Current Trial Wonnangatta - Murders of Russell Hill & Carol Clay *Pilot Greg Lynn Pleads Not Guilty

[Kurve]

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Disappearance of Barwon Prison Boss David Prideaux - High Country Mount Stirling
Hit and Run Death of Bryce Airs - High Country Jamieson

Israel Keyes

On the Greg Lynn committal proceedings Crown Prosecutor Mr Dickie said 'It is clear hopefully from the document, and if it's not clear from the document it's clear hopefully from the charges put before the court, that it is alleged of course that the accused acted with murderous intent when he allegedly killed the two victims.'

 

[highcountry]

Probably part of the defence’s choreography of their case. “This woman loves him and believes he could never commit this crime. It’s totally out of character for a home-loving family man.” Which is supposed to soften the jury’s view of him.

If it wasn’t for the inconvenient actions in the aftermath of the killings….

This was an unguarded moment after the jury and most of the court had emptied. It was not done for show.

I was surprised as I had wondered from the time of his arrest as to the impact this might have had on their relationship and her support or otherwise for him.

It was instantly obvious that she is firmly on team Greg. And you are correct that the defence will absolutely be making the most of such support in a very visible way as she is due to take the stand. As are some of his kids.

 

[Badd0g]

GL has admitted to 'annoying' RH by playing music up loud in response to the 'drone confrontation' earlier in the evening initiated by RH.

So there's admittedly some sort of conflict and provocative circumstances.

GL has just emptied his gun by firing all the bullets in it to make it safe, so he is clearly thinking straight at this stage. Only moments after CC has been fatally shot in the head.

It is going to be very hard to argue there as not excessive force used in the death of RH.

At best it looks like GL is looking at 1 count of Involuntary Manslaughter and 1 count of Voluntary Manslaughter, given his own side of events, his own actions - unsecured weapon that is loaded, pursuing an armed RH when GL has stated he was 'shitscared', engaging physically with RH while RH held a loaded weapon, being rational of mind enough to unload his firearm when back in possession of his weapon, reconfronting RH when RH was armed with a knife.

Some of it comes off a bit of childish c*ck (edited) fighting to me - got me on drone footage have you? gonna take it to the police will you? well I'll show you by playing my music up loud to piss you off.

The whole emptying of the gun thing had me thinking today - it doesn't make sense. I'm not a gun person, but I do know that a loaded gun still has to have the shells chambered to shoot it - wouldn't you then just unload any remaining shells rather than shooting them into the air? unless....you were trying to explain away 3 gunshots that could come up in witness accounts. I'm still of the opinion the drone was shot out of the sky (why else would he take it/destroy it? it doesn't hold any footage) and that has potentially triggered the physical altercation.

 

[CredibleSauce]

No argument there but given the mirror was absent on discovery of the car, how has it been determined it was shattered as opposed to just damaged?

On SM-S921B using BigFooty.com mobile app

You’d think a shattered mirror would leave debris everywhere - even if he allegedly* got under the car with a vacuum cleaner I’d be surprised if he managed to collect every tiny splintered piece of plastic and glass and dispose of it without a trace (in the dark with loud music blaring no less)

 

[highcountry]

Lynn's going away for a long time regardless or whether he's convicted of murder or manslaughter.

There's a possibility IMO he might be convicted for the murder of Carol and the manslaughter of Russell.

Quite apart from this case, but also because of this case, Lynn faces an intense amount of scrutiny into every aspect of his life prior to what went down in the High Country.

A shot gun is a generic term for an unrifled firearm. Whilst comman useage refers to ammunition loaded with shot used for game birds, it also can be loaded with a solid ammunition.

As it is not rifled it as not as accurate or has the same range as rifled ammunition and requires more stalking and hunting skills to get a clean kill.

From the Game Management Authority website:

A minimum bore of 20 and a maximum bore of 12, using a single solid projectile with a minimum weight of 245 grains (15.88 grams); SG’s (buck shot) must not be used. The firearm must be fitted with a front and rear iron sight (other than a beaded sight or sights), a telescopic sight, or a reflex sight

In other words a bloody great big lump of solid lead that could easily remove a mirror or blow a head apart at close range

Now, whether it can be deflected by a mirror compoased of glass, plastic and light steel is another different question which the prosecution will probably lead into evidence

Question from a non hunter.

I believe guns around the home are mesnt to be secured at all times in a gun safe. And I would guess in an unloaded state.

Are there regs for carrying fire arms in cars or on hunting/camping trips?

I would have thought that regs exist that stipulate that guns must be secured to prevent anyone gaining easy access. As Lynn claims Hill did.

And it’s not just the gun. Surely its not safe practice to leave loaded guns around that anyone could easy pick up and use.

We are expected to believe Hill who had no interest in guns, took the gun, found another and then knew enough on how to load the gun.

 

[Kurve]

Are there regs for carrying fire arms in cars or on hunting/camping trips?

I would have thought that regs exist that stipulate that guns must be secured to prevent anyone gaining easy access. As Lynn claims Hill did.

And it’s not just the gun. Surely its not safe practice to leave loaded guns around that anyone could easy pick up and use.

We are expected to believe Hill who had no interest in guns, took the gun, found another and then knew enough on how to load the gun.

Weapons must be stored separately from ammunition, in locked compartments that are out of arms reach. They can't be for example, lying on the back seat.

 

[Badd0g]

Are there regs for carrying fire arms in cars or on hunting/camping trips?

We are expected to believe Hill who had no interest in guns, took the gun, found another and then knew enough on how to load the gun.

Safekeeping of firearms when being transported in vehicles (from: https://www.police.vic.gov.au/firearm-storage#safekeeping-of-firearms-when-being-transported-in-vehicles)​

In most circumstances firearms should be transported safely by:

• Storing firearms in a padded or hard case. Firearms and magazines must not be loaded.
• Limiting the operability of the firearm and where possible, removing bolts, opening the action, or using trigger locks.
• Storing cartridge ammunition separately from the firearm. We recommend that you store ammunition in a lockable container while in the vehicle. You should keep any keys to the container in your possession.
• Keeping firearms secure and out of sight of the public.

A common sense approach to storing firearms during transport is essential. Licence holders must immediately return firearms to storage when not in use or being transported.

This information should be used as a guide. It does not override storage requirements imposed by other regulations. Make sure you know about any other storage requirements, such as those provided in the Wildlife (Game) Regulations 2012.

 

[EagleEyes1]

You’d think a shattered mirror would leave debris everywhere - even if he allegedly* got under the car with a vacuum cleaner I’d be surprised if he managed to collect every tiny splintered piece of plastic and glass and dispose of it without a trace (in the dark with loud music blaring no less)

I think the whole mirror story is a throw off deliberately put in to fabricate the course of events.

During the struggle the gun goes off, hits the mirror and then Clay’s head at point blank range? There would be pieces of the mirror and Clay’s head everywhere and over the car.

Clay’s blood and bone was found 20-30m away from the camp site. There's no way the shot could have gone through the mirror then struck her perfectly in the side of the head with zero pellet spread.

Further how was Clay shot on the side of the head when she was facing them both trying to stop the fight? No she was not. She was more than likely running away and got chased and gunned down after Hill was killed.

I do believe Lynn came prepared to the campsite ready to take out both of them. He did it like clockwork taking Hill out first then chasing down Clay before she got away. Only problem was Lynn thought he covered all his tracks and thought he could get away with it.

 

[Dogs_R_Us]

GL has admitted to 'annoying' RH by playing music up loud in response to the 'drone confrontation' earlier in the evening initiated by RH.

So there's admittedly some sort of conflict and provocative circumstances.

GL has just emptied his gun by firing all the bullets in it to make it safe, so he is clearly thinking straight at this stage. Only moments after CC has been fatally shot in the head.

It is going to be very hard to argue there as not excessive force used in the death of RH.

At best it looks like GL is looking at 1 count of Involuntary Manslaughter and 1 count of Voluntary Manslaughter, given his own side of events, his own actions - unsecured weapon that is loaded, pursuing an armed RH when GL has stated he was 'shitscared', engaging physically with RH while RH held a loaded weapon, being rational of mind enough to unload his firearm when back in possession of his weapon, reconfronting RH when RH was armed with a knife.

If he takes the stand he will be obliterated.

We’ve only got his dubious word that Hill got hold of the gun. Hill can’t deny it

 

[MiguelM]

The meticulous disposal of the bodies and evidence doesn't sit well with me if the events were truly accidental.

 

[highcountry]

A weird fish​

Ref: Sly knows more than most. This is as reported in the Age. Not conjecture.

Loner, pilot, barbecue-lover - mystery swirls around accused killer

The detectives who spoke to Greg Lynn about missing campers Carol Clay and Russell Hill last month had never met him, but they had already built a psychological profile of the suspect.

www.theage.com.au

Lynn trained with the RAAF but decided to leave when he was not selected in the alpha stream to be an elite pilot flying fighter jets.

“He was extremely bitter,” a friend said.
But he moved on, becoming a first officer at Ansett where he was well liked by cabin crew, even though a fellow Ansett first officer said he had a reputation with air crews as “a bit of a weird fish”. He married and had two sons with his first wife, Lisa, who was a Qantas cabin crew member. For years the pilot and his vivacious wife looked like a happy couple building a sprawling family home in Mount Macedon with their two young sons.

But according to his wife’s family, behind closed doors he was a dominating figure. One family member contacted police during the marriage to make (unproven) allegations of family violence. It is not known if police acted on the complaints.

In 1999, Lynn’s marriage collapsed and shortly afterwards, in October that year, Lisa was found dead in the garden of her home. It was listed as suicide from an overdose of prescription drugs and alcohol. To learn more about Greg Lynn’s past, police investigating the Clay and Hill disappearances have quietly called for the file on his first wife’s death.

When Ansett collapsed two years later in 2001 Lynn moved to Qatar, where he became a lead pilot. He returned to Australia in 2007 to work with Jetstar, where he was promoted to a check and training captain to examine fellow pilots on new planes, with a salary of about $280,000.

+++

1/RAAF
2/ Southern
3/ Southern
4/ Ansett
5/ Qatar
6/ Jetstar

He has certainly been busy boy.

 

[Alberto_Magnifico]

Weapons must be stored separately from ammunition, in locked compartments that are out of arms reach. They can't be for example, lying on the back seat.

As a hunter that regularly travels in Victoria with firearms I have noticed most people will have a lock box for ammo and keep firearms in a case under a blanket etc. stashed in the cabin.

I am always acutely aware when out with firearms they are solely my responsibility, and do everything possible to prevent them being stolen, if they are I am in serious trouble, even a 30 second run into a store will have me locking everything.

This doesn't mean "at camp" GL wouldn't bend the rules, but my bullshit detector starts ringing at the thought of keeping ammo and firearms exposed on the backseat, doors open, whilst there is a stranger camping metres away (not even considering the bad blood and stereo antagonism).

 

[Terrafirma]

Some of it comes off a bit of childish c*ck (edited) fighting to me - got me on drone footage have you? gonna take it to the police will you? well I'll show you by playing my music up loud to piss you off.

The whole emptying of the gun thing had me thinking today - it doesn't make sense. I'm not a gun person, but I do know that a loaded gun still has to have the shells chambered to shoot it - wouldn't you then just unload any remaining shells rather than shooting them into the air? unless....you were trying to explain away 3 gunshots that could come up in witness accounts. I'm still of the opinion the drone was shot out of the sky (why else would he take it/destroy it? it doesn't hold any footage) and that has potentially triggered the physical altercation.

I think you make a really good point. The drone shooting is a real possibility as we know Lynn hated noise and just the rudeness of the drone in his eyes would have made him angry. It's a real motive. Shoot the drone, Hill's new baby called Fred, and off course you would expect Hill to confront Lynn. Lynn's claim of Hill shooting the gun into the air is merely to cover off a shot that could have been heard by witnesses. In reality we have Hill now angry at Lynn and a confrontation takes place and Hill is killed. Knife they say? At this point I believe Lynn still has in his possession the loaded gun minus 1 cartridge. Lynn has now killed someone with a witness in Carol Clay. No accidental incident IMO Lynn still angry shoots Clay. BY his own admission Lynn says he has made some bad choices, but it wasn't just the cold blooded disposal of their bodies it was also the murder of Carol Clay. I don't see Hill taking a knife to a gunfight with Carol to think of especially. Hill could have been shot. I think there is a good chance forensics and ballistics can prove Clay's shooting was no accident.

 

[GreyCrow]

The meticulous disposal of the bodies and evidence doesn't sit well with me if the events were truly accidental.

I know juries are meant to look at facts and evidence but we know they are human with all the human emotions and thoughts and this will weigh heavy on them and be foremost on their minds

 

[Lady O]

I think the whole mirror story is a throw off deliberately put in to fabricate the course of events.

During the struggle the gun goes off, hits the mirror and then Clay’s head at point blank range? There would be pieces of the mirror and Clay’s head everywhere and over the car.

Clay’s blood and bone was found 20-30m away from the camp site. There's no way the shot could have gone through the mirror then struck her perfectly in the side of the head with zero pellet spread.

Further how was Clay shot on the side of the head when she was facing them both trying to stop the fight? No she was not. She was more than likely running away and got chased and gunned down after Hill was killed.

I do believe Lynn came prepared to the campsite ready to take out both of them. He did it like clockwork taking Hill out first then chasing down Clay before she got away. Only problem was Lynn thought he covered all his tracks and thought he could get away with it.

Don't you think that if Clay was "chased down" and shot, there would be evidence of blood at the scene. That's why I think both were most likely killed while sleeping in the tent and that is the reason the tent was burned.

 

[Zidane98]

I know juries are meant to look at facts and evidence but we know they are human with all the human emotions and thoughts and this will weigh heavy on them and be foremost on their minds

Not sure how much this will be used by the prosecution as it will be countered by GL's defense saying he didn't want to be blamed for deaths he claims he wasn't responsible for hence the attempt at a coverup and the defence will also use his cooperation with showing the location of the remains to police to their advantage.

 

[Zidane98]

Don't you think that if Clay was "chased down" and shot, there would be evidence of blood at the scene. That's why I think both were most likely killed while sleeping in the tent and that is the reason the tent was burned.

This case shows that in the future it is best to get homicide involved even if the police are not sure if a homicide has been committed yet. That way a thorough forensic sweep of the campsite would have been conducted while the possible crime scene was still fresh. They probably then would have discovered traces of blood. When were forensics first conducted on the camp site? My understanding is not until at least a year after the disappearance. By then very unlikely to find much of forensic value.

 

[Lady O]

This case shows that in the future it is best to get homicide involved even if the police are not sure if a homicide has been committed yet. That way a thorough forensic sweep of the campsite would have been conducted while the possible crime scene was still fresh. They probably then would have discovered traces of blood. When were forensics first conducted on the camp site? My understanding is not until at least a year after the disappearance. By then very unlikely to find much of forensic value.

Without wishing to be too graphic, I think if she had a portion of her skull blown off, there would be more than traces of blood. Still, I agree, it might not have been noted (due to the possibility it could have been from a deer), when they were looking for lost campers.

 

[jason_recliner]

Don't you think that if Clay was "chased down" and shot, there would be evidence of blood at the scene. That's why I think both were most likely killed while sleeping in the tent and that is the reason the tent was burned.

I don't know anything about the area. Was it raining?

 

[Zidane98]

I don't know anything about the area. Was it raining?

Definitely by the time the coppers treated the place as a crime scene. Probably rained many times.

 

[Kurve]

Do we know if a piece of Carol's skull was found 20 to 30m closer to Lynn's camp or did it go the other way?

 

[yodellinhank]

I think you make a really good point. The drone shooting is a real possibility as we know Lynn hated noise and just the rudeness of the drone in his eyes would have made him angry. It's a real motive. Shoot the drone, Hill's new baby called Fred, and off course you would expect Hill to confront Lynn. Lynn's claim of Hill shooting the gun into the air is merely to cover off a shot that could have been heard by witnesses. In reality we have Hill now angry at Lynn and a confrontation takes place and Hill is killed. Knife they say? At this point I believe Lynn still has in his possession the loaded gun minus 1 cartridge. Lynn has now killed someone with a witness in Carol Clay. No accidental incident IMO Lynn still angry shoots Clay. BY his own admission Lynn says he has made some bad choices, but it wasn't just the cold blooded disposal of their bodies it was also the murder of Carol Clay. I don't see Hill taking a knife to a gunfight with Carol to think of especially. Hill could have been shot. I think there is a good chance forensics and ballistics can prove Clay's shooting was no accident.

A workmate of mine is a hobby pilot, his son has a commercial licence I think (my mate talks things up a bit). He gets really triggered if somebody (else) does something against CASA rules with a drone. It's like a sense of sky ownership, not everyone can fly I'm special type thing.

 

[Zidane98]

Do we know if a piece of Carol's skull was found 20 to 30m closer to Lynn's camp or did it go the other way?

No reports on that yet. A pretty big issue with that is the coppers not finding it until 1 and a half years later though. Who knows what happened in between with animals. Was there a flood in the area in those times?

 

[Kurve]

A workmate of mine is a hobby pilot, his son has a commercial licence I think (my mate talks things up a bit). He gets really triggered if somebody (else) does something against CASA rules with a drone. It's like a sense of sky ownership, not everyone can fly I'm special type thing.

Exactly. I reckon Lynn shot the drone and all this happened earlier than Lynn says. They haven't found the drone yet faik and Lynn hopes they won't because it will prove the lie in his story.

 

[Zidane98]

A workmate of mine is a hobby pilot, his son has a commercial licence I think (my mate talks things up a bit). He gets really triggered if somebody (else) does something against CASA rules with a drone. It's like a sense of sky ownership, not everyone can fly I'm special type thing.

Drones are not allowed in national parks without a permit. Can see a scenario where GL, agitated by the impending shitcanning of his Jetstar career due to covid get into an argument with RH about it when he's trying to get away from it all out in the high country having a go at RH for flying the drone and then possibly losing his temper over it.


It seems whatever the altercation started over the 2 main precursors were the drone and/or RH setting up right next to GL.


I do find it a bit strange knowing how much open space there is in the 'Gatta that RH would set up camp right next to anyone. In my experience of the place campers are spread out usually over a distance of kilometers rather than right next door.

 

[Kurve]

No reports on that yet. A pretty big issue with that is the coppers not finding it until 1 and a half years later though. Who knows what happened in between with animals. Was there a flood in the area in those times?

Did they find the piece of skull when they went back, presumably when they got another piece of information through the committall? That information from my reading of the situation, came from Lynn's lawyer who incidentally, was trying to have Lynn's police statement thrown out.