Traded #22: Jake Carlisle - Pt.1 - Traded with some other stuff for pick 5, 24 and a Bird (cont in Part 2)

[84859300]

You fellas willing to throw in 23 instead of 25?

Firstly, I'll start by saying that I don't feel either 23 or 25 should be in the Carlisle offer... but for the sake of your question, from an EFC point of view I'd only be offering up pick 25 and not 23.

St.Kilda is 2 years down the track in a rebuild stage, where we are essentially starting year 1 - so we're involved in very similar circumstances. I would suggest that come this section of the draft, that both clubs wants and needs will be around the same after 22 previous selections have been taken off the board.

As much as it's only 2 picks difference, if you got a young HBF at 23 when we were looking at the same, it would be silly to give you the advantage. I'd feel much safer giving the Hawks 23, if we kept 25, as I'd suspect our needs are chalk and cheese.

 

[kelvin_sheedy]

Pick 5 + second rounder next year gives us the opportunity for 4,5,8 this year.

 

[YEMOC NAYR]

So much drama over the last week, and finally we're moving closer to the deal we all thought would get it done originally. Carlisle and Melksham pick (25) for 5.

The trade we were laughed at a week ago when we suggested it to saints supporters lol

 

[Fear Boner]

With the recruiting Dodo has done last year even the year before, I'd be happy with the hawks deal.. 15 and 18? Or something thats another set of Langford and Laverde and our pick 4..
Whether any team would swap 23 + 25 for a higher pick of course jump on that too.

Except for the fact jake said no to the hawks

 

[YEMOC NAYR]

You fellas willing to throw in 23 instead of 25?

I would personally, if it is what gets the deal done...

I don't want to get to a point were the thing stopping the deal is a 2 pick upgrade haha. I want this deal done, because I feel for us this will get worst the longer it goes. I want us to get jake to saints

 

[YEMOC NAYR]

Except for the fact jake said no to the hawks

yeah.. in my mind he gets to the saints no matter what.. that is what he wants, and personally prefer pick 5 over everything else.

I'd like to keep next seasons second over trading our current second personally.. want to have a presence in the second round next season

 

[kelvin_sheedy]

Or how about both clubs gamble on swapping first rounders next year so who finishes higher wins.

Make the season a lot more interesting

 

[yodellinhank]

I would just take 25. No point haggling at all anymore. If that's dodoros counter offer I'd just do it

Both teams could have a much more productive trade period if Bains wasn't playing games.

 

[Benno30]

Can we please stay serious, pick 5 is so much better than 15 and 18 and you all know it.

I hope like hell 5 isn't on the table but don't let your current frustration with St Kilda cloud your judgement, you look silly trying to state that you'd rather two picks.

Gws are considering giving us pick 8 for 23 and 25. Why would we give them to you.

So we could have 4,8, 15 and 18.

If we give those 2 to you then we will only have 4 and 5. See the difference?

Yes I would prefer pick 5 over 15 and 18 but that does not mean we are going to sacrifice technically a possible pick 8 and Carlile to get it.

We did not determine the value. The market did. It is really that simple....

If you do not want him then that is ok, move along and let the big boys play. Otherwise step up with 5 as a reasonable offer and get yourself a 198cm KPD with a shit ton of potential that has partially been proven and look forward to the future.

 

[MadSaint66]

If Carlisle says he only wants to go to the Saints, I think the best and fairest deal we could get will be:

Carlilse and 25 to St Kilda
5 and 45 to Essendon



I personally believe though Carlilse and 44 is a fair deal and Carlisle and 25 is not. But when a player only wants to go to one club, it makes it hard to get true value.

That's a good point. There's a few extra caveats in this case.

 

[CBombers17]

Just dont counter St Kildas offer and put it on Jake to learn to love Hawthorn or it's off to the PSD.

I dont mind the picks we have as it is.

 

[MadSaint66]

Close to the mark is Carlisle and 41.
On points values him at pick 9.
Dixon 10 and another 1st
Treloar 7 and next years 1st
Pick 9 seems reasonable.

Yes but there are a few things that count against your position that slightly downgrade your position. That's why pure numbers don't work here.

 

[Its Manbearpig]

Except for the fact jake said no to the hawks

Oh.. well.. that sucks. Must have missed that.

 

[cowboysteel66]

Both teams could have a much more productive trade period if Bains wasn't playing games.

Can't defend that as I don't know what they were doing, obviously trying to do something that hasn't happened you would think.

 

[Blind Turn]

You fellas willing to throw in 23 instead of 25?

Of course not. You'd be lucky to get a second rounder at all on pure value of the player you're getting.

 

[MadSaint66]

Both teams could have a much more productive trade period if Bains wasn't playing games.

C'mon, you really think that Bains is paying games and Dodoro isn't?
They both are playing games.....it comes with the territory.
Dodoro played it out more in the media. That's playing games too.
Be fair.

 

[fishardansin]

That's horrible.

Could you imagine if there was entire sub-forum on the main board dedicated to trashing your club at every opportunity?

They's be considered relevant?

 

[Its Manbearpig]

Yes but there are a few things that count against your position that slightly downgrade your position. That's why pure numbers don't work here.

Dont start with that shit.
You wouldnt pay 700k for someone who "has certain things counting against their value" if you truely thought said certain things were going to become an issue.

 

[yodellinhank]

C'mon, you really think that Bains is paying games and Dodoro isn't?
They both are playing games.....it comes with the territory.
Dodoro played it out more in the media. That's playing games too.
Be fair.

Saints too embarrassed to play it through the media because of how ridiculous their low ball offer is.

The only reason not to be open about discussions is when talking about other players being involved - ones that may or not be on the table.

If its picks, just be open about it.

 

[Summer Nights]

Except for the fact jake said no to the hawks

I say 'stuff him'. It's Vic so let's trade him to the Hawks and he can deal with it. Who cares if it's not his first preference.

 

[84859300]

At what stage next week is it considered "kosher" to take the St.Kilda offer off the table and start talking to other clubs?

The mediation rubbish that happened with Ryder last year ended up going until the last day - surely that's not a position we want to be in?

 

[CBombers17]

Are we unable to contribute to his salary elsewhere beacase he is uncontracted?

Also, what are the chances of Carlton stepping in with a late run?

 

[Lance Uppercut]

It could well be postulating, trying to get us to blink.

In fact, it almost certainly is.

If we take that and don't insist on keeping one of 23 or 25 then we have monumentally failed.

*posturing

 

[Doss]

*posturing

I was tired.

 

[fishardansin]

If somebody at the start of the trade period "Would you take pick 5, for Jake Carlisle and Jake Melksham?" I'd have done it.
4, 5, 23

Then you were offered another deal that meant you could have pick 4, 15, 18, 23 25 or perhaps 4, 8, 15, 25 .. you'd scoff at the 4,5, 23.

What is fair is if we give them pick 41 with Carlisle for pick 5. That way we go to the draft with 4,5, 23, 25 or 4,5, 8. My preference is to have 4, 15, 18, 23, 25. Dodoro has been nailing the drafts since Keane has been on board, though I would like to see a little more x-factor in the team. Perhaps McKenna can bring that to us, but we need a bustling mid and an "anything could happen here" small forward.