Ablett versus Ablett
Peter Hanlon | April 25, 2008
http://www.realfooty.com.au/news/news/ablett-versus-ablett/2008/04/24/1208743155630.html
MANY stupid things are said in the name of football, but here's the sort of statement to get you committed in a flash — vacancies permitting — to the great footy asylum: Gary Ablett jnr is already better than his father.
Ah, that wasn't so hard after all. Now, all we have to do is mount a case …
Billy Brownless is laughing the laugh of someone who has just heard something ridiculous. Really ridiculous. After a long silence, he speaks in a slightly wounded tone.
"No. No, you can't say that now," Brownless says. "We forget too easily just how good some people were. His old man was a superstar."
Brownless calls it "the classic drip-tray question over the bar", but admits he's probably in the large camp for whom this particular argument will always be a waste of breath. Those who, like the man who saw Ablett's feats from a prime vantage point in the Geelong forward line, will never forget.
Of course, no formula exists for ranking greatness and even the Cats' long-time historian and AFL stats man Col Hutchinson says this is an instance where the picture painted by statistics is incomplete.
"If you look at the number of matches each had played at Gary junior's age now (23 years 11 months)," Hutchinson says, "obviously, he's well in front (130 for the son, 41 the father).
"Individual honours at the same point, he's ahead (a club best and fairest each — junior's in the premiership season his old man never had — and an AFL Player's Association Most Valuable Player award for Gary the younger; Dad won one, too, but not until he was 31. Each had also topped the club goalkicking once)."
Hutchinson thinks it's "like comparing pavlova and caviar".
Another Geelong devotee this week described Gary junior as having "traditional genius", in that it looks no different to your other, garden-variety genius.
His father, however, had "an otherness" that would set him apart in any gathering of footballing Einsteins.
What is hard to dispute is that the No. 29 is getting better, and is closing the gap on No. 5.
Brenton Sanderson had the privilege of playing with both — sharing Dad's last two-and-a-bit seasons, and the son's first four. While the issue is not discussed around the football club water cooler, assistant coach Sanderson says they know just what they've got.
"We have review meetings on Mondays and there's been plenty of times we've come in and we're reviewing the game, we'll look at each other and say: 'Thank Christ he's playing for us.'
"Some of the stuff he does is just freakish, almost non-human. He's just so calm and it's almost like the world's in slow motion when he's got the ball."
A bit like … who was that bloke again?
Oh yes, his Dad.
Brownless' initial reaction to the "the Earth is flat" proposition that son could better father is mirrored by pretty much anyone with a memory. No one before or since has been able to conjure such magic, they say.
Interestingly, he was also not alone in coming around to the idea (a little, anyway) when their various faculties are lined up.
Yes, Billy admits, you could argue that Gary junior is a better team player — "but that's the culture he's been brought up in, whereas we probably weren't brought up like that".
And yes, he's certainly a great kick — "but it would be hard to be a better kick than his old man".
Yes again, he's fitter than Dad was — "but that's the era he's playing in, too". Junior's ability to "win his own ball" is, for Brownless, his biggest improvement; 17 of his 35 possessions against Sydney last weekend were hard-won. But Dad, he of the pack-splitting mark, wasn't bad in a contest, either.
"That's where they're similar, they're so strong around the thighs and the core. If the ball's on the ground and they really want to get it, nine times out of 10 they get it."
Only four men have kicked more goals than Gary senior's 1030 and nobody expects his son to boost his 172 majors into such stratospheric territory, even if he plays another decade. But he will spend more time up forward, and few doubt his threat.
One fan with a permanent reminder of the older Ablett's greatness at his fingertips is Dene Macleod, whose devotion to getting his career on tape — from replays to single-camera World Of Sport footage to television news bulletins — has left him with 12 hours of Ablett highlights on VHS. Taping the lot for a mate recently, he found himself shaking his head all over again.
"What he did was unbelievable," Macleod says. "You tend to forget just how good they were, and get caught up in the hype of today's football — how quick they are now, how fit, how long they can kick.
"(But) you just have to look at how many kids run around now with No. 29 on the back, that next generation. They don't know who Gary Ablett snr is."
Another viewing reminded Macleod of another side to Ablett's game, illustrated in the days he played as a ruck-rover. In a game in Perth, he several times took possession across half-back, bounced his way through the centre and unloaded with torpedo punts into the forward line, ignoring the pleas of his teammates. "It was just ridiculous. The torps didn't even come off. You'd look at it and say: 'This bloke just plays footy as if it's an individual sport.' "
You could argue the team he played in made him that way. Macleod watched many times as Geelong players streamed forward at Kardinia Park as if wearing blinkers, passing up free options to kick to Ablett. "He'd be up against three — and half the time, he'd get it anyway."
Former Tiger and footy pundit Barry Richardson said that while Ablett's 1989 heroics had singlehandedly almost won Geelong a premiership, it was possible he had cost them two, so efficiently did opponents work out that everything was going through him. As different as they are as players, the teams of the two Abletts are another roadblock to comparisons.
Sanderson was young when he played with Ablett senior and says all at the club knew they were running out with one of the all-time greats — "if not the greatest". "I found I was nervous talking to him, and even now, when he comes into the rooms after a match, it's the same." Gary junior, he says, is very much one of the boys.
Brownless notes how well they look after him, the little bumps in close from the likes of Jimmy Bartel, Joel Corey, Joel Selwood and Paul Chapman that leave opponents knowing they've been in a bruising contest, as Swan Kieren Jack did on Saturday. "The chop-out he gets from the boys is fantastic. If you want to argue that point, Gary senior did a lot of that on his own."
Sanderson says there is no question Ablett jnr is playing in a great side, "but wherever he was playing, he would be one of the elite players in the AFL at the moment". Brownless is most pleased with how he continues to add something to his artillery.
Already, there's less resistance to the notion they are the best father-son combination ever, but junior's continued improvement begs another question: if the boffins were to pick an updated all-time best VFL/AFL team in 10 years, could it include two Gary Abletts?
Brownless is again hesitant, wondering who he would tip out, but reckons it will take only five years for both to feature in Geelong's greatest 22. Sanderson, however, has no doubt. "For sure, without question," he says.
"He's not just a one-way player, Gaz, he has that balance of attack and defence. A lot of the great players can attack but are a little bit slow to find their opponent. Gaz's ability to influence the game defensively as well … we're talking different sports, but Michael Jordan wasn't only recognised for his ability to score points, he was a fantastic defender as well. A little bit like Gaz."
OK, so he's not as good as his Dad. Yet. He's only as good as Michael Jordan.
Peter Hanlon | April 25, 2008
http://www.realfooty.com.au/news/news/ablett-versus-ablett/2008/04/24/1208743155630.html
MANY stupid things are said in the name of football, but here's the sort of statement to get you committed in a flash — vacancies permitting — to the great footy asylum: Gary Ablett jnr is already better than his father.
Ah, that wasn't so hard after all. Now, all we have to do is mount a case …
Billy Brownless is laughing the laugh of someone who has just heard something ridiculous. Really ridiculous. After a long silence, he speaks in a slightly wounded tone.
"No. No, you can't say that now," Brownless says. "We forget too easily just how good some people were. His old man was a superstar."
Brownless calls it "the classic drip-tray question over the bar", but admits he's probably in the large camp for whom this particular argument will always be a waste of breath. Those who, like the man who saw Ablett's feats from a prime vantage point in the Geelong forward line, will never forget.
Of course, no formula exists for ranking greatness and even the Cats' long-time historian and AFL stats man Col Hutchinson says this is an instance where the picture painted by statistics is incomplete.
"If you look at the number of matches each had played at Gary junior's age now (23 years 11 months)," Hutchinson says, "obviously, he's well in front (130 for the son, 41 the father).
"Individual honours at the same point, he's ahead (a club best and fairest each — junior's in the premiership season his old man never had — and an AFL Player's Association Most Valuable Player award for Gary the younger; Dad won one, too, but not until he was 31. Each had also topped the club goalkicking once)."
Hutchinson thinks it's "like comparing pavlova and caviar".
Another Geelong devotee this week described Gary junior as having "traditional genius", in that it looks no different to your other, garden-variety genius.
His father, however, had "an otherness" that would set him apart in any gathering of footballing Einsteins.
What is hard to dispute is that the No. 29 is getting better, and is closing the gap on No. 5.
Brenton Sanderson had the privilege of playing with both — sharing Dad's last two-and-a-bit seasons, and the son's first four. While the issue is not discussed around the football club water cooler, assistant coach Sanderson says they know just what they've got.
"We have review meetings on Mondays and there's been plenty of times we've come in and we're reviewing the game, we'll look at each other and say: 'Thank Christ he's playing for us.'
"Some of the stuff he does is just freakish, almost non-human. He's just so calm and it's almost like the world's in slow motion when he's got the ball."
A bit like … who was that bloke again?
Oh yes, his Dad.
Brownless' initial reaction to the "the Earth is flat" proposition that son could better father is mirrored by pretty much anyone with a memory. No one before or since has been able to conjure such magic, they say.
Interestingly, he was also not alone in coming around to the idea (a little, anyway) when their various faculties are lined up.
Yes, Billy admits, you could argue that Gary junior is a better team player — "but that's the culture he's been brought up in, whereas we probably weren't brought up like that".
And yes, he's certainly a great kick — "but it would be hard to be a better kick than his old man".
Yes again, he's fitter than Dad was — "but that's the era he's playing in, too". Junior's ability to "win his own ball" is, for Brownless, his biggest improvement; 17 of his 35 possessions against Sydney last weekend were hard-won. But Dad, he of the pack-splitting mark, wasn't bad in a contest, either.
"That's where they're similar, they're so strong around the thighs and the core. If the ball's on the ground and they really want to get it, nine times out of 10 they get it."
Only four men have kicked more goals than Gary senior's 1030 and nobody expects his son to boost his 172 majors into such stratospheric territory, even if he plays another decade. But he will spend more time up forward, and few doubt his threat.
One fan with a permanent reminder of the older Ablett's greatness at his fingertips is Dene Macleod, whose devotion to getting his career on tape — from replays to single-camera World Of Sport footage to television news bulletins — has left him with 12 hours of Ablett highlights on VHS. Taping the lot for a mate recently, he found himself shaking his head all over again.
"What he did was unbelievable," Macleod says. "You tend to forget just how good they were, and get caught up in the hype of today's football — how quick they are now, how fit, how long they can kick.
"(But) you just have to look at how many kids run around now with No. 29 on the back, that next generation. They don't know who Gary Ablett snr is."
Another viewing reminded Macleod of another side to Ablett's game, illustrated in the days he played as a ruck-rover. In a game in Perth, he several times took possession across half-back, bounced his way through the centre and unloaded with torpedo punts into the forward line, ignoring the pleas of his teammates. "It was just ridiculous. The torps didn't even come off. You'd look at it and say: 'This bloke just plays footy as if it's an individual sport.' "
You could argue the team he played in made him that way. Macleod watched many times as Geelong players streamed forward at Kardinia Park as if wearing blinkers, passing up free options to kick to Ablett. "He'd be up against three — and half the time, he'd get it anyway."
Former Tiger and footy pundit Barry Richardson said that while Ablett's 1989 heroics had singlehandedly almost won Geelong a premiership, it was possible he had cost them two, so efficiently did opponents work out that everything was going through him. As different as they are as players, the teams of the two Abletts are another roadblock to comparisons.
Sanderson was young when he played with Ablett senior and says all at the club knew they were running out with one of the all-time greats — "if not the greatest". "I found I was nervous talking to him, and even now, when he comes into the rooms after a match, it's the same." Gary junior, he says, is very much one of the boys.
Brownless notes how well they look after him, the little bumps in close from the likes of Jimmy Bartel, Joel Corey, Joel Selwood and Paul Chapman that leave opponents knowing they've been in a bruising contest, as Swan Kieren Jack did on Saturday. "The chop-out he gets from the boys is fantastic. If you want to argue that point, Gary senior did a lot of that on his own."
Sanderson says there is no question Ablett jnr is playing in a great side, "but wherever he was playing, he would be one of the elite players in the AFL at the moment". Brownless is most pleased with how he continues to add something to his artillery.
Already, there's less resistance to the notion they are the best father-son combination ever, but junior's continued improvement begs another question: if the boffins were to pick an updated all-time best VFL/AFL team in 10 years, could it include two Gary Abletts?
Brownless is again hesitant, wondering who he would tip out, but reckons it will take only five years for both to feature in Geelong's greatest 22. Sanderson, however, has no doubt. "For sure, without question," he says.
"He's not just a one-way player, Gaz, he has that balance of attack and defence. A lot of the great players can attack but are a little bit slow to find their opponent. Gaz's ability to influence the game defensively as well … we're talking different sports, but Michael Jordan wasn't only recognised for his ability to score points, he was a fantastic defender as well. A little bit like Gaz."
OK, so he's not as good as his Dad. Yet. He's only as good as Michael Jordan.
