List Mgmt. COLLINGWOOD Trade and F/A Discussion

[Adversity10]

Reality is that Grundy wasn't in the 10 best ruckman in the afl last year.

Stats say otherwise, Numbers standpoint only here not my personal opinion he was a top 4 ruckman for hitouts/hitouts to advantage along with top 4 in hitouts to advantage and hitout to % percentage with total games played over 10 and likewise with just hits outs won. He was easily in our best three clearance players as well not to mention Disposals and tackles top 2 as a ruckman in the comp.

Can't argue with data and stats, it doesn't lie. For key "Ruck" stats he was basically tied top 3 and this is all during an "off year"

Personal opinion aside.

It was a loaded question because I was looking at the numbers just yesterday. When judging across both categories Cameron is the number 1 ruck in the competition this year.

Influence is the measure. Goals and contested marks from big men have the greatest influence on matches, IMO. A top 3-4 ruckman is worth $600-800k with Gawn the exception as a club captain and team barometer hence his 5 consecutive AA jumpers…

Looking at Cameron's Ruck numbers - 577 Ruck contests, 230 hitouts with 63 to advantage. Overall % wise hes barely a top 20 ruckman and below average in every key ruck stat. His marking and goal numbers are top tier, more reason he should be our forward/pinch hitting ruckman.

I think if Grundy can lift his contested marking numbers around the ground (not just forward) he will basically become irreplaceable as a number #1 ruckman. He gives us our best opportunity at clearances, which can be game changing with the 6-6-6. Around stoppages he's damaging, his tackling numbers are massive and ball use as a ruckman is dependable

But I agree with you 100% the money doesn't fit, he should be on closer to the 800k mark as at maximum.

 

[Silky23]

This is DC’s body of work around stoppages.

If you can’t interpret those numbers then you’re clearly interpreting what you want to interpret.

DC isn’t even close to #1 ruck in the league this year. He wouldn’t even be on the top half a dozen.

 

[soreplums]

I think the Grundy chatter is BS but if it were to eventuate for whatever reason, surely a player swap to improve the side in another position must be facilitated either by straight swap or with a third club. To swap him for Josh Dunkley or Nick Larkey, would be a solid result.

He won’t go to North

 

[Silky23]

I think if we had a midfield of Clarry Trac and Viney all locked in for several years like Melbourne do, or a GWS midfield stocked with talent, you could take a hit in the ruck and use BG as trade bait.

But when you have A grade quality tier on your list and surrounded by a C grade midfield, you can’t afford to go weak in the ruck as well.

I’m not being pessimistic but we won’t win a grand final with the current midfield set up - it is one paced, old and slow. When finals get hot and contested, we have nobody to fly the flag. That’s when you need an elite ruck to at least halve the contest and bring you back into it.

Melbourne won last year through winning contested ball. It’s the metric you need to win.

 

[Juan Ide]

There are only two potential trades that really excite me;
1. Dunkley
2. Taranto

The rest (Hill, Mc Stay etc.) seem pretty mediocre by comparison...

 

[soreplums]

There are only two potential trades that really excite me;
1. Dunkley
2. Taranto

The rest (Hill, Mc Stay etc.) seem pretty mediocre by comparison...

Where did Dunkley talk come from?

 

[Juan Ide]

Where did Dunkley talk come from?

He's still not signed up with the Bulldogs beyond this year, I believe (and they reputedly have salary cap issues)

 

[manicpie]

There are only two potential trades that really excite me;
1. Dunkley
2. Taranto

The rest (Hill, Mc Stay etc.) seem pretty mediocre to me

I prefer hill and McStay. Taranto doesn't excite me and he is slow and can't kick for shit, he would be way over priced. The same goes with Dunkley, slow and over rated, slow players get slower as they get older. Hill was a gun junior and has had injuries as well as not wanting to live in sydney, he would be a bargain and in the right environment would develop into a great player for us. McStay will be played at pure FF which will give us a strong battle in the air and time to develop a young KF.

 

[Juan Ide]

I prefer hill and McStay. Taranto doesn't excite me and he is slow and can't kick for s**t, he would be way over priced. The same goes with Dunkley, slow and over rated, slow players get slower as they get older. Hill was a gun junior and has had injuries as well as not wanting to live in sydney, he would be a bargain and in the right environment would develop into a great player for us. McStay will be played at pure FF which will give us a strong battle in the air and time to develop a young KF.

Dunkley 'slow and overrated'. WTF!!!

 

[Quicky]

He's still not signed up with the Bulldogs beyond this year, I believe (and they reputedly have salary cap issues)

+ Dunkley tried to leave last year. He has a Damir Cloke like old man. I think he'd come with a big price tag.

 

[stormskye]

I just hope we don’t do a 2018. Whilst it’s great to be a big chance of playing finals, I don’t realistically see us challenging the big boys, list wise we just have far to many holes. In 2018 we weren’t the best team, almost stole one, and then sold the farm to try and win it. I don’t want a repeat of that. I want us to stay on course and rebuild properly. We lack a spine and an a grade midfield. It’s not the formula for sustained success and needs addressing properly with no quick fixes. The fact we’ve won 7 in a row with the list we have is quite impressive. But I don’t want to be making up the numbers.

 

[Jen2310]

+ Dunkley tried to leave last year. He has a Damir Cloke like old man. I think he'd come with a big price tag.

2020 wasn't it? The year treloar came in

 

[manicpie]

Dunkley 'slow and overrated'. WTF!!!

We aren't getting Dunkley, he's going to Essendon. He would be just another over paid player at our club

 

[soreplums]

We aren't getting Dunkley, he's going to Essendon. He would be just another over paid player at our club

with Easendon’s war chest Dodoro may even go after Grundy.

 

[Maison]

As much as our KPF issues an clearance player in the vein of Tom Green

12

Tom Green

Age

24

Ht

192cm

Wt

92kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

11.5

3star

K

4.3

2star

HB

7.3

5star

M

1.8

2star

T

2.3

4star

CL

2.8

4star

D

11.5

3star

K

4.3

2star

HB

7.3

4star

M

1.8

2star

T

2.3

3star

CL

2.8

4star

D

11.5

3star

K

4.3

2star

HB

7.3

5star

M

1.8

2star

T

2.3

4star

CL

2.8

5star

or LDU would be a priority

Grab a KPF via the drsft. The good ones rarely move

 

[sr36]

Grab a KPF via the drsft. The good ones rarely move

Daniher, Cameron, Lynch, Kennedy, Buddy, Dixon, Gunston - heaps of the good ones have moved.

 

[Matrix10]

He won’t go to North

North Adelaide ! , perfect fit for him , downside for us , we ain’t getting much in return, a pallet load of Balfours Pies.

 

[Stripes B and W]

It was a loaded question because I was looking at the numbers just yesterday. When judging across both categories Cameron is the number 1 ruck in the competition this year.

Influence is the measure. Goals and contested marks from big men have the greatest influence on matches, IMO. A top 3-4 ruckman is worth $600-800k with Gawn the exception as a club captain and team barometer hence his 5 consecutive AA jumpers…

Pretty fair call Sco. about influence for a ruckman.
I'd add clearance as a significant metric for a ruck as well and its the one area that Grundy's absence has exposed IMO. Its further emphasised as we are poor in the area anyway. Grundy is elite in this area, it represents perhaps a loss of 2 per match which is the equivalent of an average mid versus an above average one or thereabouts.
In Grundy's 6 games we won the clearance count in 50% of our games, without him we have won 3 of 10. Clearance per game are down 2 -3 per game without him also, yet we have won 8 out of the 10 games. Metrics are mixed a bit for me but do highlight the goals and CM's that Cameron brings.
Ignoring Grundy's contract, ( which we cant i know if we assume sans Grundy could mean in Taranto ) but for the remainder of the year, Grundy back in a slightly differrent mix, makes us a much better side.

 

[Chrispiesssss]

Would anyone be interested in Bailey smith

6

Bailey Smith

Age

24

Ht

185cm

Wt

86kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

18.3

5star

K

8.5

3star

HB

9.8

5star

M

2.3

2star

T

3.8

5star

CL

2.7

4star

D

19.8

5star

K

9.6

4star

HB

10.2

5star

M

1.8

2star

T

3.2

4star

CL

3.2

4star

D

14.8

4star

K

7.6

3star

HB

7.2

5star

M

2.0

3star

T

3.4

5star

CL

1.6

4star

? Might need a change of scenery post scandal.

 

[Jen2310]

Would anyone be interested in Bailey smith? Might need a change of scenery post scandal.

on the verge of signing a 2 year deal

 

[mumblingpie]

I think the Grundy chatter is BS but if it were to eventuate for whatever reason, surely a player swap to improve the side in another position must be facilitated either by straight swap or with a third club. To swap him for Josh Dunkley or Nick Larkey, would be a solid result.

Naa I’ll pass on Dunkley, one of the worse set shots for goal in the league

 

[Juan Ide]

Naa I’ll pass on Dunkley, one of the worse set shots for goal in the league

Has scored more goals this season than any of our midfielders by some distance. Only Mihocek, Ginnivan, Henry & Cameron on our list have outscored him...

 

[manicpie]

Has scored more goals this season than any of our midfielders by some distance. Only Mihocek, Ginnivan, Henry & Cameron on our list have outscored him...

Can you give us another player to get excited about because Dunkley isn't coming to us and is still contracted.

 

[Quicky]

2020 wasn't it? The year treloar came in

Could be right Jen. I'll trust you on it.

 

[Anzacday]

Could be right Jen. I'll trust you on it.

Good call, she’s right.