No Oppo Supporters CAS hands down guilty verdict - Players appealing - Dank shot - no opposition - (cont in pt.2)

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Vajayjay said:
I don't know if you're joking or not - but I actually agree with this 100%.

Look at Singapore for an example of this concept working well.
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...and not one bit of chewing gum on the footpaths...now that is leadership.
 

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ManWithNoName said:
We're all angry but angry about different things, which isn't helping.
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I know, but when silly things like taking over the club get spoken about, images like that pop into my head.

We are not qualified to run a football club. I can barely run my department at my work!! Bunch of out of control sailors running around.... Actually, footy club might be easier!!
 
Shane Hird said:
...and not one bit of chewing gum on the footpaths...now that is leadership.
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Hey, make fun all you like of it, but they've gone from a fishing village to a global financial centre in 40 years...

Sure - their obsession with rules is hard for us to fathom, but looking at the bigger picture, it is a sterling example of a genuine benevolent dictatorship.
 
James Hird! I'll back him the whole way! Discuss Caro innuendo all you like. You, who flip and turn, are fuelling her and others. Yuk.

JAMES HIRD! UNCOMPROMISED. Principle centered approach. I admire that. Go Hirdy!!!
 
bomberz20_72 said:
I know, but when silly things like taking over the club get spoken about, images like that pop into my head.

We are not qualified to run a football club. I can barely run my department at my work!! Bunch of out of control sailors running around.... Actually, footy club might be easier!!
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Sailors,did you say you know where sailors hang out?

(Sorry it's a quote from a game i love called Shenmue couldn't help myself)
 
ManWithNoName said:
We're all angry but angry about different things, which isn't helping.
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This, right here in a nutshell, is why total popular democracy doesn't work.

I don't agree with totalitarian dictatorship either, but for mine, I think Jade and ManWithNoName are spot on with the observation about the member argument. You can have too little consultation, but you can also have too much.
 

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OK, but IF you look at this from another angle.

Before things 'kicked off' on Wednesday.. was there this much angst? Were we at each others throats this much? Was the club burning down around us?

It appeared that most people (not all) had come to peace with the following:
Players should defend SCN
Club and Hird shouldn't appeal
If the Club and Hird appeal it shouldn't hold up the players defence
We want this over
Hird should/is coming back as Coach
Bomber should be given ANY position he wants, OTHER than the Senior Coaching job to stay at the club
Clear the players name and rebuild the club

Again, I'm not saying everyone was happy and I'm not saying everyone agreed and I'm not saying people weren't angry.. but there was a level or degree of 'certaintity' about our position and where we were going.

Fast forward three days (just three) and you have:
Players should defend SCN
Club isn't appealing
Hird is appealing but it shouldn't hold up the players defence
We want this over
Hird is going to be sacked on Monday maybe
Bomber should be coach/shouldn't be coach/shouldn't leave the country/should be knighted
We need a fresh start
This will never end
The club is dividing
We should have members in charge of the club
Hird has to go
We can't lose Bomber
Hird not coming to B+F
Members embarrassed to be part of the EFC
Petitions and counter-petitions about the Board's removal
Uncertainty about the coaching position which affects the re-signing of Fletcher, perhaps Winders and others
In-fighting, factions, anger, rebellion
Players divided, approaching board members
Clear the players names, sack Hird or maybe not, hire Thompson or maybe not, win appeal or maybe not, sack the Board, call for a spill, I won't renew my membership etc etc...

So you may not have 'liked' things on Wednesday morning.. but far out it felt a lot better than it does now. Every time the Board makes a **** up like this.. it just brings down a wave of media and attention that we don't need. Time for a serious rethink about how we do things.

This much destruction in three days and all because ONE man took up his LEGAL right to appeal a decision made by a judge. That's it. He didn't commit a crime, he didn't go on a media roadshow, he didn't start a rally, he didn't decimate our list, he didn't have a player walk out... nope. He calmly, rationally and logically followed the advice of TWO highly trusted legal teams and appealed a contentious decision.

So I would ask: Is it the appeal that caused the mayhem or is it the Board's actions that caused this cluster****?

It seems like we can't get out of our way at the moment and seem intent on destroying ourselves from the inside. I wish calmer heads had prevailed.
 
Both the appeal and the board's actions caused the recent cluster****, rines.

I don't think many here would claim they're happy with the board's handling of the issue on Wednesday and Thursday.

But making it that easy for members to control the goings on inside the football department is not the answer. You'd have chaos regularly. Like the last couple of days, but regularly.
 
Doss said:
Both the appeal and the board's actions caused the recent cluster****, rines.

I don't think many here would claim they're happy with the board's handling of the issue on Wednesday and Thursday.

But making it that easy for members to control the goings on inside the football department is not the answer. You'd have chaos regularly. Like the last couple of days, but regularly.
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I guess we have differing views on how representation works and how democratic process works.

Needless to say.. right now.. our club is being run by a bunch of clowns who have sent us on a one way ticket to oblivion.

Our actions over the last 16 months deserve the AFL worst penalties for 'governance failings'... far far far more than a safe, legal and DR approved supplement program ever did...
 
rines said:
was there this much angst? Were we at each others throats this much? Was the club burning down around us?

Club and Hird shouldn't appeal
If the Club and Hird appeal it shouldn't hold up the players defence
Hird should/is coming back as Coach
Bomber should be given ANY position he wants, OTHER than the Senior Coaching job to stay at the club
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It seems clear to me that a few things transpired to lead to Wednesday.

Most importantly was that Hird wanted to appeal and the club did not. From there on it was always going to be basically impossible for Hird to remain as coach, while appealing the decision. At that point the club did not know how long an appeal would last and still do not know for certain. Another thing that is not 100% certain is ASADA holding off the SCN until Hird's court action is finished. Have ASADA actually let anyone know what will happen here?

Add to that Bomber probably being offered the position of coach of the Suns and the club not wanting to have both Hird and Bomber out of the picture.

I know there is a lot of angst against the Board, but they have been put in a position that is basically unworkable. They are not solely responsible for the situation we are in right now. Hird and Thompson are equally as responsible.
 
rines said:
I guess we have differing views on how representation works and how democratic process works.

Needless to say.. right now.. our club is being run by a bunch of clowns who have sent us on a one way ticket to oblivion.
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Not any different to what happens in politics. Once an election is over the gotd can do whatever they feel (with the limits of the constitution etc etc). It's not a perfect system but its the best we've come up with so far.
 
Maybe it's age that has helped (or it could be the bottle I've cracked), but I've realised that people can have differing opinions without meaning they are complete morons. It doesn't mean they are stupid, disloyal, pig headed etc etc, it just means they have a different opinion.

It's not rocket surgery.
 
I know there is a lot of angst against the Board, but they have been put in a position that is basically unworkable. They are not solely responsible for the situation we are in right now. Hird and Thompson are equally as responsible.
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The board should start putting the interest of the club first, and the others last. But this board has continued to bow to the AFL and media pressure, so nothing will change. The board has failed the club, and is a major reason we are still discussing this subject. The board does not deserve any sympathy. If its too tough for them, well they can move on and get replaced with people with integrity and the balls to stand up to the bullies.
 
Doss said:
This, right here in a nutshell, is why total popular democracy doesn't work.

I don't agree with totalitarian dictatorship either, but for mine, I think Jade and ManWithNoName are spot on with the observation about the member argument. You can have too little consultation, but you can also have too much.
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Agree with this - need to find some middle ground and the right balance
 
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