Coach Craig McRae

[Stripes B and W]

Does that matter?

I thought it was good. Honest response that pointed out we got unlucky, but also that we do get lucky at the G quite often. Let the carry on merchants carry on.

I find the fashion of pretending that umpiring luck doesn't impact games to be ridiculous. Five 50/50 calls in your favour has the same impact as 5 contested marks from Darcy Cameron - and Darcy's 5 big clunks had a really big impact on that game.

Just like the , ' swings and roundabouts, they all balance out '. They might over a trillion games, not for the 100 minutes of one game, not for the 25 games in a season. You can get lucky with decisions and it helps you win, just as the opposite applies. Saying it has no impact is akin to belief in Santa, its comforting to think umpiring doesn't impact but a sliver of thought tells you otherwise. Only way around it is to remove that particular variable and win by plenty. We have not been good at that for a while.

 

[Anzacday]

I am pretty confident something is going on with the umpires and their ear pieces.

They talk to each other which makes the DM deliberate even more confusing.
You often hear an umpire say pay it pay it and the controlling umpire pays deliberate.
I can only assume the same applies and the non controlling who signalled a throw in was saying throw it in.

 

[Anzacday]

St kilda game was awesome too. Probably one of the most blatant displays of umpire bias I can remember over an entire game

Agree totally, we got shafted big time.

 

[JoinDate]

Do the Scott brothers get fined when they talk about the umpiring, which seems to be every second week?

 

[Mollythedolly]

Using fresh legs in a season defining game isnt leaving it all out there. We have seen what Richards is capable of with his leg speed in creating and tackling.

Yep, understand what Richards has shown himself capable of, but the player identified to be subbed off was Frampton. Given Swans had the ball in their forward half for much of the final quarter, who becomes more important, Frampton as a minder for McLean or Amartey or even McDonald who seemed to drift in there, or Richards with his fresh legs? Richards being subbed late made 3/5s of SFA difference I believe. He’s very lucky to have even been selected. His last game against Hawthorn was ordinary and saw him dropped, and he’s done nothing to justify selection since. Even so, people are suggesting that in his 9th senior game that he’d have been the difference… go figure.

 

[Mollythedolly]

No one gets better in their job without feedback or opinions/views. No one is immune from making mistakes. No one's criticising his coaching as a whole, certain decisions are allowed to be dissected.

I'm sure you've been down on players at times for their output/performance. No different here

He is an amazing coach. Person. All that in spades. Pointing out we gave a player 44 seconds of game time isnt criticising ,its asking why? What is the benefit of that , why not 5 minutes earlier, why not half a quarter earlier

Objective criticism is always welcome, but what we’re reading on these boards is anything but that.

For starters, the premise that he made a mistake is nothing but hypothetical conjecture yet people are stating it as fact. He could have subbed Richards at 3/4 time and we could have lost by 20pts, or we may have won by a point. Nobody knows but if that’s your starting point then what you’re suggesting is criticism is nothing more than venting.

 

[black is White]

Macrae complaining about an umpiring decision was a big mistake.

Watch us get less free's the rest of 2024.

That would fall under corruption

 

[76woodenspooners]

McRae was frustrated and let his emotions get the best of him. I can’t recall him ever criticising the umpires in the past.

For me, that’s that most curious part of this episode.

It’s entirely normal for us supporters to howl at the moon when something goes wrong.

But not Fly. Friday night it looked like things are now getting to him in a way we haven’t seen before. IMO that’s not good.

Other coaches like Chris Scott seem to do it quite regularly.

Not for a while, and the AFL may very well have put out a directive “Let’s not do things that way any more”.

 

[NMBB]

.......Not for a while, and the AFL may very well have put out a directive “Let’s not do things that way any more".

Because we cannot tolerate any public criticism. No-one must rock the boat. It would be intolerable if the betting companies became nervous about the way the game is administered.

 

[JLC]

For me, that’s that most curious part of this episode.

It’s entirely normal for us supporters to howl at the moon when something goes wrong.

But not Fly. Friday night it looked like things are now getting to him in a way we haven’t seen before. IMO that’s not good.



Not for a while, and the AFL may very well have put out a directive “Let’s not do things that way any more”.

Geelong have not lost for close to a month? Let's wait until they lose a game.

Any clarification from the AFL on any decisions from Friday night? Or are the AFL playing the let's pretend it never happened game.

 

[76woodenspooners]

I’m not having a go at you here specifically 76 - but I find this type of comment really frustrating.

Sydney did all of this stuff, and then some more - hence the reason they were so far behind in the first place. A perfect game doesn’t exist. And when there are so many decisions that help the comeback - including chaining the ball half the field for the winning goal - it is always going to leave a sour taste in people’s mouths. People absolutely have a right to be upset about it, and it’s not the first time it’s happened to us this year.

There are a bunch of reasons why people are banging on about the umpiring.

(1) Historically people have always banged on about the umpires. They used to be referred to as “maggots” when they were all dressed in white.

(2) The rules have changed and the game is in transition. The rules needed to change for the survival of the game (concussion class actions). The competition is still trying to adjust which means (1) AFL changing the rules (2) The umpires adapting to the new rules to enforce them. (3) Clubs adapting to the rules to exploit them to win games of footy (4) Us punters in the stands trying to follow what’s going on.

(3) People are talking about it in the media. If people just stuck to the script of “It’s a very difficult game to umpire, but over the course of 120 minutes it all balances out. Umpires don’t decide games” then we wouldn’t be banging on about it. Trust me, if Fly had made some random comment about how the texture of the footy wasn’t quite right, we’d all be banging on about the texture of the footy and how it’s so unfair.

Pretending there is no issue is exactly why the state of umpiring is as diabolical as it is.

Everybody is aware there is an issue.

People were complaining about the umpiring earlier in the year. The AFL listened. They changed the rules interpretation mid-season in response to the commentary.

Did that satisfy anybody?

No. People are complaining even more about changing the rules interpretation mid-season.

What’s the AFL to do?

And if anyone thinks McRae is absolving his players of any blame behind closed doors, then I have a bridge to sell them.

Agree

He got asked a question about the game, and he answered it. Rather accurately I would have thought.

He could have simply shut the question down (again, rather accurately) with “The umpiring didn’t decide the game. There were line ball calls that went both ways right throughout the game”.

 

[76woodenspooners]

Because we cannot tolerate any public criticism.

As long as there are teams that lose games of footy there will always be public criticism.

Us punters and the media already do a great job of that, and always will. We don’t need the clubs to fan the flames.

 

[76woodenspooners]

Any clarification from the AFL on any decisions from Friday night? Or are the AFL playing the let's pretend it never happened game.

The AFL stopped the Monday morning explanations a while ago.

From time to time the AFL do experiment with putting out commentary of the weekend umpiring - but each time they do it they find it doesn’t help - it draws people’s attention to the umpiring and makes them complain about it even more.

 

[JLC]

The AFL stopped the Monday morning explanations a while ago.

From time to time the AFL do experiment with putting out commentary of the weekend umpiring - but each time they do it the find it doesn’t help - it draws people’s attention to the umpiring and makes them complain about it even more.

Ok makes sense.

Perhaps our sport is not at that stage yet.

Baseball have umpire data available an umpires accuracy on the strike zone.

The EPL have discussions and analyse decisions with former officials and players.

In terms of making life easier for the umpires - the amount of subjective decisions need to be reduced - I would

- scrap the out of bounds rule. They have completely bastardized that rule from when it was first brought in. May as well make it last touch, opposition free kick.

- scrap the rushed behind rule. Given the amount of close games, teams don't really want to score for the opposition.

 

[JLC]

And how can a player be over 6m over the mark without punishment? 6m is a huge distance.

It's either the umpire doesn't know the rules or cheated.

 

[jathanas]

And how can a player be over 6m over the mark without punishment? 6m is a huge distance.

It's either the umpire doesn't know the rules or cheated.

It was a clear infringement but not the reason Sydney won.

Umpiring often sh*ts me, but that's on the AFL creating a ruleset that is too open to interpretation.

A rare slip by Fly; not because he was wrong, but because he has to be better than that during interviews.

He's a competitive man and missing out on finals upset him.

 

[Chronz]

And how can a player be over 6m over the mark without punishment? 6m is a huge distance.

It's either the umpire doesn't know the rules or cheated.

It's an AFL scump. Severe incompetence is the first of many issues the maggots have.

 

[Vicky Park]

It was a clear infringement but not the reason Sydney won.

Umpiring often sh*ts me, but that's on the AFL creating a ruleset that is too open to interpretation.

A rare slip by Fly; not because he was wrong, but because he has to be better than that during interviews.

He's a competitive man and missing out on finals upset him.

Fly was emotional after the game. If he was feeling only a fraction of the frustration that was evident on here - the dummy spits! The melts! - then his slip-up is understandable.

He’s been very good with the media, and with controlling his emotions in public. But he’s only human. Can be forgiven for this one.

 

[unplugged]

One thing I will say... The AFL needs a remote "third umpire" (or in this case 5th umpire) involved.

They could do just about every game each week, with maybe one double-up meaning you'd need a second person.

Hell it could be the umpires boss himself.

Just be in their ear saying pay the 50, pay this, don't pay that.

Have the best umpire doing it that can no longer run around and do a game. Say a Razor Ray, he could be lost to the game now he has retired. A job like this could work for someone like him?

Take the emotion out of being at the game in the situation. Just call the shots.

 

[Cousin of Daicos]

Yep, understand what Richards has shown himself capable of, but the player identified to be subbed off was Frampton. Given Swans had the ball in their forward half for much of the final quarter, who becomes more important, Frampton as a minder for McLean or Amartey or even McDonald who seemed to drift in there, or Richards with his fresh legs? Richards being subbed late made 3/5s of SFA difference I believe. He’s very lucky to have even been selected. His last game against Hawthorn was ordinary and saw him dropped, and he’s done nothing to justify selection since. Even so, people are suggesting that in his 9th senior game that he’d have been the difference… go figure.

No one is suggesting he'd be the difference between winning or losing. At least not definitively.

But he's a small forward. We had a small forward who was having an absolute mare so we could have done a simple straight swap. He can't have done any worse than Schultz who didn't impact the scoreboard and had a hand in at least 2 Sydney goals.

Also, "Richards being subbed late made 3/5s of SFA difference I believe". Uh...ok? I'm sorry but were you expecting Richards to gain 30 possessions and kick 6 goals in the 47 seconds he was on? Also, are you seriously knocking him for playing badly against Hawthorn?

By that logic we should have dropped basically the entire side. News flash, almost everyone played badly against Hawthorn.

Frampton being subbed off was stupid.

Sydney's talls were absolutely blanketed by Moore and Frampton and kicked 2 goals for the night. That's it. One of those goals was their ruckman and the other was McDonald who spent most of the night down back.

Would subbing Richards on in the third quarter (or earlier in the last) have won us the game? We'll never know. But he couldn't have done any worse than Schultz who played arguably his worst game since coming to the club. Given we had a small forward as the sub, seems pretty logical to swap like for like.

 

[Mollythedolly]

No one is suggesting he'd be the difference between winning or losing. At least not definitively.

But he's a small forward. We had a small forward who was having an absolute mare so we could have done a simple straight swap. He can't have done any worse than Schultz who didn't impact the scoreboard and had a hand in at least 2 Sydney goals.

Also, "Richards being subbed late made 3/5s of SFA difference I believe". Uh...ok? I'm sorry but were you expecting Richards to gain 30 possessions and kick 6 goals in the 47 seconds he was on? Also, are you seriously knocking him for playing badly against Hawthorn?

By that logic we should have dropped basically the entire side. News flash, almost everyone played badly against Hawthorn.

Frampton being subbed off was stupid.

Sydney's talls were absolutely blanketed by Moore and Frampton and kicked 2 goals for the night. That's it. One of those goals was their ruckman and the other was McDonald who spent most of the night down back.

Would subbing Richards on in the third quarter (or earlier in the last) have won us the game? We'll never know. But he couldn't have done any worse than Schultz who played arguably his worst game since coming to the club. Given we had a small forward as the sub, seems pretty logical to swap like for like.

Again, your opinion that Schultz was having a “mare”. I thought he was good. Got run down from behind and missed a set shot, neither of which constitutes a bad game. Your emotions have made you irrational.

 

[domus]

For me, that’s that most curious part of this episode.

It’s entirely normal for us supporters to howl at the moon when something goes wrong.

But not Fly. Friday night it looked like things are now getting to him in a way we haven’t seen before. IMO that’s not good.



Not for a while, and the AFL may very well have put out a directive “Let’s not do things that way any more”.

I loved it. Fly was hurt and angry and showed a bit of emotion. He was upset for his boys who have worked hard to get us back into final's contention. Plenty of coaches have carried on far worse. And Longmire is an arrogant smartarse. His foul mouthed mutterings are always hidden by his hand. His comments on our home ground advantage were also inaccurate but he thinks he hit a home run being the moron he is.

 

[sr36]

Again, your opinion that Schultz was having a “mare”. I thought he was good. Got run down from behind and missed a set shot, neither of which constitutes a bad game. Your emotions have made you irrational.

Yeah it looked like a standard game but with a couple of quite common execution errors, but players don't get subbed for execution errors.

 

[76woodenspooners]

I loved it. Fly was hurt and angry and showed a bit of emotion. …

I get it, it’s theatre, us fans are hurting and we want everybody else to share our pain.

But how does it make us better? It doesn’t. IMO it’s best that the senior coach keep their emotions out of it and focus on plotting the opposition’s downfall.

 

[sam_e]

I get it, it’s theatre, us fans are hurting and we want everybody else to share our pain.

But how does it make us better? It doesn’t. IMO it’s best that the senior coach keep their emotions out of it and focus on plotting the opposition’s downfall.

he was asked directly if he thought it was a 50m penalty. he answered the question and said he thought it was!

the only issue i have is that he then qualified his response by saying "..if it was at the MCG it likely would have been paid".

IMO this weakened his response /position, created a distraction or point of equivalence for the media, Longmire and afl HQ to run with.

the player encroached over the mark by 6.6m and then did not retreat. it was a 50m penalty every day of the week (incl Sundays, supposedly a day of 'rest'), every footy venue across the country and would have been paid as such by amateur umpires down at the Manangatang 3rds .. no qualification or distraction required.