Ahmed Saad's ban for energy drink on match day

[Nutsngum]

For those of us who didn't see it, who was being a twat about Saad? Fill us in so we can join in on the vitriol

Tony Sheahan on his twitter.

 

[Barrels]

Now saying he didn't remove it, rather that it was removed for him...

Flog.

 

[Quixote]

Forgive my ignorance here - but what does this mean in terms of Saad and our list? We can't redraft him in Feb 2015.... ?

 

[saintsrfreak]

Forgive my ignorance here - but what does this mean in terms of Saad and our list? We can't redraft him in Feb 2015.... ?

He can't be on any list until then. I'd say that's career over for him.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Now saying he didn't remove it, rather that it was removed for him...

Flog.

I hate to quote Eddie Maguire but "Tony Sheahan, is just an unmitigated idiot " could be the most accurate thing he ever said.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

He can't be on any list until then. I'd say that's career over for him.

Is that true?
He cant get paid by a club, or train with a club, but I cant see that putting his name on a piece of paper in November contravenes that.
Don't pay him until February.

 

[BrianSpeaking]

He can be drafted, no problem.

 

[Sunshine Saint]

Assuming that Saad can be drafted in the 2013 Rookie Draft, 2014 National Draft, or Rookie Draft, which of the options, should the club be pursuing now:

• Rookie Saad now and hold him on the list for all of next year, even though he can't play. At the end of 2014 either retain him on the Rookie list or upgrade him to the main list
• Not select him in the Rookie List tomorrow, but take advantage of the extra spot for the year, but rookie listing someone else, to gain something from the fact that Saad can't play.
• If we don't select him in the Rookie List, can he be taken by other teams ahead of us in next years National or Rookie drafts?
• Does Saad have any say on where he goes, should we not take him up and he is available to draft at the end of 2014?

 

[SaintLex]

I can't see other clubs falling over themselves to pick up Saad in 12 months time so I see no reason to rookie him again this year. I'd much rather give the spot to someone like Weller or this mysterious draftee that we rated top 30.

If at the end of the 2014 season we are allowed to take Saad back, i'd give him a spot on the rookie list at best, given he will have to miss most of pre-season so probably won't be ready for round 1. It's even possible that others on our list will surpass him anyway, and we may choose to pick up 2014 draftees instead.

From the club's perspective, I just can't see the benefits except the warm, fuzzy feeling of supporting Saad despite his mistake.

 

[saintsrfreak]

Is that true?
He cant get paid by a club, or train with a club, but I cant see that putting his name on a piece of paper in November contravenes that.
Don't pay him until February.

But how can he sign a contract if he's not allowed to be paid?

 

[Plugger35]

Saad has a bit too much white in his jumper, just black and red he would have got off.

Disgraceful inconsistency.

 

[ike2112]

Most of the questions in last few hours are already explained.

During a ban he cannot participate in 'organised team activities'. That means he cannot play or even train with any team under the national governing body of any sport registered under ASADA or equivalent in another country. Nor train with a registered coach under above, nor participate in any event covered by the above. So he can't even go run a local 10k if it's got NGB approval. And he can't do his own work separately with a proper sprint coach (assuming the coach would be NGB-registered). All he can do is train himself or with others in a casual arrangement; that is, if he happens to go for a run and Jarryn Geary and Adam Schneider happen to see him whilst they're out and they run together, that's fine.
WADA allow the athlete to still actually be paid by an employer during a ban, but whether the club want to is another matter (and ASADA may have stricter view - their full finding and ruling has yet to be published). Most of the time the club will fire the athlete, due to the associated poor publicity of having someone with a doping suspension in their employment. Not to mention the salary cap hassle it could cause (ie. if you only pay him for a proportion of the AFL financial year 2014/15).
They can select whoever they want in the rookie draft. They could select him this year if they want, and retain their rights to him for the year, but the AFL will likely not allow them to register him.
They could leave him unemployed in 2014 and rookie him in next year's rookie draft, and re-obtain his rights. Then only register him in Feb 2015 once the ban is over. They'd need to either have a free list spot already at that point, or create one (more likely they'd leave one open from the 14-15 offseason).
Only from February 2015 could he train with them. So he's not going to do another preseason properly until 2015/16 season.

I think it was wishful thinking that the tribunal outcome was going to affect what the Saints do in this year's rookie draft. Unless he was cleared, they were never taking him this year. He has time to appeal and then I expect the success or otherwise of appeal will determine whether the Saints draft him next year. I expected his ban to be backdated to the date of reporting, it is only usually later if there was a request for B sample and/or delayed informing of the athlete, and/or it's to do with missing tests or incorrect whereabouts info. Maybe he asked for B sample. Although he also should not have played the game that he did after finding out; it could be that the August date is being chosen so as to avoid having to rewrite history and negating that game from Saints results archive.
If he could successfully appeal a moving of the backdating, or a slight reduction in ban, to allow him to do next year's (2014/15) preseason then I think he'll save his Saints career.
If he can't, then I reckon he'll be a cracking pay-per-game player in a regional league from summer 2015...

 

[gotassieboys]

I know that Saad took a banned substance via a energy drink. However i think intent is a issue that needs to be taken into account when handing down sentences.

It seems an extremely harsh sentence for a honest mistake.

If the guy deliberately took a banned substance then I would support a lengthy ban. However it is obvious the bloke made an honest mistake.

After all, he was hardly being secretive in using the product. For goodness sake he was actually the public face of the product.

ASADA once again have enhanced their standing in the community by finding another big time drug cheat!

 

[Sainter93]

Absolute joke. That's all there is to say.

 

[saintsrfreak]

Pretty sure it was a protein shake, not an energy drink, FWIW

 

[RobbieMuir]

Saad has about 14 months to wait before he can re-join the Saints in full training. He is a super-fit athlete who has been training in a professional environment for two years. Surely he knows what is required to maintain his fitness. In fact, during this 14 month period he can actually improve his aerobic fitness and his strength. People who believe his career is over should consider that improving one's fitness is more about how hard you push yourself (ie the quality of your training), rather than the quality of your training partners. There are plenty of national standard athletes that train predomiantly train by themselves.

If he is prepared to train every day for the next 14 months, and is prepared to really smash himself, he should return to the club in a healthier physical state than when he left. By not playing any games of footy whilst suspended, he will return feeling both physically and mentally fresher. I hope the club sets him a mammoth training program and he comes back better than ever. (Let's not forget how damn good he was in 2012.) He is only going to miss one season of actual footy, so in some respects it will be similar to a player who has had a knee reco - except that there will be no injury to recover from. I hope he is back in our best 22 as our team has a crack at the 2015 finals.

 

[Riccardo11]

It's a pretty terrible state of affairs here. I feel very bad for a talented young player who has effectively lost AT LEAST one year of his career (not to mention his livelihood) through an act most would deem entirely unintentional.

It is especially glaring considering the abundance of evidence that Essendrug ran a sophisticated injection program and has virtually gotten off scot free. They lost their finals place and coach for a year - that's it!

The AFL has the blood of Ahmeds career on it's hands it will have a hard time cleaning off.

 

[saintersown]

So taking a bloody protein shake gives you a total ban of 24 months. Injecting substances that are not even approved for human use and are on the banned substance list, into muscular tissue doesn't do shit.

Money talks, Essendon walks...

 

[sammm]

Saad has about 14 months to wait before he can re-join the Saints in full training. He is a super-fit athlete who has been training in a professional environment for two years. Surely he knows what is required to maintain his fitness. In fact, during this 14 month period he can actually improve his aerobic fitness and his strength. People who believe his career is over should consider that improving one's fitness is more about how hard you push yourself (ie the quality of your training), rather than the quality of your training partners. There are plenty of national standard athletes that train predomiantly train by themselves.

If he is prepared to train every day for the next 14 months, and is prepared to really smash himself, he should return to the club in a healthier physical state than when he left. By not playing any games of footy whilst suspended, he will return feeling both physically and mentally fresher. I hope the club sets him a mammoth training program and he comes back better than ever. (Let's not forget how damn good he was in 2012.) He is only going to miss one season of actual footy, so in some respects it will be similar to a player who has had a knee reco - except that there will be no injury to recover from. I hope he is back in our best 22 as our team has a crack at the 2015 finals.

that would be difficult for the club to do, how is the guy going to earn a living for the next year if he is undertaking a large training program. pretty unfair of the club to ask him, with no offical guarentee that he will be picked up.

unless the club pay him out of his contract.

 

[Winmar2Lockett]

When was it confirmed that Essendope players would not receive bans?

Dont jump the gun people, I expect that we'll get an early xmas present in that regard.

Only one person to blame re Saad & thats the man himself.

A stupid costly mistake but one of his own doing

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk

 

[Nutsngum]

So we failed to rookie Saad. Kind of shitful in my opinion.

 

[saintbatty]

So we failed to rookie Saad. Kind of shitful in my opinion.

I understand that Saints are committed to re-drafting him next year. Why waste a rookie space in the meantime? Who would you drop for a (non-playing) Saad - Templeton or Weller?

 

[Riccardo11]

So we failed to rookie Saad. Kind of shitful in my opinion.

As I understand it, he is banned from participating in training or playing until his ban is lifted, meaning we would have given up a rookie spot for a guy who technically isn't even allowed in the rooms after the game.

I'm sure we will keep contact with him and pick him up again for 2015.

 

[Squizz]

So we failed to rookie Saad. Kind of shitful in my opinion.

I'm OK with it. We need to accept that he did the wrong thing, not the club. If we don't support him (helping him arrange the necessary training he'll need to re-enter the system) and then re-draft him next year (assuming that is permitted and he's able to perform at pre-season training to the level required) then it would be poor.

But until then, there are other players desperate for an opportunity (one that Saad can't exercise in 2014).

 

[Defacto]

I'm OK with it. We need to accept that he did the wrong thing, not the club. If we don't support him (helping him arrange the necessary training he'll need to re-enter the system) and then re-draft him next year (assuming that is permitted and he's able to perform at pre-season training to the level required) then it would be poor.

But until then, there are other players desperate for an opportunity (one that Saad can't exercise in 2014).

+1 here

said it better than i ever could