Current Disappearance of 3yo William Tyrrell Pt 2 * FM guilty of assault & intimidation

[Kurve]

Continued from PART 1

Criminal charges the former foster parents currently face as at 15 April 2022 include:

• Apprehended Violence Orders on both (AVOs)
• Lying to the NSW Crime Commission on former foster mother *Not Guilty
• Lying to the NSW Crime Commission on former foster father *Not Guilty
• 2 x charges of assault against a child on former foster mother *Guilty
• 1 x charge of assault against a child on former foster father *Not Guilty
• Stalking &/or Intimidation on both *Guilty
• Dummy bidding real estate fraud *Guilty

TIMELINE

Where's William Tyrrell? - The Ch 10 podcast (under Coroner's subpoena)

Operation Arkstone

 

[truecrimepath]

I feel Craddock is protecting himself.
What am I missing?

I agree. The opening statement is the biggest 'hedge my bet'.

 

[stormbird]

Okay, only one car trip. That might work too.

'The theory... police assert is that she must have quickly resolved that if the accidental death of William was discovered she might lose 'Lindsay'.'

Lindsay - not her real name, which can't be revealed for legal reasons - was another foster child in the care of the foster mother at that time, who also can't be named.

'Police assert that in that frame of mind, [the foster mother] placed William in her mother's car,' said Mr Craddock.

'After alerting [a neighbour] to William's disappearance, [she] drove her mother's car to Batar Creek Road and placed William's body somewhere in the undergrowth.'

Mr Craddock told the hearing on Monday that the foster mother had no recollection of the precise time she drove her mother's car from the house after the boy vanished on the morning of September 12, 2014.

King Felipe snaps at local after mud attack while seeing flood victims

Spain's King Felipe has been seen snapping at Valencian locals who threw mud and him and his wife as they visited the region in the wake of devastating floods that have so far killed 217.

www.dailymail.co.uk

But if the other times are roughly correct (FF home about 10:33 am, FM meets AMS about 10:40) and FM is back at the house to call triple-0 at 10:56, that only leaves about 10 minutes for the drive down and back.

 

[Kurve]

But if the other times are roughly correct (FF home about 10:33 am, FM meets AMS about 10:40) and FM is back at the house to call triple-0 at 10:56, that only leaves about 10 minutes for the drive down and back.

I think she could have done it in ten minutes.

 

[Wallace52]

But if the other times are roughly correct (FF home about 10:33 am, FM meets AMS about 10:40) and FM is back at the house to call triple-0 at 10:56, that only leaves about 10 minutes for the drive down and back.

He would have weighed about 15, maybe 16 kilos. She’s been carrying him around since he was an infant. She’s strong enough to place him in a car, and carry him out of the car and dump him in the bush.
Did she have time to take his costume off? I recon she’s done that too.

She has poorly chosen the location, but she didn’t have much time.

 

[stormbird]

Daily Mail Australia, 04 Nov 2024

Expert combed through rubbish dump hunting for William Tyrrell's body

An inquest, which began in 2019 but has been beset by protracted delays has now entered its final block of hearings, which will be held this week, and over two weeks just before Christmas .

www.dailymail.co.uk

From the Daily Mail Australia link, adding to the bits Kurve has already mentioned:

"Both William's biological father and his foster parents are attending the hearings, as are detectives from Strike Force Rosann, and its boss Detective Chief Inspector David Laidlaw."

 

[Angry Red Bull]

But if the other times are roughly correct (FF home about 10:33 am, FM meets AMS about 10:40) and FM is back at the house to call triple-0 at 10:56, that only leaves about 10 minutes for the drive down and back.

Yes. If it was for hiding W's body, then logically you wouldn't be doing that after the search had started. So imo between 10.10 ( warm bonnet) and 10.33 for the drive.

 

[Wallace52]

Yes. If it was for hiding W's body, then logically you wouldn't be doing that after the search had started. So imo between 10.10 ( warm bonnet) and 10.33 for the drive.

She’s cut it very, very fine.

What did she do between 9:37am and 10:10am?

 

[alwaysintrigued]

https://www.news.com.au/national/courts-law/latest-police-theory-on-william-tyrrell-to-be-probed-at-inquest/news-story/ac979d8793006e331d0edcded394a532

Police have still gathered no forensic evidence explaining how William Tyrrell went missing 10 years ago, the long-running inquest into the toddler’s disappearance was told as it resumed.

Gerard Craddock SC, the Counsel Assisting the Coroner, said a statement from the lead investigator on the case Detective Chief Inspector David Laidlaw had been heavily redacted as it was “in the form of one person’s opinions about what evidence shows”.

 

[Wallace52]

I think she could have done it in ten minutes.

A childhood in Papua New Guinea tends to make one resourceful. IMO

 

[stormbird]

I think she could have done it in ten minutes.

Apparently that's what the Strike Force thinks too. But I think it's too tight a timeframe: talking to AMS for a minute or two, running back up the hill to the house, getting the car keys (unless she already had them and had already hidden William's body in the car), driving, hiding William, driving, parking, appearing around the back of the house in time to yell across the No.51 backyard to ask FF whether to call the police, then dialing at 10:56.

 

[31550]

Looks to me that Craddock is throwing the police theory under a bus in his opening statement.

No mention of photographs or any forensic photo experts on the witness list?

 

[31550]

From the Sydney Morning Herald link:

"A truck driver who said he saw the foster mother driving the foster grandmother’s Mazda along the road where police suspect Tyrrell’s body was dumped the morning of his disappearance will give evidence.

The court will also hear from Professor Jon Olley and Senior Constable Jost Preis, who will discuss the search efforts; Dr Jennifer Menzies, who will provide evidence on the breakdown of human bones in bushland; and experts on the use of cadaver dogs deployed in the search.

A video of the foster mother’s evidence to the NSW Crime Commission about hitting a different foster child with a wooden spoon will also be presented.

A 2022 police interview recording with another child in the home will also be played in closed court, along with a video of the child showing police where she last saw Tyrrell. ...

Convicted sex offender Frank Abbott, who was investigated over Tyrrell’s disappearance and subsequently charged with unrelated child sex offences, was present via video link from Long Bay prison but will not give evidence.

Tyrrell’s foster and biological parents cannot be identified for legal reasons."

That's pretty specific. Saw the car, identified the car and driver.

 

[Kurve]

Apparently that's what the Strike Force thinks too. But I think it's too tight a timeframe: talking to AMS for a minute or two, running back up the hill to the house, getting the car keys (unless she already had them and had already hidden William's body in the car), driving, hiding William, driving, parking, appearing around the back of the house in time to yell across the No.51 backyard to ask FF whether to call the police, then dialing at 10:56.

Yet she did drive off the property and down Batar Creek Road.

 

[31550]

Craddock told the hearing on Monday that the foster mother had no recollection of the precise time she drove her mother's car fro

But an extraordinary recollection of the strange cars, facial features of their drivers and other minutiae.

 

[truecrimepath]

Daily Mail.

"They found no trace of William Tyrrell'.

Is this hearing today so they can shred the police theory and remove it once and for all. Dan Box thinks it's a ridiculous theory. I share his views..

That's why Craddock is hedging his statement, he does not believe it either.

 

[Angry Red Bull]

Apparently that's what the Strike Force thinks too. But I think it's too tight a timeframe: talking to AMS for a minute or two, running back up the hill to the house, getting the car keys (unless she already had them and had already hidden William's body in the car), driving, hiding William, driving, parking, appearing around the back of the house in time to yell across the No.51 backyard to ask FF whether to call the police, then dialing at 10:56.

I recall there was at least one neighbour (can't remember who) who got home from groceries at 10.25 smack in the middle of that and had commented that she was unlucky it wasn't 10.30 because, had it been, she had thought back then she would have seen the abductor at that time being the time it was suggested it happened.

So perhaps SFR have done a critical comparison with witness statements to identify the after 10.33 time as the only window. Interesting

 

[31550]

Either way she's damned. If the drive was squeezed in between talking to AMS and dialling 000 then it must have been done at considerable speed, so not really "looking for William".

If it was done before talking to AMS it makes no sense. Why drive to riding school before checking neighbours. Only if William is already dead.

AMS sent FM down to the bus shelter - how long to walk 300 metres down and back, look for William, hear a scream? Then get keys etc. ?

 

[Awakening]

As someone who follows a lot of true crime, the ease and speed that someone can kill (accidentally or otherwise) and dispose of body and evidence is mind boggling to me (and most normal people).

Most actually dispose of body and evidence immediately because no one wants to be caught with a dead body or bloody knife or whatever.

Most people don’t kill and most people don’t cover up an accidental death.

So reacting coldly and quickly is foreign to most people, but not to those that do these things.

IMO she had plenty of time to dispose of the body and any evidence.

 

[31550]

Surely the truck will be on the tennis Centre CCTV? What time did it pass?

 

[stormbird]

ABC News, 04 Nov 2024

William Tyrrell inquest resumes with new details of police theory about involvement of former foster mother

Any evidence police have gathered against William Tyrrell's foster mother will finally be presented to a coroner as the inquest into the toddler's disappearance resumes this week.

www.abc.net.au

 

[js47]

FM HAD NO RECOLLECTION OF THE TIME SHE DROVE HER MOTHERS CAR.
BAD LUCK SHE DOESN’T HAVE CONTROL OF THE NARRATIVE NOW IF THEY FOUND THE TRUCK DRIVE BECAUSE OF HIS PHONE.
THAT WOULD BE FACT.
HOPE HE HAS A CRYSTAL CKEAR RECOGNITION
WHY DIDNT HE COME FORWARD?
NO EXCUSE THIS CASE IS TOOOOO PUBLIC.

 

[stormbird]

I recall there was at least one neighbour (can't remember who) who got home from groceries at 10.25 smack in the middle of that and had commented that she was unlucky it wasn't 10.30 because, had it been, she had thought back then she would have seen the abductor at that time being the time it was suggested it happened.

So perhaps SFR have done a critical comparison with witness statements to identify the after 10.33 time as the only window. Interesting

Lydene at No.9 got home about 10:30.

 

[31550]

I recall there was at least one neighbour (can't remember who) who got home from groceries at 10.25 smack in the middle of that and had commented that she was unlucky it wasn't 10.30 because, had it been, she had thought back then she would have seen the abductor at that time being the time it was suggested it happened.

So perhaps SFR have done a critical comparison with witness statements to identify the after 10.33 time as the only window. Interesting

It's not between 10.33 and ~10.45. FF confirmed retuned home at 10.35. THEN she talks to AMS while FF goes next door. AMS sends her to the bus stop and back. AMS hears FF calling William. AMS knocks on Paul Savages door around 10:50. So the neighbours are in the street. None of the neighbours saw the drive? Then she's there to call 000 at 10.54, and still in the street when police arrived. How does she make the drive between 10.45 and 10.55 without neighbours seeing?

 

[31550]

Lydene at No.9 got home about 10:30.

And was unpacking groceries so would have noticed traffic.

 

[Angry Red Bull]

p

Either way she's damned. If the drive was squeezed in between talking to AMS and dialling 000 then it must have been done at considerable speed, so not really "looking for William".

If it was done before talking to AMS it makes no sense. Why drive to riding school before checking neighbours. Only if William is already dead.

AMS sent FM down to the bus shelter - how long to walk 300 metres down and back, look for William, hear a scream? Then get keys etc. ?

Rowley turned up when she was down the street so after her call she took off down street to then be met with Rowley who asked if she was the mum then headed back to house at 11.05. Means her trip by foot down the street happened just after 000 call imo.

Box is pushing an agenda. They the media want the story and the only way they get that story is if they push her cause.....so they have. Don't believe a word coming from him.

As for being ridiculous......no. Tight certainly. Improbable possibly but not ridiculous. Too much support for both FPs involvement and cross corroboration for it to be ridiculous.

If there is NO sign of W nor Cadaver then either we have all misread her COG behaviours OR it is an abduction. I prefer it being earlier which means the photos are wrong time

Lydene at No.9 got home about 10:30.

So her comment must have been I must have just missed him because id gone inside to unpack..something like that..I know she has regrets her routine was out a few minutes and missed catching the guy around 10.30 mark