Current Disappearance of 3yo William Tyrrell Pt 2 * FM guilty of assault & intimidation

[Kurve]

Continued from PART 1

Criminal charges the former foster parents currently face as at 15 April 2022 include:

• Apprehended Violence Orders on both (AVOs)
• Lying to the NSW Crime Commission on former foster mother *Not Guilty
• Lying to the NSW Crime Commission on former foster father *Not Guilty
• 2 x charges of assault against a child on former foster mother *Guilty
• 1 x charge of assault against a child on former foster father *Not Guilty
• Stalking &/or Intimidation on both *Guilty
• Dummy bidding real estate fraud *Guilty

TIMELINE

Where's William Tyrrell? - The Ch 10 podcast (under Coroner's subpoena)

Operation Arkstone

Suppression orders are in force, please use the following to indicate:

FM - Foster Mother
FF - Foster Father
FGM - Foster Grandmother
FD - Foster Daughter
FPs - Foster Parents

Up to you if you wish to refer to them as former fosters but please write it in full, strictly using the above initials. No deviations.

Other initials posters will use informally but should not are:

BCR - Batar Creek Road
MW - Michelle White
SFR - Strike Force Rosann
AMS - Anne Maree Sharpley
One even reduced bike riding to - BR

 

[31550]

All of it.

There's lots of stuff in Wendy Hudson's (see how I didn't type WH) notes which has never been explained. The spiderman suit on the fence for instance. Or the FF being absent from the house alone on Friday morning, ...

 

[Earls Smother]

I am struggling to think of one involving a toddler from a private residence, under the noses of adult carers and in broad daylight. I mean there is Madeleine McCann, but she was unsupervised, and in a public place not a private home, and it was night-time.

If you want to be that specific, of course there are not going to be many.

How do you explain 3 year olds drowning in broad daylight, under theoretical adult supervision, in private residences?

Things can happen pretty quickly and no-one is saying he was taken from inside the residence, literally under their noses. For it to happen, he would had to have wandered to at least the edge of the property. We know there was time for him to have done that. He also potentially, in his 3 year old mind had reason to do so - looking for return of FF.

After that, we don't know. He could have wandered further. It's not familiar territory to him - does he get disorientated and lost. A lot can happen in 5 minutes and you admit yourself, it could be an even longer window than that.

 

[Angry Red Bull]

Totally disagree. No-one knows whether he had put his shoes on or not.

She mentioned a hit to the head, as it is one of the major things you would be concerned about if you are not finding him quickly. For me, a fall and hit to the head, drowning in a neighbour's pool and someone taking him, would be worst case scenarios without much time to think. Wandering into the bush also right up there, particularly if there were snakes around.

Mentioning something is not COG behaviour, it is normal human reaction to fear the worst as time goes on.

So on FM narrative he went around the corner and went quiet. A hit to head isn't even on my radar as an explanation for why my child is missing and cant hear me. Hiding perhaps. Wandered perhaps..Gone inside perhaps. Playing across the street with a friend perhaps. But hit to head causing deafness isn't remotely on radar as first thought. You think of risks sure but risks obvious in circumstances. That wasn't..

How do you suppose she thought he may have hit his head alone just playing in the yard? What risk caused that outcome? Bike riding sure.....but that's something she watched and would know. What else? Falling brach not in a storm? How often would that happen? 1 in 1M?

We can agree to disagree.. Without something directly associating to a head knock it isn't something that would arise randomly in thoughts. Improbable and therefore more likely because he HAD had a hit in her care and already known. That becomes a convincing COG behaviour

 

[LRitz]

There's lots of stuff in Wendy Hudson's (see how I didn't type WH) notes which has never been explained. The spiderman suit on the fence for instance. Or the FF being absent from the house alone on Friday morning, ...

Senior Constable Wendy Denise Hudson from Port Macquarie notes are good.

Her notes (18 Sept) says she she returned to the FGM's house on Friday 12th at 6pm. FM was cooking something. Drinking wine. FF was upset.

What I wish I could see is what was SC Hudson was thinking about all of this. Did she think it was odd that Foster Parents were in the position to be able to prepare a meal. It is not clear if FF, FM, or both are drinking wine. And most importantly she does not report on the type of wine. They allegedly left Sydney earlier than planned. Did they have time to throw in a bottle of Pinot from Marlborough, or did FGM have wine to their taste in her cellar.

 

[31550]

If you want to be that specific, of course there are not going to be many.

How do you explain 3 year olds drowning in broad daylight, under theoretical adult supervision, in private residences?

Things can happen pretty quickly and no-one is saying he was taken from inside the residence, literally under their noses. For it to happen, he would had to have wandered to at least the edge of the property. We know there was time for him to have done that. He also potentially, in his 3 year old mind had reason to do so - looking for return of FF.

After that, we don't know. He could have wandered further. It's not familiar territory to him - does he get disorientated and lost. A lot can happen in 5 minutes and you admit yourself, it could be an even longer window than that.

He did not wander - no scent detected off the property. Extensive and immediate ground search did not find him.
He did not leave the property on foot. Must have been in a vehicle.
So how does he get into a vehicle in such a short time?
Yes, a random opportunistic abduction explains this, but these are typically from a public place where the offender is hanging out, or passing by. They are not from a private residence like this. And abductions occur when children are on their own for a period of time. They are not snatched out of parents hands or from under their noses. The chances of a random abductor being in exactly the right time and place are microscopic. Abductions of children from a residence where a parent or adult carer is present are even rarer - and especially rare during daylight hours - kids are usually taken at night and the cover of darkness - e.g. Eloise Worledge.
Cars could not come and go in that street in daylight without being noticed.

Kids drowning is another matter. Carelessness, lack of supervision, negligence - whatever you want to call it, there is a failing on the part of the adult who is supposed to be supervising.

But yes, accidents and incidents can escalate quickly. Most common cause of death of a 3YO is a drowning or a fall. If William drowned or fell, who removed him from the property? Who was there, had access to a car, and had time to do so before the alarm was raised? Or was it not an accident, and that is why he was removed?

 

[31550]

Senior Constable Wendy Denise Hudson from Port Macquarie notes are good.

Her notes (18 Sept) says she she returned to the FGM's house on Friday 12th at 6pm. FM was cooking something. Drinking wine. FF was upset.

What I wish I could see is what was SC Hudson was thinking about all of this. Did she think it was odd that Foster Parents were in the position to be able to prepare a meal. It is not clear if FF, FM, or both are drinking wine. And most importantly she does not report on the type of wine. They allegedly left Sydney earlier than planned. Did they have time to throw in a bottle of Pinot from Marlborough, or did FGM have wine to their taste in her cellar.

Possibly the type of people for whom packing a couple of bottles of vintage wine to have with their home-cooked dinner was more important than providing a healthy dinner option for their two foster kids, or thinking to change them into comfortable nightwear, or even taking the air mattress, so that they wouldn't have to share beds. Possibly the type of people who wouldn't notice the danger of a 5 metre balcony for a 3YO. Possibly the type of people who were more concerned with "how it might look for them" if a child in their care died or had a serious accident, so get rid of the evidence in case they were seen as anything other than perfect parents where "everyone was happy"? Possibly the type of people who would assault and intimidate a child in their care? IMO

 

[Earls Smother]

He did not wander - no scent detected off the property. Extensive and immediate ground search did not find him.
He did not leave the property on foot. Must have been in a vehicle.
So how does he get into a vehicle in such a short time?
Yes, a random opportunistic abduction explains this, but these are typically from a public place where the offender is hanging out, or passing by. They are not from a private residence like this. And abductions occur when children are on their own for a period of time. They are not snatched out of parents hands or from under their noses. The chances of a random abductor being in exactly the right time and place are microscopic. Abductions of children from a residence where a parent or adult carer is present are even rarer - and especially rare during daylight hours - kids are usually taken at night and the cover of darkness - e.g. Eloise Worledge.
Cars could not come and go in that street in daylight without being noticed.

Kids drowning is another matter. Carelessness, lack of supervision, negligence - whatever you want to call it, there is a failing on the part of the adult who is supposed to be supervising.

But yes, accidents and incidents can escalate quickly. Most common cause of death of a 3YO is a drowning or a fall. If William drowned or fell, who removed him from the property? Who was there, had access to a car, and had time to do so before the alarm was raised? Or was it not an accident, and that is why he was removed?

Random opportunistic abduction can be from anywhere - hence the term.

There is no body where it should be if FM did it.

There is no cadaver dog reaction anywhere she has been, including the vehicle she drove in.

There is no witnesses who saw anything to suggest she is involved.

There is no blood or DNA on the property to suggest an accident.

All we have is you banging on about it endlessly.

Confucius say: Man who bang on, not necessarily bang on.

 

[BFew]

If he was in the Mazda, he would have been wrapped in something. This could also be why the FM was asked about what was in the garage.

Hence the "drops (drop sheets)" being mentioned.

 

[BFew]

Has SFR ever produced for public consumption a grid of full search areas both initial and strategic together with cadaver dog patterns from within them?...........and for TCP benefit.....does it include McDonald's

Something like that was shown and discussed last Tuesday at the inquest during the two Policer dog handler's witness evidence and cross-examination. (Maccas not included).

 

[BFew]

I'm not sure he needed to be wrapped in anything, if he wasn't bleeding, and was going to be immediately driven somewhere. I also think the Mazda hatch has a privacy screen thingy similar to this:
View attachment 2162592

For the actual car see below footage of it from various angles.

 

[31550]

Random opportunistic abduction can be from anywhere - hence the term.

There is no body where it should be if FM did it.

There is no cadaver dog reaction anywhere she has been, including the vehicle she drove in.

There is no witnesses who saw anything to suggest she is involved.

There is no blood or DNA on the property to suggest an accident.

All we have is you banging on about it endlessly.

Confucius say: Man who bang on, not necessarily bang on.

We don't know exactly where she drove, only where she said she drove.
The body may have been subsequently moved.
Cadaver dog evidence is not infallible, and we don't know if cadaver dogs have been to where she actually took him.
Plenty of evidence including her own testimony demonstrates she had the means to move the body, and the time. And now an alibi - 'looking for William' - before searching closer to home or informing anyone else he was missing.
No blood / DNA - may have been blunt force trauma, suffocation or drowning, or anything which doesn't leave blood - e.g. broken neck. But note this was covered for in the narrative just in case - "William deliberately crashed his bike into the garden." There is the wound on FM hand which might indicate something other than her alibi.
Doesn't have to have been an accident - may have been a punishment gone wrong or a violent reaction to something.

 

[BFew]

The coroner has nothing to do with the NSWCC. NSWCC was set up to do more than just investigate organised crime. However I do agree it is interesting that NSWPOL sought to engage NSWCC in this particular case. Even more interesting is that they seem to have come up with donuts, although only time will tell. The NSWCC seems to have spent most of their time investigating the assault, and very little time investigating William's disappearance - very strange.

For some information on the relationship between the NSW Coroner, NSW Police and the NSW Crime Commission,
I refer readers to my extensive Nov 2022 post in part one of this case thread.

 

[phonics_mnemonics]

She doesn't necessarily know that he hasn't gone there. It is understandable to me that someone living in that house would consider that as one of the worse case scenarios.

Her saying that doesn't really fit with the stuff she said on 60 Minutes. About how she imagined someone going "clump" on his shoulders and taking him away.

 

[BFew]

You don't think there would have been leaks if there was anything of genuine interest?

So how come none of the media appear to have reported/published on things like the mention of the drops sheets, and the questioning of the foster mother about the FGM's car locked/unlocked situation?

 

[alwaysintrigued]

For some information on the relationship between the NSW Coroner, NSW Police and the NSW Crime Commission,
I refer readers to my extensive Nov 2022 post in part one of this case thread.

Mr Craddock said on Thursday 7/11/24 at the inquest:

Craddock : "Here it would seem NSWPF approached the NSW Crime Commission with a request that it give consideration of an investigation. That's not something that was done by the Coroner or anyone assisting the Coroner"

 

[Earls Smother]

So how come none of the media appear to have reported/published on things like the mention of the drops sheets, and the questioning of the foster mother about the FGM's car locked/unlocked situation?

Those things would only be relevant if they added weight to other existing evidence.

I would think not having drop sheets in a shed or garage, would almost be more abnormal than having them. I certainly do.

Car unlocked/locked. Who cares? She needed the keys to drive the bloody thing either way. If William was hiding in an open car alive, do you really think the past decade would have followed the same path?

 

[Earls Smother]

Was all of this from the inquest in March 2019 ever fully explained? Particularly the end bit. Or just conveniently ignored as time went on?



“I am just trying to find this red.

“I think, in all this green, I’ve got to see red somewhere.

“Where’s the red? Why can’t I see the red?”

It was a Thursday morning, around 10:30am when the cries, “William, William,” began echoing through Benaroon Drive, a quiet street in Kendall.

Situated on the mid north coast of New South Wales, about a four hour drive from Sydney city, the small town of Kendall is surrounded by thick bushland. As you enter, there are three sculptures of gum leaves known as the ‘Leaves of Kendall’.

It was the greenery that WT's FM says still haunts her years later.

So much green. And all she wanted was a hint of red.

That morning, September 11, 2014, three-and-a-half-year-old William and his sister had awoken early at their foster grandmother’s home. They were, “excited to see Nanna”.

William was dressed in his favourite Spider-Man suit, a gift purchased for the toddler in Bali.

After breakfast and going for a walk, William played in the yard, roaring like a tiger.

His foster mother quickly made a cup of tea, before finding William on the deck, insisting he was a “daddy tiger”. She took the last photograph of William. It was 9:37am.

He ducked and ran and rushed out from corners, immersed in a world of his own.

William's foster mother then sat down for a cup of tea with her own mother where, according to the counsel assisting the inquest, Gerard Craddock, SC, the two spoke about how "boisterous and loud" William was, before his foster mother remarked, "he's a boy... that's just how they are."

A few moments later, the yard went quiet.

"It had become quiet," his foster mother described. "Too quiet."

According to Craddock, she raced into the yard, searching through ferns and trees, desperately wanting to see a flash of red.

In court, his foster mother cried as she said, "he wouldn't do it".

"He wouldn't hide, he's not brave enough.

"I raced around the house, opened every single cupboard, every wardrobe."

But the little boy dressed as Spider-Man had vanished.

It was six days after the disappearance of William that his foster mother says she had a "flash".

"The brain is a really weird thing. It will recollect things when you least expect it," she told the NSW inquest on Monday.

"With William missing it went right out of my mind..."

She says she vividly remembers waking up on the morning that William went missing, and seeing two cars parked opposite the house.

It was "odd" because the houses on the street all had long driveways, so, as she reasoned during the NSW inquest, "if you were visiting someone you'd drive up to the house, not walk from the street".

"Who's the car mummy?" she remembers her foster daughter asking, as she rode her bike in the front yard.

The cars were white and grey, and described as "old" and "dirty".

On that same morning, William's foster mother also recalls seeing a large "thick-necked" man with short red hair and a pale, weathered face on her street. They made eye contact.

"You know when you look at someone and there’s that second challenge, ‘why are you watching me, I am watching you’," she told the NSW inquest.

"It was fleeting," she said, but something about that man's face stuck with her.

 

[alwaysintrigued]

So how come none of the media appear to have reported/published on things like the mention of the drops sheets, and the questioning of the foster mother about the FGM's car locked/unlocked situation?

Because it was not worth reporting on IMO

Was all of this from the inquest in March 2019 ever fully explained? Particularly the end bit. Or just conveniently ignored as time went on?



“I am just trying to find this red.

“I think, in all this green, I’ve got to see red somewhere.

“Where’s the red? Why can’t I see the red?”

It was a Thursday morning, around 10:30am when the cries, “William, William,” began echoing through Benaroon Drive, a quiet street in Kendall.

Situated on the mid north coast of New South Wales, about a four hour drive from Sydney city, the small town of Kendall is surrounded by thick bushland. As you enter, there are three sculptures of gum leaves known as the ‘Leaves of Kendall’.

It was the greenery that WT's FM says still haunts her years later.

So much green. And all she wanted was a hint of red.

That morning, September 11, 2014, three-and-a-half-year-old William and his sister had awoken early at their foster grandmother’s home. They were, “excited to see Nanna”.

William was dressed in his favourite Spider-Man suit, a gift purchased for the toddler in Bali.

After breakfast and going for a walk, William played in the yard, roaring like a tiger.

His foster mother quickly made a cup of tea, before finding William on the deck, insisting he was a “daddy tiger”. She took the last photograph of William. It was 9:37am.

He ducked and ran and rushed out from corners, immersed in a world of his own.

William's foster mother then sat down for a cup of tea with her own mother where, according to the counsel assisting the inquest, Gerard Craddock, SC, the two spoke about how "boisterous and loud" William was, before his foster mother remarked, "he's a boy... that's just how they are."

A few moments later, the yard went quiet.

"It had become quiet," his foster mother described. "Too quiet."

According to Craddock, she raced into the yard, searching through ferns and trees, desperately wanting to see a flash of red.

In court, his foster mother cried as she said, "he wouldn't do it".

"He wouldn't hide, he's not brave enough.

"I raced around the house, opened every single cupboard, every wardrobe."

But the little boy dressed as Spider-Man had vanished.

It was six days after the disappearance of William that his foster mother says she had a "flash".

"The brain is a really weird thing. It will recollect things when you least expect it," she told the NSW inquest on Monday.

"With William missing it went right out of my mind..."

She says she vividly remembers waking up on the morning that William went missing, and seeing two cars parked opposite the house.

It was "odd" because the houses on the street all had long driveways, so, as she reasoned during the NSW inquest, "if you were visiting someone you'd drive up to the house, not walk from the street".

"Who's the car mummy?" she remembers her foster daughter asking, as she rode her bike in the front yard.

The cars were white and grey, and described as "old" and "dirty".

On that same morning, William's foster mother also recalls seeing a large "thick-necked" man with short red hair and a pale, weathered face on her street. They made eye contact.

"You know when you look at someone and there’s that second challenge, ‘why are you watching me, I am watching you’," she told the NSW inquest.

"It was fleeting," she said, but something about that man's face stuck with her.

Detective Laura Beacroft did alot of work with all the cars, she was unable to identify them.

It's very clear to me that people can drive in & out of Benaroon Drive with nobody noticing IMO

 

[Kurve]

Because it was not worth reporting on IMO

I think it is worth reporting on, we're all trying to get a sense of what the cops think happened and why they dug up half of Batar Creek Road.

 

[Kurve]

Mr Craddock said on Thursday 7/11/24 at the inquest:

Craddock : "Here it would seem NSWPF approached the NSW Crime Commission with a request that it give consideration of an investigation. That's not something that was done by the Coroner or anyone assisting the Coroner"

How good is your shorthand? Or do you have a transcript?

 

[alwaysintrigued]

How good is your shorthand? Or do you have a transcript?

Why would I have a transcript?

 

[BFew]

Mr Craddock said on Thursday 7/11/24 at the inquest:

Craddock : "Here it would seem NSWPF approached the NSW Crime Commission with a request that it give consideration of an investigation. That's not something that was done by the Coroner or anyone assisting the Coroner"

Which media article did this come from?
I now recall reading something like this recently.

 

[alwaysintrigued]

Which media article did this come from?
I now recall reading something like this recently.

No media article, my own notes that I took.

 

[Kurve]

Why would I have a transcript?

I don't know, I'm just asking. You have very precisely, quoted something Craddock said, I assume among a heap of other stuff he said. Most in the general public wouldn't be able to keep up writing notes that specific.

 

[alwaysintrigued]

I don't know, I'm just asking. You have very precisely, quoted something Craddock said, I assume among a heap of other stuff he said. Most in the general public wouldn't be able to keep up writing notes that specific.

I guess I'm lucky Mr Craddock talks very slowly with lots of pauses