Training 2024 Preseason reports and discussion

[eldorado]

Don't get too excited...

Jon Ralph assures me it's just a grand February statement...and he'd have a far better idea of what Hustwaite can do than Mitch Lewis does...

 

[tl92]

AFL 2024: Hawthorn star key forward Mitch Lewis lifts lid on pre-season​

Hawthorn gun Mitch Lewis has lifted the lid on Hawthorn’s off-season, opening up on the return of Jack Gunston, looking after livewires Jack Ginnivan and Nick Watson, his own fitness and more.
Hawthorn star Mitch Lewis says he is at full fitness ahead of the club’s twin pre-season clashes with the Western Bulldogs as he tipped an early-season selection shock.

The Hawks’ power forward was sorely missed as an impotent Hawthorn forward line struggled without him in 2023, until his round 6 return from a sprained ACL injury.

Suddenly the Hawks are spoiled for choice in the forward 50, with Lewis admitting Jack Gunston’s return was a shock – despite holidaying with Gunston at the time of his trade on an American golf trip.

Lewis lauded the midfield work of 2022’s No.37 draft pick Henry Hustwaite, who he said reminded the players of Scott Pendlebury for his ability to step through traffic after a massive summer.

While Hustwaite needs to build an AFL-ready tank, Lewis said he is set for a big early-season role in another reminder of the selection squeeze in the midfield and forward line.

Lewis also praised ex-Magpie Jack Ginnivan for his no-fuss attitude since arriving at the club, with the key forward thrilled with his quiet brand of leadership and physical shape.

Lewis, 25, was held back from full training until the week before Christmas after recovering from a foot sprain. He promised Hawks fans are in for some excitement from their new-look forward line.
“I am going well, fingers crossed. Ready for an intra-club next week and then the hitouts against the Doggies,” Lewis told the Herald Sun.
“All going well, I will be fit and firing for round 1.
“Pre-Christmas (training scheduled) was modified, and this side of Christmas has been good. I had a rolled ankle, but (only) missed one session.
“I have spent a good chunk of time with Gunners over the last couple of months. We had our 4x15 minute hitout down at Torquay, and he looked really good. He kicked five goals.
“Personally I am a better player when Jack Gunston is fit and firing in our forward line so I hope he can get his body right and play a pivotal role for us.”

Gunston’s single-year experiment with the Brisbane Lions never quite got off the ground, and Lewis said the 32-year-old simply felt it was right to come back to the club where he won three flags.

“I actually didn’t (know) and I was a bit flat on him because I was with him over in America when the news broke as well – and he was keeping it pretty tightly sealed,” Lewis said.
“He had a massive year (with his father Ray’s passing) before going up to Brisbane and he needed a life change as much as a football change.
“He went up there, it didn’t work out, but we took him back with open arms and it feels like he’s never left now.”

Midfielder Hustwaite made a late-season debut last year and while Will Day’s early-season absence to injury will allow Josh Ward and Cam Mackenzie more chances, expect to see the 19-year-old given opportunities for the Hawks in 2024.
“(Hustwaite) is going really, really well. He has really impressed me this pre-season and impressed a lot of guys,” Lewis said.

“He doesn’t have those running attributes the other guys have yet. But his work inside, not to put pressure on him, but it’s Scott Pendlebury-esque in terms of the way he has time with the footy and his ability to make blokes miss him in the tackle. It’s as good as we have to be honest.

“I think he will get chances early on, so it will be good to see how he goes.”

Premiership player Ginnivan arrived at Hawthorn with a reputation but Lewis says he has done everything in his power to dispel any myths about how he goes about his business.

“He actually surprised me with how quiet he was when he first got to the footy club, “ he said.
“I was expecting, from what you see in the media, him being quite out there and you see him with the high tackles and his teammates having to get around him.
“I was very surprised with how he presented himself with his personality. His work ethic has been absolutely fantastic. I didn’t realise he looked so muscular.
“I thought he was a bit shorter and a bit stockier but he’s quite trim and fit and works really hard, eager to learn, quite vocal in meetings. He’s only 21 years old so he’s really impressed me with his atmosphere.”
It doesn’t mean Ginnivan and new teammate Nick Watson won’t play the role of on-field agitators when round 1 hits.
“Nick Watson is very lively,” said Lewis.

“Once we get to opposition games you see his under 18 highlights and he’s always getting under the skin of ‘oppo’. I am looking forward to seeing that

“Cholly (Mabior Chol) and I might have to look after these guys a little bit because I think they are talking a little bit of smack which I don’t mind. I don’t really do it too much but I will fly the flag and support the guys. It will be interesting to see how we shape up.”

Gunston 5 snags in a shortened match sim

 

[kazzooka]

Nash and Worpel are both 25, not 35. In 2-3 years both will be in their prime.

I think you're missing the point. Worpel and Nash while good players and certainly very good for us in 2023 have limitations as players that means there peak is not as high as the other 2 permanent mids of 2023 in Day and Newcombe who we all expect to be All Australians and in brownlow contention throughout their careers.

Ward, Mackenzie and Macdonald are high draft picks who have shown a heap at very young age. Skills and smarts that makes many believe that they could be the Akermanis and Lappen to Day and Newcombe as Black and Voss.

While our midfield showed a lot of promise in it's first year without Mitchell, O'Meara and Shiels we were still bottom 4 so if we can go from 2 emerging stars and 2 solid contributors to 4-5 gun mids we'll be on our way. Melbourne 2021 had Oliver, Petracca, Viney, Brayshaw and then Harmes as the step down solid player. Nathan Jones at his peak is probaly 5th in that list despite carrying that side for 10 mediocre years. Similar Bulldogs with Libba, Bont, Macrae, Treloar, Daniel, Dunkly.

I don't think they are getting pushed out anytime soon but If you are asking me who will be our best mids in 3 years out the 2024 list i'm going with Day, Newcombe, Macdonald, Mackenzie, Ward, Nash, Worpel, Maginess.

 

[peetoo]

I think you're missing the point. Worpel and Nash while good players and certainly very good for us in 2023 have limitations as players that means there peak is not as high as the other 2 permanent mids of 2023 in Day and Newcombe who we all expect to be All Australians and in brownlow contention throughout their careers.

Ward, Mackenzie and Macdonald are high draft picks who have shown a heap at very young age. Skills and smarts that makes many believe that they could be the Akermanis and Lappen to Day and Newcombe as Black and Voss.

While our midfield showed a lot of promise in it's first year without Mitchell, O'Meara and Shiels we were still bottom 4 so if we can go from 2 emerging stars and 2 solid contributors to 4-5 gun mids we'll be on our way. Melbourne 2021 had Oliver, Petracca, Viney, Brayshaw and then Harmes as the step down solid player. Nathan Jones at his peak is probaly 5th in that list despite carrying that side for 10 mediocre years. Similar Bulldogs with Libba, Bont, Macrae, Treloar, Daniel, Dunkly.

I don't think they are getting pushed out anytime soon but If you are asking me who will be our best mids in 3 years out the 2024 list i'm going with Day, Newcombe, Macdonald, Mackenzie, Ward, Nash, Worpel, Maginess.

Melbourne have done next to nothing.

 

[kazzooka]

I think Hustwaite's ability to go forward to exploit a mismatch may be viewed as very valuable. He outmarked Petracca in his first match. If the oppo changes the matchup for him that has a flow on effect for our other forwards too.

I'd love for Nash and Day to be doing this too as taller mids.

 

[tl92]

I think you're missing the point. Worpel and Nash while good players and certainly very good for us in 2023 have limitations as players that means there peak is not as high as the other 2 permanent mids of 2023 in Day and Newcombe who we all expect to be All Australians and in brownlow contention throughout their careers.

Ward, Mackenzie and Macdonald are high draft picks who have shown a heap at very young age. Skills and smarts that makes many believe that they could be the Akermanis and Lappen to Day and Newcombe as Black and Voss.

While our midfield showed a lot of promise in it's first year without Mitchell, O'Meara and Shiels we were still bottom 4 so if we can go from 2 emerging stars and 2 solid contributors to 4-5 gun mids we'll be on our way. Melbourne 2021 had Oliver, Petracca, Viney, Brayshaw and then Harmes as the step down solid player. Nathan Jones at his peak is probaly 5th in that list despite carrying that side for 10 mediocre years. Similar Bulldogs with Libba, Bont, Macrae, Treloar, Daniel, Dunkly.

I don't think they are getting pushed out anytime soon but If you are asking me who will be our best mids in 3 years out the 2024 list i'm going with Day, Newcombe, Macdonald, Mackenzie, Ward, Nash, Worpel, Maginess.

Harmes is terrible for the record.

 

[ahhhhhh]

I think you're missing the point. Worpel and Nash while good players and certainly very good for us in 2023 have limitations as players that means there peak is not as high as the other 2 permanent mids of 2023 in Day and Newcombe who we all expect to be All Australians and in brownlow contention throughout their careers.

Ward, Mackenzie and Macdonald are high draft picks who have shown a heap at very young age. Skills and smarts that makes many believe that they could be the Akermanis and Lappen to Day and Newcombe as Black and Voss.

While our midfield showed a lot of promise in it's first year without Mitchell, O'Meara and Shiels we were still bottom 4 so if we can go from 2 emerging stars and 2 solid contributors to 4-5 gun mids we'll be on our way. Melbourne 2021 had Oliver, Petracca, Viney, Brayshaw and then Harmes as the step down solid player. Nathan Jones at his peak is probaly 5th in that list despite carrying that side for 10 mediocre years. Similar Bulldogs with Libba, Bont, Macrae, Treloar, Daniel, Dunkly.

I don't think they are getting pushed out anytime soon but If you are asking me who will be our best mids in 3 years out the 2024 list i'm going with Day, Newcombe, Macdonald, Mackenzie, Ward, Nash, Worpel, Maginess.

What limitations does Nash have?

 

[kazzooka]

If we’re at a point where Nash and Worpel can’t crack the league side that’s exciting as it means our young players are even better.

If in the next few years both are in the VFL, we're probably top of the ladder.

 

[kazzooka]

Melbourne have done next to nothing.

Yes, besides winning a flag and multiple finals appearances that midfield has done nothing.

 

[HappyHawk_1]

I cant see Nash or Maginness dropping out of Sam’s preferred 22 over the next 5 years.

Between those 2 - Sam is essentially able to clamp down on whomever he seems as the most dangerous non-KPP on the opposition, with Nash able to take the larger bodies / mids, and Finn able to play as a forward or back to clamp down on the smaller / more athletic types.

Outside of those valuable shut down roles, Nash can play the big defensive mid role, and Finn can essentially play on any line (particularly if he’s improving his kicking).

IMO - Finn could be one of the reasons they are trialing Hardwick forward - the ability to ‘swing the magnets’ and theoretically have Maginness as a shut down defender, then get the added benefit of having Hardwick as a dangerous forward - which improves Sam’s flexibility against any side another team can come up with.

 

[threesixpio]

Gunston 5 snags in a shortened match sim

Did he get them out the front of Bunnings?

 

[kazzooka]

What limitations does Nash have?

There are times even last year where his game sense wasn't quite there. His skills aren't as slick as Macdonald or Mackenzie. Despite his height he doesn't really create a threat arially and can't play forward well. Which is something Hustwaite showed glimpses of doing in his first game.

But please don't take it the wrong way as a knock on him, he's been great recently. When I say limited I mean it in the same way i'd say Brad Sewell or Liam Sheils was a limited player. Sewell didn't have the damaging disposal or slickness like Lewis and Mitchell. Sheils was good defensively but when he moved up the rungs as a key cog in the midfield he was never the type to be regularly in the votes. Or even how O'meara was a limited player.

Some of our young players at this stage look like they can be stars of the comp, some might be, some might just be role players and some may not make it. But thats the exciting journey we are on. Nash and worpel absolutely could be multi premiership players for us, but they could also be passed up and take a lesser role.

 

[threesixpio]

Yes, besides winning a flag and multiple finals appearances that midfield has done nothing.

They have definitely under achieved with that team imo. One flag is a poor outing. That said I am an arrogant Hawthorn supporter who expects dynasties

 

[peetoo]

Maybe one flag in a covid altered year is an achievement at the dees, poor since the sixties

 

[kazzooka]

They have definitely under achieved with that team imo. One flag is a poor outing. That said I am an arrogant Hawthorn supporter who expects dynasties

Yes, they could have done better but that can be said of all teams. At least they won 1, StiKilda of 2009, 2010 was a better side and didn't get it done. And I think the fact that a team wins 1 you expect them to be so great to win more. Bulldogs have under achieved, Sydney under achieved, West Coast, Geelong had Selwood and Dangerfield how long without winning? We should have won in 2011, 2012 and 2016. We Should have won in 84 and 85. Essendon blew it in 99 and 2001. Brisbane in 2004, Port in 2001-3. Richmond blew it in 2018 and should have had 4 in a row.

Flags are bloody hard to win.

 

[hawkmang]

Melbourne have done next to nothing.

In more than one way they are almost cookie cutter copy of the eagles 2004-2007. Absolutely elite midfield with dominant ruckman but dogged by off field indescretions.

That eagles side should have won 3-4 flags on paper.

 

[HedgeFund]

North Melbourne have done next to nothing.

FIFY.

Was not a great take TBH. Demons have been going pretty well in the past 5 years

 

[burger09]

I think you're missing the point. Worpel and Nash while good players and certainly very good for us in 2023 have limitations as players that means there peak is not as high as the other 2 permanent mids of 2023 in Day and Newcombe who we all expect to be All Australians and in brownlow contention throughout their careers.

Ward, Mackenzie and Macdonald are high draft picks who have shown a heap at very young age. Skills and smarts that makes many believe that they could be the Akermanis and Lappen to Day and Newcombe as Black and Voss.

While our midfield showed a lot of promise in it's first year without Mitchell, O'Meara and Shiels we were still bottom 4 so if we can go from 2 emerging stars and 2 solid contributors to 4-5 gun mids we'll be on our way. Melbourne 2021 had Oliver, Petracca, Viney, Brayshaw and then Harmes as the step down solid player. Nathan Jones at his peak is probaly 5th in that list despite carrying that side for 10 mediocre years. Similar Bulldogs with Libba, Bont, Macrae, Treloar, Daniel, Dunkly.

I don't think they are getting pushed out anytime soon but If you are asking me who will be our best mids in 3 years out the 2024 list i'm going with Day, Newcombe, Macdonald, Mackenzie, Ward, Nash, Worpel, Maginess.

All high quality midfield combos have a mix of grunt and class, muscle and skill.

Our best combination will sort itself in time. At least we aren't still running a slow unskilled group going nowhere fast.

 

[Mitch75]

I think Hustwaite's ability to go forward to exploit a mismatch may be viewed as very valuable. He outmarked Petracca in his first match. If the oppo changes the matchup for him that has a flow on effect for our other forwards

I think Hustwaite's ability to go forward to exploit a mismatch may be viewed as very valuable. He outmarked Petracca in his first match. If the oppo changes the matchup for him that has a flow on effect for our other forwards too.

I wouldn’t be surprised if Hus gets a guernsey down back at various points during the season. Has played a fair bit of his junior footy there

 

[ahhhhhh]

There are times even last year where his game sense wasn't quite there. His skills aren't as slick as Macdonald or Mackenzie. Despite his height he doesn't really create a threat arially and can't play forward well. Which is something Hustwaite showed glimpses of doing in his first game.

But please don't take it the wrong way as a knock on him, he's been great recently. When I say limited I mean it in the same way i'd say Brad Sewell or Liam Sheils was a limited player. Sewell didn't have the damaging disposal or slickness like Lewis and Mitchell. Sheils was good defensively but when he moved up the rungs as a key cog in the midfield he was never the type to be regularly in the votes. Or even how O'meara was a limited player.

Some of our young players at this stage look like they can be stars of the comp, some might be, some might just be role players and some may not make it. But thats the exciting journey we are on. Nash and worpel absolutely could be multi premiership players for us, but they could also be passed up and take a lesser role.

I think the problem is you’re just completely ignoring his strengths, which are much more damaging than Sewell or Shiels in my opinion. Isn’t it Sam’s motto to focus on our strengths not try improve our weaknesses?

 

[Blackhawk42]

Harmes is terrible for the record.

Solid footballer.

Will be one of the best value recruits of the season for the Dogs. Bookmark this post.

 

[steezy]

Does anybody know if the boys are training back at Waverley tomorrow morning?

 

[CHUBBSS]

You have to feel for Blanck, he would be getting thrown between lewis, chol and Gunston, should set him up for a big year though.

(Something tells me we see Gunston a bit in defence)

 

[TylerDurden]

Does anybody know if the boys are training back at Waverley tomorrow morning?

Yes they are.

 

[Roddy]

I have a strong feeling Nash is only going to get better. I have a strong feeling he’s only shown us a glimpse of what he’s capable of and he is maybe 2/3 of the way to his ceiling at most.