Australian Rules State of Origin Football.

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giskard said:
The so called 2nd tear states should be kept as separate teams. But I don't see why we persist with keeping the ACT separate from NSW. The Rugy codes don't seem to do that when they have their state of origin games.
I'd suggest a knock out comp to find the top two teams, then play a best of 3 games like the NRL.

The women should be playing state of origin too.
Click to expand...

Here is how it was done in 1958, not Origin, interstate Carnival with all & sundry to mark 100 years of the game:

For the first time since the 1950 Brisbane Carnival, all nine eligible teams in both Section 1 and Section 2 competed at the carnival.
Section 1 consisted of two Victorian teams from the (VFL and VFA), South Australia, Western Australia and Tasmania;
Section 2 consisted of New South Wales, Canberra, Queensland and the Australian Amateurs

The Carnival was held between 2 July and 12 July. Day matches were held at the Melbourne Cricket Ground, and night matches were held at the South Melbourne Cricket Ground.
Overall, the ANFC made a loss of more than £11,000 on the carnival, similar in magnitude to the loss made on the previous nine-team carnival in 1950 ..

en.wikipedia.org

1958 Melbourne Carnival - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org
 
Kwality said:
This is the reason we dont have an ongoing Origin series, putting the NT, Q, NSW, ACT & Tas into a 'the rest' basket will never survive. These are growth markets, insulting them isnt a good idea.
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It amuses me that people in WA & SA who would consider a Vic vs 'All Stars' game invalid because their state isn't represented would think it acceptable for other states play as 'Allies'.
 

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telsor said:
It amuses me that people in WA & SA who would consider a Vic vs 'All Stars' game invalid because their state isn't represented would think it acceptable for other states play as 'Allies'.
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The allies concept is rubbish.

Tas would be decent competition for SA in the first year anyway.

WA V Vic
SA V Tas
Can/NSW V NT
 
telsor said:
It amuses me that people in WA & SA who would consider a Vic vs 'All Stars' game invalid because their state isn't represented would think it acceptable for other states play as 'Allies'.
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Can only speak for myself & the Allies concept was always rubbish, it was never valued & part of the reason Origin died in Aussie Rules.
 
Kwality said:
Can only speak for myself & the Allies concept was always rubbish, it was never valued & part of the reason Origin died in Aussie Rules.
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I disagree with your conclusion, but agree that the Allies was a rubbish idea.
 
have a week off before the grand final, so both GF teams can go in with player over niggles, get rid of week off before finals
Vic v rest of australia ( most of you dont like vics) or WA, VIC,SA and allies
exclude players from the 2 GF teams
play the state of origin on that weekend
players still pretty fit as season has just ended, clubs not paranoid that player will be injured for upcoming season
 
WilloTree said:
The allies concept is rubbish.

Tas would be decent competition for SA in the first year anyway.

WA V Vic
SA V Tas
Can/NSW V NT
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No Queensland?

The NSW team is considerably better than Tasmania these days. In fact, the current NSW team would likely beat South Australia pretty easily:

New South Wales
B: Dane Rampe (Syd), Dougal Howard (StK), Zac Williams (Car)
HB: Matt Suckling (WB), Phil Davis (GWS), Callum Mills (Syd)
C: Isaac Smith (Gee), Jacob Hopper (GWS), Harry Perryman (GWS)
HF: Nick Blakey (Syd), Taylor Walker (Ade), Harrison Himmelberg (GWS)
F: Luke Breust (Haw), Tom Hawkins (Gee), Josh Bruce (WB)
Fol: Jarrod Witts (GC), Jack Steele (StK), Isaac Heeney (Syd)
IC: Tom Green (GWS), Harry Cunningham (Syd), Jeremy Finlayson (GWS), Michael Gibbons (Car)

South Australia
B: Rory Laird (Haw), Tom Jonas (PA), Shannon Hurn (WC),
HB: Brodie Smith (Ade), Ryan Burton (PA), Caleb Daniel (WB)
C: George Hewett (Syd), Trent Dumont (NM), Jared Polec (NM)
HF: Chad Wingard (Haw), Darcy Fogarty (Ade), Connor Rozee (PA)
F: Eddie Betts (Car), Scott Lycett (PA), Orazio Fantasia (PA)
Fol: Brodie Grundy (Col), Lachie Neale (BL), Jack Redden (WC)
Int: Wayne Milera (Ade), Jack Lukosius (GC), Aaron Francis (Ess), Izak Rankine (GC)


Tasmania are far better suited to face the Queensland but Tassie would probably also lose that game.
 
GC2015 said:
No Queensland?

The NSW team is considerably better than Tasmania these days. In fact, the current NSW team would likely beat South Australia pretty easily:

New South Wales
B: Dane Rampe (Syd), Dougal Howard (StK), Zac Williams (Car)
HB: Matt Suckling (WB), Phil Davis (GWS), Callum Mills (Syd)
C: Isaac Smith (Gee), Jacob Hopper (GWS), Harry Perryman (GWS)
HF: Nick Blakey (Syd), Taylor Walker (Ade), Harrison Himmelberg (GWS)
F: Luke Breust (Haw), Tom Hawkins (Gee), Josh Bruce (WB)
Fol: Jarrod Witts (GC), Jack Steele (StK), Isaac Heeney (Syd)
IC: Tom Green (GWS), Harry Cunningham (Syd), Jeremy Finlayson (GWS), Michael Gibbons (Car)

South Australia
B: Rory Laird (Haw), Tom Jonas (PA), Shannon Hurn (WC),
HB: Brodie Smith (Ade), Ryan Burton (PA), Caleb Daniel (WB)
C: George Hewett (Syd), Trent Dumont (NM), Jared Polec (NM)
HF: Chad Wingard (Haw), Darcy Fogarty (Ade), Connor Rozee (PA)
F: Eddie Betts (Car), Scott Lycett (PA), Orazio Fantasia (PA)
Fol: Brodie Grundy (Col), Lachie Neale (BL), Jack Redden (WC)
Int: Wayne Milera (Ade), Jack Lukosius (GC), Aaron Francis (Ess), Izak Rankine (GC)


Tasmania are far better suited to face the Queensland but Tassie would probably also lose that game.
Click to expand...
Apart from the fact that you've picked six key forwards in the NSW team, take your point.

In any case, an Allies team would smash SA by 10 goals, so it seems a bit imbalanced.
 
A Brisbane mate of mine (and lifetime rugby league man) put it well: State of Origin exists for rugby but not for AFL because, as kids, we all grow up wanting to pull on the jumper of our favourite club side. Queenslanders generally grow up wanting to pull on the maroon jumper. Don't forget, the Broncos are only about as old as Fremantle.

It also helps enormously that there are only two sides and they are well-matched. The AFL generally has three major footballing states, and of those, one of them is definitely the 900-pound gorilla. There is also the rivalry that exists between the two states outside of rugby. There's no such rivalry between Victoria and South Australia or WA.

State of Origin died in the AFL because people just didn't really care and neither did the players.
 
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GC2015 said:
No Queensland?

The NSW team is considerably better than Tasmania these days. In fact, the current NSW team would likely beat South Australia pretty easily:

New South Wales
B: Dane Rampe (Syd), Dougal Howard (StK), Zac Williams (Car)
HB: Matt Suckling (WB), Phil Davis (GWS), Callum Mills (Syd)
C: Isaac Smith (Gee), Jacob Hopper (GWS), Harry Perryman (GWS)
HF: Nick Blakey (Syd), Taylor Walker (Ade), Harrison Himmelberg (GWS)
F: Luke Breust (Haw), Tom Hawkins (Gee), Josh Bruce (WB)
Fol: Jarrod Witts (GC), Jack Steele (StK), Isaac Heeney (Syd)
IC: Tom Green (GWS), Harry Cunningham (Syd), Jeremy Finlayson (GWS), Michael Gibbons (Car)

South Australia
B: Rory Laird (Haw), Tom Jonas (PA), Shannon Hurn (WC),
HB: Brodie Smith (Ade), Ryan Burton (PA), Caleb Daniel (WB)
C: George Hewett (Syd), Trent Dumont (NM), Jared Polec (NM)
HF: Chad Wingard (Haw), Darcy Fogarty (Ade), Connor Rozee (PA)
F: Eddie Betts (Car), Scott Lycett (PA), Orazio Fantasia (PA)
Fol: Brodie Grundy (Col), Lachie Neale (BL), Jack Redden (WC)
Int: Wayne Milera (Ade), Jack Lukosius (GC), Aaron Francis (Ess), Izak Rankine (GC)


Tasmania are far better suited to face the Queensland but Tassie would probably also lose that game.
Click to expand...
oops

Good work on the teams:thumbsu:
 
Mitchell Madness said:
State leagues have it, just needs to be promoted better.
AFL funding the state leagues would also help native retired players, but let's face it, the AFL is the game, and the rest is fodder to make the executives appear "in sync" with the paying public
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With very few exceptions, Australian's don't watch second tier sport unless the top tier is only rarely available (e.g. RL SoO three games a year, so the top league an audience). Look at the NRL vs QRL, Test vs Shield cricket (even when some Shield teams are higher quality than some Test teams). State games used to be promoted, audiences still dwindled to nothing, because people (mostly) only care about the AFL.

The inter-league games are no different. Add to that state leagues get practically no interest, and the AFL has killed them as compeitions with some clubs not even there for the premiership but operating primarily as reserves for AFL clubs. The VFL isn't a competition at all any more, with aits mix of reserves, clubs acting as reserves, and justa couple of clubs actually there to win things. The SANFL and WAFL haven't been bastardised to the same extreme.
As you say, the non-AFL leagues are allowed to exist purely for benefit of the AFL.
 
Engimal v3 said:
Being an "Allies" supporter sucks. Big part of why SoO won't take off in AFL. Too many fans not in Vic/WA/SA now.
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There has probably never been a stronger 4th team than recently. Maybe Tas could have been if origin existed in the 50s and 60s. NSW, and prior to that Qld, probably would belong in a four team division 1.
I don't think they would beat SA, at least not regularly, but I don't think that Allies would be needed to make some games in the top division competitive.

The clubs don't want to release players, the league makes far more money out of a full round, some players say they want it but would they do so if it was a regular thing, what happens with Qld (a vital "growth" state but not going to draw numbers playing Tas or NT in second division).

I would love it, with real states (and NT). The powerful in the game, and a large portion (maybe a majority now) of fans, do not.
 
iameviljez said:
A Brisbane mate of mine (and lifetime rugby league man) put it well: State of Origin exists for rugby but not for AFL because, as kids, we all grow up wanting to pull on the jumper of our favourite club side. Queenslanders generally grow up wanting to pull on the maroon jumper. Don't forget, the Broncos are only about as old as Fremantle.

It also helps enormously that there are only two sides and they are well-matched. The AFL generally has three major footballing states, and of those, one of them is definitely the 900-pound gorilla. There is also the rivalry that exists between the two states outside of rugby. There's no such rivalry between Victoria and South Australia or WA.

State of Origin died in the AFL because people just didn't really care and neither did the players.
Click to expand...

they entered the comp in 1988, so about as old as the Eagles....one year younger
 
Howard Littlejohn said:
With very few exceptions, Australian's don't watch second tier sport unless the top tier is only rarely available (e.g. RL SoO three games a year, so the top league an audience). Look at the NRL vs QRL, Test vs Shield cricket (even when some Shield teams are higher quality than some Test teams). State games used to be promoted, audiences still dwindled to nothing, because people (mostly) only care about the AFL.
Click to expand...
A great point. State of Origin worked well when there were three separate, strong leagues and so it was the pinnacle of Australian rules.
 
iameviljez said:
A Brisbane mate of mine (and lifetime rugby league man) put it well: State of Origin exists for rugby but not for AFL because, as kids, we all grow up wanting to pull on the jumper of our favourite club side. Queenslanders generally grow up wanting to pull on the maroon jumper. Don't forget, the Broncos are only about as old as Fremantle.

It also helps enormously that there are only two sides and they are well-matched. The AFL generally has three major footballing states, and of those, one of them is definitely the 900-pound gorilla. There is also the rivalry that exists between the two states outside of rugby. There's no such rivalry between Victoria and South Australia or WA.

State of Origin died in the AFL because people just didn't really care and neither did the players.
Click to expand...
The biggest problem in the AFL is that the rivalry was only one sided from either SA or WA. People in Victoria stopped caring. The games between SA and Vic always sold out in Adelaide, just not in Melbourne, especially in the 90's.

Also, the decision to include the Allies was the death knell.

Nowadays, there is a magic to SOO in league that exists, and also existed in South Australia when I was growing up in the 80's and 90's that has been lost, and has probably been gone for too long to ever be recaptured.
 
threenewpadlocks said:
Apart from the fact that you've picked six key forwards in the NSW team, take your point.

In any case, an Allies team would smash SA by 10 goals, so it seems a bit imbalanced.
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Nothing wrong with having tall depth, especially these days. Finlayson spent a decent amount of time in the ruck this year and Himmelberg spent time in the backline so there's versatility to some of these guys. Also, I'm not sure if you noticed but South Australia has very little tall depth and therefore NSW would likely take advantage by selecting taller players. Having said that, Blakey and Bruce don't play like typical talls. I would say they play more like medium forwards and you have your smalls in Bruest and Gibbons.

Kwality said:
Last time I knew their were 44 Qlders in the player pool.
Click to expand...
And? Tasmania has less than 30. Plus, Queensland can put forward a decent state team these days:

Queensland
B: Connor Budarick (GC), Harris Andrews (BL), Aliir Aliir (PA)
HB: Jarrod Harbrow (GC), Rory Thompson (GC), Lachlan Keeffe (GWS)
C: Bailey Scott (NM), Ben Keays (Ade), Jack Bowes (GC)
HF: Charlie Cameron (BL), Charlie Dixon (PA), Josh Thomas (Col)
F: Alex Sexton (GC), Connor Ballenden (BL), Keidean Coleman (BL)
Fol: Mabior Chol (Ric), Dayne Zorko (BL), Lachie Weller (GC)
Int: Archie Smith (BL), Sam Reid (GWS), Jarrod Cameron (WC), Jack Payne (BL),

Tasmania would really struggle to put together a 22 that doesn't require many players to play out of position. Plus they would get smashed by every other state in the country.
 
GC2015 said:
No Queensland?

The NSW team is considerably better than Tasmania these days. In fact, the current NSW team would likely beat South Australia pretty easily:

New South Wales
B: Dane Rampe (Syd), Dougal Howard (StK), Zac Williams (Car)
HB: Matt Suckling (WB), Phil Davis (GWS), Callum Mills (Syd)
C: Isaac Smith (Gee), Jacob Hopper (GWS), Harry Perryman (GWS)
HF: Nick Blakey (Syd), Taylor Walker (Ade), Harrison Himmelberg (GWS)
F: Luke Breust (Haw), Tom Hawkins (Gee), Josh Bruce (WB)
Fol: Jarrod Witts (GC), Jack Steele (StK), Isaac Heeney (Syd)
IC: Tom Green (GWS), Harry Cunningham (Syd), Jeremy Finlayson (GWS), Michael Gibbons (Car)

South Australia
B: Rory Laird (Haw), Tom Jonas (PA), Shannon Hurn (WC),
HB: Brodie Smith (Ade), Ryan Burton (PA), Caleb Daniel (WB)
C: George Hewett (Syd), Trent Dumont (NM), Jared Polec (NM)
HF: Chad Wingard (Haw), Darcy Fogarty (Ade), Connor Rozee (PA)
F: Eddie Betts (Car), Scott Lycett (PA), Orazio Fantasia (PA)
Fol: Brodie Grundy (Col), Lachie Neale (BL), Jack Redden (WC)
Int: Wayne Milera (Ade), Jack Lukosius (GC), Aaron Francis (Ess), Izak Rankine (GC)


Tasmania are far better suited to face the Queensland but Tassie would probably also lose that game.
Click to expand...

Good work on putting these teams together. The "Who would win in a SOO match between NSW and South Australia?" really needs it own thread. I'm guessing NSW would be a warm favourite.

p.s I'd drop Bruce for Gulden!
 

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