Rumour Future of the club (Bevo, board, assistant coaches, football department)

[Next Waiting]

In a moment of weakness I watched OTC last night. Once I was able to turn my focus away from the abomination that are the bags under Garry Lyons' dead eyes, they had a bit on the small fwd set up of teams currently in the hunt. Geelong and GWS have 3 each (I think) hard running, ground covering, quick ball users. My Dog we lag.....

I don't think it's something we can replicate this season. We almost have to do the opposite given what's on our list.

TL/DR. JUH and Freijah on the wings. Darcy, Naughts and Lobb fwd with a bit of West, VDM, Clarke and Weightman (later) mixed in.

 

[yebach]

I agree with you

But feel like with this playing list, club would feel the pressure to go with experience

Surely not Simpson. He's also stuck in the 2015-2018 game plan. With no other alternatives.

 

[scratchie]

Our player development can’t be that bad - our reserves are undefeated with West, Garcia, ODonnell, Khamis, Gallagher Darcy, Jamarra Weightmann all improving with experience.

The problem has been that Beveridge picks list clogging rejects from other clubs who block our better young players from getting games.

You didn’t mention Macrae- what happens to him. Personally I would keep and play him as a defensive mid.?

There is a difference between recruitment and the development. the first is fine, the second is not.

O Donnel was a great pick-up - credit to the recruiters - we fast tracked him so I'II concede that much
Khamis is the most athletic player on our list - waisted last year playing him forward in VFL - which is why his not sure when to go for the mark and when to kill the contest with a punch.

Darcy is just a freak - no development credit - father son - an easy one.

English's development as Ruckman is god awful

Gallagher is being miss managed, ditto Sanders, Freijah, Clarke, Jones, as is/was West

Garcia Does it everytime - first game into the team and he gives it his all, next game he begins to coast as he did v Freo
Needs told its unacceptable and dropped. Give him another go in 3 weeks time and he might start stringing them together.

I've got no issue giving Sanders a game in the VFL but Gallagher had stunk it up far more and it was he who should have been dropped first. Otherwise the message is that performance does not mean anything - what matters is whether Bevo likes you or not.

This is the kind of crap that fractures team unity.

The players can be made to understand why we are trying to develop Vandermeer because of his pace and defensive output and I'm fine with it - there some progress though it feels glacial at times. Sanders being dragged and dropped twice when others are worse is not acceptable.

With Eade this kind of stuff was so easy to read. Not with Bevo- I recall Addison would be played - one bad game and he was out. It was the same for all the bottom four or five. The trouble with Bevo's approach is that it breeds mediocrity. Watch the Geelong team and you see everyone puts in every game - there is pride in the way they go about it. It's all as a supporter I want to see. Pride, passion and accountability.

I expect there is mass confusion as to the expectations. Then after a week of media lampooning we came out against the Saints like it we were playing a Final. Well, the good clubs come out like that 5/6 weeks not 1 of 6.

As for Macrae - the increased pace of the game has hurt him - as its killed Caleb. Whilst Macrae will find it difficult to have the same influence he once had - his output remains of an AFL standard there is room for him. It's just our expectations need to adjust - he is now a quality bottom six not top six in the squad.

 

[GetDimmaBack]

Goodness me we are frustrating club. We've got a lot wrong of late and what we've got right is arguably accidental.

Player Development and selection is sub-par with mixed messaging.
Gallagher - has shown a bit, but two-three weeks ago he dropped-off. It was the moment to identify the standard you expect and send him back to the VFL for 2-3 weeks. Instead, he has been allowed to stink it up further, allowed to coast and has lost all confidence. We saw the same with Arthur Jones last year. This is destroying development. It's outrageous. Now when Gallagher is dropped it's not the 3 good games he remembers but the last 3 where he appears out of his depth.

In the VFL last week v Williamstown, we are playing 3 non AFL listed players on the ball!. Why on earth wouldn't you give Clarke and A.Jones intermittent runs in the middle? WTF. The forward pocket role is notoriously difficult - give them the opportunities to get their hands on it build some confidence. Who knows what they might learn about themselves or what we might learn about them.

The same argument is doubly worse regarding Freijah - here is a big bodied lad recruited as a wingman - playing a deep defensive role in the VFL. A position he has zero chance of filling in the AFL for the next 2-3 years. No problem, there is an argument to teach him defensive patterns - fine. But a five-minute run in the middle each or every other quarter is not going to undermine the defensive learning and might just fast track his development.

It's the same with Cleary, - what are we doing with him? I see zero creativity or thinking of his development. Why can't Cleary have a run on the ball - Callum Mills was an average defender at Sydney before being moved. May work, may not work but give these kids a chance - hold them to a standard.

THE GAME HAS PASSED THEM BY
That Fremantle game should be the last time we see Harmes or Daniel in the Senior. The game is too quick for them. It's sad for Caleb who has had a tremendous career with us - but the game evolves and he is now being rag dolled. As for Harmes, what's the point? I'm not critical we gave him a chance but the evidence is sufficient to move on. He has a premiership - so a much happier career than most. Zero point giving him games.

TEAM UNITY AND PASSION
This may well be the biggest problem - we are not a team. Too many players are playing for themselves. I watched Geelong play Carlton and the support and genuine joy the players show for each other is outstanding. It would be a joy to follow a team that is so united -win or lose.

For Example - And this is not picking on West - it's a team problem.
You may all remember this play against Fremantle, Dale was involved in from the back line - had two possession and gut ran to receive a pass on the boundary, fifty from goal. He slots thru! It's the kind of effort that wins you games. Dale runs to the bench, West barely acknowledges him, Dale sits on the same bench with a two meter gap between them and as they proceed to stare out into space!

Contrast this with the Cats bench when someone does anything special. They are over the moon with a play of that caliber.

Repeatedly, against Fremantle we saw players refuse take easy passing options to players all by themselves in the forward fifty and instead bomb it to contest or take a low percentage shot. No, it wasn't just because they did not see the option. There were lots of those too, I'm referring to players with the ball 60-70 meters out with a player inside by themselves ignored. Options Geelong players would reflexively take.

LIST STRENGTH & WEAKNESS
Our priorities need to be to Secure the Talls; Develop the mid-field, find some X-factor

The spine with Naughton, Darcy, Jamarra, Buslinger, O'Donnell and Khamis - and Croft to come is healthy.

The mid-field is aging quickly and needs replenishment - Liber and Treloar are near the end and Bont needs less battering if we are to prolong his career for the next tilt.
Finding Richards has some elite mid-field assets is a godsend. As is Sanders.

TRADE AWAY
Lobb needs to be traded and every likelihood a team like Melbouurne would jump at him
Bailey Smith - don't need the circus that comes with him, has value will be traded
English - we can't to have so much money invested in a timid ruckman - get what you can for him
Work thru the list during the rest of the season and have clear idea who should be kept, who can be traded and who delisted.

DRAFT
The above should provide us with 2 first round picks and a second rounder in a highly rated mid-field draft crop.
Find a gun mid and someone with X-Factor and we're away before the Tasmanian compromised drafts arrive. Do not want to be caught mid-ladder or lower around 2027.

COACHES
Announce Beveridges departure mid-season allowing the club to properly interview and find the best candidate for the role. Pick a team with the best head-coach, best tactician and best development coaches available.

FOCUS ON TEAM FIRST UNITY

NOT A REBUILD ITS A RELOAD.

Otherwise we are coasting to nowhere - and in a competitive sport that's oblivion.

This is the first post I can recall seeing from you, scratchie, but man, have you nailed it!

Not much of what you've said is anything like the club we have been over the years (other than the bit about playing for themselves), but it IS the club we need to become.

...and should have become 50 years ago.

 

[Next Waiting]

As for Macrae - the increased pace of the game has hurt him - as its killed Caleb. Whilst Macrae will find it difficult to have the same influence he once had - his output remains of an AFL standard there is room for him. It's just our expectations need to adjust - he is now a quality bottom six not top six in the squad.

Harsh but fair. It's the new reality.

 

[Deadly Darcy]

JUH still hasn’t signed despite the positive noise. Concerning given our tragectory at the moment. I don’t know if he’s a Bevo in or Bevo out player but I wouldn’t be signing without a clear vision in his shoes and our big issue currently is we don’t seem to have any clarity to sell.

 

[Anja_Nees]

Our player development can’t be that bad - our reserves are undefeated with West, Garcia, ODonnell, Khamis, Gallagher Darcy, Jamarra Weightmann all improving with experience.

The problem has been that Beveridge picks list clogging rejects from other clubs who block our better young players from getting games.

You didn’t mention Macrae- what happens to him. Personally I would keep and play him as a defensive mid.?

All of Bont, Daniel, Macrae, Hunter, JJ etc played most of their footy under Bevo and hit significant heights.

Naughton, Richards, English (flawed though he is) have also come on well. I don’t think player development has been a major issue under Bevo.

Strongly agree that we should bypass list cloggers, and unfortunately their recruitment is something that has happened under his watch.

My general rule going back 20 odd years when Carlton and Richmond imploded is:

• don’t recruit fringe players from other clubs
• if you absolutely have to, recruit them from top four clubs.

I’ve never seriously reconsidered that position.

 

[Oliver G]

As for Macrae - the increased pace of the game has hurt him - as its killed Caleb. Whilst Macrae will find it difficult to have the same influence he once had - his output remains of an AFL standard there is room for him. It's just our expectations need to adjust - he is now a quality bottom six not top six in the squad.

Harsh but fair. It's the new reality.

Not sure what people are expecting from Macrae, his role has changed. Since being made the sub he's been solid and was excellent in the St Kilda match, hardly a bottom 6 player.

For years people complained he was just an accumulator and now that he's not getting 30 disposals a game, people think that it's good night. He's currently ranked 3rd at the club for score assists and over the last two games he's been our #1 tackler and our #1 pressure player. He's actively working on the very things he was criticised for lacking.

I think it's only fair to give him until the end of the year before we talk about writing him off.

 

[Next Waiting]

Not sure what people are expecting from Macrae, his role has changed. Since being made the sub he's been solid and was excellent in the St Kilda match, hardly a bottom 6 player.

For years people complained he was just an accumulator and now that he's not getting 30 disposals a game, people think that it's good night. He's currently ranked 3rd at the club for score assists and over the last two games he's been our #1 tackler and our #1 pressure player. He's actively working on the very things he was criticised for lacking.

I think it's only fair to give him until the end of the year before we talk about writing him off.

Not writing him off by a long shot and tbh I hope he stays with us. I think his pace relegates him to being a role player as the game stands currently but he could be a very effective role player.

I'm pulling a figure out my ass here, but I'd suggest that 90% of AFL midfielders are quicker than he is (maybe 95%). Not a criticism, just the reality. But he has skill in congestion and vision that 75% would kill for.

I put it to you this way. If Macrae had Clayton Oliver's speed, he'd be a top 5 player in the league, year in, year out, ad nauseum. But he doesn't so he isn't. I'll diverge for a moment. Oliver kills us and he kills us because he's quick, sizeable and he's hard. Ugly as sin, but he's a player. We have no-one who can go with him for pace. So he's first to the ball if it's more than a few metres from congestion, aided by the unfortunate coincidence of Gawn being the ruck. If we get it, and it breaks down, he's also often the first one there. Equally unfortunately, Oliver also has a tank so he doesn't stop like we need him to. Macrae has him covered for skill and vision IMO but he can't get there like Oliver can to impact. My answer to that is a hard Richards tag but that's another story

Back to Macrae. If he's a bottom 6 player for us, we might be OK, if not this year, next.

 

[ScragCity]

Back Sevo

 

[cleveland]

If Dogs move on Bevo

We won't be going for a first timer coach unless we are entering full rebuild mode

Ideally, a experienced coach like Adam Simpson

Lol no chance

 

[Westerndog11]

Heard word out of the Framlingham mob that the reason why Marra has taken the time away from the club and headed back home isn’t just because of the passing of an elder. While the grieving process in the community takes time and isn’t the same process as normal funeral Marras issues aren’t attributed to this. The contract process and the weight of the huge money offers and his future is what has become a huge weight on his shoulders. He wants to remain a Dog and is extremely loyal (Never wanted to leave East Warrnambool but moved to South Warrnambool to develop and get recruited) but the current situation at the club and the significant offers from elsewhere have really complicated things in his mind. Hopefully he will be back in the team soon and he is able to get a clear mind. The time back home and away from the club may have given him what he needs.

 

[Hobdog]

Heard word out of the Framlingham mob that the reason why Marra has taken the time away from the club and headed back home isn’t just because of the passing of an elder. While the grieving process in the community takes time and isn’t the same process as normal funeral Marras issues aren’t attributed to this. The contract process and the weight of the huge money offers and his future is what has become a huge weight on his shoulders. He wants to remain a Dog and is extremely loyal (Never wanted to leave East Warrnambool but moved to South Warrnambool to develop and get recruited) but the current situation at the club and the significant offers from elsewhere have really complicated things in his mind. Hopefully he will be back in the team soon and he is able to get a clear mind. The time back home and away from the club may have given him what he needs.

Seems like things just keep going from bad to worse at the moment. The joint is broken, there’s enough info to make a reasonable conclusion on that fact.


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[Dog 36]

Heard word out of the Framlingham mob that the reason why Marra has taken the time away from the club and headed back home isn’t just because of the passing of an elder. While the grieving process in the community takes time and isn’t the same process as normal funeral Marras issues aren’t attributed to this. The contract process and the weight of the huge money offers and his future is what has become a huge weight on his shoulders. He wants to remain a Dog and is extremely loyal (Never wanted to leave East Warrnambool but moved to South Warrnambool to develop and get recruited) but the current situation at the club and the significant offers from elsewhere have really complicated things in his mind. Hopefully he will be back in the team soon and he is able to get a clear mind. The time back home and away from the club may have given him what he needs.

With what you state above accompanied with info from those ITK along with some of the media commentary along with some mixed messages coming out of club during media conferences I seriously feel for the players.

There mindset must be all over the place to the extent I don't know how they take to the field let alone perform to the level we all expect.

The place needs direction and a person put in place to make the required changes and give direction to all ASAP as we will lose some good players, we will start to put our dirty laundry out on the field and media and last thing we want is a messy end to Bev tenure and lose players along the way.

The board needs to get their s**t together now today this minute

 

[Hobdog]

Multiple reviews and the club is seemingly in a worse place than before. So frustrating. Going to be a long season with all this speculation floating around. I suspect if you’re playing regularly and in a position you like, you’re probably a Bevo fan. If you’re on the outer, the opposite likely applies. Perfect recipe for a divided playing list.


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[dogwatch]

With what you state above accompanied with info from those ITK along with some of the media commentary along with some mixed messages coming out of club during media conferences I seriously feel for the players.

There mindset must be all over the place to the extent I don't know how they take to the field let alone perform to the level we all expect.

The place needs direction and a person put in place to make the required changes and give direction to all ASAP as we will lose some good players, we will start to put our dirty laundry out on the field and media and last thing we want is a messy end to Bev tenure and lose players along the way.

The board needs to get their s**t together now today this minute

Agree. A lot of it is yet to be confirmed of course, but some of it seems to be from sound sources.

Concerning if true. The Board has to wear it.

 

[TiAn_]

I can’t blame some players for being annoyed that a coach that they may see as a dead man walking might take down their career with him on his way out. Would be frustrating.

I just hope when Bev eventually goes later this year we manage to triage the senior players that are on the outer and don’t lose a handful like in 2014. Our list isn’t nearly as strong as it was then.

 

[LondonBulldog]

Our player development can’t be that bad - our reserves are undefeated with West, Garcia, ODonnell, Khamis, Gallagher Darcy, Jamarra Weightmann all improving with experience.

The problem has been that Beveridge picks list clogging rejects from other clubs who block our better young players from getting games.

You didn’t mention Macrae- what happens to him. Personally I would keep and play him as a defensive mid.?

Who cares if we are undefeated in the reserves. I'm much prefer to use the reserves to do actually what Scratchie was suggesting. Throw Clearly into the middle, throw Clark in there, Try Artie off half back etc. We need to find out who can play. I like Freijah yet they have concerns about his contested work, hence that why his is playing deep defence, I get that, yet do that with the whole team.

 

[doggy_dog]

There’s enough to smoke to see that there is zero alignment at this club from top to bottom. Need a big clean out of our administration (and have done for a while now)

 

[Next Waiting]

I can’t blame some players for being annoyed that a coach that they may see as a dead man walking might take down their career with him on his way out. Would be frustrating.

I just hope when Bev eventually goes later this year we manage to triage the senior players that are on the outer and don’t lose a handful like in 2014. Our list isn’t nearly as strong as it was then.

I see a couple of similarities with 2014.

We needed to lose Higgins, Griffen, Cooney and for Gia to retire to be successful. They were part of an unsuccessful dynamic as was the Coach. Boyd shifted back, we got Tom Boyd's and evolved...quickly.

We need to lose Smith and Daniel at a minimum this year. Maybe Williams or Macrae are part of that as well.... and the coach....maybe. Instead of a Tom Boyd this time round though, we need an absolute midfield gun. A fast, top 10 in the comp midfielder.... top 5 if possible....and then we'll evolve again....quickly.

 

[Freshwater]

I see a couple of similarities with 2014.

We needed to lose Higgins, Griffen, Cooney and for Gia to retire to be successful. They were part of an unsuccessful dynamic as was the Coach. Boyd shifted back, we got Tom Boyd's and evolved...quickly.

We need to lose Smith and Daniel at a minimum this year. Maybe Williams or Macrae are part of that as well.... and the coach....maybe. Instead of a Tom Boyd this time round though, we need an absolute midfield gun. A fast, top 10 in the comp midfielder.... top 5 if possible....and then we'll evolve again....quickly.

Remember we lost our reining best and fairest in the practice games, Libba. He didn’t play under Bevo until that first game in 2016, where he kicked a goal early in the game.

 

[threenewpadlocks]

Multiple reviews and the club is seemingly in a worse place than before. So frustrating. Going to be a long season with all this speculation floating around. I suspect if you’re playing regularly and in a position you like, you’re probably a Bevo fan. If you’re on the outer, the opposite likely applies. Perfect recipe for a divided playing list.


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I'll dispute that we're in a worse place than before.

Most statistical ladder predictors etc.: https://squiggle.com.au/ladder/ have roughly slightly better or equal than what was predicted at the start of the season.

Power Rankings - Squiggle

AFL Power Ratings from the internet's finest models.

squiggle.com.au

We were lower than 9th in power rankings to start the season. We're not hugely more likely to make finals than the start of the season, despite the better-than-expected performance, because transferring a percentage of 114.7% into only 3 wins and 4 losses is a bit inefficient/bad luck.

In other words, if before round one, if you asked people if we had scored 82 more points than we had conceded over the first 7 rounds, knowing our opposition, whether that would represent more of an improvement or a regression of the team from pre-season expectations, more people surely would have said improvemen? (As proven in the increase of power rankings from about 11th to 9th through 7 rounds).

People threw the toys out with the cot when we lost to Hawthorn and West Coast to end last year, and they were right to do so, it was two awful losses against two bottom teams. But had we carried that form into 2024, we would not have a percentage of 114.4% against our opposition as it stands.

 

[TiAn_]

I see a couple of similarities with 2014.

We needed to lose Higgins, Griffen, Cooney and for Gia to retire to be successful. They were part of an unsuccessful dynamic as was the Coach. Boyd shifted back, we got Tom Boyd's and evolved...quickly.

We need to lose Smith and Daniel at a minimum this year. Maybe Williams or Macrae are part of that as well.... and the coach....maybe. Instead of a Tom Boyd this time round though, we need an absolute midfield gun. A fast, top 10 in the comp midfielder.... top 5 if possible....and then we'll evolve again....quickly.

Unfortunately, I don’t think we currently have a cohort of U22 youth that gets within shouting distance of what we ended 2014 with… Bont, Libba, Macrae, Wallis, Dahlhaus, Stringer, Hunter, T. Boyd, Johannisen, Daniel, McLean, Dale, Smith. We rode the wave of that group (plus additions the following year like Dunkley and Williams) hitting their straps.

 

[dogwatch]

Yep, that works!

 

[Golden_6]

Unfortunately, I don’t think we currently have a cohort of U22 youth that gets within shouting distance of what we ended 2014 with… Bont, Libba, Macrae, Wallis, Dahlhaus, Stringer, Hunter, T. Boyd, Johannisen, Daniel, McLean, Dale, Smith. We rode the wave of that group (plus additions the following year like Dunkley and Williams) hitting their straps.

A lot of those guys were minimal performers (Dale, Daniel, McLean) throughout 2015 during our initial rise and barely contributed to that success.

There's plenty of talent on our list. To counter your argument we have Naughton, JUH, Richards, Smith, Sanders, Weightman, Buku, Darcy, West, JOD, Croft, Gallagher, Frejiah & Clarke. These guys are all under 24 and are either established AFL players or seemingly have bright futures. That group stacks up with that initial group for sure.

I definitely believe there's enough talent on this list for a very quick turnaround if we get it right. We're going to lose a few of the top end (Jones, Libba, Treloar etc.) but we have the players on the list to step up.