Top 10 2005

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Ragingbull

Senior List
Jul 19, 2004
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Melbourne
Before the championships a prediction

1- Mitchell Clark (East Fremantle)
2- Beau Dowler (Oakleigh)
3- Xavier Ellis (Gippsland)
4- Travis Varcoe (Central Districts)
5- Shannon Hurn (Central Districts)
6- Grae Grant (Perth)
7- Marcus Drum (Murray)
8-Robert Warnock (Sandringham)
9- Beau Muston (Murray)
10- Josh Kennedy (East Fremantle)
 
Playing mainly around FF/CHF in 9 games

Ave per game 11.5 kicks, 5.5 h/ball, 8.3 marks, 3 gls and 2.4 tackles.

He is often double teamed and plays in a middle of the road team. He is the teams only real focal point up forward. The kid goes okay.
 

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pretty good effort IMO, ragingbull.

Not sure Dowler is quite worth top2. More like top 6.


I dont think Grant could go top 6....he didnt even make the WA u18 side.
 
Grae Grant is that good i cant explain the U18 selectors thoughts it is way out of line compare to the AFL clubs recruiting managers thoughts. He won the Kevin Sheehan Medal at the Under 16's last year he stood out as the best outside quick midfielder at the championships I’m in shock that he didn’t get picked. He is top 10 material according to a large percentage of the AFL recruiting managers.
 
Keeping Grae out of the spotlight so that he can be picked up by a club that doesn't have a high draft pick perhaps?
 
Ragingbull said:
Grae Grant is that good i cant explain the U18 selectors thoughts it is way out of line compare to the AFL clubs recruiting managers thoughts. He won the Kevin Sheehan Medal at the Under 16's last year he stood out as the best outside quick midfielder at the championships I’m in shock that he didn’t get picked. He is top 10 material according to a large percentage of the AFL recruiting managers.
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yeh...i was having a dig at the WA selectors more than your placing of him in the draft.

How must the poor boy be feeling?
 
Ragingbull said:
Before the championships a prediction

1- Mitchell Clark (East Fremantle)
2- Beau Dowler (Oakleigh)
3- Xavier Ellis (Gippsland)
4- Travis Varcoe (Central Districts)
5- Shannon Hurn (Central Districts)
6- Grae Grant (Perth)
7- Marcus Drum (Murray)
8-Robert Warnock (Sandringham)
9- Beau Muston (Murray)
10- Josh Kennedy (East Fremantle)
Click to expand...



I know it is crystal ball stuff, but of this list, who is the most likely to develop into the best KP defender??

The Bluebaggers are in dire need of a young, tall, strong CHB or FB potential 200 gamer to bolster, no lead our midget size defence!!!

Note: A Murray Vance or Livo like player need not apply. :)
 
The most likely FB out of the top 10 I named is Marcus Drum but he is only 191cm probably not tall enough to play FB at AFL level. Josh Kennedy could develop into one but would take a long time as he ha spent the majority of his junior career as a tall forward.
 
Ragingbull said:
The most likely FB out of the top 10 I named is Marcus Drum but he is only 191cm probably not tall enough to play FB at AFL level. Josh Kennedy could develop into one but would take a long time as he ha spent the majority of his junior career as a tall forward.
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Cheers, Ragingbull for the info.

Drum sounds a bit short at 191 cm, and unless he grows few a fair bit, he mightn't not be our answer either.

The best hope in that case may be to get the best tall forward and turn him into a defender. It wouldn't the first time that has happened.

How big and good is Beau Dowler and could he make a backman?
 
Blue Boyz said:
I know it is crystal ball stuff, but of this list, who is the most likely to develop into the best KP defender??

The Bluebaggers are in dire need of a young, tall, strong CHB or FB potential 200 gamer to bolster, no lead our midget size defence!!!

Note: A Murray Vance or Livo like player need not apply. :)
Click to expand...

I think Marcus Drum is the most likely though Dowler could go back but is more suited in the forward line
 

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Hu$$ey said:
I think the blues are in more need of running midfielders than a key backman
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I am not disagreeing with you in that we need some running midfielders but IMHO we desperately need some tall defenders more than midfielders as our backline would nearly be the shortest in the league and we regularly get taken to the cleaners by teams who have more than two tall forwards which is just about all teams these days. :)

As soon as we have an injury to Thornton or Livo we are pinching hitting with Whitnall, Morrel or even DeLuca who are better played forward.
 
Carlton need more key position defenders than anything,but if Hurn and Clarke are the best players you have to go with them as your choice. Drum sounds like a terrific player but at 190 cms it scares me and reminds me of another Livingston size KPP.Dowler is 193 cms and may be a good player but his pace over 20 metres isn't that outstanding for someone who has to play CHF or CHB.
 
Best natural tall defender in the draft is Austin Lucy from Queensland 193cm his reading of the play is outstanding. He is an excellent mark and uses his body very well in a contest. Bit skinny at this stage but will improve very quickly can play FB and CHB. Has the frame to fill out.
After Lucy is probably Matt Tyler from North Ballarat 193cm plays like a Dustin Fletcher at this stage has a lot to learn but is underage this year but was in the AIS squad and can also play FB and CHB.

I like Alan Toovey from Claremont in WA but he is only 190cm like Drum just a tad short to play AFL key position. Played CHB for WA in the Championships in 2004 he displayed that he is an excellent reader of the play brave, agile,poised, has a good kick on him and was named All Australian in 2004 and was almost drafted by Brisbane last year. The query amongst the AFL recruiting managers that he doesnt he get enough of the ball and tends to negate his opponent rather than run off and provide rebound for his team. This year he has had stints as a winger for Claremont and has performed quite well including a few BOG's. He is winning a lot more of the ball so i expect him to be drafted inside the top 30 this year.
 
Blue Boyz said:
I am not disagreeing with you in that we need some running midfielders but IMHO we desperately need some tall defenders more than midfielders as our backline would nearly be the shortest in the league and we regularly get taken to the cleaners by teams who have more than two tall forwards which is just about all teams these days. :)

As soon as we have an injury to Thornton or Livo we are pinching hitting with Whitnall, Morrel or even DeLuca who are better played forward.
Click to expand...

The only way to battle the pressure that our defence comes under due to the oppositions play is by experience. Our backmen are young and they get nervous but thats due to inexperience. We have thornton, livo, teague who are all good players but inexperienced and even if we draft a young defender he would also need experience just like these guys before he comes off good. BTW we already drafted a young backman in hartlett last year and this year we should go for pacy midfielders such as hurn or varcoe or grant. I am also not a fan of drafting ruckman really early because they take ages to develop so midfielders should be the blues priority with their top 5 picks but with say pick 18 they should go for a tall defender and ill be rapt if some quality tall slips through
 
For all those that say Drumm at 191 is too short for a FB position. Watch some footy and get an education please.

These are the best current in the league.

M. Michael 190
M Scarlet 192
D Glass 192
C Bolton 190
S & D Wakelin 191 & 192
L Colbert 192
C Bizel 188 etc... etc..

The only exception is D Fletcher at 196.

Drumm is exactly what Carlton need. If they go for a midfielder and overlook Drumm, than they deserve to be in the mire at the bottom of the league for a long, long time.
Personally I wish that Drumm will be available when the Lions have their first pick. 'Cause we need to begin blooding someone for Mal Micheal.
Agree on the wraps for Austin Lucy. If Carlton can somehow grab Drum and Lucy, they will be set for the next decade. But as a late first rounder Lucy may be Brisbane bound, as he already plays in the Lions reserve team, Suncoast Lions.
 
irel said:
For all those that say Drumm at 191 is too short for a FB position. Watch some footy and get an education please.

These are the best current in the league.

M. Michael 190
M Scarlet 192
D Glass 192
C Bolton 190
S & D Wakelin 191 & 192
L Colbert 192
C Bizel 188 etc... etc..

The only exception is D Fletcher at 196.

Drumm is exactly what Carlton need. If they go for a midfielder and overlook Drumm, than they deserve to be in the mire at the bottom of the league for a long, long time.
Personally I wish that Drumm will be available when the Lions have their first pick. 'Cause we need to begin blooding someone for Mal Micheal.
Agree on the wraps for Austin Lucy. If Carlton can somehow grab Drum and Lucy, they will be set for the next decade. But as a late first rounder Lucy may be Brisbane bound, as he already plays in the Lions reserve team, Suncoast Lions.
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Agreed. Someone around 190cm is an average backman size.
 
cypher said:
Dowler is 193 cms and may be a good player but his pace over 20 metres isn't that outstanding for someone who has to play CHF or CHB.
Click to expand...

You are right..he isnt quick but you dont really need that pace from CHB/CHF only really FF/FB when you have the quick start lead. CHF's are always moving and really need endurance more than pace off the mark. Its rare they do a quick 20m, more like the long ranging lead.


Also, If Drum is 191cm he could still play keyposition if good enough. That is the height of Micheal, Lloyd etc. If he has the spoiling capacity and leap he will be fine.
 
Dowler is an interesting one..
reminds me of Ash Hansen of the West Coast Eagles as he is very athletic and has a good work rate around the ground and can take marks...
needs to improve on his seconds efforts after a contest and need to see him take some more pack marks to be eligable for a top 2 selection....
but i would say that he is a superstar in the near future and any club that picks him up at the end of the year will certainly get a great deal out of him!!
 
I still disagree with some, carlton has thornton and livingston as two long term key backmen along with teague, carrazo and the under rated norman but do not have gun midfielders. A good team needs around 7 decent midfielders to rotate and be succesful and the only ones carlton have are stevens and kouta who is apporaching the end. Now we drafted russell, blackwell and smith last year but two of them are slow midfielders and these guys are still not enough with campo and lapping also approaching the end of their playing days. Carlton needs at least another three gun midfielders and thats who we should go for in the draft. As for defenders it would be great to pick one up with our second round draft pick but priority should be the middle.
 
theorangeapple said:
You are right..he isnt quick but you dont really need that pace from CHB/CHF only really FF/FB when you have the quick start lead. CHF's are always moving and really need endurance more than pace off the mark. Its rare they do a quick 20m, more like the long ranging lead.


Also, If Drum is 191cm he could still play keyposition if good enough. That is the height of Micheal, Lloyd etc. If he has the spoiling capacity and leap he will be fine.
Click to expand...
Drum is the same size as Livingston who still struggles on the 196 cm type and the quick leaders. Carlton may draft them but with Lance capable of leading long and Livingston, Drum and Dowler wouldn't be as desirable as Clarke who is 197 cms tall and hopefully Hurn.
Michael is certainly taller than 191 cms and you rarely see Lloyd take pack marks against big opponents.
 

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