Strategy 2014 game plan improvements

[geelong_crazy26]

Fantastic thread geelong_crazy26!

Have to agree, we were really in groove with Simpson, having limped along for so long without a ruck and when he went down I think it showed many just how glaringly our game needed a good ruck! (Yet CS still managed for the team to do well without one.)

For me not having speed was a bit of a killer, Varcoe being out; and with StevieJ playing in the midfield we were hurting without a good small forward like StevieJ or Chappy. There are so many areas where we either were missing players or the regulars were injured!

There were times when we'd have all our players running back and when we did get possession there was no one forward to kick goals. Opposing teams seem to preempt our game and that's where we need to shake it up! I think CS will do that because he said last year he rates versatile players! Remember Taylor kicking goals?

I think Selwood needs to take his game to another level this year! His goal kicking practise proved what a versatile player he is, if I had to niggle about him, I'd say he needs to find away to shake a tag. I think he was exposed by some taggers last season.



I'm not sure I agree with that about Lonergan, VC - although he always has the worst stats, he is still good one-on-one with the full forwards - continued to keep the Buddies etc to two goals.

Obviously, I do agree with you that Scarlett was a loss! But how did you rate Guthrie's first year in the back line?

Jon Douglas says it perfectly - "Imagine the game plan we had this year with a fit Hawkins, Simpson and Menzel ! Reckon that would have made a difference."



Are you saying Chris Scott was out coached by Lyon, Malthouse and Clarkson? Not Malthouse! 2011 GF? + Clarkson only in one game!




+ please, will someone explain the rose-coloured glasses version that Geelong missed the GF by five points? We gave up a 20 point lead at 3/4 time FFS!!! + yes, I'm still devo about it!



Agree Footscore! The only thing I'd add is that with no Scarlett, there were times when Bartel just appeared in exactly the spot we needed him and you'd see a collective sigh of all our backs!

CS has been saying for two years that he wants versatile players - if anything we should be prepared to see how he shakes it up again this season!

was meant to say "wouldnt" trade back for thompson, and that thompson got outcoached by lyon malthouse and clarkson, not CS! i think chris scott honestly is the best coach in the AFL. just look at the position we were in and what everyone was saying at the end of 2010, and since then what scott has done with a side that looked old and gone! not to mention slaughtering malthouse as a tactician in his first season! no doubt it was the game plan we had that won us the 11 premiership, if it was the personnel we had out on the field, then don't you think we would have won it in 2010 a year younger + garry ablett in the side? but yet we got our absolute pants pulled down, 80 points in the 3rd quarter!!!

we had a better side in 2010 than we did in 2011, yet we simply had a brilliant coach in 2011 who turned it around and got us that third premiership thompson just wasn't up for

 

[Partridge]

We are a victim of our own success,I guess the reward for on going excellence is handy caping much like horse racing I suppose.While mediocrity and failure gets rewarded.

Can't agree with that YPY. It might make fans feel better to blame the draft or the AFL, but most if not all of our problems in 2013 were self-inflicted. For example:

- No one but the club decided NOT to rest veterans throughout the season, with the result that the team was old and exhausted (not a good combination) by the Prelim final.
- No one but the club decided NOT to give more games to our younger guys in the VFL, a few of whom absolutely deserved it on form. 10 more games to Horlin-Smith might have meant 5 less each to Corey and Kelly - how much fresher might they have been in September?
- No one but the club blundered their selections in the Qualifying Final.
- No one but the club horrendously managed the fitness of Hawkins. Or played Varcoe when his form didn't warrant it.
- We still finished 18-4, and with a double chance, and a home final for the first time ever. They had their chances and weren't good enough.

The first lesson the club needs to relearn is start planning the season better. And stop feeding us bullshit about how they're ready to peak in September when two years in a row they clearly haven't been.

 

[4quarter_cat]

I have to say Partridge, you make a lot of very fine points, but I don't think there is a person on this forum who hasn't gotten the message now. "We had an excellent shot in 2013 and blew it with bad decisions from the MC."

We live we learn, but please realise we all already know what you think on this topic.

 

[geelong_crazy26]

Can't agree with that YPY. It might make fans feel better to blame the draft or the AFL, but most if not all of our problems in 2013 were self-inflicted. For example:

- No one but the club decided NOT to rest veterans throughout the season, with the result that the team was old and exhausted (not a good combination) by the Prelim final.
- No one but the club decided NOT to give more games to our younger guys in the VFL, a few of whom absolutely deserved it on form. 10 more games to Horlin-Smith might have meant 5 less each to Corey and Kelly - how much fresher might they have been in September?
- No one but the club blundered their selections in the Qualifying Final.
- No one but the club horrendously managed the fitness of Hawkins. Or played Varcoe when his form didn't warrant it.
- We still finished 18-4, and with a double chance, and a home final for the first time ever. They had their chances and weren't good enough.

The first lesson the club needs to relearn is start planning the season better. And stop feeding us bullshit about how they're ready to peak in September when two years in a row they clearly haven't been.

I remember back in 2011, we had a mini pre season building up towards the finals, I believe we should have tried something similar this year looking back given the position we were in at one point sitting onto
Of the ladder.

It was obvious in 11 that rounds 15-16 were the start of the mini pre season ( the shock losses to essendon and west coast). So important to get wins on the board early for luxuries such as this preparing for finals

 

[fpm84]

Change one:

Stop bombing the ball forward to an injured or absent key forward (Hawkins) and whoever is alongside him - this year, that'll likely be an injury prone novice in Vardy.

Change two:

If players are injured and performing below par - even if they're reigning All Australians - do the right thing for the team by resting them to have them in their best possible shape for the end of the season.

 

[CF]

One of the areas we need to badly work on is our work at the stoppages. Getting smashed at the centre bounces and around the ground makes it very difficult to win a flag. You can get away with mostly winning the ball at CHB and transitioning it up the corridor against teams in the H&A season. Come finals time, the good teams are going to shut down the corridor, and then not only are we losing the clearances, we're getting done on turnovers as well.

Hopefully Simmo or McIntosh can string together a good season for us to give our midfielder's a chance at winning more ball.

 

[Turbocat]

Bobby_ , who are the players to the right of JoelS?
To me its Duncan,Caddy,Sel,Kelly,Guthrie, ?,?

 

[Turbocat]

Bobby_ , who are the players to the right of JoelS?
To me its Duncan,Caddy,Sel,Kelly,Guthrie, ?,?

 

[Vdubs]

Bobby_ , who are the players to the right of JoelS?
To me its Duncan,Caddy,Sel,Kelly,Guthrie, ?,?

Is the 2nd? Billie with growth?

 

[Whit3y]

I remember back in 2011, we had a mini pre season building up towards the finals, I believe we should have tried something similar this year looking back given the position we were in at one point sitting onto
Of the ladder.

but the excuses on this forum for the loses towards the end of the season was exactly this, but dont worry chris scott will have them firing come finals they said.

 

[Whit3y]

Can't agree with that YPY. It might make fans feel better to blame the draft or the AFL, but most if not all of our problems in 2013 were self-inflicted. For example:

- No one but the club decided NOT to rest veterans throughout the season, with the result that the team was old and exhausted (not a good combination) by the Prelim final.

we looked tired didnt we, combined this with hawkins back and thats why our 2nd half of the season was poor, it wasnt all to do with the ruck situation as alot here believe.

 

[geelong_crazy26]

but the excuses on this forum for the loses towards the end of the season was exactly this, but dont worry chris scott will have them firing come finals they said.

Who said they did a mini ore season this year? Or are posters on big footy assuming they know everything when they know nothing as per usual?

I was told in 2011 they did This from my friend involved with list management down at Geelong, I remember asking a whole lot of questions after the two losses in a row and he just was so calm and relaxed saying nothing to worry about st all and that they expected a bit of a form slump with the training load they had going on. I heard no such thing as last season thought

 

[Partridge]

but the excuses on this forum for the loses towards the end of the season was exactly this, but dont worry chris scott will have them firing come finals they said.

Exactly.

It's now trotted out for almost every loss - "they're in the middle of a heavy training period". Love to see evidence of it. Just once.

 

[Partridge]

we looked tired didnt we, combined this with hawkins back and thats why our 2nd half of the season was poor, it wasnt all to do with the ruck situation as alot here believe.

Definitely not. The rucks hurt us in the finals, especially the Qualifying Final, but it wasn't the only reason. There were a whole host of them.

 

[Partridge]

Change one:

Stop bombing the ball forward to an injured or absent key forward (Hawkins) and whoever is alongside him - this year, that'll likely be an injury prone novice in Vardy.

Change two:

If players are injured and performing below par - even if they're reigning All Australians - do the right thing for the team by resting them to have them in their best possible shape for the end of the season.

Change three:

Sensible management of veterans. No it doesn't mean they all get dropped or horror of horrors play VFL. It means they might get 1 game in 5 or 6 either as a sub (if it's a midfielder) or rested. Rotate those imaginary injuries through Enright, Kelly, Bartel, Lonergan as required so that they really are fresh approaching the finals. If the young players are as good as we all think we should have the depth to cover them. It isn't a case of dropping 5 of them at once either (although no doubt it'll be construed as that).

 

[El Dubya]

Exactly.

It's now trotted out for almost every loss - "they're in the middle of a heavy training period". Love to see evidence of it. Just once.

The one time it was true was 2011.

 

[CF]

Hawkins injury really hurt us last year, and he didn't lead much to the ball, especially by the end of the season. That's why we started to long bomb it I think. Pods also didn't have a great year last season. This was balanced out with good years from our smaller guys up forward, especially Motlop, and our midfielder's contributing much needed goals. Hopefully Hawkins will be better this year, and have his movement back. Back injuries are a killer though.

I don't think they went in with a plan on when to rest players, I think they left it to see how the medical issues stacked up during the season. This probably caught them out. A lesson Scott & Co. will have learned. There were some errors made last season I agree. But it comes with the territory.

It's going to be an interesting season in 2014. No Smithy, Chappy, PODs, Westy, & Hunt. I think the structure of the team is going to be very different than what we've been used to in the past. As our old champions continue to move towards the end of their careers it will certainly be a changing of the guard this season.

The question is will these young guys be as good as the teams of 07-11? We may have to accept that while many of these guys are good, they may never be as good as the guys that won us three flags. Time will tell.

 

[geelong_crazy26]

Hawkins injury really hurt us last year, and he didn't lead much to the ball, especially by the end of the season. That's why we started to long bomb it I think. Pods also didn't have a great year last season. This was balanced out with good years from our smaller guys up forward, especially Motlop, and our midfielder's contributing much needed goals. Hopefully Hawkins will be better this year, and have his movement back. Back injuries are a killer though.

I don't think they went in with a plan on when to rest players, I think they left it to see how the medical issues stacked up during the season. This probably caught them out. A lesson Scott & Co. will have learned. There were some errors made last season I agree. But it comes with the territory.

It's going to be an interesting season in 2014. No Smithy, Chappy, PODs, Westy, & Hunt. I think the structure of the team is going to be very different than what we've been used to in the past. As our old champions continue to move towards the end of their careers it will certainly be a changing of the guard this season.

The question is will these young guys be as good as the teams of 07-11? We may have to accept that while many of these guys are good, they may never be as good as the guys that won us three flags. Time will tell.

No, they won't be as good, hardly any side in the history of the game has ever been that good, only really comparable side is Brisbane( discarding amateur VFL days due to immense different system). I doubt if we will see another Geelong side like it in the next 50 years.

How often do you think triple premiership AFL sides will come along? I will give you a hint so far since it began 20 odd years ago, Brisbane and Geelong only

 

[Zouz Kitty]

was meant to say "wouldnt" trade back for thompson, and that thompson got outcoached by lyon malthouse and clarkson, not CS! i think chris scott honestly is the best coach in the AFL. just look at the position we were in and what everyone was saying at the end of 2010, and since then what scott has done with a side that looked old and gone! not to mention slaughtering malthouse as a tactician in his first season! no doubt it was the game plan we had that won us the 11 premiership, if it was the personnel we had out on the field, then don't you think we would have won it in 2010 a year younger + garry ablett in the side? but yet we got our absolute pants pulled down, 80 points in the 3rd quarter!!!

we had a better side in 2010 than we did in 2011, yet we simply had a brilliant coach in 2011 who turned it around and got us that third premiership thompson just wasn't up for

I agree with you! CS combined with Moons giving Tomahawk the pep-talk + as soon as Duncan came on the game just turned! It was one of the best GF for me, probably more because I was there! + also like his insistence on versatility from the players! + he also got us through without a ruck!

 

[Zouz Kitty]

Good to see you back kitty.
In my opinion Lonergans lack of ability to get back (combined with poor stoppage work) cut us open.

And I thought Guthries LAST year as a backman was A+

Thanks VC

Agree, Guthrie was fantastic! Thought he saved so many goals!

Met a lot of the Kittens at the Carji and sweet talked them by saying "Old fat ladies used to be young and pretty " + they were all delightful! Guthrie, Caddy, Vardy, Simpson, Poodle and Rivers all fell for it and were just divine! Even had a pic with Max Rooke! Highlight!!!

 

[geelong_crazy26]

I agree with you! CS combined with Moons giving Tomahawk the pep-talk + as soon as Duncan came on the game just turned! It was one of the best GF for me, probably more because I was there! + also like his insistence on versatility from the players! + he also got us through without a ruck!

Ever since 2011, I have just admired everything about the man and had 100% faith in him at the top. What he did in 2011, bringing us practically back from the dead after our embarrassing prelim and losing Gary ablett?

Do people actually remember what the end of 2010 was like? As a club we were absolutely gutted! We got embarrassed in the prelim in what was a slaughter, we then lost Garry ablett the week later, and then Thompson walked.... If you had of told people at the time Geelong would win the 11 premiership, they would have laughed as much as saying it after north loss at skilled round 5 2007. Chris Scott really did save the club from a potential disastrous road, and resurrecting us to a premiership the next year!!!

I just cringe and think to myself " you absolute clueless moron" when I hear people on the Geelong board question him, he is a star coach, all you need to do is hear the man talk to figure it out

 

[Zouz Kitty]

Ever since 2011, I have just admired everything about the man and had 100% faith in him at the top. What he did in 2011, bringing us practically back from the dead after our embarrassing prelim and losing Gary ablett?

Do people actually remember what the end of 2010 was like? As a club we were absolutely gutted! We got embarrassed in the prelim in what was a slaughter, we then lost Garry ablett the week later, and then Thompson walked.... If you had of told people at the time Geelong would win the 11 premiership, they would have laughed as much as saying it after north loss at skilled round 5 2007. Chris Scott really did save the club from a potential disastrous road, and resurrecting us to a premiership the next year!!!

I just cringe and think to myself " you absolute clueless moron" when I hear people on the Geelong board question him, he is a star coach, all you need to do is hear the man talk to figure it out

I liked him as soon as he walked in the door and said he had no strategy to change the Club, just thoughts on how to improve some areas! He was respectful and that counts for a lot! He is the best thing that's happened to Geelong!

PS I should have just highlighted your whole post lol

 

[Zouz Kitty]

Hawkins,and one of either Simpson or H.Mc we win.I reckon it was personal not game plan that cost us that final.

+ lack of Chappy! He won the Port game for us! + we really missed Boris too! It was heart breaking to lose the lead we had at 3/4 time! Anyway, spilt milk !!!

 

[Zouz Kitty]

I always find it personal when beaten in a final , not a great loser when I think we are good enough. Then losing to Hawthorn after being ahead for so much of the game. If anything screamed era over it was this loss , so much different than any other loss in the previous 6 or so years. Geelong was 18 (or so) up how deep into the last....

Ohh sorry misread it. Yes personnel also had a huge influence on outcome. But how much of this was just bad luck , or how much was a reflection of how close to the tipping point we were. We last an AA CHB in 07 in R22 , then won 2 of the three finals by over a 100 points.

So yes I do agree a fit Simpson and Hawkins would have made a huge difference , I feel the core issue is our midfield strength was average to poor. Too reliant on Selwood. Bundy had a poor finals and we lacked inside strength. Kelly and Bartel not what they were. And again your right if Hunt and Varcoe had been 100% it would have helped a bit , but I think we struggled because we really have not replaced the match winning ability of a 22-28 year old Kelly/Bartel/Ling/Rooke/Chapman.

When we have 8-12 quality types in the 22-28 age range again (with 75 games plus) ..watch out. The mission should be to continue to push quality youth into the midfield. The first obvious addition should be Guthrie. At 21 and 40 games he is precisely what I want more off. Caddy is another. Bundy is only 22 with 57 games We really lack in this age/game/inside mid type. By the end of 2015 we must have that fixed.

We need to add the best of the players who have showed they are close.Sort the keepers out.
GHS , Smedts , Stringer , Cowan. Then blood more youth. Thurlow, Bews, Schroder ..maybe even Jansen. (Perhaps its a lot to ask but if we could pump 50 into him , with his frame , by 2016 he would be primed).

So a fit Simpson and Hawkins would have perhaps got us over the line , add more mid strength and we get by with and ordinary ruck and forward ( as we have done before )

Super post TC!!! One of your crackers, where you hit the nail on the head!

I remember Bartel being interviewed, in 2011 on B4 the Game, about GAJ leaving and he said that losing Rooke had a bigger impact on the team! My hope, with Rooke as Development Manager, the kittens will have that ruthlessness drummed into them!

Bad luck contributed of course! To lose the lead in that Final was heart breaking! I'm still in mourning

 

[winty]

Super post TC!!! One of your crackers, where you hit the nail on the head!

I remember Bartel being interviewed, in 2011 on B4 the Game, about GAJ leaving and he said that losing Rooke had a bigger impact on the team! My hope, with Rooke as Development Manager, the kittens will have that ruthlessness drummed into them!

Bad luck contributed of course! To lose the lead in that Final was heart breaking! I'm still in mourning

I remember saying the same thing on the main board after Gaz left too, and had so many opposition supporters say I was crazy! Glad Jimmy agreed with me!