Training 2023 Pre Season

[lewdogs]

Watching McCartin this year I think we should be able to rest a little easier that it wasn't the heinous call that it previously appeared, and there was a lot of bad luck involved with Paddy's injuries.

It has helped me to move on.

 

[CursingFijian]

Again, he's not our recruiter, that's Toce. SOS will wok out who to contract for what capital and choose the types of players we target in the draft. He might make it a priority to chase a ruck/forward for example but decide that we need ready made and okay trading our FRDP or player out for it. He won't pick the actual player although he would be who Toce sells the kid's skill set to.

A lot of how trades get done is though relationships built over years. Allen and SOS would have very good networks. Gags best asset was his ability to low ball guys like Ross and Billings who had been on easy street for a long time. That stuff is great for our cap but not great for relationships with managers and players.

Neglecting to draft elite youth and over stocking on mediocre ready made’s, because someone thinks we’re in a window, would be a consequence of a List Manager’s decision making though, right?

 

[stavro#4]

Im sure Winmar2Lockett is good bloke and I'm not trying to disrespect him - but that trade has haunted me since the day I heard it confirmed on the radio - I remember exactly where I was when I heard it ! And I just can't believe that there were other clubs ready to make that poor decision that we did - I might be wrong but I honestly just can't personally believe it

Because it haunts you that doesn’t mean he was lying though.

We clearly weren’t the only club who rated him and he clearly had talent. The problem was that most clubs could see the obvious choice and we out smarter ourselves.

 

[BrutThough]

How have we gone with Marshall, Wood and now Stocker?
Done to death but nobody would give us anything for Dunstan, no currency.

We got Jones for Bruce, good swap. Bruce is just about done after the acl.
We got Van Es for Long another good trade.


On SM-S908E using BigFooty.com mobile app

Dunstan was also a Free Agent so we got what the rest of the competition thought he was worth, which was nothing.

 

[George]

You been listening to this bloke , corey homicide williams

On the pies again are we

 

[gringo2011]

Dunstan was also a Free Agent so we got what the rest of the competition thought he was worth, which was nothing.

I think that was mostly due to the absolute shitshow where he bagged his club and started to make himself look psycho. Probably mostly Ratts but you don't see that kind of relationship breakdown play out in public too often. To have to do a deleting instead of getting anything back for a free agent was extraordinary too. It was one of our more bizarre pieces of list management no matter what you thought of him as a player. A guy like Cripps I'm pretty sure would have managed to get a much better return for both players.

People struggle to see the reality when it comes to the footy department that we are replacing. They were below standard across most areas. People loved Trout on here but he was moved on because we found better people. Gags was better than some that we've had but we are replacing him. There is usually a reason.

 

[CaptainRisky]

On the pies again are we

Don't be silly , Keith is not open on a Sunday

 

[Ephemeral Hope]

The downside of that is that he was inconsistent and injury prone as a KP. His best footy is as a high half forward/wing where he can use his athleticism to make space. A bit like Battle, there is a risk moving them out of a position that they have started to flourish in.

Good point but its a dire situation right now hoping for Philippou and Owens, two midfielders who are in their first and second years to be our forwards

 

[St Neil]

I reckon we had a bit of an austerity drive in the footy department and under Finnis it was low priority. Bassat seems to be very determined to give us everything we could ask for as far as experienced high quality operators.

Lyon on his own couldn't possibly do everything but we've surrounded him with quality people and they seem to be ones he's happy to work with. Some of the rich clubs do the same thing but they amass too many good operators who can't work in unison. Footy department builds are as important as list builds and Bassat has given us the best I've seen in my life time. He's put his money where his mouth is.

Well said.

 

[Winmar2Lockett]

Im sure Winmar2Lockett is good bloke and I'm not trying to disrespect him - but that trade has haunted me since the day I heard it confirmed on the radio - I remember exactly where I was when I heard it ! And I just can't believe that there were other clubs ready to make that poor decision that we did - I might be wrong but I honestly just can't personally believe it

What trade?

It was a draft pick.

Probably get the very basics of list management right before you accuse me of making stuff up.

Did it really haunt you when Petracca did his knee in 2015 & Paddy was showing signs of what he is now producing on a weekly basis?

Now that sounds like a made up 'fact'.

 

[CursingFijian]

I reckon we had a bit of an austerity drive in the footy department and under Finnis it was low priority. Bassat seems to be very determined to give us everything we could ask for as far as experienced high quality operators.

Lyon on his own couldn't possibly do everything but we've surrounded him with quality people and they seem to be ones he's happy to work with. Some of the rich clubs do the same thing but they amass too many good operators who can't work in unison. Footy department builds are as important as list builds and Bassat has given us the best I've seen in my life time. He's put his money where his mouth is.

I agree Gringo.

We really need the incumbent setup to be ultra successful. We need a premiership soon so that when we are floundering in the future we can look back and say ‘oh yeah, why don’t we do that thing again where we get the best operators in our football department’.

 

[saintmike65]

Harvey and Hayes went and learnt to be coaches.
Harvey has been in the mix for senior coach several times.
Hayes was highly rated.
Both of them played their entire playing career at the Saints.
They are family, they have blood on the table. Its not just a job, they care.
Misson is an addition to the conditioning. I rate Nick Walsh, and i can't believe that Misson doesn't add to us.

SOS is harder, we won't really know for a long time.

I hope that Lyon will listen to his assistants and take it on board.
The was i see it, if he can delegate well, he won't have to do so much.
He will just need to steer the ship.

The boss is already listening to his assistants!

 

[g_TRAIN]

The boss is already listening to his assistants!

From what I've heard him say the assistants basically developed the whole gameplan and then came to him for final checks and sign-off.

And from the training reports you and others have posted it seems like they run the show and RTB just oversees it all at a higher level and provides input.

 

[Joffaboy]

I think that was mostly due to the absolute shitshow where he bagged his club and started to make himself look psycho. Probably mostly Ratts but you don't see that kind of relationship breakdown play out in public too often. To have to do a deleting instead of getting anything back for a free agent was extraordinary too. It was one of our more bizarre pieces of list management no matter what you thought of him as a player. A guy like Cripps I'm pretty sure would have managed to get a much better return for both players.

People struggle to see the reality when it comes to the footy department that we are replacing. They were below standard across most areas. People loved Trout on here but he was moved on because we found better people. Gags was better than some that we've had but we are replacing him. There is usually a reason.

Nobody wanted Dunstan, minimum contract with Melbourne was his only offer.

Really a wasted pick 18, basically a bust.

On SM-S908E using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Mstr Strokesman]

Skinny little bugger

Can confirm Quick tough and good kick

 

[saintmike65]

Well at present the club looks to have two possibilities to start the season.

Well call it what you like, a third-tall is a role, but our set up may mean having more than one of them and so will no longer be a "third".

• Go with a raft of third-talls/medium forwards so that we have multiple marking options with the brief to our mids to look to pass to the one in the best position. Say Sharman, Wood and Owens...with maybe the Poo also rotating through. Plus remember that Higgins is a handy mark and lead for his size.
• Bring in a tall who is either unproven and probably not quite ready (ie Van Es, Heath), or older but not quite up to it (Campbell or Cordy). Their role in part being to be to bring the ball to the ground if they do mark it it to create opportunities for our small forwards. Though yes still supported by the medium forwards and the small forwards.

Option 1 is the one I’d go with!

 

[Saintsydney]

What trade?

It was a draft pick.

Probably get the very basics of list management right before you accuse me of making stuff up.

Did it really haunt you when Petracca did his knee in 2015 & Paddy was showing signs of what he is now producing on a weekly basis?

Now that sounds like a made up 'fact'.

Look - I was going to leave it where it was because I hate 'saintsational' bickering diverting the chat - yes it was a draft pick - obviously - I was not really thinking when I wrote that - but mate if you want to go on with it I will say it again I just don't believe what you say about other clubs having Paddy as first pick is true - I'm not saying you are lying - that is something different - I just don't believe it - it was nearly 10 years ago so I'm sure the waters have muddied - but I'm happy to move on and stop talking about this if you are

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Neglecting to draft elite youth and over stocking on mediocre ready made’s, because someone thinks we’re in a window, would be a consequence of a List Manager’s decision making though, right?

Which elite youth did we neglect?

 

[seasonedsainter]

Any thought of having Membrey perform something other than set shots at goal is worth rethinking.

Haah yeah you could be right!

 

[bird_man]

He isn’t the “best appointment”

We tried and failed with the 2 we thought as options 1 & 2.

But he is better than Gallagher. That’s undisputed in my eyes. He is proven and he is coming in as part of a very strong football leadership team.

If you’re judging the lists. His GWS nucleus’s were Perennial top 4 sides. They under performed - that’s coaching.

His Carlton side has some absolute top end talent. Some big blown picks. But they are the football worlds tip to break into the top 4. Largely based off a nucleus’s of his picks and trades.

Irrelevant is the number of picks he had and the number of trades completed. The quality of lists speak for themselves. He is a good appointment that will work alongside people proven quality in their roles.

I can't see how it could be undisputed he's better than Gallagher.

He was sacked from Carlton because he wasn't able to build a list capable of playing finals.

Outside of one very good draft there are a lot of blunders over his time at the Blues with both drafting and trading.

My opinion is that there would have be someone out there that are untried in the top role but with experience in the field that would be better at the job than SOS. It's just a matter of finding them.

 

[SaintersUnite]

Will be interesting to see how we fair in the pre season games with a new game plan. Might get a taste of which players Ross prefers as well.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[Mstr Strokesman]

I can't see how it could be undisputed he's better than Gallagher.

He was sacked from Carlton because he wasn't able to build a list capable of playing finals.

Outside of one very good draft there are a lot of blunders over his time at the Blues with both drafting and trading.

My opinion is that there would have be someone out there that are untried in the top role but with experience in the field that would be better at the job than SOS. It's just a matter of finding them.

If we only had an in ,with a high level executive at an employment recruiting agency.Hmmmmmm

 

[CursingFijian]

Which elite youth did we neglect?

We took a heap of what you would term mature agers in the Lyon years when we thought we were in the window:

We traded early picks for Dempster, Schneider, Farren Ray & Lovett and drafted the likes of Colm Begley, Jesse Smith, Adam Pattinson, Will Johnson, Ryan Gamble & Dean Polo. There's always too much sliding doors in saying who we would have taken if we held our picks, but Sloane & Fyfe are amongst a plethora of other talent.

I still can't fathom trades like pick 12 for Tom Lee & Nathan Wright as well when players like Brodie Grundy are forecast to be on the table, and at a time when the club desperately needed ruck talent. But I'm not saying Lyon influenced that one either.

 

[gringo2011]

I can't see how it could be undisputed he's better than Gallagher.

He was sacked from Carlton because he wasn't able to build a list capable of playing finals.

Outside of one very good draft there are a lot of blunders over his time at the Blues with both drafting and trading.

My opinion is that there would have be someone out there that are untried in the top role but with experience in the field that would be better at the job than SOS. It's just a matter of finding them.

I'd say none of us know how good or bad Gags was or Silvagni for that matter. I guess if he's good someone will chase him down to work at Port or Adelaide now that he has some experience. It's a role that is quite hard to judge from afar because it takes time to filter through and probably even slower than the head recruiters role does.

I guess the clubs you were at need to be playing finals after you've had a decent amount of time to create something. At Carlton he was coming off the bottom of the ladder after a long period of poor performance.

 

[Jesuswasacarpenter]

And the Victorian Bed Makers Fraternity.

Is that with blankies and a bedspread...or sheets and a Doona?