in that side.

Mitchell, Hodge, Lewis, Sewell, McGlynn... quite a few inside ball winners.