Dear Alan

[September Action]

4 gods' sake stop sooking will you? They're footballers FFS, that's what a great % of footballers do. It's reality. If you want to protect your precious son from reality, send him to a monastery or something.
Get real, there are people starving and being bombed to pieces all over the world. I save my sympathy for them.

Knob.

This is a footy forum, not Amnesty International.

 

[Kirby]

For what it's worth, mate, I wasn't having a go at you or your parenting. We all grow up with footy heroes as children, I was no different with guys like Daics and Gavin Brown. Fortunately for me they never really let me down, and I was lucky that they were well behaved off the field. Or at least I think they were, the media weren't quite so scrutinising back then as they are now.

I think in a situation like this we've got to take a few steps back and realise that perhaps they're not really such bad people after all, and we have to explain to kids who admire them that these guys made a mistake and are hopefully doing their best to fix their ways.

My hero was Rene Kink (before Daics) and he had his problems too.

Look, I think we are pretty much on the same page on this.

For what it's worth I hope we keep them both and tell the rest of the world to go stick it.

 

[Magpies696]

If collingwood want to win a Premiership within the next 3-4 years they have to keep Didak And the Shaw boys

 

[Suspense]

My God, you really are an idiot arn't you?

How so?

Funniest thing is Didak will never read your pathetic letter and even if he did, he would simply roll his eyes at yet another muppet supporter who believes that he must live HIS life in accordance with YOUR beliefs and act in a fashion that sets a good example to YOUR child.

Uneless they are absolute clowns they must know that unlawful actions in their own time, in a public place, will be of interest to media parasites, and in turn will damage the club that pays them $$$$$$ and supports their privilaged lifestyle.

Major sponsors Wizard Home Loans and airline Emirates have backed their ties with the club.

Wizard spokesman Matt Allison said the charge did not affect how the company would deal with the club.

"Wizard remains a committed partner of the Collingwood Football Club," he said.

Emirates, which has supported the club since 1999, delivered a similar message.

The airline's corporate spokesman, Mike Simon, said it could not control the football club's players.


The sponsors want success. They want to see their logo plastered all over the papers around the nation come the day following the grand final. They understand that for this to happen, the best players need to be playing, regardless of the unfounded bad press spread by vermin like Caro and Hutchy. What they don't want is their own investment stupidly slitting it's own throat, essentially ending any chance for success for the Collingwood club and the sponsor's brand, as they did yesterday...

 

[kevind]

My hero was Rene Kink (before Daics) and he had his problems too.

Look, I think we are pretty much on the same page on this.

For what it's worth I hope we keep them both and tell the rest of the world to go stick it.

Interesting to hear about Rene Kink. I remember a story about Kink during his playing days. Apparently he killed an elderly pedestrian who wandered in front of his car. Was deemed to ne not really Kink's fault, but for the rest of that particular year, the victim's family issued him with death threats that had some substance.

You may also remember Kink spitting at Carlton's Alex Jesaulenko during the 1979 GF. Apparently Jesaulenko got under Kink's skin by calling out to him "Hey, murderer!"

Irrelevant with current events I guess, but sometimes the full story can be a little inconspicous

 

[Kirby]

How so?

Funniest thing is Didak will never read your pathetic letter and even if he did, he would simply roll his eyes at yet another muppet supporter who believes that he must live HIS life in accordance with YOUR beliefs and act in a fashion that sets a good example to YOUR child.

Of course he will never read the letter and I doubt it would make any difference if he did.

Where you totally f*ck up, is that this in not about him living his life in accordance with my beliefs or setting a good example for my child. It's about living his life with respect for his team mates, club, and for the supporters, especially in his situation where he had also severely embarrassed the club only one year before. He allegedly was very remorseful about that, but three weeks after having the restrictions lifted off his contract he is back on the piss big time. He hadn't learnt a thing!

What you need to get through your incredibly thick scull, is that his and Heath's actions placed the club in a situation of extreme embarassment and ridicule. This in turn causes a lot of angst in children (and others).

All I'm pointing out is that they have a greater responsibility than just to themselves and their actions have repercussions.

They dont have to be good role models, just not bad ones.

 

[Kirby]

Interesting to hear about Rene Kink. I remember a story about Kink during his playing days. Apparently he killed an elderly pedestrian who wandered in front of his car. Was deemed to ne not really Kink's fault, but for the rest of that particular year, the victim's family issued him with death threats that had some substance.

You may also remember Kink spitting at Carlton's Alex Jesaulenko during the 1979 GF. Apparently Jesaulenko got under Kink's skin by calling out to him "Hey, murderer!"

Irrelevant with current events I guess, but sometimes the full story can be a little inconspicous

I remember it well.

 

[The Royal Sampler]

Kirby, this is a good thread, although people obviously have pretty strong views about it, it does approach the issue from an interesting perspective.

I know you've said you don't need parenting advice, but this might sound like some. It's not really, it's just that I can best explain my position in the first person.

I don't have kids. I probably will next year, but it will be a while before I have to deal with this stuff. When I do, I'll have to remember that not only does he/she have heroes (who may or may not be Collingwood players) but that I'm 30 and I still do. I've just learned along the way that they don't necessarily stick around, behave correctly off-field, play the way you'd want them to, remain injury-free their whole careers, or take the first contract they're offered. That stuff takes experience, just like sitting through losing Grand Finals!

So, if a situation like this arises, I guess I'll try to use it to explain that everyone makes mistakes, everyone screws up no matter how much you'd want otherwise. Sometimes those mistakes can be "made up for" or "fixed", sometimes they can't. The aim is to try to avoid them, and if you can't avoid them, do your best to learn from them so you don't repeat them, and try to redeem yourself in the best way possible.

If someone doesn't learn from their mistakes, or isn't willing to attempt to make amends, they're probably not someone you should look up to as a hero for whatever reason.

 

[Suspense]

Of course he will never read the letter and I doubt it would make any difference if he did.

Then what was the point of this thread? Yet another "You let me down, Alan" sob story. Good on you...

Where you totally f*ck up, is that this in not about him living his life in accordance with my beliefs or setting a good example for my child.

The existence of this thread and the very next sentence qualifies that this is exactly the case.

It's about living his life with respect for his team mates, club, and for the supporters, especially in his situation where he had also severely embarrassed the club only one year before. He allegedly was very remorseful about that, but three weeks after having the restrictions lifted off his contract he is back on the piss big time. He hadn't learnt a thing!

As much as you'd wish to, you don't control his life. As a footballer, he can get on the piss as long as it doesn't affect his ability to play football. Football is simply a part of their lives and you essentially wish for them to follow your guidelines of what you believe is right and wrong and apply them to all facets of their lives. This premise is essentially based solely on what they do for a living and the burden of social responsibility parents like you wish to lump upon these otherwise independant individuals.

What you need to get through your incredibly thick scull, is that his and Heath's actions placed the club in a situation of extreme embarassment and ridicule. This in turn causes a lot of angst in children (and others).

The club was the one who came out and made a huge deal about it, not the players. Eddie's tantrum on Monday did nothing to help the situation and it has since only made it worse. Any embarassment the club has recieved, they have essentially brought upon themselves. Heath ****ed up and it is an issue for him and the police to deal with. Damage control should have avoided any massive media blow out, but instead they turned on the players, blew the issue out of proportion themselves and then opened the players, the club, the members and the supporters up for free-for-all media criticism. As we know, these vultures will swoop and swoop they did.

You're kid is crying not because Heath got caught driving drunk and not because they lied to the club, but because the Club suspended them and the Club (and "supporters") are talking about trading him. You may say that these are a consequence of their actions, but they are far from direct consequences as they are based on decisions made by the club.

All I'm pointing out is that they have a greater responsibility than just to themselves and their actions have repercussions.

No they don't. They are recruited to play fooball, they have an obligation to the club and the supporters to play football to the best of their ability. If their off-field actions hinder their ability to meet their obligations, THEN it becomes an issue. Until then, this case and the Didak story last year, remain non-issues.

People like you are the one who build these guys up as heroes and role models to your kids (perhaps it is because you are an inadequate role model yourself? I don't know) simply because they can kick a footy straight. In reality, you know nothing about who they actually are, and yet you are somehow shocked and for some reason betrayed when one happens to **** up. When this occurs, you get on your high horse and begin to heap the blame upon them, when was actually people like you who built them up as superstars, living legends and role models in the first place. All because they could kick a footy.

It's the equivalent of backing a horse because it has a cool name or whatever and then getting pissed off at horse when it comes in last. You lost your money and the horse lost the race. Applying it to this scenario, Heath and Didak should be held responsible for coming last, but I'll be ****ed if they have anything to do with you losing your money by backing the wrong horse in the first place, a judgement based on flimsy, specious reasoning originally.

I realise that this line of thinking is too unconventional for you to fathom, so feel-free to just respond with the typical "BUTT TEHY HAV A SPONSIBILITY TO MAH KIDDZ!" nonsense...

 

[The Norm]

If someone doesn't learn from their mistakes, or isn't willing to attempt to make amends, they're probably not someone you should look up to as a hero for whatever reason.

Exactly, it will be the way in which Dids and Shaw respond to the incident that should determine our views on them. If the aftermath of the incident instills a greater hunger and appreciation for the roles they have within the team then it will prove to be a blessing in disguise, especially if the entire team begins to build a stronger work ethic.

You're son will get over it as soon as he sees Dids and Heater dominating in the black & white next year.

 

[sirlothie]

Suspense, if what you say is true then you are saying the fans don't matter, with no fans there is no professional game, there is no money and Didak isn't famous and rich and he actually has to work for a living and can't be out getting shit-faced on a Sunday night. The fans are the game buddy.

 

[The Norm]

The club was the one who came out and made a huge deal about it, not the players. Eddie's tantrum on Monday did nothing to help the situation and it has since only made it worse. Any embarassment the club has recieved, they have essentially brought upon themselves. Heath ****ed up and it is an issue for him and the police to deal with. Damage control should have avoided any massive media blow out, but instead they turned on the players, blew the issue out of proportion themselves and then opened the players, the club, the members and the supporters up for free-for-all media criticism. As we know, these vultures will swoop and swoop they did.

You're kid is crying not because Heath got caught driving drunk and not because they lied to the club, but because the Club suspended them and the Club (and "supporters") are talking about trading him. You may say that these are a consequence of their actions, but they are far from direct consequences as they are based on decisions made by the club.


No they don't. They are recruited to play fooball, they have an obligation to the club and the supporters to play football to the best of their ability. If their off-field actions hinder their ability to meet their obligations, THEN it becomes an issue. Until then, this case and the Didak story last year, remain non-issues.

Agree with most of what you said. By applying this thinking you can argue that Rhyce's decisions were the worst considering he is reported to have been out drinking most of the weekend when the club has a strict no-drinking policy when injured. Heath's decision was a bad one, but is one that most young people, myself included, have made. Hopefully he never does it again. Dids, well he was just caught in the wrong place at the wrong time, much like last year. The funny thing is that if Heath never hit the car none of this would ever be known, and I'm sure it's gone on many, many times before this where the driver has managed to get home safely.

If Eddie and co had've taken the time to deal with the issue and taken time to make sure all the information they got was correct they could've dealt with the media later and the situation would be very different now.

 

[The Royal Sampler]

If Eddie and co had've taken the time to deal with the issue and taken time to make sure all the information they got was correct they could've dealt with the media later and the situation would be very different now.

Disagree with that. Maybe Eddie could've handled things better, but he and the club were acting on the best available information at the time. Due to Shaw's lies, their actions were not the ideal response, but that doesn't mean they were inappropriate at the time.

You can't blame Eds for being lied to.

 

[The Norm]

Disagree with that. Maybe Eddie could've handled things better, but he and the club were acting on the best available information at the time. Due to Shaw's lies, their actions were not the ideal response, but that doesn't mean they were inappropriate at the time.

You can't blame Eds for being lied to.

Some part of me just can't help but think Eddie called a press conference first and then asked the players what happened.
His reaction was justifiable considering what he knew at the time although it left no room for the further developements to the story. You could argue that he should've made sure he would not have to change his story after fronting the media, even if it wasn't his fault. How did it actually eventuate that people at the club found out Didak was there? Police?
Eyewitnesses? There was already a lot of speculation on radio that Didak had been in the car when it crashed and had run away ... I'm only speculating but I think that the approach the Collingwood officials must have taken when questioning the boys was wrong because the players lied to them and felt they couldn't be honest for whatever reason ...
Or maybe just cos theyr'e two of my favourite players I can't let myself think that theyre to completely to blame.
I'm really just a more accepting version of Kirby's kid

 

[Suspense]

Suspense, if what you say is true then you are saying the fans don't matter...

I'd be interested to know how you came to that conclusion as I don't believe that is the case at all...

If Eddie and co had've taken the time to deal with the issue and taken time to make sure all the information they got was correct they could've dealt with the media later and the situation would be very different now.

Completely agree. Sporting clubs around the world do it almost daily. They deal with sportstars. Some will be angels and some will **** up. The media are vicious mongrels looking for that next juicy story to write endless articles about. Other special interest groups like the People Against Lenient Sentencing see this and think about an oppotunity to push their agenda on the front pages of the paper. Opposition supporters with a position of power or persuasion with an axe to grind against collingwood will attempt to seize this opportunity and tear us apart.

Essentially, it comes down to how the club handles these situations and how they ride the numerous bumps as smooth as possible. In this case they messed up big time and our whole club is copping it from everywhere as a result. Shaw's lying didn't help, but the whole response was bungled from the word go, with the club admitting they had left him out to dry for the media to ravage him. Not to mention the big song and dance the club made about Didak's nothing story and numerous threats towards him since, which provide an insight into the reasoning behind the lie, once again a testament to the club's inability to keep past non-issues from exploding in the media.

Perhaps the most disillusioning part about it, from my perspective, is that the club has abandoned their members, sponsors, supporters and the very purpose for their existence as a football club by suspending these players, essentially sacrificing our 2008 season, the season in which we remain the only team to not only beat, but FLOG the reigning premiers.

 

[The Royal Sampler]

I'm really just a more accepting version of Kirby's kid

LOL.

If you're Eddie, and you're trying to control the media fallout after an unsavoury incident, you have to move at a similar speed to the media. By getting the club's response out sooner rather than later, it would normally kill off much of the speculation and innuendo. Unfortunately, in this instance the players lied to Ed and co. As a result, and also due to the fact that the incident had witnesses (how stupid must the players be?) the Collingwood response did not nip the speculation in the bud and it continued throughout the day.

As Caro said in her article, by the time the 6pm news was coming around, the club hierarchy knew something didn't wash with the players' story, due to the reports and rumours going around in the media.

 

[Somebody]

Knob.

This is a footy forum, not Amnesty International.

Oh I don't know, for people like you the slaughter and strangulation of other countries in Iraq and Afghanistan are probably more or less a form of sport. Vicious scum.

 

[Somebody]

My God, you really are an idiot arn't you?

Whatever limited sympathy I had for yoru postition is gone now, all that remains is contempt.

you don't even know what you're talking about in your muddled little peasant brain. Why do you tink your son is upset? Because Heater had an accident and was over the limit? Didak was a passenger and let him drive?? None of the above, as if a 7 yo would understand or care about that. In the days when footy player scandals were just reported and were considered their private business, some people like you clucked like fretting hens, whereas most people including young kids like me just thought it was a bit of a joke. That was an Australia that unfortunately may now be gone forever.

No, what your son is upset about is that Didak is being punished and humiliated by teh media and the club and of course people like your good self, but more importantly that he is in danger of being sacked. All of that is not the players' fault at all, but the fault of the media feeding frenzy and the club's draconian sanctions against Didak. The cognitive dissonance of seeing his father turn against his hero for some sort of crime he doesn't understand may also be quite disturbing. Upsetting for the kid but not exactly a life altering event. What worries me much more is that he and millions of other defenseless children have parents like you. I think it's very likely that by the time he is 20 he'll be a confused angry rebel probably with a drug problem much worse than any of the players, or even worse - he may become a carbon copy of you!

 

[MightyMagpie]

Dear Alan (and Heath),

Thanks to you and your stupidity my 7 year old son now has a broken heart (and I'm sure many other kids out there too) as he worships you as a football God.

My son watches endless videos of you on youtube, he mimmicks your actions, and wears a Collingwood jumper with number 4 on the back every day.

After all the shit hit the fan yesterday he was in tears before school and distraught over the whole affair. He's a bright kid and fully understands what is going on. This whole fiasco has brought ridicule upon our club that children don't fail to notice. He was still tearing up last night and is visibly fragile and I can assure you that this is a normally robust kid.

There is now talk of you being traded and this fills him with dread. You see, he still loves you.

Next time you are on the verge of doing something idiotic, please take some time out to think about all the people, including young children, who look up to you. Not only do you have a responsibilty to your team mates and club, you have a responsibilty to all us supporters who make the club what it is.

Yours sincerely

Kirby

tell ur kid to grow some skin and harden the **** up mate. face reality the world isnt rainbows and butterflies.

 

[sirlothie]

tell ur kid to grow some skin and harden the **** up mate. face reality the world isnt rainbows and butterflies.

He's 7, yeah I'm sure you were really badass when you were 7...

 

[tess]

Disagree with that. Maybe Eddie could've handled things better, but he and the club were acting on the best available information at the time. Due to Shaw's lies, their actions were not the ideal response, but that doesn't mean they were inappropriate at the time.

You can't blame Eds for being lied to.

Wrong if I knew Alan was in the car before this even hit the news then Ed would have been worded up I expect.

As Bucks said Ed was just being a big head.

 

[Kirby]

Whatever limited sympathy I had for yoru postition is gone now, all that remains is contempt.

Like the contempt that Scott Burns must feel towards two his star players for being lyed to both privately and publicly?

you don't even know what you're talking about in your muddled little peasant brain.

Peasant brain? Is that your best shot? Well done!

Why do you tink your son is upset? Because Heater had an accident and was over the limit? Didak was a passenger and let him drive?? None of the above, as if a 7 yo would understand or care about that.

On the Monday he did understand that, believe or not. When it was just Heater and Didak wasn't in the car he was okay with that, and he understood from my discussions with him how stupid it is to drink drive. He still appreciated it was bad news for Collingwood.

some people like you clucked like fretting hens, whereas most people including young kids like me just thought it was a bit of a joke. That was an Australia that unfortunately may now be gone forever.

You know, I'm 41 years old and I can't remember ever thinking issues like this were a "joke". Usually the ridicule from your mates who support other teams would see to that.

No, what your son is upset about is that Didak is being punished and humiliated by teh media and the club and of course people like your good self, but more importantly that he is in danger of being sacked. All of that is not the players' fault at all, but the fault of the media feeding frenzy and the club's draconian sanctions against Didak.

Yes, it is the media reaction he is upset about and the constant call for his sacking. This would not have happened (to anywhere near this extent) if if had just told the truth in the first place. Now I want you to pay really close attention here so that this sinks in --> It is the lying to his Captain and the club that has brought this about. His leadership group do not want him or Heath to wear the jumper next to them for the rest of the year. That is very damning. If he had just come clean in the first place he would be in minor trouble and there would hardly be any talk of sacking or trading him. That is the crime mate, so get off your high horse.

The cognitive dissonance of seeing his father turn against his hero for some sort of crime he doesn't understand may also be quite disturbing. Upsetting for the kid but not exactly a life altering event.

Where have i turned against Didak or Heath? Come on smartarse, show me where? In fact, I've made it clear I want both to stay. You have no idea how I have dealt with this with him.

What worries me much more is that he and millions of other defenseless children have parents like you. I think it's very likely that by the time he is 20 he'll be a confused angry rebel probably with a drug problem much worse than any of the players, or even worse - he may become a carbon copy of you!

Now, see, this is where you cross the line. You are an internet hero. You would never have the balls to say such crap to my face. I can gaurentee it.

 

[Kirby]

tell ur kid to grow some skin and harden the **** up mate. face reality the world isnt rainbows and butterflies.

here we go, another mental giant.

 

[shawthing09]

Geez that got out of hand pretty quick, I think all Kirb was doing was pointing out the effect the football club and the players in it have on the thousands of fans, many of whom aren't old enough to take in everything that is going on. He never suggested he needed help to deal with it, or that his kid was going to be scared forever because of it.

Beyond that like it or not footballers behaviours are under the microscope now days and that won't be changed whether it is right or wrong, knowing this it is their responsiblity to deal with it and it is what comes along with the pay checks. It is no longer just being paid to kick the footy around.

Futhermore the fact of the matter is if it was your mate drink driving and nearly killing himself you would feel obligated to give him a spray as it is his friends and family who would wear it if he hurt himself which is something that people don't think of at the time they make stupid choices like that. I highly doubt footballers would be aware of the scale of their actions and how it affects the fans so it would be nice if they did have some perspective on that

 

[morax]

It's difficult for parents to be role models to young children when their children are looking for something greater. Traits such as work ethic, empathy ( hi suspense ) responsible drinking... etc are difficult to convey to a small child. The media create a football god that is easy for the child to relate to.

Now this is the time for the parent to ensure their child feet are well grounded but that can still fail when the child is bombarded with the God like status elite sportsman a given in the media and advertising.

My six year old loves Collingwood. She has no comprehension about the current situation. I noticed today there was a football jumper day at her primary school and no child was wearing a Collingwood jumper. Not one. Plenty of Essendon and Hawthorn, i nearly cried. Kids copying the idols, especially buddy (creating an arc when kicking).

Players are role models, they shouldn't be, but its not going to change.