2024 Offseason Thread - Summer League

[peternorth]

Knowledgable posters of basketball.

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2024 Paris Olympic Games basketball thread (XXXIII Olympiad)

Summer - Paris 2024 - Basketball

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[BEaston]

Mavs defence after the ASB was great. Doesnt mean Luka will ever be a great defender but he doesn't have to be, he has to hurt you on the other end more than he gets hurt. Nothing more

Let the other guys focus on D.

They'll take time figuring out splits for Klay/Luka/Kyrie lineups. I dont think all 3 can play for extended periods but if their D is close to last year AND Klay hits more open 3s than DJJ did, obviously a W

Yep. We already stagger rotations with Luka and Kyrie to some extent, Klay will go into that mix as well. There's even a decent chance Klay comes off the bench. Either way I don't think he plays more than 28 mins a night.

I think we'll see a lot of tactical subs between Klay/Naji for O/D as well at the end of games.

The other thing is, you have to look at the roster as a whole
Klay -> THJ (huge upgrade on O)
Naji -> DJJ (upgrade on D, neutral O)*
Grimes -> Green (upgrade on O, neutral D)*

* you can maybe quibble on these, but that's how I see it

 

[peternorth]

Dillion Jones doing things all over the court today. Gees OKC moved on from giddey quickly. The jersey wasnt even cold

 

[GoEaglesGoSGIO]

Green had by far the worst defensive on/off metric of any Mav who played substantial minutes last season.

Dallas had a top five defence when he sat, and the league's worst defence when he was on.

But then he is comparable to Klay on defensive rating so he is a equal match?

Dallas had a top five defence when the starters were on and played iso ball with slower tempo and leagues worst defence when Luka/Kyrie were taking a break and they couldnt keep the ball

Green as a 1 on 1 defender is fine. I think vs Clippers for example he was pretty good. Got more minutes as the series went on for a reason surely?

 

[GoEaglesGoSGIO]

Yep. We already stagger rotations with Luka and Kyrie to some extent, Klay will go into that mix as well. There's even a decent chance Klay comes off the bench. Either way I don't think he plays more than 28 mins a night.

I think we'll see a lot of tactical subs between Klay/Naji for O/D as well at the end of games.

The other thing is, you have to look at the roster as a whole
Klay -> THJ (huge upgrade on O)
Naji -> DJJ (upgrade on D, neutral O)*
Grimes -> Green (upgrade on O, neutral D)*

* you can maybe quibble on these, but that's how I see it

I like Grimes as a defensive replacement style player for Green but what are his minutes going to be exactly if Klay gets 28?

 

[Son of Skeletor]

But then he is comparable to Klay on defensive rating so he is a equal match?

They were both poor last season, so it's kinda a wash. Just pointing out that they didn't get 'worse' defensively.

If you really think about it, they shipped out Hardaway and Green for Klay and Grimes, only the latter are making $20 mil between them this season, while the former duo are pulling down over $30 million.

If the Mavs had given Klay the bag, I'd say they were asking for trouble. But to get him at the price they did, and at the effective 'trade cost' they did, it's fine. if they need young legs to cover Green's minutes, they have Grimes and Exum.

 

[GoEaglesGoSGIO]

They were both poor last season, so it's kinda a wash. Just pointing out that they didn't get 'worse' defensively.

If you really think about it, they shipped out Hardaway and Green for Klay and Grimes, only the latter are making $20 mil between them this season, while the former duo are pulling down over $30 million.

If the Mavs had given Klay the bag, I'd say they were asking for trouble. But to get him at the price they did, and at the effective 'trade cost' they did, it's fine. if they need young legs to cover Green's minutes, they have Grimes and Exum.

I agree the price was good but doesnt mean it will work out 100% the way they want.

Very easy for them to move on from the deal if it goes wrong so not the end of the world that way either

 

[Slysh]

How?

Mavs were 2nd in 3pt attempts and 3rd in 3pt makes for the season.

Mavs biggest hole is their defense, for the season they were ranked 18th in the league.

Klay is a good addition but doesn’t solve the mavs problems as he has dropped off on the defensive end due to injuries and age.

You are looking at season rankings when they were a different team post trade deadline.

 

[Slysh]

Defensive rating in basketball is 100% illogical in so many ways. Doesnt take into account help defense, who you defending, when

Its not like Klay Thimpson is James Harden and Green is Jrue Holiday but its a difference nonetheless where a teams biggest weakness is now worse

The problem with Green is he doesn't offer enough on either end consistently to justify minutes a lot of the time. He doesn't lock anyone down, can't create and is a very inconsistent shooter. Klay has weaknesses but he has a skill that he is absolutely elite at.

 

[Slysh]

But then he is comparable to Klay on defensive rating so he is a equal match?

Dallas had a top five defence when the starters were on and played iso ball with slower tempo and leagues worst defence when Luka/Kyrie were taking a break and they couldnt keep the ball

Green as a 1 on 1 defender is fine. I think vs Clippers for example he was pretty good. Got more minutes as the series went on for a reason surely?

No one is trying to argue Klay is a better defender or anything, it is simply pointing out what you 'lose' on defence is no where near as important as what you make up in offensive output.

 

[Slysh]

Can't remember if i posted this last week or not... But this is so sickening it can be posted again if i did

 

[hamG]

Can't remember if i posted this last week or not... But this is so sickening it can be posted again if i did

Tobias must be proud of his agent.

 

[fidstar]

. Why is it THJ. Its Josh Green he is replacing in the rotation.

Given they struggled on defense when the finals came around, I dont think getting rid of one of the better defenders to get more points will help much

Mavs scored 89, 98, 99, 122 & 88 in the Finals. The one game they scored 100, they won. They need to score.

 

[GoEaglesGoSGIO]

Tobias must be proud of his agent.

Or just very grateful for Elton Brand

 

[Son of Skeletor]

Can't remember if i posted this last week or not... But this is so sickening it can be posted again if i did

The good news is I think this'll start happening less.

A lot of NBA front office executives have noted that the 'three star' roster build model is going to become more and more difficult to follow, maybe even impossible. Instead it'll be two stars plus a decent supporting caste, if you do it right.

The NBA has struggled with 'medium salaries' for a while, especially in recent years. There are such a variety of 'max' salaries, and teams, especially non big-market teams, feel so pressured to not lose talent that they default acquiesce to max salary demands.

The latter part will still happen, of course. Cade Cunningham is a good example this off-season, he's being paid on potential rather than results so far. But in general, I think the MLE is going to cease becoming the defacto 'medium' salary for teams, whereby there's a yawning vacuum between a team's 'stars' and the rest of the roster..

To give some examples, the Knicks will have seven guys on their roster making between $36 mil (Anunoby) and $11.5 mil (DiVincenzo) this season. $11.5 million is effectively the non-taxpayer MLE salary. It won't stay that way as Brunson and Bridges probably will receive raises, and Anunoby is on a max-ish level contract now, but it's an approach to roster construction and salary cap management that has been rare of late.

The Mavs are a good example of the new 'two star' model that will supposedly become de jure. Two clear stars on max salaries, and five guys - Klay, Washington, Gafford, Kleber and Marshall - on a variety of mid-sized contracts. It'll be interesting to see what someone like Washington gets on his next deal - I'm thinking it'll be a 'medium contract' par excellence, something like $25 mil per year.

The big 'losers' under this kind of arrangement will be the Tobias Harris types who make 'big 3' money without really performing at a 'big 3' level. One of the reasons Denver's team has been weakened is that they're effectively paying Michael Porter as a 'big 3' guy, which has probably cost them KCP, at least. The new tax apron rules make carrying so many max contracts incredibly difficult. I actually feel bad for Denver, but they won't the last.

There will still be overpays, bad contracts, that'll never change. However there seems to be a new appreciation for the usefulness of the 'mid-range' contract. Now we just need to bring back the mid-range jumper.

 

[burge13]

Kawhi out of Paris. Shocked to be sitting here, he's usually so reliable

 

[burge13]

Massive TV deal, great for players and owners but people do realise it's fans that'll be paying more right? While people are cheering $60m contracts for their fav players (as if $30m wasn't enough), your ESPN/Kayo/Amazon subscription is going to sky rocket to cover this...

Piracy ftw. What's going to happen when everyone has a dodgy firestick? The bubble on sports broadcasting can't be far off bursting. Owners/players/broadcasters need to be more realistic on how much they can gouge everyday punters IMO

 

[philthy05]

What was the point of okc signing ducas to a ten day, taking him to summer league and then not playing him at all?


Anyone know how many more games okc have left?

 

[apollo_creed]

Kawhi out of Paris. Shocked to be sitting here, he's usually so reliable

Massive. Boomers with one hand on the gold already.

 

[stewie griffen]

Dillion Jones doing things all over the court today. Gees OKC moved on from giddey quickly. The jersey wasnt even cold

Dillon Jones repping Bronnys offensive output on his jersey

 

[stewie griffen]

Kawhi out of Paris. Shocked to be sitting here, he's usually so reliable

He was in the club getting a lap dance within an hour lol

 

[stewie griffen]

The big 'losers' under this kind of arrangement will be the Tobias Harris types who make 'big 3' money without really performing at a 'big 3' level.

So Zach Lavine and Vuc

lel

 

[hamG]

Saddiq Bey 20/3 at the Wizards. Bloke probably lost a solid $40m from bunging his knee.

 

[fidstar]

lol

 

[Slysh]

This shit is so lame, no issue with making your case and feeling you deserve more recognition. Putting down your team mates to do it is just shitty. Americans are so weird.

[Goodwill] Bam Adebayo on DPOY award: “A point guard got it over me, a center got it over me, a power forward has gotten it over me. The goalposts move for me, in certain degrees. It’s me and a lot of undrafted dudes, and we still have a top-five defense.”

 

[peternorth]

Dillon Jones repping Bronnys offensive output on his jersey

Wrong. Repping giddeys favourite numbe.....



oh wait.