Will Ashcroft or Nick Daicos?

[Gold Rocks]

Ashcroft looks more like another Lachie Neale type. You'd be happy with that.

Daicos just a level above.
Be interesting to see what his ceiling could be.
If he adds goals to the tally, along with the versatility of playing multiple positions, no reason why he can't become a top 5 player in the competition for a very long time.

And Daicos looks like an advanced new age Garry Ablett jr clone crossed with lots of other classy players like McCloud and Burgoyne into one.

 

[Gold Rocks]

Daicos, Dawson and jeremy cameron

5

Jeremy Cameron

Age

31

Ht

196cm

Wt

94kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

12.5

3star

K

9.0

3star

HB

3.4

3star

M

5.4

5star

T

1.6

4star

G

2.6

5star

D

10.0

3star

K

7.1

3star

HB

2.9

2star

M

4.6

4star

T

2.0

3star

G

1.9

5star

D

8.2

2star

K

5.0

2star

HB

3.2

3star

M

4.6

5star

T

2.4

4star

G

2.0

5star

are probably the three best damaging game winner player’s in the league so far.

 

[biggiemediums]

no-one is saying he is a bad player. he's elite. we covered this already. But even elite players have weaknesses. And Daicos' criticisms are justified.

First part of your post is true. Every player has strengths and weaknesses.

Second part I disagree with. His criticisms are silly. Not every player has to be hard-nosed in an under. You have to have inside-outside players. Pies fans don't want him in the pack, we don't want him on the ground wrestling for touches. He's a receiver and an elite decision maker and ball-user. Shouldn't be criticized for something that he's not in the team to do.

There's not a single flag-winning team that had just all inside, contested players. That would be a shitty team.

 

[jakson68]

I think you're conveniently squirming out of the definition to suit your narrative. Soft = afraid to get physically hurt. That's it. We have Jake Bowey who is smaller than Daicos and he goes much harder. So I agree with others, he needs to be better. You say he's smart enough and good enough to not have to put his body on the line and that's simply not true. When he squibbed the contests last week his opponents just grabbed the ball and ran away.

You are a sad little man.
Are you really comparing Jake Bowey to Daicos??
Not even close to compare. If I had a shitty jeep, I may take that bush bashing and wouldn't care if it got damaged.
I wouldn't do the same to the Ferrari.

Also ANY player good enough to get to AFL level, is no squib.

 

[danster168]

You are a sad little man.
Are you really comparing Jake Bowey to Daicos??
Not even close to compare. If I had a shitty jeep, I may take that bush bashing and wouldn't care if it got damaged.
I wouldn't do the same to the Ferrari.

Also ANY player good enough to get to AFL level, is no squib.

I compared this element of their game. Why not? Bowey goes harder at the ball than Daicos. I'm not saying Daicos isn't better as a player. I thought that's pretty clear.

The fact that you're justifying Daicos' multiple squibbing the other week seems a bit like denial. Like I said, even the best players in the comp have flaws.

 

[danster168]

First part of your post is true. Every player has strengths and weaknesses.

Second part I disagree with. His criticisms are silly. Not every player has to be hard-nosed in an under. You have to have inside-outside players. Pies fans don't want him in the pack, we don't want him on the ground wrestling for touches. He's a receiver and an elite decision maker and ball-user. Shouldn't be criticized for something that he's not in the team to do.

There's not a single flag-winning team that had just all inside, contested players. That would be a shitty team.

that's ridiculous. If it's your turn to go, you go. that's Afl 101. Regardless of size. No-one said anything about him having to be a jack viney type or anything but there are many players smaller than Daicos that go when it's their turn. Offering up excuses for not putting his head over the ball is not something McCrae or even Daicos himself would be saying.

 

[biggiemediums]

that's ridiculous. If it's your turn to go, you go. that's Afl 101. Regardless of size. No-one said anything about him having to be a jack viney type or anything but there are many players smaller than Daicos that go when it's their turn. Offering up excuses for not putting his head over the ball is not something McCrae or even Daicos himself would be saying.

By your obsessive posting in here, it's pretty clear you have an agenda with this. I doubt any rational conversation can be had with you. McCrae has spoken on Daicos' role many times. If you're ignorant on that. Nothing can really be said.

 

[danielnajdek]

Both are great. Will needs to clean up his kicking. Does a lot of kicks around the corner which go high in the air when he gets it out of a stoppage. Think he’s going fine.

As for Nick. Don’t really care what people think of him. He’s on my team and not theirs so suck it.

 

[danster168]

By your obsessive posting in here, it's pretty clear you have an agenda with this. I doubt any rational conversation can be had with you. McCrae has spoken on Daicos' role many times. If you're ignorant on that. Nothing can really be said.

agenda? I said he was one of the best players in the comp...? no agenda here but if pies fans can't acknowledge that he needs to be harder in the contest then that's not rational or balanced in any way.

"he's an outside player, he's allowed to squib contests". how is that remotely rational?

 

[biggiemediums]

agenda? I said he was one of the best players in the comp...? no agenda here but if pies fans can't acknowledge that he needs to be harder in the contest then that's not rational or balanced in any way.

His contested possession count isn't bad. He's had one game where he rattled a few contests but was still one of the best on the ground.

Think his hardness is fine for a pretty small second year player. It's most likely going to naturally improve as he gets stronger, but he'll never be a hard nut. He's just not built that way. I think he's on track.

 

[danster168]

His contested possession count isn't bad. He's had one game where he rattled a few contests but was still one of the best on the ground.

Think his hardness is fine for a pretty small second year player. It's most likely going to naturally improve as he gets stronger, but he'll never be a hard nut. He's just not built that way. I think he's on track.

I'm not saying he's not a gun. he's one of the best players in the comp amd I'd love him at the dees but all I'm saying is that he can improve this side to his game. it's not a big knock because of all of his other elite traits. But do you think you'll ever see him as a full time inside mid? or do you think he'll be a back flanker with a licence to roam?

 

[biggiemediums]

I'm not saying he's not a gun. he's one of the best players in the comp amd I'd love him at the dees but all I'm saying is that he can improve this side to his game. it's not a big knock because of all of his other elite traits. But do you think you'll ever see him as a full time inside mid? or do you think he'll be a back flanker with a licence to roam?

He'll never be an inside mid - why would he be? He's not an in and under. He's a second touch player. He'll be a full time midfielder but I doubt you'll ever see him at the bottom of a pack. That would completely nullify his strengths.

Does he need to get a bit tougher? Absolutely. But I see that coming with size and experience. I don't think he needs to change too much to actively try and get tougher.

 

[jakson68]

I'm not saying he's not a gun. he's one of the best players in the comp amd I'd love him at the dees but all I'm saying is that he can improve this side to his game. it's not a big knock because of all of his other elite traits. But do you think you'll ever see him as a full time inside mid? or do you think he'll be a back flanker with a licence to roam?

No he wont be a full time inside mid.
Taylor Adams and Tom Mitchell are inside mids, as they are bulls and get the ball to the outside to class players like Daicos to distribute the ball to our advantage.
As the data clearly shows, he can get the contested ball if needed but a full time battering ram for someone with his class, would be just plain stupid.

 

[KissKiss]

No he wont be a full time inside mid.
Taylor Adams and Tom Mitchell are inside mids, as they are bulls and get the ball to the outside to class players like Daicos to distribute the ball to our advantage.
As the data clearly shows, he can get the contested ball if needed but a full time battering ram for someone with his class, would be just plain stupid.

This is kinda why I'm always bemused at people talking down players like Mitchell for small handballs that go backwards. Them feeding the ball out to a guy like Daicos makes everyone look good. Why waste your best users on the inside when you can get fast hands giving it to them in more space.

Its also why this thread is kinda stupid. They are going to be very different players. If you were picking a dream team of 1st and second year players you would have both of them. Ashcroft inside to feed the ball out to Daicos

 

[biggiemediums]

This is kinda why I'm always bemused at people talking down players like Mitchell for small handballs that go backwards. Them feeding the ball out to a guy like Daicos makes everyone look good. Why waste your best users on the inside when you can get fast hands giving it to them in more space.

Its also why this thread is kinda stupid. They are going to be very different players. If you were picking a dream team of 1st and second year players you would have both of them. Ashcroft inside to feed the ball out to Daicos

That would honestly be unfair!

 

[jakson68]

This is kinda why I'm always bemused at people talking down players like Mitchell for small handballs that go backwards. Them feeding the ball out to a guy like Daicos makes everyone look good. Why waste your best users on the inside when you can get fast hands giving it to them in more space.

Its also why this thread is kinda stupid. They are going to be very different players. If you were picking a dream team of 1st and second year players you would have both of them. Ashcroft inside to feed the ball out to Daicos

Agree totally.
There are many roles required to make a good team.
Mitchell has had less possessions than he would be used to since coming across to Collingwood.
His impact however has been fantastic.

 

[jakson68]

That would honestly be unfair!

I would love for these two to be in the same team.
The supporter base would have some great times.

 

[T2B_]

Nick is a second player and built like a 15 year old. He'll be completely fine.

 

[Korol Mira]

Ashcroft will be a good honest toiler but let's be real here, he's short, slow and can't kick

 

[Ginnieboy]

I’d put him in the goal square, he’s a Daicos.

 

[Daka]

Daicos has the edge at the moment in terms of influence he is also a 2nd year player but what I will say is Ashcroft is playing a harder position.

 

[HairyO]

Daicos has the edge at the moment in terms of influence he is also a 2nd year player but what I will say is Ashcroft is playing a harder position.

And playing it very well. Also gets himself Goal of the Year with his Rising Star.

 

[JasRulz63]

Daicos has the edge at the moment in terms of influence he is also a 2nd year player but what I will say is Ashcroft is playing a harder position.

He'll never have Daicos' ability to find the ball in space or ability to pull off the kind of kicks Daicos does on a regular basis, but what Ashcroft's strengths are over Daicos' aren't the ones you generally see on highlight clips.

 

[My Tilly]

Daicos has the edge at the moment in terms of influence he is also a 2nd year player but what I will say is Ashcroft is playing a harder position.

No he isn't. Ashcroft can make mistakes and brush it off at the next stoppage.

Daicos makes a mistake and the ball is going be kicked over his head and he'll know all about it.
Sure, Ashcroft is right in the coalface and mixing it with mature bodies but watch Daicos closely, he's moving in between positions during the game.

 

[danster168]

How is this even a poll? People are talking about Daicos as a top 5 player in the AFL but Ashcroft wouldn't even be in the top 150.

Even at Brisbane he's behind Cameron, Neale, Andrews, Dunkley, Daniher, Mccluggage, Zorko, Starcevich, Rayner, Rich, Mcinerney.