Recruiting AFL Trade & Free Agency XII - 💰💰💰

[Lore]

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Spoiler: 2024 Draft Order

 

[Old Campaigner]

I don't disagree with most of what you have said I just think the bolded should be happening this year (but also including players in the 25-30 bracket).
I know the answer is "dodoro was in charge now Rosa is" but it's disappointing that we get to this spot at the end of year 2.

We kinda did most of that though, injury and fitness permitting.

 

[BrunoV]

I didn't have an issue with signing parish and at time I defended the contract length because I was under impression it was a salary cap management move.
But in hindsight it really was a poor move and his and a few other similar contracts/extensions given out end of last year/start of this year have hamstrung our ability to reshape the list.
I know dodoro was still involved but I don't think Scott gets as much as as a pass as he did for calls made when he first came on board.

Parish is not on Dodoro, he is on Vozzo and Scott. None of these list management decisions is on Dodoro. It is all on Vozzo and Scott, and it is a nonsense to suggest otherwise. We should be absolutely clear on that point because blaming the past for things that had nothing to do with the past is clearly now on the cards. Narratives and stories distract from the issues, which is just like what happened post 2017. All of the BS about the saga-fatigue when the football department was a shambles.

Scott and Vozzo have been the senior figures in the football department for all of the last 2 seasons. Between them it is has been total control. There is nothing that has happened to their list without their sign off. They are the ones that have delivered this latest mess and no capacity to aggressively target what is shaping as one of the best drafts ever...at the same time that, at least when it started, we were all about the long term.

Someone needs to explain to me how it could be that the strength of the 2024 draft has not been a factor in any decision making by Essendon. What our head scout, Robert Foster Knight, has been on leave for 20 months or has his network collapsed? Or did he forget to hit send on an email? Did the network protocol prevent it from from reaching the desk of Vozzo and Scott? Is it that the list management team has not been meeting for the last 2 years? Or is it that Essendon has overrated its players, again?

How can these people have been in their roles for this long and have no coherent strategy? Or is Brad doing his 'lets take out picks and sign free agents' again as he blows up another list?

 

[Armoooo]

Why would we have our backup plan lined up with the Saints, when we are trying to get them not to put an early bid on... makes no sense. The deal has to be with someone else, so that Saints don't benefit by going early on Kako.

If we make a bid there are two options, you either pass on Kako and we get him or you trade out 9 for future picks.

If you decide you're matching it doesn't impact us whether you use 9 or later picks, we miss out either way. If you decide to put 9 on the table we would obviously be interested as would 16 other clubs.

It would then be in your best interest to take the best deal available to you and there is a decent chance our offer could be the best.

Essendon would be foolish to rule out trading with St Kilda on principle.

 

[FootyGuru]

If we make a bid there are two options, you either pass on Kako and we get him or you trade out 9 for future picks.

If you decide you're matching it doesn't impact us whether you use 9 or later picks, we miss out either way. If you decide to put 9 on the table we would obviously be interested as would 16 other clubs.

It would then be in your best interest to take the best deal available to you and there is a decent chance our offer could be the best.

Essendon would be foolish to rule out trading with St Kilda on principle.

Haven’t you heard that Essendon is trading pick 9


And leverde for pick 7.


Win win and only logical thing to do.


St kilda would be foolish to rule out trading with Essendon on principal.

 

[rusman]

If we make a bid there are two options, you either pass on Kako and we get him or you trade out 9 for future picks.

If you decide you're matching it doesn't impact us whether you use 9 or later picks, we miss out either way. If you decide to put 9 on the table we would obviously be interested as would 16 other clubs.

It would then be in your best interest to take the best deal available to you and there is a decent chance our offer could be the best.

Essendon would be foolish to rule out trading with St Kilda on principle.

Assuming saints are being genuine in wanting kako at 8.

 

[rusman]

The future first pick is a good one to have a chat about.

Last year we traded away pick 31 for a 1 pick upgrade to get what we needed.


If next years draft is compromised and this is strong. Along with reportedly a lot of clubs chasing 11 and 13. I am curious what would be on offer for 9

 

[jdstorm]

I think were worse next year, but things are very even

Crows - adding Peatling, ANB, Cumming

Pies - Perryman, maybe Houston

Melbourne - Have a better 22 even losing ANB, whether they can sort out the politics or not is the question and what Oliver you get (Trac, Gawn, Oliver, Viney, Kozzie, May, Lever, Fritsch) group is still elite

Stkilda - Finished the year very well, King returns. Wanganeen/Owens/Windhaeger/Wilson looks ok. Theyre a side i think were probably still better than

GC Suns - Really starting to enter a good age. Lombard ready to go, the 3 Academy kids all improve a fair bit next year. Rioli, Noble

In terms of how our improvement stacks against other teams I think that’s a huge question. We could massively improve and still go backwards on the ladder if other teams improve more and no top teams drop off.

However there is unquestionably huge scope for this team to improve due to its age profile. The other big opportunity is transition play where we were just terrible. Fix that and i think things start to look very different.

 

[Milanista28]

The early days of baseball shows this is not the case.

Not fun for players or for clubs?

 

[Howard Moon]

 

[Yoda_]

Who will they turn too to become their new villain?

SOS or Mackie leading the charge.

Jason McCartney?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[ant555]

Get what you are saying but the key for me is the length, if the only way we could keep darcy was by guaranteeing x years then we shouldve let him test the market like we are with stringer this year, the reason being because we have added caldwell/duz/hobbs/tsatas to the midfield group over last few years.
It isn't 2021 when we only had 3-4 mids we could rely on.

I suspect length of deals is not going to be an issue going forward. Clubs will find ways to move them on with 2 years to go a lot easier than the past. Clubs did kick the tyres as far as Darcy goes. Still think that using hindsight on this is totally unfair.

 

[cAsEy_18]

View attachment 2137295

Thank **** for that.

I’ve been saying this guy’s name for months - and I haven’t even seen him play!

But it’s the exact type we should be going for.

 

[ant555]

Parish is not on Dodoro, he is on Vozzo and Scott. None of these list management decisions is on Dodoro. It is all on Vozzo and Scott, and it is a nonsense to suggest otherwise. We should be absolutely clear on that point because blaming the past for things that had nothing to do with the past is clearly now on the cards. Narratives and stories distract from the issues, which is just like what happened post 2017. All of the BS about the saga-fatigue when the football department was a shambles.

Scott and Vozzo have been the senior figures in the football department for all of the last 2 seasons. Between them it is has been total control. There is nothing that has happened to their list without their sign off. They are the ones that have delivered this latest mess and no capacity to aggressively target what is shaping as one of the best drafts ever...at the same time that, at least when it started, we were all about the long term.

Someone needs to explain to me how it could be that the strength of the 2024 draft has not been a factor in any decision making by Essendon. What our head scout, Robert Foster Knight, has been on leave for 20 months or has his network collapsed? Or did he forget to hit send on an email? Did the network protocol prevent it from from reaching the desk of Vozzo and Scott? Is it that the list management team has not been meeting for the last 2 years? Or is it that Essendon has overrated its players, again?

How can these people have been in their roles for this long and have no coherent strategy? Or is Brad doing his 'lets take out picks and sign free agents' again as he blows up another list?

No it is on Scott , Vozzo and Dodoro. They where the list management crew at the time. Scott said sign him he is part of my future team. Dodoro negotiated the contract. Vozzo and Welsh signed off on it.

As far as the 2024 draft the comment last year was it was a small midfielders draft. Every year the top 10 changes. Even more so when there is not a Harley Reid. Sometimes you really show a lack of understanding or contempt for how it works.
Lets face it we did not know the system would be changed mid year and we would be in line to take Kako via NGA. Secondly Kako was considered to be more 20 to 30 at the start of the year. A player like Tauru who is now being looked at well inside the first round was not even inside the top 30. The fact that multiple clubs now want to trade in shows there was not really an obvious vibe about the top end of this draft. Saying there is no coherent strategy is simply wrong.

 

[Duckworth]

If we make a bid there are two options, you either pass on Kako and we get him or you trade out 9 for future picks.

If you decide you're matching it doesn't impact us whether you use 9 or later picks, we miss out either way. If you decide to put 9 on the table we would obviously be interested as would 16 other clubs.

It would then be in your best interest to take the best deal available to you and there is a decent chance our offer could be the best.

Essendon would be foolish to rule out trading with St Kilda on principle.

Your initial proposal was that St Kilda was trying to leverage Essendon into trading pick 9 to them. I'm telling you that we will remove that leverage.

In any case, I think we're done here, as you seem incapable of grasping what I'm telling you.

 

[JayJ20]

Very uninspiring off-season so far especially when the best we can hope for is trading out of this year's draft into next year. Pretty depressing really. Not even a Conor Stone coming in.

It'll be the same old squad + Kako - Stringer. Not really hitting the draft, not playing finals, not trading in players. Doesn't really look like a side that's continuing a rebuild.

If I were to look at the competition, our list is probably one of the least exciting lists.

 

[Old Campaigner]

Very uninspiring off-season so far especially when the best we can hope for is trading out of this year's draft into next year. Pretty depressing really. Not even a Conor Stone coming in.

It'll be the same old squad + Kako - Stringer. Not really hitting the draft, not playing finals, not trading in players. Doesn't really look like a side that's continuing a rebuild.

If I were to look at the competition, our list is probably one of the least exciting lists.

Maybe that unexciting list is the reason we don't have much to trade out to improve our position in the draft, and it's a bit hard to trade players in if we don't have picks and players don't want to come here.

If things go well for us we'll get a pick before a Kako bid and we'll effectively walk away with two first round picks

 

[Vindicater]

Very uninspiring off-season so far especially when the best we can hope for is trading out of this year's draft into next year. Pretty depressing really. Not even a Conor Stone coming in.

It'll be the same old squad + Kako - Stringer. Not really hitting the draft, not playing finals, not trading in players. Doesn't really look like a side that's continuing a rebuild.

If I were to look at the competition, our list is probably one of the least exciting lists.

Meh, after years of Dodo just adding people for the sake of it I am happy to have a quiet offseason where we start reshaping the list.

 

[JayJ20]

Parish is not on Dodoro, he is on Vozzo and Scott. None of these list management decisions is on Dodoro. It is all on Vozzo and Scott, and it is a nonsense to suggest otherwise. We should be absolutely clear on that point because blaming the past for things that had nothing to do with the past is clearly now on the cards. Narratives and stories distract from the issues, which is just like what happened post 2017. All of the BS about the saga-fatigue when the football department was a shambles.

Scott and Vozzo have been the senior figures in the football department for all of the last 2 seasons. Between them it is has been total control. There is nothing that has happened to their list without their sign off. They are the ones that have delivered this latest mess and no capacity to aggressively target what is shaping as one of the best drafts ever...at the same time that, at least when it started, we were all about the long term.

Someone needs to explain to me how it could be that the strength of the 2024 draft has not been a factor in any decision making by Essendon. What our head scout, Robert Foster Knight, has been on leave for 20 months or has his network collapsed? Or did he forget to hit send on an email? Did the network protocol prevent it from from reaching the desk of Vozzo and Scott? Is it that the list management team has not been meeting for the last 2 years? Or is it that Essendon has overrated its players, again?

How can these people have been in their roles for this long and have no coherent strategy? Or is Brad doing his 'lets take out picks and sign free agents' again as he blows up another list?

I found the perfect term for how Essendon is run. Weaponised incompetence. It almost seems like a practical joke sometimes.

Richmond just won three premierships and they'll probably fly by us in a couple of years because they'll nail another Dusty, Cotchin, Rance etc in a super draft. They'll give away the likes of Bolton and Baker to make it happen.

Meanwhile we're sitting there with Parish and McGrath with almost no elite young talent. Geelong have better young players than we do and we'll be selecting either the same or likely less amount of young talent than them and the likes of Brisbane, Sydney and GWS this year. All 4 of them already have better young players. It's unbelievable really.

This is a strong draft and the best we can do is trade out of the draft into next year when that could be a 2020 quality draft. We're nowhere near contending yet we're not loading up on elite young talent.

And all of this with Tasmania coming in a couple of years.

Meh, after years of Dodo just adding people for the sake of it I am happy to have a quiet offseason where we start reshaping the list.

I would have too if we weren't falling behind all the teams around us with Tassie coming in to compromise drafts. I'm not really concerned about trading in players (unless they're younger than 23), but it's concerning how little elite young talent we have on the list. It's like we're not even trying. We messed up by not trading some of our senior players sooner.

 

[Yoda_]

Very uninspiring off-season so far especially when the best we can hope for is trading out of this year's draft into next year. Pretty depressing really. Not even a Conor Stone coming in.

It'll be the same old squad + Kako - Stringer. Not really hitting the draft, not playing finals, not trading in players. Doesn't really look like a side that's continuing a rebuild.

If I were to look at the competition, our list is probably one of the least exciting lists.

The uninspiring part is us sitting on our hands like we are happy with where the club (list) is going

after yet another dismal ending, the penny really will never drop.

 

[Sporno 4 Pyros]

Very uninspiring off-season so far especially when the best we can hope for is trading out of this year's draft into next year. Pretty depressing really. Not even a Conor Stone coming in.

It'll be the same old squad + Kako - Stringer. Not really hitting the draft, not playing finals, not trading in players. Doesn't really look like a side that's continuing a rebuild.

If I were to look at the competition, our list is probably one of the least exciting lists.

Jake Niall from The Age has said it many times (&he is 100% correct)…we have no stars.

Our last 2 genuine stars were Hird and Lloyd (both drafted pre 1995 )

In the past 10 years the bulldogs have consistently picked guys who have at one point been considered top10 in the AFL such as Bont, Naughton, Smith, Darcy, JUH,
(or potentially top 10 in some of these cases) Every one of their first rounders in the past 10 years would be better than ours (except Caddy)

Overall our list is ok (player for player against other sides it matches up pretty evenly) but we lack stars (and a game plan, & any idea how to defend,& gut runners )

 

[nipst@r]

I would try for shiel and stringer for a gws tall or small forward. They have plenty of both and worst case we plant the seed for future years when they have another year of not cementing a spot. May need to throw in future pick.

Stringer is interesting as he is a better player than langford but it is one or the other for me. Langford is now a favourite who plays evens when injured and ineffective.

Totally fine with our list approach at the moment but what I'm still annoyed at is wasting the last month to 6 weeks of the season. This list approach should and will need to be aligned with selection. Not confident this will happen.

Last year we pointlessly played a unfit stringer and injured langford for the last 2 months. Would have been good to look at a fwd line with just 1. Lonh Delay in playing roberts, caddy, byran and not playing hayes at all and weideman instead. Just wow.

Really worried that club as a whole are slow to pick up on things or react based on last year. We wasted 2 months of last season when it was obvious we needed the injections of caddy/roberts/byran etc weeks before they happened. Persisted with heppel, kelly, goldy all for at least a month too long. Also stuck with a stubborn and terrible fwd structure until right before the end. Hoping with lower expectations next year we can stop chasing quick unrealistic wins, like we did last year.

What we will finally need is to have a sensible aligned top to bottom approach as a club. Low hopes this will happen as involves a step back from a win/loss and talent perspective.

 

[ant555]

The uninspiring part is us sitting on our hands like we are happy with where the club (list) is going

after yet another dismal ending, the penny really will never drop.

How are we sitting on our hands ?
Maybe we need to produce a gun and force blokes to sign up or clubs to take blokes off our hands.
Mistakes have been made. It is not an easy fix. The bloke who has to fix it is in his first Trade / FA period.
He is not a magician.
You an not spend 10 years complaining about Dodoro and then complain the next bloke can not fix it in year 1.
And before you jump in Dodoro was out of the draft selection part and Scott did want Parish and McGrath but Dodoro was still part of that side and negotiated the contract lengths.
The biggest issue we have is not McGrath and Parish anyway. Biggest problem we have is the 2020 draft where we had 3 top 10 picks and 5 within the top 50 (close enough as Brand was 53).
Then we have 2021 that only produced Hobbs and the jury is still to decide on him .
So far 2022 is not producing either although there is time.
That is 3 drafts in the rebuild that are looking pretty thin. Three drafts that despite Dodoro not having total control still had his beak in the process.
You can not scream blue murder about Dodoro and then wonder why Rosa is not making moves all over the place in his first few months of complete control. You can question what Scott was thinking in his first year but even he was starting from a position where he had no deep list analysis and spent a season also picking out the issues with the football program.

 

[ghostdog]

I found the perfect term for how Essendon is run. Weaponised incompetence. It almost seems like a practical joke sometimes.

Richmond just won three premierships and they'll probably fly by us in a couple of years because they'll nail another Dusty, Cotchin, Rance etc in a super draft. They'll give away the likes of Bolton and Baker to make it happen.

Meanwhile we're sitting there with Parish and McGrath with almost no elite young talent. Geelong have better young players than we do and we'll be selecting either the same or likely less amount of young talent than them and the likes of Brisbane, Sydney and GWS this year. All 4 of them already have better young players. It's unbelievable really.

This is a strong draft and the best we can do is trade out of the draft into next year when that could be a 2020 quality draft. We're nowhere near contending yet we're not loading up on elite young talent.

And all of this with Tasmania coming in a couple of years.

I would have too if we weren't falling behind all the teams around us with Tassie coming in to compromise drafts. I'm not really concerned about trading in players (unless they're younger than 23), but it's concerning how little elite young talent we have on the list. It's like we're not even trying. We messed up by not trading some of our senior players sooner.

We also messed up by not expunging ourselves of the previous list manager sooner, whom the Prez implied did not have a list management strategy.

Those three top 10 picks in 2020. Wtf.

 

[Yoda_]

How are we sitting on our hands ?
Maybe we need to produce a gun and force blokes to sign up or clubs to take blokes off our hands.
Mistakes have been made. It is not an easy fix.

we've butted heads over this in the past.. I know you're going to come back with the same retort of Scott has needed time to review the list. Its been two years. If he cant ascertain that Reid cant get on the park something is wrong. IF he cant completely rule out moving on a Hobbs if he cant ascertain that Parish is able to buy in and not be a kick chasing stat paddler then we really do have a problem.


I couldn't give a shit about trying o bring in Houston let alone Bailey Smith. Nice sugar hit. I want movement of our b and c grade players that may net us something. I am not suggesting o blow the joint up but move one on to get pick(s) in the door.

Would be hopeful that something happens because at the moment we're likely to do something silly and desperate like Stringer for pick 53 (meaningful picks aside)

 

[Yoda_]

I would try for shiel and stringer for a gws tall or small forward. They have plenty of both and worst case we plant the seed for future years when they have another year of not cementing a spot. May need to throw in future pick.

Stringer is interesting as he is a better player than langford but it is one or the other for me. Langford is now a favourite who plays evens when injured and ineffective.

Totally fine with our list approach at the moment but what I'm still annoyed at is wasting the last month to 6 weeks of the season. This list approach should and will need to be aligned with selection. Not confident this will happen.

Last year we pointlessly played a unfit stringer and injured langford for the last 2 months. Would have been good to look at a fwd line with just 1. Lonh Delay in playing roberts, caddy, byran and not playing hayes at all and weideman instead. Just wow.

Really worried that club as a whole are slow to pick up on things or react based on last year. We wasted 2 months of last season when it was obvious we needed the injections of caddy/roberts/byran etc weeks before they happened. Persisted with heppel, kelly, goldy all for at least a month too long. Also stuck with a stubborn and terrible fwd structure until right before the end. Hoping with lower expectations next year we can stop chasing quick unrealistic wins, like we did last year.

What we will finally need is to have a sensible aligned top to bottom approach as a club. Low hopes this will happen as involves a step back from a win/loss and talent perspective.

the most ou of line selection was the Weidemann one late in the season. I get that we were still hopeful of finals but Hayes had better runs on the board and for the long term benefits of the club (imho) should have been selected


completely agree with what your saying