Current Disappearance of 3yo William Tyrrell Pt 2 * Coroners Inquiry Current

[Kurve]

Continued from PART 1

Criminal charges:

• Apprehended Violence Orders on both (AVOs)
• Lying to the NSW Crime Commission on former foster mother *Not Guilty
• Lying to the NSW Crime Commission on former foster father *Not Guilty
• 2 x charges of assault against a child on former foster mother *Guilty
• 1 x charge of assault against a child on former foster father *Not Guilty
• Stalking &/or Intimidation on both *Guilty
• Dummy bidding real estate fraud *Guilty

TIMELINE

Where's William Tyrrell? - The Ch 10 podcast (under Coroner's subpoena)

Operation Arkstone

Suppression orders are in force, please use the following to indicate:

FM - Foster Mother
FF - Foster Father
FGM - Foster Grandmother
FD - Foster Daughter
FPs - Foster Parents

Up to you if you wish to refer to them as former fosters but please write it in full, strictly using the above. No deviations.

Other initials posters will use informally but should not are:

BCR - Batar Creek Road
FA - Frank Abbott
MW - Michelle White
SFR - Strike Force Rosann
AMS - Anne Maree Sharpley
CCR - Cobb and Co Road
One even reduced bike riding to - BR

 

[Underarrest_]

https://www.smh.com.au/national/ger...ks-he-killed-for-himself-20140720-zuzug.html#

This is the face of GBC after he murdered his wife.

I am just wondering, what did the foster mother’s hand look like - the one that was mysteriously injured on the morning that William went missing?

Could you lead me to this information about FM hand injury please? I haven’t seen this.

 

[LRitz]

I am just wondering, what did the foster mother’s hand look like - the one that was mysteriously injured on the morning that William went missing?

Agree, it seems a bit suspicious.
It would be interesting if there was a photo or note about the injury. The FM mentions the injured hand in her statement made 2 days later on14th September. She claims she slipped in the garden and grazed right hand. So nothing to see here.
Again, another trivial incident mentioned that would have nothing to do with William missing an hour later, while important details such as what time exactly did William disappear, are vague. The middle of your hand seems an unusual injury and no mention of grazed knees.
In FM walkthrough she is covering her right hand with a tissue so impossible to see hand injury .Why not have a dressing on it? (And, mentioned before, really odd that FF does a similar thing in his walkthrough. Please no comments. I just thought it was odd, but just a coincidence?)

 

[LRitz]

I don’t want to say specifically because police are saying it’s the FM but if it’s not the FM it leaves a number of possibilities, one being targeted and if was targeted it was someone who knew somehow that they were going to be there and in saying that, perhaps FM did see the cars there.

The FF and FM allege that they changed plans and left earlier on Thursday afternoon rather than Friday. They themselves said they told no one, and only rang FGM around 5pm when they were on their way. Now the 100% proof for this is that they had not booked the cats into cattery! Lets see how that would stand up in court.
Luckily the FGM was a bit prepared because she had eggs toast, orange juice, and wheatbix for everyone for breakfast on Friday morning. And she did not ask FF to pick up anything (besides the newspaper) when he was going out on Friday morning.

So that leaves only the cat sitter, the staff at the child care centre, or FGM FF FM, to let someone else know that they would be at Benaroon drive on Friday morning. That is presuming the staff at Mc'donalds did not know their destination.
In FM's statement on the 14th her memory is pretty good. She includes details about orange juice for breakfast and playing with the dice. But she does not mention suspicious cars, kookaburras, or bike riding. Perhaps there were no cars.

 

[LRitz]

True and FM asked FF did you pick up William he replied why would I have him? Am I Right? I remember some sort of conversation along those lines?

FM claims in her statement that she asked FF if he had William. But when you think about it, we do not know what FM and FF said. I would add this to a list (not complete) of things that are without evidence.

Mystery cars on street - FM.
FF left at 9ish and was running late - FM statement.
William was running around full of life and the "joy of living" - FGM walkthrough.
Everyone was happy - FGM walkthrough.
Kids rode bikes that morning - FM.
FM's hand was injured when she fell in garden - FM statement.

 

[LRitz]

I think it’s possible it was an opportunistic crime by an unknown offender.

We only have to look at the Cleo Smith case. She was kidnapped from a tent by a stranger in an even more remote place than Kendall.

The offender didn’t know she was going to be there. He was there to steal property as he had done on previous occasions, but this time acted on impulse.

I hear zebras.

 

[Underarrest_]

The FF and FM allege that they changed plans and left earlier on Thursday afternoon rather than Friday. They themselves said they told no one, and only rang FGM around 5pm when they were on their way. Now the 100% proof for this is that they had not booked the cats into cattery! Lets see how that would stand up in court.
Luckily the FGM was a bit prepared because she had eggs toast, orange juice, and wheatbix for everyone for breakfast on Friday morning. And she did not ask FF to pick up anything (besides the newspaper) when he was going out on Friday morning.

So that leaves only the cat sitter, the staff at the child care centre, or FGM FF FM, to let someone else know that they would be at Benaroon drive on Friday morning. That is presuming the staff at Mc'donalds did not know their destination.
In FM's statement on the 14th her memory is pretty good. She includes details about orange juice for breakfast and playing with the dice. But she does not mention suspicious cars, kookaburras, or bike riding. Perhaps there were no cars.

The Family were going to be there on the Friday anyway (the day William went missing.)
Delayed memory is a real thing especially when you’re going through something as traumatic as a child missing.

 

[31550]

The Family were going to be there on the Friday anyway (the day William went missing.)
Delayed memory is a real thing especially when you’re going through something as traumatic as a child missing.

True but they were never going to be there as early as 10:30am. It's at least a 4-hour drive from Sydney.

 

[Underarrest_]

True but they were never going to be there as early as 10:30am. It's at least a 4-hour drive from Sydney.

That’s true, they wouldn’t have known what time, but if for example it was targeted, people might have been in place knowing they were arriving on the Friday. Some parents like to leave early morning, even on dark so the kids sleep through some of the trip.

 

[31550]

That’s true, they wouldn’t have known what time, but if for example it was targeted, people might have been in place knowing they were arriving on the Friday. Some parents like to leave early morning, even on dark so the kids sleep through some of the trip.

I don't see the fosters as being inclined to or even capable of getting two toddlers organised for a 4-5 hour road trip in the early hours of the morning when there was no need to. Remember also that FF had a work meeting scheduled for 10am and knew the internet was 'crap' at FGM's house. So they would need to have arrived well before 9am, meaning leaving the house in Sydney closer to 4am. It seems that the original plan was to leave after his work meeting (around 11am?) and arrive in Kendall late afternoon. Otherwise, he would have to have his meeting in the car while FM drove - not an ideal situation with two toddlers on board.
A kidnapper would want to spend as little time as possible hanging around the location to avoid being spotted. If it was a targeted abduction, the best time would be late afternoon when everyone had settled in but William was still likely to be outside. It just doesn't make sense to have been targeted.
And if it was opportunistic, the perpetrator needed a reason to be there that morning. There is one person who fits that (FA) - he might have been there on spec to work on the deck for Geoff Owen, or just to check the property out. But apparently, FA has been investigated by SFR and cleared - we don't know how or why, but this is the case.

 

[Underarrest_]

I don't see the fosters as being inclined to or even capable of getting two toddlers organised for a 4-5 hour road trip in the early hours of the morning when there was no need to. Remember also that FF had a work meeting scheduled for 10am and knew the internet was 'crap' at FGM's house. So they would need to have arrived well before 9am, meaning leaving the house in Sydney closer to 4am. It seems that the original plan was to leave after his work meeting (around 11am?) and arrive in Kendall late afternoon. Otherwise, he would have to have his meeting in the car while FM drove - not an ideal situation with two toddlers on board.
A kidnapper would want to spend as little time as possible hanging around the location to avoid being spotted. If it was a targeted abduction, the best time would be late afternoon when everyone had settled in but William was still likely to be outside. It just doesn't make sense to have been targeted.
And if it was opportunistic, the perpetrator needed a reason to be there that morning. There is one person who fits that (FA) - he might have been there on spec to work on the deck for Geoff Owen, or just to check the property out. But apparently, FA has been investigated by SFR and cleared - we don't know how or why, but this is the case.

Maybe wasn’t targeted.
I did mention I was going to leave my thoughts as police believe it’s the FM.
I don’t seem to be doing a good job at leaving it
I watched the first interview on 60 mins with the FP again and I just for whatever reason don’t think the FM dumped/buried little William after an accident. Maybe just trying to see the good.

 

[31550]

Maybe wasn’t targeted.
I did mention I was going to leave my thoughts as police believe it’s the FM.
I don’t seem to be doing a good job at leaving it
I watched the first interview on 60 mins with the FP again and I just for whatever reason don’t think the FM dumped/buried little William after an accident. Maybe just trying to see the good.

Agree that the 60 Minutes Interview is favourable to the fosters. But who controlled the narrative in that interview? There were no confronting or investigative questions - the entire interview followed the narrative that William was abducted.

 

[Underarrest_]

Agree that the 60 Minutes Interview is favourable to the fosters. But who controlled the narrative in that interview? There were no confronting or investigative questions - the entire interview followed the narrative that William was abducted.

True, they both seem so genuine though but I guess the worst of the worst can hold it up in an interview.

 

[LRitz]

That’s true, they wouldn’t have known what time, but if for example it was targeted, people might have been in place knowing they were arriving on the Friday. Some parents like to leave early morning, even on dark so the kids sleep through some of the trip.

Sorry, but I have to agree with discussion on previous posts. It does not make sense that these "sneaky" actors turn up very early on Friday and park two cars for hours in that quiet street that any neighbour could see and record the number plates. And where were the drivers.
And as for delayed memory how is it some things trivial are well narrated and important things are left out. FGM does not look very traumatised or even upset in her walkthrough . Not even crocodile tears.

 

[Underarrest_]

Sorry, but I have to agree with discussion on previous posts. It does not make sense that these "sneaky" actors turn up very early on Friday and park two cars for hours in that quiet street that any neighbour could see and record the number plates. And where were the drivers.
And as for delayed memory how is it some things trivial are well narrated and important things are left out. FGM does not look very traumatised or even upset in her walkthrough . Not even crocodile tears.

Did the FM say they were parked there for hours? False number plates? Just watchers?
I’m not sure about the FGM. She did seem very nervous whether that’s from guilt or just her age and talking to an officer. Shock/grief (cried when alone as many people who grieve do.) She couldn’t be said to be bunging tears on for the officer which is what you might do if guilty.
Not sure about FM’s memory, I went through a traumatic experience once and went to the park with a friend a couple of days later, and a lady approached me who I knew well, but at that time because of the trauma, I could not place her. Trauma can affect someone in many ways. Everything seems unreal and certain things are suppressed because there’s more things at the forefront like maybe in this case where a child is and what are they going through.

 

[Underarrest_]

Does anyone have a source for FM’s damaged hand? Was this from the inquest?

 

[shorsky]

I don’t want to say specifically because police are saying it’s the FM but if it’s not the FM it leaves a number of possibilities, one being targeted and if was targeted it was someone who knew somehow that they were going to be there and in saying that, perhaps FM did see the cars there.

William had been abducted before by his biological parents.

But they were living with him, and then once William was found - he was removed from his bio parents.

William’s bio parents would NOT have abducted William again and then not lived with him. They missed him and they wanted him home, is what I understand.

Also, they were in Sydney on the day that William was abducted, and there is CCTV that day that puts them in Sydney.

It wasn’t them. They are the victims of crime here.

All the attention grabbing headlines that ‘William was abducted by his parents’ annoy & frustrate me.

In reality, William’s parents moved to a different abode, and of course took their child with them.

The fact that they moved because they got wind that authorities were going to ‘take’ their child away from them makes sense as they had already experienced the loss of their first born ( daughter) to the same hands. (And tbh, if someone was about to take my child, I’d skip town too - and I’d question a parent who says they wouldn’t)

Interestingly in all the print where we read about the personal challenges these young parents were going through ( emotional, mental, drugs & perhaps alcohol all leading to provocation & disharmony) no where was it ever stated that the children were uncared for or harmed.
Was it just easier to take the kids and forget about the parents than it was to genuinely support, assist & educate so that a wholesome family unit could be established ?
I’m glad I wasn’t the one who filed the demand to take those children - William’s disappearance sits clearly in their hands imo.

 

[shorsky]

I don’t want to say specifically because police are saying it’s the FM but if it’s not the FM it leaves a number of possibilities, one being targeted and if was targeted it was someone who knew somehow that they were going to be there and in saying that, perhaps FM did see the cars there.

Just wondering if you’ve now reached out again & escalated your previous report ?

 

[shorsky]

https://www.smh.com.au/national/ger...ks-he-killed-for-himself-20140720-zuzug.html#

This is the face of GBC after he murdered his wife.

I am just wondering, what did the foster mother’s hand look like - the one that was mysteriously injured on the morning that William went missing?

I doubt anyone looked under the bandage. .. so many holes in the initial investigation.

FM said on her 000 call ‘my son is missing’.

Why did they just automatically think he wandered off instead of covering every possible scenario.

 

[shorsky]

I don't see the fosters as being inclined to or even capable of getting two toddlers organised for a 4-5 hour road trip in the early hours of the morning when there was no need to. Remember also that FF had a work meeting scheduled for 10am and knew the internet was 'crap' at FGM's house. So they would need to have arrived well before 9am, meaning leaving the house in Sydney closer to 4am. It seems that the original plan was to leave after his work meeting (around 11am?) and arrive in Kendall late afternoon. Otherwise, he would have to have his meeting in the car while FM drove - not an ideal situation with two toddlers on board.
A kidnapper would want to spend as little time as possible hanging around the location to avoid being spotted. If it was a targeted abduction, the best time would be late afternoon when everyone had settled in but William was still likely to be outside. It just doesn't make sense to have been targeted.
And if it was opportunistic, the perpetrator needed a reason to be there that morning. There is one person who fits that (FA) - he might have been there on spec to work on the deck for Geoff Owen, or just to check the property out. But apparently, FA has been investigated by SFR and cleared - we don't know how or why, but this is the case.

There was the suggestion that FGM had a pilot friend & that maybe William was deliberately moved on. Do you give any credence to those ideas ?

 

[shorsky]

Agree that the 60 Minutes Interview is favourable to the fosters. But who controlled the narrative in that interview? There were no confronting or investigative questions - the entire interview followed the narrative that William was abducted.

I’ve found it interesting that the whole thing suddenly changed from ‘my son is missing’; ‘no, there’s been no strangers, no strange cars ‘ etc ….. to now it all about ‘William was abducted’.

And I wonder why that change. … why could it not have remained that he was simply ‘missing’. .. Maybe he did wander off.

I wonder what happened in the day or so after William went missing that made her say about the cars.

What day did FM pick her sister up at airport ?
It was on way back that she ‘remembered’ those cars & reported it to the command post when she got back. (Honestly, I would’ve been ringing Wendy Hudson & any other of the police team who I had a contact for the minute I remembered. Time is of the essence !)
And I still can’t believe she was permitted to drive off for that round trip - let alone that she’d even want to, or be up to it.

Did her sister arrive that night and immediately take FGM & self off to motel ? If that’s the case, I think FGM walkthrough may’ve been a good week after that, when ‘fosters’ had left & she had come back to the house ( imo they left it in a dreadful mess for an aging Mum to deal with, but perhaps other daughter was still there to help her )

 

[Underarrest_]

Just wondering if you’ve now reached out again & escalated your previous report ?

Yes I have Shorsky. Funnily enough there’s been sightings in the same area from the media reports. Will they go through hours of video footage in the shopping centre, who knows? I would hope so, they have their focus on their main suspect.
(Unfortunately I couldn’t check if they’d followed up on my last report as I didn’t have the number after 8 years and had phoned anonymously.)
Maybe nothing anyway but at least I’ve followed up.

 

[js47]

Who is connected to both the bio and foster families?

Could it be the bio grandmother’s friend. She I think lives Casino way 300 is from Kendall. And knows people in the Camden Haven who knew the FGM or am I wrong .
Also I love how no one knew the fosters were going early.
What about both work places? FF asked the police if he could have been followed, why? I guess you could make enemy’s at work.

 

[Underarrest_]

Could it be the bio grandmother’s friend. She I think lives Casino way 300 is from Kendall. And knows people in the Camden Haven who knew the FGM or am I wrong .
Also I love how no one knew the fosters were going early.
What about both work places? FF asked the police if he could have been followed, why? I guess you could make enemy’s at work.

There’s definitely some intertwining there.
I think there’s more people that knew the F Family were going away to Kendall, than has been identified, at least to the public anyway.
Maybe they left a day earlier to avoid being followed.
Maybe they were followed.
FF thought he might have been tracked, that’s pretty full on.

 

[Underarrest_]

Still trying to get my head around this.
How does the FM disposing of William play out?
William’s gone around the corner, fallen off the balcony.
FM’s found him in the garden bundled him in the car, taken a shovel, driven away, dug a hole, buried William, driven home.
Or
FM found him in the garden, bundled him in the car, has driven away, dumped him in the bushes, driven home, then gone back at another day to bury him.
Or
FM has put William in the garage/car/ deep freeze then taken him away later to bury him.
Any other scenarios?
because I don’t like these ones.

 

[js47]

Sorry, but I have to agree with discussion on previous posts. It does not make sense that these "sneaky" actors turn up very early on Friday and park two cars for hours in that quiet street that any neighbour could see and record the number plates. And where were the drivers.
And as for delayed memory how is it some things trivial are well narrated and important things are left out. FGM does not look very traumatised or even upset in her walkthrough . Not even crocodile tears.

They may have laid in the bushes for 12 hours some people do that