Player Watch #9: Trent Cotchin is an obscenely good 3 x Premiership Captain, Victorian Captain & Brownlow Medalist

["The Roar Is Back"]

I reckon Trent has been pretty good considering he's pushing shit uphill with a pointy stick.
Dustin needs his own thread however.
I'm confident he can be the player we want but geez he gets a pretty fair run at it from media and fans alike.
He's pulling the wool over their eyes at the moment.

We'll back your up if you start a thread mate , be brave .

 

[Rodney Dangerfield]

Haha I'd be happy to but it would be just repeating myself!

 

[tigerz18]

fair article, Cotch has disappointed me this year (although everyone except Titch, Rance and Maric have)
when we are down and under pressure, he doesnt look to be revving the players up or doing the big play to get the boys going, Maric does and Titch has been. Cotch is down at the moment, and needs to grab the game by the horns and start playing.
and maybe have some bodies in to protect him. im sure its hard to keep enthusiasm up during a game when you are getting bashed and crashed around with no protection.
2 things that are causing this

1) noone is blocking for him.
2) noone is stepping up and dominating games to draw the tagger away from Cotch.

 

[no orange peeler]

We can't afford to snipe blokes like Hawthorn can.

we cant but funnily enough the incidents last year were when we were playing with mongrel no fear and passion.

 

[Hank Heavenly]

We are soft, plain and simple!

 

[Rodney Dangerfield]

We are soft, plain and simple!

It's odd too because you look at two kids who cone in like Martin and Brandon Ellis who came in with big bodies for kids and neither relish the hard stuff and prefer to get out in space.

 

[Hank Heavenly]

It's odd too because you look at two kids who cone in like Martin and Brandon Ellis who came in with big bodies for kids and neither relish the hard stuff and prefer to get out in space.

Granted we have some blokes who have courage, so not soft in every sense of the word, but in reality we are the kid who gets picked on, and that only keeps happening because we never stand up for ourselves.

When Nathan Jones rag-dolled one of our blokes a week ago, he then proceeded to get in his face and tell him all about it, I over heard Harry Whateverthe****mynameisnow get stuck into Rance, I mean Harry O for goodness sake!!!! Neither occassion did our bloke or his teammates do anything about, and the entire competition saw us get bullied by melbourne, even when they were carrying their handbags!

I don't want us to go around and start fights, but at least stand up for yourself first, then your teammate second!

Even if starting a melee sets a tone, whats a piddly 1k out of their pockets these days anyway!

 

[Tiger Toffee]

I agree. But why do they get a game the next week?

If I ever get invited into the selection committee i'll let you know.

 

[tigs2010]

If I ever get invited into the selection committee i'll let you know.

So basically because the coaching staff picks them each week?

 

[TigerImposter]

We seriously need some arseholes in the middle.
Maybe it's time Martin just said "right **** this!"
And I don't mean with a bloody fend off.
Get some shit in him. Maybe it's not his thing?
Apart from Vlastuin I can't think of anyone else to put in there.
You can see why blokes like Thomas and Petterd were going in there now when Jacko went down.
They weren't long term projects but at least one thing they offered was a bit of Steel around the contest and some protection for blokes like Cotchin and Edwards.
Jackson is horribly missed.

People have been mentioning Rance for 8 months on here

 

[theflea]

i was about to say he needs protection. Was a much better player with Jackson and Tuck in the team

And a fit Foley.

 

[theflea]

We seriously need some arseholes in the middle.
Maybe it's time Martin just said "right **** this!"
And I don't mean with a bloody fend off.
Get some shit in him. Maybe it's not his thing?
Apart from Vlastuin I can't think of anyone else to put in there.
You can see why blokes like Thomas and Petterd were going in there now when Jacko went down.
They weren't long term projects but at least one thing they offered was a bit of Steel around the contest and some protection for blokes like Cotchin and Edwards.
Jackson is horribly missed.

Martin was never a real in and under player, more like a pick up the ball whislt standing player who still managed to get the contested ball that way fend off and all. It was doomed a little at AFL level as players got used to it. So while he is a good 1 on1 player he could never replace Jackson, Foley or Tuck. As you said we need to fine more in and under players of which Vlas can be. But we still would need to find another back pocket player and Drummond was a loss and maybe Castagna will be that player.

 

[Rodney Dangerfield]

People have been mentioning Rance for 8 months on here

I remember seeing him play in the middle before he was drafted but I doubt we can do without him in defence?

 

[Rodney Dangerfield]

Its not even so much in and under.
I just want a big bodied mid fielder who plays like one.
Mind you a selwood type would be nice too though!

 

[theflea]

Have you for one second actually watched our players when we have the ball across half back, they are stationary, very rarely do they take off in the quest to find space ,more often than not they just jog along with their opponent glued to them ,think about it, how many times do we kick to a 1 on 1 or a 2 on 2 or kick it long to a contest but when the opposition get the ball their are loose men all over the place.

We do not work hard enough on the ground, the amount of times I see the opposition busting a gut and finding space while we trail behind is damn frustrating, how many times do you see our players darting off in all different directions to provide options when we have the ball at half back.

This has nothing to do with the coach, it's to do with the players and their want to work hard.

Lids stated on the TT podcast was DH tells the players to run and play on but the players just refuse to do it. He say DH can handle skill errors but just keep on doing it. It seems to me that is a player issue and they go in their shells far too much. Now I understand that ultimately the coach is responsible but geez the players are getting let off too easily in this area.

 

[no orange peeler]

Its not even so much in and under.
I just want a big bodied mid fielder who plays like one.
Mind you a selwood type would be nice too though!

Just a bull. Someone who will contest the first ball off the contest and lay a path for others.

 

[leekok]

It's odd too because you look at two kids who cone in like Martin and Brandon Ellis who came in with big bodies for kids and neither relish the hard stuff and prefer to get out in space.

I've never considered B Ellis as a big bodied mid. What is he? about 180cm, 80 kg??? Not sure but he looks tiny when we play Freo especially As you probably more so mean though he was always thickish. Even in his first game. Just compared to the modern day mid he's small

 

[TigerImposter]

I remember seeing him play in the middle before he was drafted but I doubt we can do without him in defence?

This is where Elton comes into the equation

 

[Rodney Dangerfield]

I've never considered B Ellis as a big bodied mid. What is he? about 180cm, 80 kg??? Not sure but he looks tiny when we play Freo especially As you probably more so mean though he was always thickish. Even in his first game. Just compared to the modern day mid he's small

Yeah not tall.
Pretty solid unit though.

 

[Jack 17]

We seriously need some arseholes in the middle.
Maybe it's time Martin just said "right **** this!"
And I don't mean with a bloody fend off.
Get some shit in him. Maybe it's not his thing?
Apart from Vlastuin I can't think of anyone else to put in there.
You can see why blokes like Thomas and Petterd were going in there now when Jacko went down.
They weren't long term projects but at least one thing they offered was a bit of Steel around the contest and some protection for blokes like Cotchin and Edwards.
Jackson is horribly missed.

I agree Rodney. Macintosh seems to like to tackle to hurt and is BIG. Give him a try - a bit like the chaos ball - who knows what might happen?

 

[Calcium Man]

Have you for one second actually watched our players when we have the ball across half back, they are stationary, very rarely do they take off in the quest to find space ,more often than not they just jog along with their opponent glued to them ,think about it, how many times do we kick to a 1 on 1 or a 2 on 2 or kick it long to a contest but when the opposition get the ball their are loose men all over the place.

We do not work hard enough on the ground, the amount of times I see the opposition busting a gut and finding space while we trail behind is damn frustrating, how many times do you see our players darting off in all different directions to provide options when we have the ball at half back.

This has nothing to do with the coach, it's to do with the players and their want to work hard.

I watch constantly mate.

As tigs2010 said why are these guys picked every week then?

But in all seriousness I disagree with your assumption the guys don't work hard enough, especially when we have the ball. We've been one of the best sides since 2012 getting into space, Bomber Thompson said in 2012 or 13 we were probably the quickest and scariest side with breaking into space and moving the ball. Where has that gone??

Its gone because the guys have been told to slow down as we're too scared to get beaten on the counter, its why we don't break to space as much or leave our man because when we broke if we turned it over teams hurt us with loose men everywhere.

Instead we've moved to a slower tempo and a bigger forward press for repeat entries. Unfortunately a lot of clubs have moved away from that game plan to a "sling shot" because going into a forward line with space is far more effective.

That being said i think we are poor and trail our opponents too much when they have the ball but it's also not easy when we get hit on the counter, every team in the league struggles with chasing their men when hit on the counter.

 

[living_in_syd]

Lids stated on the TT podcast was DH tells the players to run and play on but the players just refuse to do it. He say DH can handle skill errors but just keep on doing it. It seems to me that is a player issue and they go in their shells far too much. Now I understand that ultimately the coach is responsible but geez the players are getting let off too easily in this area.

he needs to grow some balls and drop players that dont listen.

 

[living_in_syd]

also, i remember back in 2012 we in a massive debate over cotchin is better than fyfe.... hasnt that changed...

 

[partycorolla]

I disagree in a lot of ways the article is correct. But for mine its missing a few vital ingredients to truly do a comparison, such as what level was he at in 2012 when he was on verge of being in the top 5 players in the game and if is as i suspect the numbers show his impact was higher, then whats changed. It could be a lack of tuck but I think its clearly Hardwick's gameplan. I don't understand why the media keeps suggesting Dimma wants an attacking gameplan when we've become so slow and predictable last year and this. The players have to be playing the way Hardwick is demanding as he keeps citing that we are meeting his KPI.

This was true of the start of 2014 but certainly not the 2nd half..... There was a greater focus on defensive accountability which was clearly drummed into players. This was clearly articulated by a few at the club last year. The message not to forget our offense was clearly understood before the Hawks game last year (round 10ish maybe) and we played on flat chat after that (often creating horrible turnovers)... but it obviously worked better. The same was evident in the 2nd half against Geelong. If we play that way, with a better execution of our skills, we'll win games and win them well.... execution of the plan is the issue, not the plan.

Good players are good even in crap teams.... it's rarely the coach. Cotch can go forward, he had almost 600 metres gained against Brisbane and his game on the weekend was 80 or so below his average as the article said.... This suggests that his game on the weekend was below average for him.... it does suggest he is usually that average. He's out of form and possibly burdened by captaincy.... however, we've made finals every year that he has been skipper so perhaps it's not that bad....

 

[partycorolla]

he needs to grow some balls and drop players that dont listen.

This is my biggest criticism of DH's coaching so far. Early years it could be ok not to drop them straight away and give them a 'time to learn' excuse but the last 2 years and this year players are not seemingly been punished enough for failing to adhere to team basics......

Time to get harder on them, not by his words, which he's been doing according an source of mine, but by his actions and those of the selection committee.....