Draft Expert Davo-27's 2022 u18 Draft Thread

[GUMBLETRON]

It

It'll continue as long as we have the amount of stoppages we do. Mathews touched on this himself I seem to recall. As long as the game keeps being altered to cause more stoppages, we have to have bigger bodies around the stoppages. Most don't realise but once "prior opportunity" came in, stoppages just kept growing. Simply because every second tackle now sees a resultant ball up stoppage through a no prior call. Its endemic. So many rules and changes have flowed from this single biggest screw up to try and address the increases in stoppages and resultant congestion. Now we also know it's affecting the actual range of Aussie kids and consequently numbers in total the game caters towards. Make no mistake, "prior opportunity" has been the single biggest rule mistake in AFL history.

And here I was thinking recruiters just hated short West Australians they hadn't bothered to watch play.

 

[ArdentEagle]

Wouldn't the best players at stoppages require one touch, great vision and quick hands not so much height?
Some of the best in the AFL are 183cm and below.

 

[Goosecat]

It's more than that unfortunately. You can have all the touch in the world but if you keep getting moved off or way from the zone you don't get the touch regardless. If the team doesn't have enough strength to hold and block for play-makers, they don't get the touch and on and on it goes.
Stoppages require bodywork, more stoppages = more bodywork.
When we get away from continual stoppages ( which can't really happen until prior opportunity is finally removed to the waste-bin of history where it belongs), you will see the player profiles start to broaden again.

 

[ArdentEagle]

It's more than that unfortunately. You can have all the touch in the world but if you keep getting moved off or way from the zone you don't get the touch regardless. If the team doesn't have enough strength to hold and block for play-makers, they don't get the touch and on and on it goes.
Stoppages require bodywork, more stoppages = more bodywork.
When we get away from continual stoppages ( which can't really happen until prior opportunity is finally removed to the waste-bin of history where it belongs), you will see the player profiles start to broaden again.

I get that but you can have shorter guys with very strong cores too. I still think there is too much weighting on height. (not having a crack or anything )

 

[Mutineer]

I get that but you can have shorter guys with very strong cores too. I still think there is too much weighting on height. (not having a crack or anything )

Lachie Neale goes alright...

 

[Mutineer]

If your short you can make it , if your skilfull and quick. Pretty hard if deficient in either.

Lachie Neale and Caleb Daniel quick?

 

[DeafHawk]

Davo-27
Your suggestion?
Would Hawthorn take Anthony Munkara or Liam Henry on pick 24 partner with Brocky or Saunders as
We realky need forward presure player like Cyril & Poppy

 

[briztoon]

Lachie Neale goes alright...

But he’s becoming an outlier to the standard afl mid.

He’s also genetically different to a lot of other sub 180cm mids.

He’s thick. From his toes to his head. Having seen him many times up close at training, he’s real thick, from his ankles up.

He’s also changed his game somewhat. He’s not at the bottom of packs so much anymore. More often he’s just outside the contest, on the move, and reading and reacting to where the ball is going, moving in and moving out of the contest before others can react.

And he has exceptional hands collecting and protecting the ball.

 

[Futbolista]

They key is, as already mentioned, only 5% of AFL listed players are 177cm or below. That stats speaks for itself.

In my youth it would have been more like 20-40% going back to the 70's and 80's and very few were above 188cm.

Yes, there are exceptions - players who make it - but 5% is a damning stat.

 

[briztoon]

Certainly we're getting taller as a species but the curve is flattening in developed countries now. There is a cutoff where height becomes a net negative to the species.
None of that changes the fact clubs are looking for bigger bodies in general in AFL to cope with the extra bodywork stoppages require.

The curve might be flattening for the general population, but I’d bet my bottom dollar that current studies show that sports where height and size give an advantage, their athletes are still getting taller and bigger.

15 years ago Kevin Durant (nba basketball) was a freak at 208cm tall, moving like a guard. Then came Giannisgiannis antetokounmpo at 211cm with a bigger build, moving the same.

They are one generation after Michael Jordan, who was 198cm.

Next year, there’s a kid coming to the nba draft who just measured 223cm with a 244cm wingspan and he moves like a guard. He’s still growing and moves like a baby giraffe, but he’s got that fluidity and agility that you know once he grows in to his body, that he’s going to be different than the really tall players that came before him.

 

[briztoon]

And here I was thinking recruiters just hated short West Australians they hadn't bothered to watch play.

I’m assuming this is very much tongue in cheek.

 

[Mutineer]

But he’s becoming an outlier to the standard afl mid.

He’s also genetically different to a lot of other sub 180cm mids.

He’s thick. From his toes to his head. Having seen him many times up close at training, he’s real thick, from his ankles up.

He’s also changed his game somewhat. He’s not at the bottom of packs so much anymore. More often he’s just outside the contest, on the move, and reading and reacting to where the ball is going, moving in and moving out of the contest before others can react.

And he has exceptional hands collecting and protecting the ball.

They still exist...they're not extinct just yet.

 

[Davo-27]

Davo-27
Your suggestion?
Would Hawthorn take Anthony Munkara or Liam Henry on pick 24 partner with Brocky or Saunders as
We realky need forward presure player like Cyril & Poppy

i think we want a midfielder and general forward, so if we take a midfielder at 7 then we would take a forward at 25 or wherever the picks land, same as if we take a forward at pick 7 then we should take a midfielder at pick 25

as for Anthony Munkara it depends on if he wants to play AFL? if he does then i think he has the talent for us to pick him at 25, Liam Henry would be a trade and im not sure if Fremantle would trade him, if they do then i would be happy to use pick 25 on him.

 

[briztoon]

They still exist...they're not extinct just yet.

I don’t believe the discussion is saying the sub 180cm football player is gone yet.

I do agree they are becoming less common and more often filling niche positions or roles.

 

[Smythe]

I just checked the average age for the 2022 WA 18's squad of 38.

188.4cm and that's just a junior team.

That is very old

 

[RedmanWasHere]

So Futbolista, who are the top prospects born in 1834?

 

[Saintscomemarchingin]

What size? is Charlie Clarke

 

[Smythe]

What size? is Charlie Clarke

182

 

[Davo-27]

well the Grand Final in the NAB League happened, to no ones surprise, Cam MacKenzie, Will Ashcroft, Harry Sheezel and Olli Hotton were great, Archie Roberts played a good game also for the under ager

Archie Lovelock also playing well in the final series in SA, everyone loves a big game player.

 

[Davo-27]

post Grand Final Update

1. Will Ashcroft - 180cm 76kg - Sandringham (Bris F/S)
2. Harry Sheezel - 184cm 77kg - Sandringham
3. George Wardlaw - 182cm 81kg - Oakleigh
-----------------------------------------------------------Elite Tier ^
4. Aaron Cadman - 194cm 88kg - GWV
5. Elijah Tsatas - 186cm 79kg - Oakleigh
6. Cam MacKenzie - 187cm 80kg - Sandringham (StK NGA)
7. Jhye Clark - 181cm 77kg - Geelong
8. Mattaes Phillipou - 191cm 83kg - WWT
9. Jedd Busslinger - 196cm 82kg - East Perth
------------------------------------------------------------ Top Tier ^
10. Reuben Ginbey - 189cm 85kg - East Perth
11. Bailey Humphrey - 184cm 86kg - Gippsland
12. Lewis Hayes - 197cm 81kg - Eastern
13. Elijah Hewett - 186cm 82kg - Swan Districts
14. Matthew Jefferson - 194cm 76kg - Oakleigh
15. Isaac Keeler - 198cm 88kg - North Adelaide (Adel NGA)
16. Oliver Hollands - 184cm 71kg - Murray
17. Adam D'Aloia - 186cm 86kg - WWT
18. Mitch Szybkowski - 186cm 84kg - Dandenong
19. Jaspa Fletcher - 184cm 73kg - Bris A (Bris A)
20. Brayden George - 185cm 87kg - Murray
21. Anthony Munkara - 186cm 77kg - NT/West Adelaide (Ess NGA)
22. Olli Hotton - 181cm 77kg - Sandringham
23. Tom McCallum - 192cm 78kg - Tasmania
--------------------------------------------------------------- High Quality Prospects ^
24. Coby Burgiel - 183cm 76kg - Gippsland
25. Henry Hustwaite - 194cm 84kg - Dandenong
26. Al Davey Jnr - 181cm 74kg - Oakleigh (Ess F/S)
27. Jed Hagan - 175cm 73kg - East Fremantle
28. Darcy Jones - 175cm 67kg - Swan Districts
29. Josh Weddle - 191cm 87kg - Oakleigh
30. Kobe Ryan - 183cm 73kg - West Adelaide
31. Harry Barnett - 202cm 93kg - West Adelaide
32. Lachlan Cowan - 188cm 81kg - Tasmania
33. Luke Teal - 188cm 78kg - Oakleigh
34. Charlie Clarke - 182cm 75kg - Sandringham
35. Brandon Leary - 177cm - Tasmania
36. Hugh Bond - 184cm 81kg - GWV
37. Shadeau Brain - 185cm - Bris A (Bris A)
38. Will Dowling - 187cm 79kg - North Adelaide
39. Jonti Schuback - 183cm 75kg - Gippsland
40. Noah Long - 178cm 74kg - Gippsland
41. Ed Allan - 194cm 82kg - Claremont
42. Archie Lovelock - 178cm 72kg - Glenlg
42. Callum Verrell - 187cm 79kg - Eastern
43. Blake Drury - 177cm 73kg - Oakleigh
44. Jacob Konstanty - 176cm 70kg - Gippsland
45. Cooper Vickery - 180cm 72kg - Gippsland (Haw NGA)
46. Jake Walker - 184cm 85kg - Glenlg
47. Jaiden Magor - 185cm 79kg - South Adelaide
48. Sam Gilbey - 188cm 71kg - Claremont
49. Harry Rowston - 180cm - Calder/GWS A (GWS A)
50. Harry Lemmey - 199cm 93kg - West Adel
---------------------------------------------------------------- Quality Prospects ^

other good prospects that have good qualities: J.Ryan, Scully, Hempel, Penny, J.Davey, Harvey, J.Lawrence, Petric, K.Windsor, Ashwin, M.Clohesy, T.Clohesy, Northam, O'Sullivan, Binns, Van Es, Fogarty, Wright, McMullin, C.Mitchell, Foster, Michaelanny, Sadler, Michael, MacNeill, Cleaver, Green, Julian, Cole, Campbell, Madden, Knobel and Campbell-Farrell, special mention: L. Bailey(Dand)

 

[maverick001]

You call that plenty? 39 out of nearly 800 players. Look back 25 years and you will see that there were far more

Yes but across the whole of society generations are getting taller, so the goalpost shift.

 

[maverick001]

post Grand Final Update

1. Will Ashcroft - 180cm 76kg - Sandringham (Bris F/S)
2. Harry Sheezel - 184cm 77kg - Sandringham
3. George Wardlaw - 182cm 81kg - Oakleigh
-----------------------------------------------------------Elite Tier ^
4. Aaron Cadman - 194cm 88kg - GWV
5. Elijah Tsatas - 186cm 79kg - Oakleigh
6. Cam MacKenzie - 187cm 80kg - Sandringham (StK NGA)
7. Jhye Clark - 181cm 77kg - Geelong
8. Mattaes Phillipou - 191cm 83kg - WWT
9. Jedd Busslinger - 196cm 82kg - East Perth
------------------------------------------------------------ Top Tier ^
10. Reuben Ginbey - 189cm 85kg - East Perth
11. Bailey Humphrey - 184cm 86kg - Gippsland
12. Lewis Hayes - 197cm 81kg - Eastern
13. Elijah Hewett - 186cm 82kg - Swan Districts
14. Matthew Jefferson - 194cm 76kg - Oakleigh
15. Isaac Keeler - 198cm 88kg - North Adelaide (Adel NGA)
16. Oliver Hollands - 184cm 71kg - Murray
17. Adam D'Aloia - 186cm 86kg - WWT
18. Mitch Szybkowski - 186cm 84kg - Dandenong
19. Jaspa Fletcher - 184cm 73kg - Bris A (Bris A)
20. Brayden George - 185cm 87kg - Murray
21. Anthony Munkara - 186cm 77kg - NT/West Adelaide (Ess NGA)
22. Olli Hotton - 181cm 77kg - Sandringham
23. Tom McCallum - 192cm 78kg - Tasmania
--------------------------------------------------------------- High Quality Prospects ^
24. Coby Burgiel - 183cm 76kg - Gippsland
25. Henry Hustwaite - 194cm 84kg - Dandenong
26. Al Davey Jnr - 181cm 74kg - Oakleigh (Ess F/S)
27. Jed Hagan - 175cm 73kg - East Fremantle
28. Darcy Jones - 175cm 67kg - Swan Districts
29. Josh Weddle - 191cm 87kg - Oakleigh
30. Kobe Ryan - 183cm 73kg - West Adelaide
31. Harry Barnett - 202cm 93kg - West Adelaide
32. Lachlan Cowan - 188cm 81kg - Tasmania
33. Luke Teal - 188cm 78kg - Oakleigh
34. Charlie Clarke - 182cm 75kg - Sandringham
35. Brandon Leary - 177cm - Tasmania
36. Hugh Bond - 184cm 81kg - GWV
37. Shadeau Brain - 185cm - Bris A (Bris A)
38. Will Dowling - 187cm 79kg - North Adelaide
39. Jonti Schuback - 183cm 75kg - Gippsland
40. Noah Long - 178cm 74kg - Gippsland
41. Ed Allan - 194cm 82kg - Claremont
42. Archie Lovelock - 178cm 72kg - Glenlg
42. Callum Verrell - 187cm 79kg - Eastern
43. Blake Drury - 177cm 73kg - Oakleigh
44. Jacob Konstanty - 176cm 70kg - Gippsland
45. Cooper Vickery - 180cm 72kg - Gippsland (Haw NGA)
46. Jake Walker - 184cm 85kg - Glenlg
47. Jaiden Magor - 185cm 79kg - South Adelaide
48. Sam Gilbey - 188cm 71kg - Claremont
49. Harry Rowston - 180cm - Calder/GWS A (GWS A)
50. Harry Lemmey - 199cm 93kg - West Adel
---------------------------------------------------------------- Quality Prospects ^

other good prospects that have good qualities: J.Ryan, Scully, Hempel, Penny, J.Davey, Harvey, J.Lawrence, Petric, K.Windsor, Ashwin, M.Clohesy, T.Clohesy, Northam, O'Sullivan, Binns, Van Es, Fogarty, Wright, McMullin, C.Mitchell, Foster, Michaelanny, Sadler, Michael, MacNeill, Cleaver, Green, Julian, Cole, Campbell, Madden, Knobel and Campbell-Farrell, special mention: L. Bailey(Dand)

What do you see as McKenzie's limitations? Everything I read makes him sound like an excellent prospect, doesn't seem to have a bad game, performs well in big games. For Eagles' pick 2 he might be a safer bet than Wardlaw (hamstrings) and Tsatas (not as inside as McKenzie).

Where do you see Hotton going in the draft? Is he an inside mid, or balanced? Do you see him having the game to be a full time mid at AFL level, or do you think he ends up on a flank somewhere?

How was Szybkowski in the U18s GF?

 

[Titch3Votes0MooreAA]

post Grand Final Update

1. Will Ashcroft - 180cm 76kg - Sandringham (Bris F/S)
2. Harry Sheezel - 184cm 77kg - Sandringham
3. George Wardlaw - 182cm 81kg - Oakleigh
-----------------------------------------------------------Elite Tier ^
4. Aaron Cadman - 194cm 88kg - GWV
5. Elijah Tsatas - 186cm 79kg - Oakleigh
6. Cam MacKenzie - 187cm 80kg - Sandringham (StK NGA)
7. Jhye Clark - 181cm 77kg - Geelong
8. Mattaes Phillipou - 191cm 83kg - WWT
9. Jedd Busslinger - 196cm 82kg - East Perth
------------------------------------------------------------ Top Tier ^
10. Reuben Ginbey - 189cm 85kg - East Perth
11. Bailey Humphrey - 184cm 86kg - Gippsland
12. Lewis Hayes - 197cm 81kg - Eastern
13. Elijah Hewett - 186cm 82kg - Swan Districts
14. Matthew Jefferson - 194cm 76kg - Oakleigh
15. Isaac Keeler - 198cm 88kg - North Adelaide (Adel NGA)
16. Oliver Hollands - 184cm 71kg - Murray
17. Adam D'Aloia - 186cm 86kg - WWT
18. Mitch Szybkowski - 186cm 84kg - Dandenong
19. Jaspa Fletcher - 184cm 73kg - Bris A (Bris A)
20. Brayden George - 185cm 87kg - Murray
21. Anthony Munkara - 186cm 77kg - NT/West Adelaide (Ess NGA)
22. Olli Hotton - 181cm 77kg - Sandringham
23. Tom McCallum - 192cm 78kg - Tasmania
--------------------------------------------------------------- High Quality Prospects ^
24. Coby Burgiel - 183cm 76kg - Gippsland
25. Henry Hustwaite - 194cm 84kg - Dandenong
26. Al Davey Jnr - 181cm 74kg - Oakleigh (Ess F/S)
27. Jed Hagan - 175cm 73kg - East Fremantle
28. Darcy Jones - 175cm 67kg - Swan Districts
29. Josh Weddle - 191cm 87kg - Oakleigh
30. Kobe Ryan - 183cm 73kg - West Adelaide
31. Harry Barnett - 202cm 93kg - West Adelaide
32. Lachlan Cowan - 188cm 81kg - Tasmania
33. Luke Teal - 188cm 78kg - Oakleigh
34. Charlie Clarke - 182cm 75kg - Sandringham
35. Brandon Leary - 177cm - Tasmania
36. Hugh Bond - 184cm 81kg - GWV
37. Shadeau Brain - 185cm - Bris A (Bris A)
38. Will Dowling - 187cm 79kg - North Adelaide
39. Jonti Schuback - 183cm 75kg - Gippsland
40. Noah Long - 178cm 74kg - Gippsland
41. Ed Allan - 194cm 82kg - Claremont
42. Archie Lovelock - 178cm 72kg - Glenlg
42. Callum Verrell - 187cm 79kg - Eastern
43. Blake Drury - 177cm 73kg - Oakleigh
44. Jacob Konstanty - 176cm 70kg - Gippsland
45. Cooper Vickery - 180cm 72kg - Gippsland (Haw NGA)
46. Jake Walker - 184cm 85kg - Glenlg
47. Jaiden Magor - 185cm 79kg - South Adelaide
48. Sam Gilbey - 188cm 71kg - Claremont
49. Harry Rowston - 180cm - Calder/GWS A (GWS A)
50. Harry Lemmey - 199cm 93kg - West Adel
---------------------------------------------------------------- Quality Prospects ^

other good prospects that have good qualities: J.Ryan, Scully, Hempel, Penny, J.Davey, Harvey, J.Lawrence, Petric, K.Windsor, Ashwin, M.Clohesy, T.Clohesy, Northam, O'Sullivan, Binns, Van Es, Fogarty, Wright, McMullin, C.Mitchell, Foster, Michaelanny, Sadler, Michael, MacNeill, Cleaver, Green, Julian, Cole, Campbell, Madden, Knobel and Campbell-Farrell, special mention: L. Bailey(Dand)

Those rankings of yours, Davo, are very impressive. I must, however, strongly disagree with your placement of Cowan at number 32. Without taking into account any of his other performances this year, I judged him to be among the top 25 in talent based solely on his performance against Dandenong. He will be a very capable halfback/wing for whoever chooses him. I would switch him for Munkara. I'd also rank Konstanty and Clarke in the 20s.

 

[blueiris]

When was the last time a club had 3 players in the top 10 like Sandringham looks like this year?

 

[Titch3Votes0MooreAA]

When was the last time a club had 3 players in the top 10 like Sandringham looks like this year?

Sandringham in both 2018 and 2016. In 2016 they had 4 in the top and Florent at pick 11. They are Australia's top U18 team. That is indisputable.