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It is recognised that this is a fraught topic for any number of you posting here. Some of you will have family in Israel or Palestine. Some of you will have connections to either side of the conflict. What you need to understand is that this site has rules governing posting standards and the appropriate way to talk to other posters, and you will abide by them.

How this interacts with this thread is that the following will result in your post being deleted, with a recurrence of the same behaviour resulting in (depending on severity) a threadban for a week and a day off:
  • direct labelling of someone as anti-semitic or a terrorist sympathiser for posting that is merely critical of Israel's response over time. Israel has the right to defend themselves from violence, but that does not mean that Israel has carte blanche to attack disproportionately towards people under their care.
  • deliberate goading or flippant responses, designed to get people reacting to your posting emotionally.
  • abuse.
  • attempts to turn this into a Left vs Right shitfight.
  • Use the word 'Nazi' in here, you had better be able to justify it in the post you're making and the comparison had better be apt. Godwin's law is in full effect for the purposes of this thread; if you refer to Nazis, you've lost whatever argument you're involved in.
  • Any defense of Hamas' actions on the basis of justification. There's no justification for genocide, regardless of whether or not they have the power to do so.
Please recognise that this is a difficult time for all involved, and some level of sensitivity is absolutely required to permit discussion to flow. From time to time, mods will reach out to specific posters and do some welfare checks; we may even give posters who get a bit too involved some days off to give people some time to cool down. This is not a reflection on you as a poster, merely that this is an intense subject.

I get that this is a fairly intense topic about which opinion can diverge rather significantly. If you feel you cannot be respectful in your disagreement with another poster, it is frequently better to refuse to engage than it is to take up the call.

From this point, any poster who finds themselves directly insulting another poster will find themselves receiving a threadban and an infraction, with each subsequent reoccurance resulting in steadily more points added to your account.

It has also become apparent that this needs to be said: just because someone moderates this forum that does not hold them to a different standard of posting than anyone else. All of us were posters first, and we are allowed to hold opinions on this and share them on this forum.

Treat each other with the respect each of you deserve.

Maggie5 Gone Critical Anzacday Jen2310
 

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Markfs said:
what was the question again?
Click to expand...

You know. Your assertion about “Jewish-owned businesses forming a significant part of the Australian economy”. That’s paraphrasing, but significant was your word.

It’s either an anti-Semitic trope or you need to justify the assertion.

Edit: just remembered. You used “firms”. If it wasn’t so heinous it would be hilarious

On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app
 
sideswipe said:
You know. Your assertion about “Jewish-owned businesses forming a significant part of the Australian economy”. That’s paraphrasing, but significant was your word.

It’s either an anti-Semitic trope or you need to justify the assertion.

Edit: just remembered. You used “firms”. If it wasn’t so heinous it would be hilarious

On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app
Click to expand...

no i dont think that i said that...
 
sideswipe said:
You know. Your assertion about “Jewish-owned businesses forming a significant part of the Australian economy”. That’s paraphrasing, but significant was your word.

It’s either an anti-Semitic trope or you need to justify the assertion.

Edit: just remembered. You used “firms”. If it wasn’t so heinous it would be hilarious

On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app
Click to expand...
I don't get the edit. What's the connotation of "firms"?
 

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Markfs said:
When faced with jewish-australian-israeli controlled firms making up a significant part of the economy, they will often side with their employers' interests, especially when they are "encouraged" to.

This isnt just true for israeli interests, as unionists will often side with similarly propagandaising mining companies, to ensure their income. I live in WA and mining companies are probably verballing the community more than jewish-australian-israeli interests are doing on the east coast, although it could be argued that the latter are happier to use methods that discredit .
Click to expand...

Here’s a bit of an extract for you


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app
 
The short temporary easily concluded ceasefire is being negotiated by the parties. Hamas has made some concessions, although the israelis have a bottom line that they need to start the killing again some time in the future.

Maybe israel would agree to a ceasefire if every palestinian agreed to move to new york, boston and miami....

www.bbc.com

Gaza war: 'Breakthrough' heightens hopes of ceasefire deal

Surprise resumption of talks puts warring sides closest to agreement for months.
www.bbc.com www.bbc.com
 
The Israelis have "legalised" the expansion settlements in West Bank. Doesn't that send a message to anyone who is looking with any degree of objectivity on what is happening.

Let me provide a second piece of evidence. The BBC reports "However, the far-right Israeli minister, Bezalel Smotrich, who lives in a West Bank settlement, has welcomed the recent steps. "We are building the good land and thwarting the establishment of a Palestinian state," he said Wednesday on social media platform X."

It's not just a netinyahoo thing. It's not just a right wing thing. It's an israeli thing and its supported by their various lobby groups here and in the US.

There will be no two-state solution. It is clearly deceptive for Albanese to refer to it this week. The US cant even stop israel from murdering. It has no will to enforce a two state solution. Albanese is either getting in the prone position or kicking the can down the road for later gov't to deal with it.

www.bbc.com

Israel settlements drive heightens Palestinian land angst

The settlements are spreading on land Palestinians want for a future independent state.
www.bbc.com www.bbc.com
 
Netinyahoo is coming to Washington on 24th July. Watch to see how Joe responds. He shouldnt even meet with him but I doubt he would want that or the lobby allow him to do that.

I saw an interesting comment from Haartz which said that Joe's understanding of israel's politics is rooted in the 1980s.
 

By June 19, 2024, 37 396 people had been killed in the Gaza Strip since the attack by Hamas and the Israeli invasion in October, 2023, according to the Gaza Health Ministry, as reported by the UN Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs.1 The Ministry's figures have been contested by the Israeli authorities, although they have been accepted as accurate by Israeli intelligence services,2 the UN, and WHO. These data are supported by independent analyses, comparing changes in the number of deaths of UN Relief and Works Agency (UNRWA) staff with those reported by the Ministry,3 which found claims of data fabrication implausible.4

Collecting data is becoming increasingly difficult for the Gaza Health Ministry due to the destruction of much of the infrastructure.5 The Ministry has had to augment its usual reporting, based on people dying in its hospitals or brought in dead, with information from reliable media sources and first responders. This change has inevitably degraded the detailed data recorded previously. Consequently, the Gaza Health Ministry now reports separately the number of unidentified bodies among the total death toll. As of May 10, 2024, 30% of the 35 091 deaths were unidentified.1

Some officials and news agencies have used this development, designed to improve data quality, to undermine the veracity of the data. However, the number of reported deaths is likely an underestimate. The non-governmental organisation Airwars undertakes detailed assessments of incidents in the Gaza Strip and often finds that not all names of identifiable victims are included in the Ministry's list.
6 Furthermore, the UN estimates that, by Feb 29, 2024, 35% of buildings in the Gaza Strip had been destroyed,5 so the number of bodies still buried in the rubble is likely substantial, with estimates of more than 10 000.7

Armed conflicts have indirect health implications beyond the direct harm from violence. Even if the conflict ends immediately, there will continue to be many indirect deaths in the coming months and years from causes such as reproductive, communicable, and non-communicable diseases. The total death toll is expected to be large given the intensity of this conflict; destroyed health-care infrastructure; severe shortages of food, water, and shelter; the population's inability to flee to safe places; and the loss of funding to UNRWA, one of the very few humanitarian organisations still active in the Gaza Strip.8

In recent conflicts, such indirect deaths range from three to 15 times the number of direct deaths. Applying a conservative estimate of four indirect deaths per one direct death9 to the 37 396 deaths reported, it is not implausible to estimate that up to 186 000 or even more deaths could be attributable to the current conflict in Gaza. Using the 2022 Gaza Strip population estimate of 2 375 259, this would translate to 7·9% of the total population in the Gaza Strip. A report from Feb 7, 2024, at the time when the direct death toll was 28 000, estimated that without a ceasefire there would be between 58 260 deaths (without an epidemic or escalation) and 85 750 deaths (if both occurred) by Aug 6, 2024.10

An immediate and urgent ceasefire in the Gaza Strip is essential, accompanied by measures to enable the distribution of medical supplies, food, clean water, and other resources for basic human needs. At the same time, there is a need to record the scale and nature of suffering in this conflict. Documenting the true scale is crucial for ensuring historical accountability and acknowledging the full cost of the war. It is also a legal requirement. The interim measures set out by the International Court of Justice in January, 2024, require Israel to “take effective measures to prevent the destruction and ensure the preservation of evidence related to allegations of acts within the scope of … the Genocide Convention”.11 The Gaza Health Ministry is the only organisation counting the dead. Furthermore, these data will be crucial for post-war recovery, restoring infrastructure, and planning humanitarian aid.

MM is a member of the editorial board of the Israel Journal of Health Policy Research and of the International Advisory Committee of the Israel National Institute for Health Policy Research. MM was co-chair of the Institute's 2016 6th International Jerusalem Conference on Health Policy, but writes in a personal capacity. He also collaborates with researchers in Israel, Palestine, and Lebanon. RK and SY declare no competing interests. The authors would like to acknowledge study team members Shofiqul Islam and Safa Noreen for their contribution to collecting and managing the data for this Correspondence.
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Last edited:
Haaretz has said that Hamas has effectively accepted the deal. It has also said that Hamas has agreed to US proposals. Netinyahoo and his two mates dont want to see it proceed. Netty's greenlight for further meetings is the usual tactic.

Haaretz published a report on the hannibal directive and how the IDF shot at anything returning to gaza on oct 7th. We all know that the hostages are secondary to the israeli gov't. The main prize is the promised land.

I've seen statements from palestinians that they will move out of gaza if they are allowed. There is probably a percentage who will do the same in the West Bank. THe question for the israelis is how many they can get rid off....and whether they can annex the West Bank.

THe majority of hte US congress are onboard, either by being evangelicals and therefore christian zionists, or they owe their spot in the congress to AIPAC. The question is how US-Israel will stage manage all of this.

The race is on for the democrats to deliver the desired outcome. They need to deliver before the US election because Trump has a voting base that is evangelical and he's been paid $100million to deliver.
 
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