Current Disappearance of 3yo William Tyrrell Pt 2 * FM guilty of assault & intimidation

[Kurve]

Continued from PART 1

Criminal charges the former foster parents currently face as at 15 April 2022 include:

• Apprehended Violence Orders on both (AVOs)
• Lying to the NSW Crime Commission on former foster mother *Not Guilty
• Lying to the NSW Crime Commission on former foster father *Not Guilty
• 2 x charges of assault against a child on former foster mother *Guilty
• 1 x charge of assault against a child on former foster father *Not Guilty
• Stalking &/or Intimidation on both *Guilty
• Dummy bidding real estate fraud *Guilty

TIMELINE

Where's William Tyrrell? - The Ch 10 podcast (under Coroner's subpoena)

Operation Arkstone

Suppression orders are in force, please use the following initials to indicate:

FM - Foster Mother
FF - Foster Father
FGM - Foster Grandmother
FD - Foster Daughter

Up to you if you wish to refer to them as former fosters but please write it in full, strictly using the above initials. No deviations.

Other initials posters will use informally but should not are:

BCR - Batar Creek Road
MW - Michelle White
SFR - Strike Force Rosann
AMS - Anne Maree Sharpley
One even reduced bike riding to - BR

 

[zedx]

​

“And the one thing that, among all that kind of long and detailed raking over of the evidence we've heard, is he talked about how the neighbors heard a car that morning. They heard a car on the gravel at the top end of Benaroon Drive, which is just outside the house where William was staying. And he says you can't prove that there was a car, but there's definitely evidence of a car being there.

And no one knows, no one's been able to prove who drove that car.

Yeah, Peter and Sherelle Crabb. So I went back and looked into that. And so they got home about 9.30 in the morning that day.

And they both testified in 2019 that they heard a car doing a U-turn in the street. They both thought it sounded like the postman at the time.

Yeah.

And Sherelle testified that the car was moving quite fast. But I did wonder, because there's been a lot of people testifying about cars, I did wonder the significance of the Crabbs in particular. Did he mention why he brought them up?

He's confident about the Crabbs' evidence because he says one of the detectives[…]”

From Witness: William Tyrrell: The Evidence | 5, 8 Nov 2024

This material may be protected by copyright.

I think we need to be careful with the Crabbs information. Firstly they did give a slight discrepancy on timing of the car turning in the gravel only 10-15 minutes though. Also they did not see the car, but said it was doing a 'u turn', how could they then, positively know it was doing a 'u turn'? I've heard a car outside doing something in the gravel drive way only to find out later it was doing something completely different to what I thought. If it was a u turn it could not have been the FM, as she would have reversed out onto the road (it was a cement drive way) and then driven forward on the road. Her cars tyres may have come into contact with 'some' gravel but IMO not enough to sound like a u turn.
Lastly the Crabb's house is situated at the top of the hill (gully below) which means the sound of the car on gravel could have amplified/echoed up the hill, IMO giving a false sense of exactly where the sound came from.

 

[Wallace52]

Just noticed this from the sticky/

Other initials posters will use informally but should not are:

BCR - Batar Creek Road
MW - Michelle White
SFR - Strike Force Rosann
One even reduced bike riding to - BR

 

[Lady O]

I think we need to be careful with the Crabbs information. Firstly they did give a slight discrepancy on timing of the car turning in the gravel only 10-15 minutes though. Also they did not see the car, but said it was doing a 'u turn', how could they then, positively know it was doing a 'u turn'? I've heard a car outside doing something in the gravel drive way only to find out later it was doing something completely different to what I thought. If it was a u turn it could not have been the FM, as she would have reversed out onto the road (it was a cement drive way) and then driven forward on the road. Her cars tyres may have come into contact with 'some' gravel but IMO not enough to sound like a u turn.
Lastly the Crabb's house is situated at the top of the hill (gully below) which means the sound of the car on gravel could have amplified/echoed up the hill, IMO giving a false sense of exactly where the sound came from.

Well, if the theory FM found WT deceased under the high verandah, she would have backed out of the concrete driveway and taken the car into the lower gravel driveway in order to load the body. So she either backed in or backed out.

 

[truecrimepath]

It's 1 diagonal block across from them. Quiet country town.



Agree, but there is probably one testimony that is accepted as the truest version. It is the reporting of it that clouds it further.



The "top end of the road" is literally in front of their house. It is the most likely place they will hear something.

You can see a car stop at 48, but you can’t be sure they stopped there by hearing it. It could have been one of three or four properties.

 

[Underarrest_]

Well, if the theory FM found WT deceased under the high verandah, she would have backed out of the concrete driveway and taken the car into the lower gravel driveway in order to load the body. So she either backed in or backed out.

Sounds feasible. Walks from side yard into lower garage, backs car in to lower garage and back to upper garage.
Ready to drive car out after neighbours are alerted (which is the police theory.)

 

[Lady O]

Sounds feasible. Walks from side yard into lower garage, backs car in to lower garage and back to upper garage.
Ready to drive car out after neighbours are alerted (which is the police theory.)

No, I think all this happened when he was first noticed missing. I don't believe anyone saw this trip.

 

[Angry Red Bull]

Did the cadaver dog find William’s scent or the scent of a dead human in the FGM car?

We don't know that information..I'd say not.

 

[Underarrest_]

No, I think all this happened when he was first noticed missing. I don't believe anyone saw this trip.

It’s possible.

 

[truecrimepath]

One account claims a car on gravel, and a stop at 48. The other claims no gravel and no stop. One claim is that it was about 9.45, the other about 10.10.

I am glad this is so clear cut.

 

[Angry Red Bull]

The location has to be virgin bush but with access road. Not a main road like BCR and nil houses in surrounds within 10 min max drive and in same direction as Cobb & co away from town

Looked at GE..my tip exactly 10 min drive is Mccolloms road. Virgin bush. Off main roads and nil houses. Middle of nowhere it seems

Any local input to locations virgin bush, no houses virtually no traffic within 10 mins of Benaroon?

The SFR needs to use Cadaver dogs within 15-20 metres of road surface on what amounts to be probably 6 streets within 10 min drive in secluded bush settings. The scent will STILL be there for those dogs..walk the dogs along those streets . They will detect it because she won't have gone further than 15 metres off the road imo.

This business of having feral animals take the body and therefore no longer cadaver scent is RUBBISH imo..

 

[Earls Smother]

One account claims a car on gravel, and a stop at 48. The other claims no gravel and no stop. One claim is that it was about 9.45, the other about 10.10.

I am glad this is so clear cut.

Yes, unfortunately each piece of information casts doubt on another piece. You can look at in multiple ways to suit your perspective.

There is enough doubt at this stage IMO, that it won't progress much further with the FM for now. They need more to charge her, but she certainly can't be ruled out.

So that's 1 of the 732 remaining POI's that is left as "possible" or "probable" depending on your viewpoint. That only leaves 731 to work through as efficiently as they have with her.

 

[Wallace52]

This business of having feral animals take the body and therefore no longer cadaver scent is RUBBISH imo

And I think that the Coroner knows it’s rubbish and that’s why it’s not being allowed to be heard
IMO

 

[Awakening]

Episode 6 seems to have been released early. It usually drops around midnight on a Monday ….

Is this your podcast?

 

[Earls Smother]

Sounds feasible. Walks from side yard into lower garage, backs car in to lower garage and back to upper garage.
Ready to drive car out after neighbours are alerted (which is the police theory.)

...steals excavator from Peter's truck whilst he is sorting out invoice with Michelle, digs dirty big hole, puts William in hole, fills in hole with excavator leaving ground surface looking untouched. Hole is luckily deeper than the smelling ability of cadaver dogs. Drives excavator back onto truck just before Peter returns. Drives back to 48 Benaroon unnoticed and sits down to cup of tea.

 

[Angry Red Bull]

And I think that the Coroner knows it’s rubbish and that’s why it’s not being allowed to be heard
IMO

They are suggesting there is NOTHING left of a child In a suit? How? I can't see it I'm afraid.

The cadaver evidence allegedly implicating McCann included a detection in the garden bed. There is no logical reason for THAT detection unless the perpetrator placed the dead body down there for seconds to check the street was clear then carried again. A minute at best but scent was still there months later

Cobb & co never had W there imo

 

[Wallace52]

They are suggesting there is NOTHING left of a child In a suit? How? I can't see it I'm afraid.

The cadaver evidence allegedly implicating McCann included a detection in the garden bed. There is no logical reason for THAT detection unless the perpetrator placed the dead body down there for seconds to check the street was clear then carried again. A minute at best but scent was still there months later

Cobb & co never had W there imo

They’re ruling out the accident, body disposal theory - right ?! Surely?

 

[Angry Red Bull]

They’re ruling out the accident, body disposal theory - right ?! Sure?

No. I personally think he was hidden just not at that location

 

[Wallace52]

Is this your podcast?

Ha ha no. Unless I am Nina Y in disguise? But I’m not.

But I did see early this morning on ** the other forum that it was out. So I shared the episode here.

Usually I am up by 5am Monday and it is never out the night before, so I am assuming it gets released at midnight on a Monday morning.

But then they put that other episode out randomly on a Friday so I am not sure if the inquest put their schedule out, or if there is no schedule and the episodes come out at random.

 

[Underarrest_]

...steals excavator from Peter's truck whilst he is sorting out invoice with Michelle, digs dirty big hole, puts William in hole, fills in hole with excavator leaving ground surface looking untouched. Hole is luckily deeper than the smelling ability of cadaver dogs. Drives excavator back onto truck just before Peter returns. Drives back to 48 Benaroon unnoticed and sits down to cup of tea.

I totally agree with what you’re saying. I don’t know how FM would find William and contain herself and dispose of him in a short time frame but we don’t know what people are capable of.
I’m no criminal and can’t fathom what some people do.
Just trying to look at it from all possibilities given police seem to think this for some reason.

 

[stormbird]

<snipped>

However I have wondered why Wendy Hudson didn’t have to answer questions at the inquest.

Donoghue has been adamant about the call she received, although the 9.43am reported time of his departure from tennis courts indicates the phone call to be very close to the 9.37 am taking of that iconic photo. IMO

(14 mins slow would better suit the narrative in my tiny mind )

Snr Cst Hudson did appear at a hearing in March 2019. Not much was reported about what she said. MOO, I think if the coroner had wanted to ask questions about what she did at the tennis courts that morning, Mr Craddock might have asked them then, but I don't know.

 

[Wallace52]

There is enough doubt at this stage IMO, that it won't progress much further with the FM for now.

Today is November 10, 2024.

So, let’s say the NSW Police homicide squad charged the foster mother today and somehow the case ended up in Court: Even if the cops produce everything they have on the foster mum at a Judge Only trial, right now, there would still be the issue of reasonable doubt. And it certainly wouldn’t pass through a jury, because again, reasonable doubt and 12 people would have to reach a consensus that the case was proven without reasonable doubt.

What the stike force really need is for the Coroner to rule that William is deceased, and then after that they can move forward with their case against the foster mum. If they have enough evidence.

There is no sense in charging her until the Coroner has declared him dead. It just won’t hold up. You can’t be charged with moving the body of a child who is still alive.



IMO

I also think that if they ever do lay further charges on the FM, they might lay the charge of interfering with a corpse before the charge of perverting the course of justice and just deal with one at a time.

'That's the reason we're here,' counsel assisting, Gerard Craddock SC, told Monday's hearing.

'The theory [is that] William must have died at [his foster grandmother's home at] 48 Benaroon Drive [in Kendall],' said Mr Craddock.

William Tyrrell's foster mother abused by a stranger at inquest

The incident was revealed as the second day of the resumed William Tyrrell inquest got underway in Sydney on Tuesday morning.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[truecrimepath]

Yes, unfortunately each piece of information casts doubt on another piece. You can look at in multiple ways to suit your perspective.

There is enough doubt at this stage IMO, that it won't progress much further with the FM for now. They need more to charge her, but she certainly can't be ruled out.

So that's 1 of the 732 remaining POI's that is left as "possible" or "probable" depending on your viewpoint. That only leaves 731 to work through as efficiently as they have with her.

I disagree. I think without any solid evidence, it’s a cold case. No point continuing this any longer. On what has been presented, they clearly don’t have enough to charge the FM or her family.

Someone will have to come forward and provide something so compelling that they open the case. Imho.

 

[Wallace52]

without any solid evidence, it’s a cold case. No point continuing this any longer.

Is that your opinion?

 

[truecrimepath]

Is that your opinion?

Yes. You know what I actually think.

I can’t see this being progressed without challenging some of the so called facts in the case. I can’t see investigators getting out of their mind set. We have no evidence for any third party abduction.

Craddock has it in his head the time line is correct from the very first hearings in 2019. He has never wavered in that belief. I would love to see the evidence for that and whether it stands up to scrutiny.

The whole week was about throwing the police theory under a bus, he is clearing the deck for an open finding.

Ask yourself, are they any closer than they were in September, 2014? If the answer is no, it’s cold case. Time to turn off the money tap.

 

[Wallace52]

Yes. You know what I actually think.

I can’t see this being progressed without challenging some of the so called facts in the case. I can’t see investigators getting out of their mind set. We have no evidence for any third party abduction.

Craddock has it in his head the time line is correct from the very first hearings in 2019. He has never wavered in that belief. I would love to see the evidence for that and whether it stands up to scrutiny.

The whole week was about throwing the police theory under a bus, he is clearing the deck for an open finding.

Ask yourself, are they any closer than they were in September, 2014? If the answer is no, it’s cold case. Time to turn off the money tap.

You know what I am thinking? I think they might need to run another inquest at some stage, and clear the decks. Get a new Barrister in place and just run it again.