Aggro vs the Hawks

[robstewart23]

Liked the tactic. It was something different. It is rare that I watch us lose a game, especially by 38 points, and yet I come away somewhat satisfied that there was some spirit shown, particularly early. Now I look at next week against wce with some real hope that we will put up a fight in a game, showing heart. There are still too many good players down for mine but I think we can beat the eagles and gain some confidence as a group.

 

[speedytiger]

Yeah i liked it too. I don't believe we lost our focus at all. I was surprised at how mature Hawthorn were in the way they handled it.

 

[cheesedogg]

I'm not too sure about it. I mean we have not come out and played with intent to intimidate the opposition in that way once this year.

To come out all of a sudden with that kind of attitude when we haven't really before almost give the impression we are intimidated by them.

Massive <3 for Taz though

 

[Mateyman]

that 'bullshit' free kick was given for a blatant hold of the arm. how about you open your other eye when you watch the replay?

and as far as franklin being 'destroyed' by taz, cloke had only managed 2 goals until the 20-minute mark of the 3rd. did schoenmakers 'destroy' cloke? you can't have it both ways.

if i were you i'd be more worried about collingwood's on-field leadership in big finals rather than coming up with child-like excuses.

Tarrant was holding Buddy,but Buddy had a fistful of Tarrant's jumper.

 

[darcy tyler]

That "bullshit" free kick was pretty soft. As was the Hale free kick when scores were level in the second. The Roughead non-holding-the-ball goal was pretty painful when scores were level in the first. And I think that if the shoe had been on the other foot, you'd be able to see how very disappointed we all were when Cloke was lining up for a set shot from just outside the goalsquare, to make the margin only 11 points in the third, only to have the ball suddenly turned over for a goal thanks to an unseen incident one hundred metres off the ball.

I know you think that your opinions hold a lot of extra weight right now because the team you support currently contains the highest percentage of talented footballers in the league. But please don't let this false sense of entitlement lull you into the trap of so many of your bigfooty brethren by coming to opposition boards, denigrating passionate and hurting supporters with "child-like" name-calling, taking snide potshots at an opposition team's on-field leadership in pressure games (notwithstanding that your own team's on-field leadership in pressure games has been nothing short of abysmal for every crunch game over the past three years), and generally displaying a lack of any humility whatsoever in victory.

If that cloke reversed decision was unseen, how do you know it wasn't there?

I think a lot of those decisions you've mentioned could have gone either way. Whether they're paid or not depends on the umpiring up until that point. I thought that the umpires were letting a fair bit go early on, so I wasn't overly surprised with that roughead one.
With the Hale one (if it's the one I'm thinking of), Maxwell blocked someone (I think Franklin) off the ball and wasn't looking at the contest. My comment about Maxwell was in reference to this, his 50 against Hodge and his high hit on Puopolo. I think he's a good captain, but he lost his way in a few brief moments. If he had of done a few things differently, then perhaps we'd be looking at a completely different result.

With regards to humility, sitting around blaming umpires isn't exactly a shining example of humility.

 

[jmac70]

If that cloke reversed decision was unseen, how do you know it wasn't there?

I think a lot of those decisions you've mentioned could have gone either way. Whether they're paid or not depends on the umpiring up until that point. I thought that the umpires were letting a fair bit go early on, so I wasn't overly surprised with that roughead one.
With the Hale one (if it's the one I'm thinking of), Maxwell blocked someone (I think Franklin) off the ball and wasn't looking at the contest. My comment about Maxwell was in reference to this, his 50 against Hodge and his high hit on Puopolo. I think he's a good captain, but he lost his way in a few brief moments. If he had of done a few things differently, then perhaps we'd be looking at a completely different result.

With regards to humility, sitting around blaming umpires isn't exactly a shining example of humility.

You make a lot of really good points but you simply are not going to get anyone to agree with you in here.

 

[the mighty T]

i thought it was brilliant to get into the faces of the opposition. I think that the club and coaching staff have recognised that there is definately one team we cant beat on talent and usual game style alone and thats hawthorn. So why not change it up and show some agression?

Certainly when we played with that intensity, they didnt have control over us. And apart from a huge brainfade at the start of the last Q and the end of the 2nd where we just stalled for a few minutes, it was just about level

If we meet the hawks again this season, we have to go as hard and as physical as possible

 

[SuperSub17]

We won the flag in 1958 by roughing up a seemingly invincible team...and I might add despite getting thrashed in the first final.

 

[Old Spice]

Liked it myself. Don't want Franklin strutting around like a ****. Definitely tired Franklin out the wrestling, like Ali and Foreman, but without the happy ending. He ended up with 4, but not by any displays of brilliance and bravado.

 

[coldpieswarmbeer]

Liked it myself. Don't want Franklin strutting around like a ****. Definitely tired Franklin out the wrestling, like Ali and Foreman, but without the happy ending. He ended up with 4, but not by any displays of brilliance and bravado.

and his team ended up with the 4 points

 

[Old Spice]

and his team ended up with the 4 points

This is true, but had little to do with Franklin in my opinion. Blow-out might have been 60 points. We'll never know the answer there, but I think there was always going to be a premium on playing tight as Hawks with an outside run would have destroyed us by more. That's my opinion anyway.

 

[Mateyman]

This is true, but had little to do with Franklin in my opinion. Blow-out might have been 60 points. We'll never know the answer there, but I think there was always going to be a premium on playing tight as Hawks with an outside run would have destroyed us by more. That's my opinion anyway.

It was a joke, because Franklin said it, even though there were no premiership points involved

 

[collwood]

Must admit first thing I thought was it showed a lack of confidence - it's the kind of thing teams try and do when they know they're not good enough. I would have preferred manic tackling and attack on the ball, which has won us finals (see Prelim 2010). We can still try this but feels like we're running out of time.

 

[Pera]

Thought it was great. Physicality is something we haven't seen a lot of this year.

In regards to your question about going Lynch/Wakelin if we do indeed meet again, I'd hope Taz stays away from that, but gives a few little rib ticklers to keep him in line. Maybe he can throw in a stomp, a pinch and the odd bite here or there just to let him know he's there.

 

[Civilest]

Whilst I enjoyed the aggression and it served some purpose, it rarely wins you games. Matthews famously forbade (is that a word?)... forbade the Pies to play the man after the famous quarter time blue in 1990 GF.

I kept wondering if Tarrant, having retired, would just break Franklin's jaw in the first few minutes.

Our performance would have beaten any other team I feel, but Hawthorn are just a cut above the rest. Pretty happy with how we played and certainly an improvement on recent weeks.

 

[PenAndPaper]

1) The biggest sniper in the game was Jarryd Roughead.
2) Apart from Taz, who else engaged in 'roughing them up' tactics? Clearly not a team tactic.
3) It's not Maxwell's fault that Puopolo is a midget who wasn't watching where he was going.
4) And considering Hawthorn is such an impressively physical side, its supporters are remarkably soft observers. Very precious. It's annoying.

Maxwell's was worse than Roughead's, there was a lot more force behind Maxwell's and not to mention the head high. I honestly think neither of them should get anything but Maxwell's hit was definitely worse. Seriously mate get a grip.

As for the tactic used. When it first started I was a little worried we would react stupidly but glad we didn't. In the end it did make you guys look silly but those tactics always do if you are on the losing side, if you had of won it would have been a different story.

 

[JustKickIt]

This is true, but had little to do with Franklin in my opinion.

Just in case you missed the best player lists from the game:

BEST
Hawthorn: Sewell, Mitchell, Gibson, Breust, Franklin, Ellis
Collingwood: Pendlebury, Swan, Krakouer, Cloke, Sinclair

 

[Bosk]

Roughing up the opposition is fine, but there's a difference between controlled aggression & refusing to back down and outright thuggery. The first one is often displayed by great teams like Brisbane & Geelong in the past, the second is usually something weak teams resort to when they know they're certain to be outclassed by a superior side.

I dare say the way the MRP chooses to look at Maxwell & Tarrant's performances may have a large bearing on how you guys end up feeling about Buckley's decision to use the tactic.

 

[sr36]

1) The biggest sniper in the game was Jarryd Roughead.
2) Apart from Taz, who else engaged in 'roughing them up' tactics? Clearly not a team tactic.
3) It's not Maxwell's fault that Puopolo is a midget who wasn't watching where he was going.
4) And considering Hawthorn is such an impressively physical side, its supporters are remarkably soft observers. Very precious. It's annoying.

Daisy spent the first quarter not even trying to get a kick, all he wanted to do was smash into blokes. He was bloody lucky that Mitchell got 2cm below a front on charge, otherwise Daisy would have got him in the head and been rubbed out for 4 weeks.

 

[Old Spice]

Just in case you missed the best player lists from the game:

BEST
Hawthorn: Sewell, Mitchell, Gibson, Breust, Franklin, Ellis
Collingwood: Pendlebury, Swan, Krakouer, Cloke, Sinclair

Oh, now I see.

I think you missed my point, which was that Franklin might have kicked 6 rather than 4. Got right in his face and I think nullified him to a large extent. One-on-one Tarrant wasn't that badly scored against.

And Bosk, I think you were the better team and it was a sign we weren't a better team. I think we needed to fly the flag even if we weren't going to win just to give Hawthorn something to think about.

 

[Gambit78]

Maxwell's was worse than Roughead's, there was a lot more force behind Maxwell's and not to mention the head high. I honestly think neither of them should get anything but Maxwell's hit was definitely worse. Seriously mate get a grip.

As for the tactic used. When it first started I was a little worried we would react stupidly but glad we didn't. In the end it did make you guys look silly but those tactics always do if you are on the losing side, if you had of won it would have been a different story.

Any player other than Puopolo, then it would not even be discussed. It is unfortunate that he is so short. I'll even go as far as to say that Puopolo instigated the contact seeing as it was him who changed direction so suddenly. Roughead, on the other hand, was off the ball, from behind, unexpected and clearly pre-meditated. If we're rating them on impact, then you might have an argument, but in terms of an 'act' Roughead's was worse.

Daisy spent the first quarter not even trying to get a kick, all he wanted to do was smash into blokes. He was bloody lucky that Mitchell got 2cm below a front on charge, otherwise Daisy would have got him in the head and been rubbed out for 4 weeks.

Daisy's always played like that, though. He was rubbed out for 4 weeks last year, wasn't he? He's always been on edge. Still hold that it wasn't a team tactic.

 

[Cousin of Daicos]

Team tactic?

Didn't see anyone else doing it apart from Taz and Buddy. I actually thought it was escelated more when Buddy realised he was being taken to the cleaners. Notice it died off once Buddy kicked a couple?

Seemed like Taz was hanging some shit probably reminding him of their last 2 meetings against each other, which Buddy obviously didn't like, then it got worse when Taz shut him down and probably niggled and hung some more shit on him.

 

[Cyril the Squirrel]

Buddy realised he was being taken to the cleaners.

More like driven in the general direction of the cleaners.

 

[Cousin of Daicos]

More like driven in the general direction of the cleaners.

Even you have to admit, that Tarrant had him more than covered in the first half.

 

[Mr Meeseeks]

I didn't like it. I agree that it was a clear team tactic - and the fact that it was told me one thing:

We were not confident in our own game!

I didnt think it was particularly one sided Aggro, aside from the buddy/tarrant stoush. Roughead on Dawes for example...

Thought it was typical finals footy.

I enjoyed the Tarrant/Buddy contest, entertaining stuff, though can you imagine how Tarrant would be getting dragged through the mud in the media this week if he'd given that sort of treatment to Judd, Ablett, Watson or Goodes??

Whats good for the goose is apparently not so for the gander.