Politics & Government The Politics Thread

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holybishop said:
So apparently the LNP can still retain government if they win any by-election for that seat and the KAP members side with them?
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Currently (including Maryborough and Ferny Grove - two seats in doubt) the ALP have 44 seats, with the Independant Peter Wellington supporting a Labor government. That gives QLD a minority ALP government of 45 seats, even without the two Katter boys. With the KAP onside, it'd give Labor a 47 seat parliament.

That means that should the LNP pick up the 3 seats that are currently in doubt, but ahead in LNP votes - they'd have 42. Plus the two Katter boys is 44, plus a by-election win is 45, which would be a minority government in itself.

However, there are two important things to note.

1) Both Katter members stated that they wouldn't side with the LNP if they selected a new leader from the previous cabinet. Springborg is now the LNP leader, which is completely ignoring the Katter Party warning prior to the leadership vote.
2) Even if the Ferny Grove seat went to a by-election, I haven't seen an election analyst yet state they think the LNP has any chance of reclaiming the seat. However, if something down the line were to happen where the LNP won a by-election AND the ALP pissed off the Katter boys, then QLD could very well have a new government without an election.

Exciting stuff!
 
The KAP would be wise to learn from Oakeshott and Windsor that pissing off your voting base by supporting the party of opposite ideology is akin to political suicide. I also imagine any by-election in Ferny Grove will be months away. It first needs to go to the court of disputed returns then an appropriate amount of time needs to be given for the campaign. LNP can certainly claw back ground under Springborg and some voters who voted Labor in protest but never actually thought they'd be in a position to form government might reassess who they really want to govern them.
 

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jackenny said:
If I was Labor, I would offer to make Katter the Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Forestry.
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That's actually a fantastic idea. Not just as a bribe to get the Katter boys on their side, but mainly because Rob Katter would actually make a fantastic agriculture minister - something Queensland genuinely needs.
 
I honestly like the KAP a hell of a lot more than the remnants of the National Party. The National Party are traditionally supposed to look out for regional and agricultural interests, but I think it's safe to say that they have been compromised by deal-making with the Liberal Party. They're just a bunch of blokes who parrot the message of their Liberal counterparts (albeit while wearing akubra hats and speaking in a stronger Australian accent).
 
http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...on-lnp-bloodbath/story-fnr8vuu5-1227216517113

While the LNP’s slide from a massive majority to facing a return to Opposition after only one term caught many pundits by surprise, Ms Bligh said she was not one of those.

“There is nothing about this result or what’s happened to Campbell Newman that surprises me,” she said – with a wry smile – during an event yesterday in Sydney, where she now lives.

All class Captain Bligh as always, she was the leader of the labor party when it was destroyed, cocked up the states health (pay system scandal and paying fake princes) and water (Desalination plants that don't work but cost millions to maintain, dams without pipes and pipes without dams) systems and almost bankrupted the state that she then leaves to live on the Qld tax payer coin in Sydney.

What a grub (sorry to all the grubs out there for the comparison)
 
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Iva Bigun said:
“There is nothing about this result or what’s happened to Campbell Newman that surprises me,” she said – with a wry smile
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I laughed so hard at that when I saw the footage on the news last night. It was literally the only thing she said before walking away. ****ing hilarious.
 
Experimental said:
I laughed so hard at that when I saw the footage on the news last night. It was literally the only thing she said before walking away. ******* hilarious.
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I suppose its all about your political preferences as to how an individual views the comments, you may see them as a funny quip, I see them as acid tongue from a bitter disposed leader that couldn't run a chook raffle and was kicked out accordingly in a record result.

Hopefully Newman will act with a little more class when he is asked to comment in the future leaders.
 
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Experimental said:
I guess it wasn't a 'carefully scripted statement', so we should just ignore it. What a ******* arsehole.
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He was trying to blame the 12-year high unemployment figures on Labor and came out with that pearler of a statement (sarcasm). His flippant comments combined with the current unemployment rate will surely hurt him in the opinion polls. You wouldn't think it would bring on another spill motion just yet but he certainly hasn't done himself any favours.
 

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A political analyst on Channel Nine had an interesting quote in regards to the to the unemployment rate - "You can't cut your way to growth."
 
In this day and age, using the word 'holocaust' to refer to anything other than the WW2 atrocity (despite the actual definition of the word) is comparable with using the word 'f*ggot' and claiming you're talking about a bundle of sticks. It's a poor choice of words and a prime minister should know better.
 
Experimental said:
Hopefully the disease is terminal and incurable. Let the agony end.
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Not sure the cure is any better, Bill Shorten is a product of the union bullyboy movement and little more than a puppet, plus he preferrs to stab sitting PM's in the back rather than be one.

Reports this morning that we are headed for a trillion dollar debt in the next 30 years unless serious change to our spending happens now, and Labor in power will only speed up the process of racking up debt.

Why do I assume labor will do this (History) as when Federal Labor came to power Australia had a future fund of greater than 50 BILLION in the bank, enough to build the hospitals and roads of the future DEBT FREE, by the end of Labors reign we had a 266 BILLION dollar debt, a turn around of more than 300 BILLION in the negative (by the so called Treasurer of the year) not bad work in 6 years, should be in Gaol. .

As I remember it quality of life under the Howard government was stable and much better the the 11% unemployment and 18% interest rates the Keating government gave us prior and the Massive debts the Rudd, Gillard, Rudd governments gave us afterwards.

I can understand your frustration with Abbot as I am frustrated too, but don't assume the Libs will oust him, it is only the Labor party that has ever stabbed a first term PM, infact they are well practised at it by now, Shortan especially.
 
Iva Bigun said:
Reports this morning that we are headed for a trillion dollar debt in the next 30 years unless serious change to our spending happens now, and Labor in power will only speed up the process of racking up debt.

Why do I assume labor will do this (History) as when Federal Labor came to power Australia had a future fund of greater than 50 BILLION in the bank, enough to build the hospitals and roads of the future DEBT FREE, by the end of Labors reign we had a 266 BILLION dollar debt, a turn around of more than 300 BILLION in the negative (by the so called Treasurer of the year) not bad work in 6 years, should be in Gaol. .
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Government spending isn't the issue. You can't cut your way to growth. Government revenue is the issue. The carbon tax and mining tax were huge revenue streams from the areas of business that can sustain the 'loss' of income. Focussing only on revenue (not the environmental benefits), the carbon tax was huge for the economy - but King ****face and his group of losers took the policy to the election and conned the ignorant public into ditching it. Half of these same morons that voted for it are now complaining about the budget and the unfair cuts that would've been made redundant if the taxes were kept in place.

You, and everybody else, keep bringing up these big numbers of how many BILLIONS of dollars in debt the country is in, but as I've mentioned many, many times - it's not relative to the huge amount of money the government is bringing in to begin with. Compared with GDP, that number you've quoted is tiny. Miniscule in fact. Hardly worth a mention. It creates growth and keep the country prosperous. Despite what the LNP want you to believe, debt allows for prosperity.

However, the trajectory as you've also mentioned is what is worrying IF it were left as is. But the fact is, if the trajectory continued, the federal government regardless of party would be forced to created new forms of revenue rather than continuing to cut. You'd see an increased tax on big business and likely the reinstatement of the carbon and mining tax.

Since the removal of the mining and carbon taxes, the government debt (note that I say government, not "labors debt" or "LNP debt" - the blame game is stupid) has increase overwhelmingly. What was once a huge revenue stream for the federal government is no longer there, and that huge economic hole is a cause for concern - now the poindexter pretending to be the treasurer wants to cut crucial areas as a matter of 'emergency'.

In all likelihood, this term of government is going to be completely useless. The carbon and mining taxes NEED to be reinstated and likely will if the ALP get majority next election, marriage equality will pass under a Labor government w/ Greens support, health and university funding will be INCREASED, and all of Abbott's lies and idiotic decisions will be reversed.

Labor's first term will be a 'fixing' term, which will get them straight into a second term afterwards.

If the current LNP government can't see that they need to change drastically, they'll be voted into oblivion should the new government be careful with their policies (i.e. not doing a Newman).
 
Iva Bigun said:
I can understand your frustration with Abbot as I am frustrated too, but don't assume the Libs will oust him, it is only the Labor party that has ever stabbed a first term PM, infact they are well practised at it by now, Shortan especially.
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Don't make the mistake of thinking that the removal of leaders is just a Labor curse. Liberals arent immune to stabbings themselves. They stabbed Gorton after 3 years as PM, and would have done so earlier if the Nationals didnt protect him. People can't compare removing Tony now to the removal of Kevin in 2010. Kevin was very popular when elected, was still fairly popular at the time of his removal, and no one saw it coming. The public saw it as a 'back-stabbing' because they couldn't see the reasons for his removal, and Kevin of course worked behind the scenes to play the public and sabotage Julia. Tony never has been popular and the majority of the public want Turnbull as leader. The public won't bemoan the Government if they remove Tony, but will instead flock back, and I can't see Tony doing a Kevin and undermining any new leader. The Liberals have to go to the next election with a fighting chance to win to keep Bill out and that can only happen under Malcolm.
 
holybishop said:
Don't make the mistake of thinking that the removal of leaders is just a Labor curse. Liberals arent immune to stabbings themselves. They stabbed Gorton after 3 years as PM, and would have done so earlier if the Nationals didnt protect him. People can't compare removing Tony now to the removal of Kevin in 2010. Kevin was very popular when elected, was still fairly popular at the time of his removal, and no one saw it coming. The public saw it as a 'back-stabbing' because they couldn't see the reasons for his removal, and Kevin of course worked behind the scenes to play the public and sabotage Julia. Tony never has been popular and the majority of the public want Turnbull as leader. The public won't bemoan the Government if they remove Tony, but will instead flock back, and I can't see Tony doing a Kevin and undermining any new leader. The Liberals have to go to the next election with a fighting chance to win to keep Bill out and that can only happen under Malcolm.
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I remember waking up that morning when Gillard became PM thinking "WTF, how did this happen? Everyone loved Kevin!". As you said, definitely a different situation.

I was actually pretty surprised at the backlash from some people about MPs coming to the media to say why they supported the spill motion - most of whom stated they didn't necessarily want Tony gone, but acted on behalf of their constituents who raised concerns and basically wanted to see how the whole party room would vote.

I had a look at Wyatt Roy's FB page (which I've evidently blocked from commenting on for some reason, and who I generally like as a person and as an MP), and there was a huge number of hate posts from die-hard Liberal voters. I think I counted maybe 2 posts thanking him for voting for a spill, with the other 50+ posts really bitter and angry. Strange times considering it's pretty much a universal thought that without Malcolm as PM heading into the next election, the Libs are a lost cause.
 
Experimental said:
I remember waking up that morning when Gillard became PM thinking "WTF, how did this happen? Everyone loved Kevin!". As you said, definitely a different situation.

I was actually pretty surprised at the backlash from some people about MPs coming to the media to say why they supported the spill motion - most of whom stated they didn't necessarily want Tony gone, but acted on behalf of their constituents who raised concerns and basically wanted to see how the whole party room would vote.

I had a look at Wyatt Roy's FB page (which I've evidently blocked from commenting on for some reason, and who I generally like as a person and as an MP), and there was a huge number of hate posts from die-hard Liberal voters. I think I counted maybe 2 posts thanking him for voting for a spill, with the other 50+ posts really bitter and angry. Strange times considering it's pretty much a universal thought that without Malcolm as PM heading into the next election, the Libs are a lost cause.
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The problem is that while the majority of the Australian public like Malcolm, die hard Liberals don't. He supports a Republic, marriage equality, protecting the ABC and believes in climate change, everything the true believers of the party despise. However unlike Labor who just leak votes to the Greens, the Liberals arent caught between a rock and a hard place. There is no where for these supporters to go to, there is no credible far-right party for them to lurch to. They'll win far more votes from Labor and even the Greens with Malcolm as leader than they'll lose to the likes of KAP, Clive or even Family First.
 
Honestly, the 'astronomical' debt that Labor built up during their time (and during the GFC) is pretty reasonable; for example, China actually built up more debt (GDP-to-debt ratio) in the same amount of time. Nobody is about to accuse China of running their economy badly, considering China is lauded as one of the best run and fastest growing economies in the world today.

What we were fed from the Liberal Party about that out-of-control debt was manipulative fear-mongering.

I know, crazy right, politicians fibbing and exagerating about the state of things to get elected... how shocking... :eek:
 
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