eth-dog
Tier 1 WW Player
Sorry for the late replay, but Teddy/Grundy/Malceski/Laidler/Shaw/Smith/Rampe.
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Traded #22: Jake Carlisle - Pt.1 - Traded with some other stuff for pick 5, 24 and a Bird (cont in Part 2)
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I agree.. and posted as such in the Forward Line thread.
That said, Carlisle looked better than he has all season AND our forwardline actually had some space.. or maybe you didn't notice. There is a reason why guys like Howlett and Zach Merrett were able to get into the game.. the ball wasn't rebounded out of there at 100mph... The twin threats of TBC/JD with smalls seemed to work really well and allowed the 'smalls' to go to work. Also encouraged the ball carriers to move a little quicker as there were short options everywhere...
All Carlisle has done thus far up forward is clog space, get outmarked, kill leads and fumble..
If Carlisle plays forward last night.. we would have been lucky to win by 20pts..
How do you get that conclusion.
We've spent two weeks working on the structure at training. The players get the emotional and physical rest from the bye. The best 22 is playing. Myers and Zaharakis are primarily responsible for forward 50 entries.
And yet there is more space in the forwardline because Carlisle isn't there?
We've spent two weeks working on the structure at training. The players get the emotional and physical rest from the bye. The best 22 is playing. Myers and Zaharakis are primarily responsible for forward 50 entries.
And yet there is more space in the forwardline because Carlisle isn't there?
Ben the Gooner
Stand by Hird
in case anyone cares, im still firmly on the Carlisle forward bus. (In the Fletcher era, anyway)
yaco55
Hall of Famer
You read too much into pressers. I posted before the bye that I expected the structure to change - I expect that Ambrose will be sacrificed.
Zach Package
Prespakis2Tsatas
the way Carlisle used the ball when he got it up around the wings and let the play unfold around him had the hallmarks of a great CHF, created angles for his teammates and released them into space by hand and foot.
This game has no bearing on the future, we already know Carlisle is a class above in defence when he's playing on the best in the business, let alone when he's allowed to run his own race
This game has no bearing on the future, we already know Carlisle is a class above in defence when he's playing on the best in the business, let alone when he's allowed to run his own race
Ben the Gooner
Stand by Hird
Likewise.
Not sure about the second bit....Bomber loves players who get to contests and create outnumber scenarios. Think that was why we saw so much of Kommer last year and why Ambrose is playing this year. Think he plays a very specific role that Bomber values.
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I honestly didn't realise Griffiths was playing until half way through the third quarter.
yaco55
Hall of Famer
Do want Hooker released this week. Has played on the last line in the last two weeks - Has outplayed his opponents though sadly his opponents got cheap goals. We work much better when he plays at CHB and he is our best defender at intercept possessions - Should happen this week - Carlisle/Hurley can take Patton or if Cameron plays, Fletch picks up Patton. I expect Hooker can go to Tomlinson. I aslo prefer Hurley to play deeper in defence as he can be turned around too easily at times.
Zach Package
Prespakis2Tsatas
Griffiths is simply more mobile, not surprising in the slightest.
He's not as good, but he is a better mover and probably a better jumper as well
Isn't that slightly concerning in light of the reality that Griffiths hardly gets around the park.
I don't expect support in light of the success of the combination last year but I have a suspicion that Carlisle and Hooker are too slow to be a combination that will successfully deal with the quality modern forward lines.
I think we all have to cool our jets and consider for a minute that Jakey boy was just in shit form early in the season. Similar to Zaka and Melk. I actually thought his attack on the ball when he came on against Sydney was good and hoped that he'd turned a corner.
If he goes for the ball up forward like he did last night he will be a good forward. Sure he may be a better defender, but most people are because it's easier to play as a defender in this day and age with zones.
If he goes for the ball up forward like he did last night he will be a good forward. Sure he may be a better defender, but most people are because it's easier to play as a defender in this day and age with zones.
tbh im getting a little tired of hearing the commentators tell me jake(ey) (why is every jake a jakey according to the sevel commentators?) is a better defender because he can judge the flight of the ball so well....
as far as im aware the ball also comes into the forward line via the sky which also requires the same judgement of flight. Its cutting corners by these pundits to just put it down to judging the flight of the ball.... and not putting it down to leading patterns, the want to gut run and lead 1 , 2, then 3 times to create spaces ect.
Its just plain easier to be a defender, you are dictating nothing, you are just playing the ball and man as it comes. As a forward you need to make the play (if your midfielder hasnt done it for you) and dictate where you want it then actually beat your man to the ball and take the mark.
as far as im aware the ball also comes into the forward line via the sky which also requires the same judgement of flight. Its cutting corners by these pundits to just put it down to judging the flight of the ball.... and not putting it down to leading patterns, the want to gut run and lead 1 , 2, then 3 times to create spaces ect.
Its just plain easier to be a defender, you are dictating nothing, you are just playing the ball and man as it comes. As a forward you need to make the play (if your midfielder hasnt done it for you) and dictate where you want it then actually beat your man to the ball and take the mark.
Given that the back line was very good on Saturday night, what would your thoughts be on bringing Hurls in to play the role that Ambrose has been playing? No. 1 he'd probably be better at it and 2 it may drag a good defender, thoughts?
Ben the Gooner
Stand by Hird
No, I'm not overly keen on playing the bloke who physically can't play forward in the forwardline.
It's either Carlisle into the forwardline or Fletch the medium defender.
CourtzMajora
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I chuckled when I read it, then proceeded to read it out loud to my husband who shook his head at me haha.
yaco55
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Hooker has more than enough speed - Carlisle is a different question.
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Richmond did not exactly make it hard for our defenders the other night, we can only hope that the confidence gained can flow through into the coming weeks for Jake, whether he plays back or goes back forward when Hurley comes back from his sore back.
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I think Bomber put it pretty succinctly.
"What I am not going to do is get influenced by public perception. I'm going to do what I think is right and what the coaching group thinks is right. And we know better than most."
I agree 100% with the sentiment.
"What I am not going to do is get influenced by public perception. I'm going to do what I think is right and what the coaching group thinks is right. And we know better than most."
I agree 100% with the sentiment.
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How many of those are big defenders?
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As others are indicating here, Jake is not real quick off the mark which is why he is not beating his opponent to the ball. Then the third man up finishes him off every time. He reads the ball in flight so well but his opponent only needs to get a fist on it whereas at the other end of the ground the roles are reversed. It would be real easy to be a forward if there was value in taking the punch opportunity!
Bezakery. Creation is much harder than destruction. However, if his role is to work up the wings to provide an option and then high tail it back to provide another 30-40m out if the ball goes up the other wing then he can do that. Also with a gun small forward there is value to a forward punching the ball, especially with long arms like he has. He could easily tap the ball behind himself, which would be an extremely dangerous play if there were two small forwards streaming past him towards goal.
I would like to give Hurls a few games up forward this year though. He's played on Reiwoldt and Gunston. I wonder if he could see if he could try to emulate that sort of effort himself from half forward. Hooker is doing very well as number 1 kpd for the last 6 or 7 games, not just the best intercept mark in the game, so Hurley could go forward for bits.
I think the best combination is those two swapping ends a bit. In two years time when Fletch is gone and Daniher has filled out and Ambrose knows where to run then the best combination is both of them down back.
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