Blues politics and stereotypes are wearing thin!

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Originally posted by KOUTAISABIGPOOF:
OOOOOO Carlscum are coming!! How scary.
NOT
Whitnall falling on me NOW that is scary.

Your intelligence overwhelms me. How can we compete with such wit?

You wouldn't be one of the regulars logging in under a pseudonym would you?

Register and make yourself known, hitch up your skirt and fight fair, loser!!!!

 

[The Dutchman!]

CJH

I stand corrected - if those are the stats then it would seem I have fallen victim to the perception is reality syndrome.

Don't get me wrong - I really like Richmond fans and frankly see the Tiges as an explosion just waiting to happen... be good for footy if it did...

Danno:

I've seen a lot of empty seats at Crow park in the second halves of one-sided games... that's all I'm saying.

Eagle_Fan:

I think you know I apprecite more than most the diehard factor does exist with the Eagles - but I think my "proof-coming" prediction will sadly hold true this year - maybe it will be good for the club to wash your hands of these fair weather friends.

Shinner:

Glad to see reason prevail - even after a season when you've had to cop heaps from Bomber fans revelling in it , natural justice still prevails - you still hate the baggers more - excellent call!!! PS. I thik you know I was calling for the roos downfall early last year - reckon they might be ok next year after the pick ups and might get a bigger contribution from quite a few 2000 passengers... eg: Colbert and Cartman...

 

[Bee]

Originally posted by The Old Dark Navy's:
What a relief! I was beginning to think I was in the twilight zone when I couldn't find other Blues supporters.

Keep writing Krystin. good to meet you Bee, Bernie and Sticks I've mentioned before.

I suggest we follow Bluey's advice and email asking for our own board. Restore some balance in the universe.

I am proud to be a Carlton fan, through thick and thin. They have already done enough to deserve my support until the day I die regardless of what the future holds. I will stay away from the most arrogant bragging rights however as I would prefer to be heard and taken seriously by other supporters. After all, we are all in this together and we need each other good and bad otherwise this wouldn't be the greatest game of all!!!

Thank God some other Carlton fans have finally arrived. Not that I minded fending off the insults by myself. Quite fun actually. When I talk about arrogance I am really just trying to stir up the Essendon fans who seem hell bent on always explaining why they deserve the number one accolade. My point is if you are that good you don't need to go into lengthy explainations as to why. Just simply state it proudly and arrogantly.
Anyway, Navy Blue, stick around this should be fun.

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The Blues. The Best in the business.

 

[Shinboners]

Dutchy

Yeah, there's a bit more optimism around Arden Street than what there was back in August. Colbert will be fine with a full pre-season behind him...I don't think he did as badly as most people seem to think. Calthorpe on the other hand....I can't see him forcing his way into a small/medium man role with a queue that now reads Stevens, Simpson, Harvey, King, Pickett, McLaren, Sinclair, Rawlings, Makepeace, Lasscock, S.Motlop, D.Motlop, Smith, Harris, and Olarenshaw. Then there's Sav...a few Carlton mates are dirty that we've picked him up, but what do the Carlton fans on this board think?

As for hating Carlton, it's as natural to me as breathing

[This message has been edited by Shinboners (edited 14 November 2000).]

 

[Bee]

Dan,
When I talk about arrogance I am trying to stir up you bummer fans. But you are wrong if you think arrogance is not an admirable quality. Arrogance when used correctly (which is something you do not know how to do) is an art form. Just take a look at Parliament and the Pollies and see what I mean. Paul Keating was a master at it.
BTW don't call me little girl! I am older than you and a lot bloody wiser too!

Oh yeah, another thing. Even your signature is a sad reflection on how Essendon try so very hard to be just like Carlton! What is that old saying? Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery?

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The Blues. The Best in the business.

[This message has been edited by Bee (edited 14 November 2000).]

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Shinboners. I couldn't care less about Sav. He may have served a purpose for a short time but Carlton have been down that road before. We have turned some "rejects" into premiership players before but more of our established recruits have gone missing in action. Stephen O'Reilly for example.

Who was our pick after Sav went? Blake Campbell? We'll see how many games he plays for us before we regret not getting Rocca. Besides, we have a slight pace deficiency up forward at times. Whitnall's not the quickest player but his skill and reading of the play make him great. Rocca is a good leading mark and strong kick. That's it!!!
Could be a liability at times taking up a place in the 22.

 

[Shinboners]

B-Girl

The art of arrogance comes down to the ability to deliver the one liner that doesn't allow for a one-line comeback. One of the best examples was when a woman admonished Winston Churchill for being drunk, and he replied (something along the lines of), "And you, my lady, are ugly. But at least I'll be sober in the morning".

Arrogance isn't so much about trying to win an argument (which is what Dan24 tries to do), but in ending it. And the best way for any Essendon fan to end any argument (and believe me, I tested this thoroughly through 1997 and 2000

) is to just utter two words....."reigning premiers".

 

[Bee]

Originally posted by Shinboners:
B-Girl

The art of arrogance comes down to the ability to deliver the one liner that doesn't allow for a one-line comeback. One of the best examples was when a woman admonished Winston Churchill for being drunk, and he replied (something along the lines of), "And you, my lady, are ugly. But at least I'll be sober in the morning".

Arrogance isn't so much about trying to win an argument (which is what Dan24 tries to do), but in ending it. And the best way for any Essendon fan to end any argument (and believe me, I tested this thoroughly through 1997 and 2000

) is to just utter two words....."reigning premiers".

Shinners,
I know that quote from Churchill very well. It is a classic example of arrogance. There was also another he used. When a lady told him "Mr Churchill if I was your wife I would poison your coffee." To which Winston replied, "And if I were your husband I would drink it!!"
Shinners, the bombers can utter the words reigning premiers as much as they like but that only lasts for a season. What classic comeback do they have next season?
It's too much fun stirring them up. They can't help themselves they just keep on coming back for more.

 

[Shinboners]

It may only be one year of uttering just two words, but it has ended plenty of arguments for me....as well as ensuring a smug grin on my face. Which reminds me, it's not only what words are chosen, but how they are delivered. To be truly arrogant, you must have a smug confidence in the way you say things. That's what made Paul Keating sound so much in control while making Alexander Downer and John Hewson sound so, well, whiny and lacking in confidence (although in Alex's case, he probably really is whiny and lacking in confidence....that accent doesn't help either).

If anything, Dan24 is more like Steve Bracks than Paul Keating. If he has to make one simple point, he'll say it in three different ways.

It must be something in the water over on that side of town

 

[Westy Boy]

OI!!!... keep Werribee and the rest of the Western Suburbs seperate Shinners!!

 

[Bee]

Originally posted by Shinboners:
It may only be one year of uttering just two words, but it has ended plenty of arguments for me....as well as ensuring a smug grin on my face. Which reminds me, it's not only what words are chosen, but how they are delivered. To be truly arrogant, you must have a smug confidence in the way you say things. That's what made Paul Keating sound so much in control while making Alexander Downer and John Hewson sound so, well, whiny and lacking in confidence (although in Alex's case, he probably really is whiny and lacking in confidence....that accent doesn't help either).

If anything, Dan24 is more like Steve Bracks than Paul Keating. If he has to make one simple point, he'll say it in three different ways.

It must be something in the water over on that side of town

Shinners. We may never totally agree on football but at least I can agree with you on politics. Keating was and still is an absolute master with the one line put down.
If nothing else I loved to watch him on the attack in parliament. John Howard is a classic example of how NOT to do it!
I know what you mean about Dan. That's why I like to keep biting at him. He always has a bag of reasons ready to throw back. Not just one, but a whole bloody bag.

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

I don't know Shinboners. "Reigning Premier" doesn't stop me in my tracks. Every team has a sore point. If we were all put out by that retort, there would only be one team represented here every year. Where's the fun in that?

No, the other 15 teams in any given year just have to have a thick hide and keep niggling away at the reigning premiers. But it is open slather on each other!!!!

 

[Shinboners]

Bee

Maybe we should get together and write a book on the great one-liners of Australian politics.

I hated Keating, but I do miss his presence in parliament....and there's hardly been a good one-liner since he's left.

ODN's

It's a true point, but you'd be amazed at the number of people who do get stopped in their tracks. But a lot does depend on delivery.

Westy Boy

If only we could find out where the D-meister lived, we could quarantine his address from being a part of the Western suburbs

By the way, if you go to the official North website (www.kangaroosfc.com.au) and go to the forum, the Bulldogs have come up as part of one of the threads. There's plenty of respect for the Dogs, but one tosser reckons that no more than 3 Doggies would make it into the North side....needless to say, some of the more clued up North fans have been setting him straight.

[This message has been edited by Shinboners (edited 14 November 2000).]

 

[Bee]

Shinners
Paul Keating would be a little like John Elliott then? You can't stand him but you'd miss his presence.

Elliott is also one good with the arrogant put down. Think of this showdown. Elliott, Keating and Whitlam!
But enoough about politics.


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The Blues. The Best in the business.

 

[Gonzo]

Westy

We'll take Libba and Jose as tackle bags!

Cheers

Gonzo

 

[Dan26]

Bee,

How can you bring up Paul Keating ? Yes, he was arrogant, but this wasn't admirable. As Don Bradman said: "Arrogance is tolerated, but never admired"

Anyway, sport is different. Sport is about giving respect to your opponent and all that crap.

You, little girl, seem to be the one who keeps coming back for more. You seem awfully jealous that another club now holds the premiership record. And yes, Bee we DO hold the record. 16 flags in 102 seasons is BETTER than 16 in 104 seasons. We have won our 16 in 2 less years than you. Ha ha ha ha

If that doesn't settle the argument, nothing will. We have more supporters, a better premiership strike rate, a better recent history, we play at the two best stadiums in Australia (not a dump like Optus Oval, which aritifically increases their win-loss record, yet they still can't match Essendon !) AND we are the reigning premiers.

Carlton are nothing but filth, who "claim" arrogance to make them feel good. Keep saying you are arrogant. If that makes you feel better and make you feel like a "big" girl, then keep it up.

I'll just keep pointing to the scoreboard.

Oh, and I don't have a signature. I just added it in, on my last post. Carlton want to be like Essendon, but they fail on every level. Name one thing that Carlton has above Essendon at the moment ? Nothing.

Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha

[This message has been edited by Dan24 (edited 14 November 2000).]

 

[Bee]

Dan,
You have justified every thing I have said about you. You try too hard! Give up.
Did my little dig at you about Essendon wanting to be like Carlton hit a raw nerve?
And don't call me little girl! I said it before and I'll say it again. I am older and wiser than you, boyo!
Hold the record, my bum. You don't hold the record. God, you are such a try hard.

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The Blues. The Best in the business.

 

[Dan26]

If there is a decision about being the most arrogant, OR being the best, I'll take the "best".

If we are the most successful club (which we are), and in ADDITION, we remain less hated, then that is a bonus. I don't really care how the rest of the competiton feels. As long as Carlton hate us, due to jealousy of our superiority, then that is fine.
They are so jealous, as we can all see by Bee's statements. She hates the fact that Essendon are premiers. Hates it Say it, Bee. Say it nice and slow...... ESSENDON ARE PREMIERS. You can't bring yourself to utter those words can you? Ha ha ha ha. Get used to it, sweetheart, because those words are reality and will be reality again in 2001.

That's the situation we find ourselves in at the moment, since Essendon are undisputeldy, the BEST on and off the field. That is a fact. It cannot be argued by Carlton scum. It's cold, hard fact.

And in addition to being inferior, Carlton ALSO have the indignity of changing their jumper to sell-out, so that they looked like an M&M; Their president is a criminal; they have an unmarketable nickname (the Blues - ughh - don't make me laugh); and they are well known for celebrating preliminary final victories.

At Carlton, a preliminary final win is a premiership. At Essendon, a Grand Final win is a premiership. That prety much sums it up, really.

It must aggravate Calton, that we have both had prelimianry final victories over each other in the last two years. But, in that time, Essendon has won "2 McClelland tropys -top spot", "one day premiership" and an "Ansett Cup premiership."

Carlton has won sweet F.A.

 

[Dan26]

Originally posted by Bee:
Dan,
You have justified every thing I have said about you. You try too hard! Give up.
Did my little dig at you about Essendon wanting to be like Carlton hit a raw nerve?
And don't call me little girl! I said it before and I'll say it again. I am older and wiser than you, boyo!
Hold the record, my bum. You don't hold the record. God, you are such a try hard.

Sounds like I'm the one who his your raw nerve. Why would anyone - let alone Essendon who has it all - want to be like Carlton ? Don't make me puke.

I've stated Carlton's deficiency's above. Essendon doesn't have any deficiency's. We are the greatest.

A measure of how great we are, was that when Carlton beat us in 1999, they treated it like a Grand Final. Beating Essendon, meant more to them that wining the premiership. It's true. Admit it Bee. It meant more to you, than winning the flag. If you deny it, you're a liar.

Look at how their suporterts were acting. They cared more about Essendon losing, than they did about winning themsleves. That's pathetic. At Carlton, the fact that Essendon lost was more important than Carlton winning.

I found this so amusing, because it shows how much they hate Essendon. Essendon occupied more of their thought patterns than their own club !

In 2000, we played Carlton in a preliminary final, but we didn't care so much about Carlton losing. We cared about US winning. It was important for Essendon supporters to win, for US. Carlton was a stepping stone for us to win the premiership.

That's all Carlton are to Essendon - a stepping stone.

From Carlton's point of view, it's sooooooo diferent. Essendon is the club they love to beat, and they care more about Essendon losing than their own club winning, which is sad and pathetic. I'm glad Essendon suporters aren't like that.

Carlton are Essendon "wanna-be's"


[This message has been edited by Dan24 (edited 14 November 2000).]

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Dan you have been lauding your arrogance for days now, then you turn around and say you were baiting us. Now you criticise a Blues fan for being arrogant. You can't have it all ways. You change your personality on a daily basis. Fair Dinkum...is Dan24 a club, not a person, with many people of differing opinions?

1) Carlton have never finished last. Essendon have. We score in that area. You wanted 1, I gave you 1.

2) Optus oval is an asset. Ask the AFL!!! We are not at the mercy of the Colonial trust. Having said that, was Essendon's win/loss ratio, not to mention premiership tally artificially inflated by having the MCG as a home ground??

3) Carlton were strong enough to continue flying the flag since the VFL's inception. Seems to me that your history isn't quite as rich as ours now is it. We have been in the VFL more than you. Therefore our history and tradition is superior. You can't have it both ways.

4) Essendon actually won a premiership without playing a grand final. We have won more Grand Finals than you. If you can clutch at straws, so can we.

5) Why would we be jealous of a team we are so morally opposed to. Hatred doesn't always equate to jealousy you know.

What line were you using before this year when the tally was 16-15? For all your confidence and bragging you have only had reson on odd occasions that you have drawn level. Carlton have been leading or equal in the premiership tally since 1981.

We do have some things to be proud about in our own right. Have we only wanted to be like you since this year's GF??? Or before that did we secretly wish we had only won the second most premierships.

Stupid, stupid statement, baiting or otherwise. And you are generalising again!!!

 

[Dan26]

Originally posted by The Old Dark Navy's:


1) Carlton have never finished last. Essendon have. We score in that area. You wanted 1, I gave you 1.

2) Optus oval is an asset. Ask the AFL!!! We are not at the mercy of the Colonial trust. Having said that, was Essendon's win/loss ratio, not to mention premiership tally artificially inflated by having the MCG as a home ground??

3) Carlton were strong enough to continue flying the flag since the VFL's inception. Seems to me that your history isn't quite as rich as ours now is it. We have been in the VFL more than you. Therefore our history and tradition is superior. You can't have it both ways.

4) Essendon actually won a premiership without playing a grand final. We have won more Grand Finals than you. If you can clutch at straws, so can we.

5) Why would we be jealous of a team we are so morally opposed to. Hatred doesn't always equate to jealousy you know.

1.) In the first 6 years of the league (1897-1902 inclusive), the only thing preventing Carlton from winning 6 wooden spoons in a row was the complete incompetence of St.Kilda. The Saints lost their first 48 games and were at a level of "crapness" all of their own. Carlton always finished second last, ahead of the incomparable Saints. You can thank your lucky stars that St,Kilda was in the comp, to save Carlton embarassment in the early years.

2.) Optus Oval. Don't make me laugh. You own it, eh ! So what ? If you think playing at Optus Oval is better than playing at the MCG and Colonial - the two best footy stadiums in the country - then thats very, VERY strange. You should be a Colonial or MCG club. Optus Oval is a crap ground, with limited capacity and it is OLD. The fact that you own it, doesn't sem to enhance your financial situation with the ENORMOUS debt on the legends stand. We are about to announce a profit of 1.2 million. We have gone ahead in leaps and bounds since leaving Windy Hill. Carlton should leave that hole, known as Optus Oval. Go to a better ground.

3.) You have only been in the comp longer because our players fougt in the WAR in 1916-17. If fighting in the war is dishonourable, than that is your opinion. If you're happy that Carklton kept playing while the other clubs were serving their country, then that is sad.

4.) Whether we won a premeirship with an actual Grand Final or not is irrelevant. A premiership is a premiership. The system used to decide that premiership is irrelevant since the premiership will be the premiership.

5.)Well obviously Carlton ARE jealous of Essendon, as their pathetic supporters showed after 1999. Fancy supporters caring more about Essendon losing than their own club winning. It shows how much Esendon plays on the Catlon consciousness. It's true. That kind of attitude sickened me. It's absolutely pathetic. Carlton would rather see Essendon lose than their own club win.

[This message has been edited by Dan24 (edited 14 November 2000).]

 

[The Old Dark Navy's]

Dan, did I say that fighting in wars dishonourable? Carlton also have had players fight and die in wars. Don't twist that one around. We were able to still field a side that's all.

You claim that Essendon don't give a crap about Carlton. Carlton has had great rivalries with Essendon, Collingwood and Richmond for decades now. History will record that as being a fact. No doubt, Essendon have just appointed you their official spokesperson just in time for you to refute history.

As rivals, we are obviously quite pleased to defeat you. It has special significance regardless of where you are on the ladder or premiership tally. This is why Carlton/Collingwood matches still get billed as blockbusters. Rivalry!!! Do we fear Collingwood? No! Do we want to be like them? NO!

As for Optus. Yes we owe money on the legends stand. So what! When the government has a new highway or bridge built, do they pay for it outright? They put tolls on the road for twenty or thirty years until the road users pay for it. Same principle applies here.

Would you suggest that, somebody that owns their own modest house but is paying off the extensions is in a worse position financially than someone who is lodging in somebody else's mansion. Appearances can be deceiving.


You say we should play at a great stadium like the G or Colonial but you posted earlier that Optus inflated our win/loss ratio. Sorry, but I think it's better to win games than look good.

Is all this sinking in yet or will you just change tack again? Get one of the 'other' Dan's to answer this.

 

[Dan26]

Well your precious Optus Oval didnlt inflate your win-loss ratio this year to within a bull's raor of Essendon. Despite not having a home-ground advantage, we still went 24-1.......seven more wins than the Carlton side who had a home ground advantage.

I still think you should be playing at the MCG, or Colonial. It is far more "appropriate" for the Blues to be playing at a major stadium. After all, the Blues consider themselves a "major" club, right ? So, why do they play at a sub-par stadium by AFL standards ? Get out of that hole of a ground.

You're right. Carlton's rivalry with Essendon holds special significance. But for some reason, those Carlton fans still want Essendon to lose more than they want their own club to win. That is sad in my opinion. Most Carlton supporters shouldn't even be called Carlton supporters. They should be called "Essendon haters".

You're one of the better carlton supporters. Most are so ignorant and dismissive of the opposition, that it makes me wanna puke. I'm glad we are the greatest club, so that they have to look up at us.

Carlton supporters, generally find it very hard to accept that another club DARE beat their premiership record as Essendon has.

I'm not having a go at you, because you seem reasonably intelligent.....for a Carlton fan *smile*

 

[Michele]

Dan24,

In your posts to ODNB, you stated that Carlton supporters cared more about Essendon losing than their own club winning.

WRONG! Essendon supporters thought that they only had to turn up for the 1999 Grand Final day and the Premiership was theirs for the taking. Hence many Essendon supporters were lining up for tickets 3 weeks before the GF. Essendon didn't make it past the prelims. and the supporters (with the dumbstruck look "this was not preordained - what happened to the Premiership) had to pack up and go home. That's arrogance and stupidity rolled into one. Not optimism but sheer arrogance. Counting chickens before they hatch.

One other small point, something about ..."despite not having home ground..Ess won 24-1.." I know Essendon are greedy but how many HOME grounds does it need. Other teams have one home ground but Essendon have two. Colonial for the corporate sector and the interstate teams - MCG for something loosely called a draw, but in reality it is a fixture - for the BIG clashes/rivalries/cups/plaques/derbies/trophies/scarves/Pascalls and anything else Sheedy can get his hands on.

Dan, just one more query, Essendon had a good year - how much do you believe luck and lack of injuries helped Essendon's cause?

Michele

 

[Hawkforce.]

Dan, your backflips are so adroit... are you a member of Circus Oz?