Current Disappearance of 3yo William Tyrrell * The foster mother has been recommended for charges of pervert the course of justice & interfere with a corpse

[Kurve]

Criminal charges the former foster parents currently face as at 15 April 2022 include:

• Apprehended Violence Orders on both (AVOs)
• Lying to the NSW Crime Commission on former foster mother *Not Guilty
• Lying to the NSW Crime Commission on former foster father *Not Guilty
• 2 x charges of assault against a child on former foster mother *Guilty
• 1 x charge of assault against a child on former foster father
• Stalking &/or Intimidation on both
• Dummy bidding real estate fraud *Guilty

TIMELINE

Where's William Tyrrell? - The Ch 10 podcast (under Coroner's subpoena)

Operation Arkstone

 

[Kurve]

Perhaps the reported trip down Batar Creek Rd was a diversion from what really happened

Agree, that might have been a deliberate mislead and could even play in later on if charges ever eventuate. The police might have gone back and managed to map every single device in the area with their 'new investigative overlay tool' and found something, or not found something that should be there but isn't.

 

[stormbird]

The police had to track down the FGM's vehicle last year to perform a forensic examination 7 years after the event, after they decided the FM was a prime suspect and therefore we can assume no examination of that vehicle occurred earlier. This was a obviously a critical error made by police. IMO - If the FM was involved in WT's disappearance, it's most likely that the trip in FGM's vehicle never happened and it was fabricated to lead police away from the real disposal area. In terms of when that claimed trip happened, you would assume it's after the FF had returned home, because you would assume she knew the FF had just travelled down Batar Ck Road to the intersection of Benaroon Dr and would have seen WT if he was wandering towards Kendall and thus she claimed she drove towards the riding school heading south to make sure the story made some logical sense.

FGM's car was forensically examined earlier (I'm guessing in 2014, but neither of these sources put a time on it):

[A forensic search of FGM's house was conducted three days after William disappeared.] "There was nothing to indicate that a crime had taken place there.
There had been forensic testing of William's foster nana's car, and of the new four-wheel-drive. His foster parents had surrendered computers and phones for forensic testing, too."
- Missing William Tyrrell, 2021 rev.ed., pp.94-95

"Later [after FGM's house had been "searched and re-searched"], [FGM's] car would be tested for fingerprints, as would [FF's]. Both vehicles were forensically examined. The results of those tests confirmed the foster family's statements about the use of the vehicles and didn't yield anything significant."
- Searching for Spiderman, 2020, p.109

 

[NRL Fan]

Another theory worth considering: Perhaps the reported trip down Batar Creek Rd was a diversion from what really happened? Mabe the FGM car was used to move William. But just in case someone saw the car, FM "invented" the trip with the excuse she was looking for William. Which means she didn't take William to the riding school, nor did she follow him in that direction. Where else could she have gone? Not towards Kendall, or she would have been seen on CCTV or by witnesses. The only other way she could have gone was along Ellendale Crescent towards the cemetery. Then maybe FM or whoever drove handed William over to someone waiting with a car at the cemetery? This third person could have escaped with William without being detected on CCTV - might even have been the speeding cars seen by Chapman! Is this a possible scenario?

I think the cemetary is a highly possible resting place for WT. Regarding the Chapman vehicles, we dismissed those on the basis of no supported CCTV at the tennis courts noted by police and those vehicles would have driven right past the camera, which recorded the FF on his travels.

 

[fazacs1]

What I find odd is that the FM made no mention of this drive in her 6-page statement given on 14th September 2014. Neither is it mentioned in the later 29-page statement made March 2015. I don't recall when this drive was made public, but I think she spoke about it on the 60-Minutes interview? What would be the reason for not disclosing this drive earlier? Jubelin seems to be confident the drive by FM took place, even describing how she got out of the car at the riding school. But how does he know it happened at all? From the phone records, it seems FM's phone was turned off on the 12th September until late afternoon/evening, so there would not have been phone pings.

It's not clear when this drive took place, but if we take the 14 Sep 2014 FM statement at face value, there is just no time for this to have happened before the FF returned home at 10:30. FM was walking up Batar Ck Rd and then met up with FF in the driveway according to all accounts - FM, FF and FGM stories all seem to confirm this. The 000 call was made just before 11:00am, so it's possible the drive took place after FF returned home and before the 000 call. It seems unlikely she made the drive AFTER the 000 call as she waited for police, who did not take long to arrive, and then the property was quickly filled with people, so she would have been seen driving off. So I'm assuming the drive was between 10:30 and 10:55am.
So, why did FM take FGMs car and not FF's car? Or why not get FF to take the drive looking for William?
It seems to me that either

• the drive did not take place as FM described it OR
• she deliberately omitted the drive from statements in 2014 and 2015 OR
• the 2014 statement is false

Maybe the drive took place between 9.50 and 10.15, no times are set in concrete. The only times we know in this case are FFs calls and msg, the call to Spedding, and if FFs phone was off how did she see FFs msg? Was her phone deliberately turned off, so she could not be tracked, we don’t know exactly how long the car trip was, was it to the private airfield or a prearranged handover in another direction?

 

[fazacs1]

View attachment 1540869Part of a 44 page statement made by FF on 14 Sep 2014.

Weird, I couldn’t find any abn matching Brody Corporation in Queensland,

 

[Poppy Penny]

Weird, I couldn’t find any abn matching Brody Corporation in Queensland,

Good pick up. Surely this was followed up and verified at the time?

 

[31550]

Maybe the drive took place between 9.50 and 10.15, no times are set in concrete. The only times we know in this case are FFs calls and msg, the call to Spedding, and if FFs phone was off how did she see FFs msg? Was her phone deliberately turned off, so she could not be tracked, we don’t know exactly how long the car trip was, was it to the private airfield or a prearranged handover in another direction?

I am only going by the call records attached to the FM Statement in 2015. There are no calls or SMSs between late Thursday afternoon 11 Sep 2014 and approx 2:20pm on 12 Sep 2014. We can't tell if the phone was switched on or had signal during this period (from these records).
So, there is no record that FM received the 'home in 5' text message from FF when it was sent. Maybe he sent it via instant message rather than SMS? Or she may have not seen the message until later. She used FGM landline in the morning and to make the 000 call, so perhaps her phone was flat or turned off or had no signal? These records only show calls and SMS, not pings.

I don't subscribe to the 'handover' theory, but anything is possible. I think more likely there was an accident/incident or an altercation between William and someone else. He may have run away and FM may have followed, or she may have driven him away as some sort of response to the incident (either for help or for punishment). Maybe she followed him to the cemetery and he ran away and she couldn't find him or be bothered chasing him. Or maybe she took him there and he ran away. Maybe someone else was lurking nearby and grabbed him without her knowing?

 

[Kurve]

So, there is no record that FM received the 'home in 5' text message from FF when it was sent. Maybe he sent it via instant message rather than SMS? Or she may have not seen the message until later. She used FGM landline in the morning and to make the 000 call, so perhaps her phone was flat or turned off or had no signal? These records only show calls and SMS, not pings.

He sent that text via Siri iirc?

 

[31550]

He sent that text via Siri iirc?

Understand that, but Siri is not a transport mechanism. Siri is just a way of using your voice to get your phone to do something instead of typing or tapping. Using your phone (with or without Siri), you can send an SMS message (which uses the phone network) or you can send an iMessage or Facebook Message, or WhatsApp message, ... or any other number of instant messages. It's not clear whether FF sent an SMS or some sort of other instant message.

 

[stormbird]

FM's hearing for the false or misleading information charge should be shown on the NSW Online Registry by now - it was supposedly set for 03 and 04 Nov 2022. But as far as I can find there are no results across the next three weeks, which is as far as the registry website shows.

The same thing happened before FF's hearing which had supposedly been set for 12 and 13 Oct 2022 (see my post #7,301) and on those days there were no news reports saying that it went ahead; recently (see below) Daily Mail Australia said it will happen in Feb 2023.

The false or misleading information charges are the only ones so far said to be related to William's disappearance, so for me are the only ones that seem to actually be relevant:

"In April [2022], the couple were charged for knowingly giving false or misleading information to the NSW Crime Commission hearing about William Tyrrell's disappearance.
The foster mother will face a hearing next month [Nov 2022] and the foster father will face a hearing next February [2023]."
- Daily Mail Australia, 20 Oct 2022

 

[stormbird]

I am only going by the call records attached to the FM Statement in 2015. There are no calls or SMSs between late Thursday afternoon 11 Sep 2014 and approx 2:20pm on 12 Sep 2014. We can't tell if the phone was switched on or had signal during this period (from these records).
So, there is no record that FM received the 'home in 5' text message from FF when it was sent. Maybe he sent it via instant message rather than SMS? Or she may have not seen the message until later. She used FGM landline in the morning and to make the 000 call, so perhaps her phone was flat or turned off or had no signal? These records only show calls and SMS, not pings.

I don't subscribe to the 'handover' theory, but anything is possible. I think more likely there was an accident/incident or an altercation between William and someone else. He may have run away and FM may have followed, or she may have driven him away as some sort of response to the incident (either for help or for punishment). Maybe she followed him to the cemetery and he ran away and she couldn't find him or be bothered chasing him. Or maybe she took him there and he ran away. Maybe someone else was lurking nearby and grabbed him without her knowing?

Just re the call records saying that FM's phone was not used until the afternoon:

From Missing William Tyrrell, 2021 rev. ed., p.45:
"[William's caseworker, BA] was on a train, heading to an appointment, when his phone rang shortly after 12.53 p.m. on Friday, 12 September 2014.
He knew the number - it was William Tyrrell's foster mum - so of course he picked up." BBM

If it's true that FM's mobile phone didn't make any calls until later that afternoon, and if it's true that William's caseworker recognised from the number displayed that it would be FM calling, then FM must have been using an alternative phone which was already known by the caseworker. If it was FGM's landline (which FM had used for calls earlier), maybe the bulk approval for William's visits to Kendall had that phone number listed as a contact? Whichever phone it was, presumably it had been used to call the caseworker before or he had previously saved it as a contact, IMO, which might mean that FM's use of an alternative phone was not unusual or at least not unexpected.

Just to add, the book explains the apparent delay in calling the caseworker: when the first police officer drove up Benaroon Drive at 11:06 he stopped to talk to FM near the intersection with Ellendale Crescent and she told him she was William's foster mum (p.29). He then drove up to FGM's house and was let in at the front door by FGM; he spoke to FF in the time between FF running out of the bathroom and down the front steps; and he started searching the house room by room (p.30).

"He was still looking when William's foster mum came to find him, to again say that William was a foster child, and she needed to call FaCS and tell them what had happened.
'Let's hold off for a minute,' [Senior Constable CR] said. 'He can't have gotten far. Let's see if we can find him.'
- Missing William Tyrrell, 2021 rev. ed., p.30

 

[31550]

Just re the call records saying that FM's phone was not used until the afternoon:

From Missing William Tyrrell, 2021 rev. ed., p.45:
"[William's caseworker, BA] was on a train, heading to an appointment, when his phone rang shortly after 12.53 p.m. on Friday, 12 September 2014.
He knew the number - it was William Tyrrell's foster mum - so of course he picked up." BBM

If it's true that FM's mobile phone didn't make any calls until later that afternoon, and if it's true that William's caseworker recognised from the number displayed that it would be FM calling, then FM must have been using an alternative phone which was already known by the caseworker. If it was FGM's landline (which FM had used for calls earlier), maybe the bulk approval for William's visits to Kendall had that phone number listed as a contact? Whichever phone it was, presumably it had been used to call the caseworker before or he had been previously saved it as a contact, IMO, which might mean that FM's use of an alternative phone was not unusual or at least not unexpected.

Just to add, the book explains the apparent delay in calling the caseworker: when the first police officer drove up Benaroon Drive at 11:06 he stopped to talk to FM near the intersection with Ellendale Crescent and she told him she was William's foster mum (p.29). He then drove up to FGM's house and was let in at the front door by FGM; he spoke to FF in the time between FF running out of the bathroom and down the front steps; and he started searching the house room by room (p.30).

"He was still looking when William's foster mum came to find him, to again say that William was a foster child, and she needed to call FaCS and tell them what had happened.
'Let's hold off for a minute,' [Senior Constable CR] said. 'He can't have gotten far. Let's see if we can find him.'
- Missing William Tyrrell, 2021 rev. ed., p.30

Good pickup. IF Overington's account is true, and IF the phone records attached are complete and accurate regarding FM's phone.
It also means FM left the house after dialling 000 and went down Benaroon to Ellendale. Hadn't she already gone down there once before? Why go down again, especially if the police are on their way? And despite FF saying he looked desperately and extensively for William in the backyard and neighbours yards for some time, it must have been less than 30 minutes for him to be in the bathroom when police arrived.

Here's the phone records for the 11th and 12th - no call to BA at 12:53pm

 

[Awakening]

Good pickup. IF Overington's account is true, and IF the phone records attached are complete and accurate regarding FM's phone.
It also means FM left the house after dialling 000 and went down Benaroon to Ellendale. Hadn't she already gone down there once before? Why go down again, especially if the police are on their way? And despite FF saying he looked desperately and extensively for William in the backyard and neighbours yards for some time, it must have been less than 30 minutes for him to be in the bathroom when police arrived.

Here's the phone records for the 11th and 12th - no call to BA at 12:53pm


View attachment 1542172

Perhaps she went down again to wait for police?

 

[Poppy Penny]

Recommend "The Widow of Walcha", by Emma Partridge.

Yes, it was a great read. Thanks for recommendation.

 

[31550]

Perhaps she went down again to wait for police?

Maybe she called FACS from FF's phone? We don't have his phone records, unfortunately.

 

[Liandra]

FGM's car was forensically examined earlier (I'm guessing in 2014, but neither of these sources put a time on it):

[A forensic search of FGM's house was conducted three days after William disappeared.] "There was nothing to indicate that a crime had taken place there.
There had been forensic testing of William's foster nana's car, and of the new four-wheel-drive. His foster parents had surrendered computers and phones for forensic testing, too."
- Missing William Tyrrell, 2021 rev.ed., pp.94-95

"Later [after FGM's house had been "searched and re-searched"], [FGM's] car would be tested for fingerprints, as would [FF's]. Both vehicles were forensically examined. The results of those tests confirmed the foster family's statements about the use of the vehicles and didn't yield anything significant."
- Searching for Spiderman, 2020, p.109

FGM's car was forensically examined at Port Mac on the 20th Sept 2014.

 

[31550]

Maybe she called FACS from FF's phone? We don't have his phone records, unfortunately.

But then Wendy Hudson has this to say (see attached clip from WH statement)
So FM had her phone out in the afternoon, and looked it up to see when she got the text from FF. So she could have used it to call FACS.
I suspect the phone call records have been edited and this is not the complete list of calls/texts made / received from FM's phone, even though this seems to be the list attached to the police statement.
I wonder who edited the list and why not all calls/texts are being included in the statement.

OR - did FM have two phones or 2 SIMs?

 

[Poppy Penny]

I wonder who edited the list and why not all calls/texts are being included in the statement.
OR - did FM have two phones or 2 SIMs?

I reckon 2 phones - changing SIMs would be messy

 

[DonnaHayward]

I reckon 2 phones - changing SIMs would be messy

In this interview with Gary Jubelin, Ben Fordham asks GJ if he knows anything about the FM having 2 phones...

 

[NRL Fan]

I am only going by the call records attached to the FM Statement in 2015. There are no calls or SMSs between late Thursday afternoon 11 Sep 2014 and approx 2:20pm on 12 Sep 2014. We can't tell if the phone was switched on or had signal during this period (from these records).
So, there is no record that FM received the 'home in 5' text message from FF when it was sent. Maybe he sent it via instant message rather than SMS? Or she may have not seen the message until later. She used FGM landline in the morning and to make the 000 call, so perhaps her phone was flat or turned off or had no signal? These records only show calls and SMS, not pings.

I don't subscribe to the 'handover' theory, but anything is possible. I think more likely there was an accident/incident or an altercation between William and someone else. He may have run away and FM may have followed, or she may have driven him away as some sort of response to the incident (either for help or for punishment). Maybe she followed him to the cemetery and he ran away and she couldn't find him or be bothered chasing him. Or maybe she took him there and he ran away. Maybe someone else was lurking nearby and grabbed him without her knowing?

When I did my trip to the house a few months back, I checked the mobile signal from the house and it's about 3 bars but the reception might have improved since 2014. However, we still had GSM back then and that has better long range reception and SMS only needs a very small signal and will work well below the voice signal threshold. I also did a plot from Jolly Nose Hill to the house and it has radio line of sight, so it's more likely that the FM had her mobile switched off. So, the question is why was it turned off until after 2:00pm ?. Was it done intentionally so her movements couldn't be tracked ?

 

[Awakening]

When I did my trip to the house a few months back, I checked the mobile signal from the house and it's about 3 bars but the reception might have improved since 2014. However, we still had GSM back then and that has better long range reception and SMS only needs a very small signal and will work well below the voice signal threshold. I also did a plot from Jolly Nose Hill to the house and it has radio line of sight, so it's more likely that the FM had her mobile switched off. So, the question is why was it turned off until after 2:00pm ?. Was it done intentionally so her movements couldn't be tracked ?

I’m always on 3 bars. I dream of 4.

 

[NRL Fan]

But then Wendy Hudson has this to say (see attached clip from WH statement)
So FM had her phone out in the afternoon, and looked it up to see when she got the text from FF. So she could have used it to call FACS.
I suspect the phone call records have been edited and this is not the complete list of calls/texts made / received from FM's phone, even though this seems to be the list attached to the police statement.
I wonder who edited the list and why not all calls/texts are being included in the statement.

OR - did FM have two phones or 2 SIMs?

The police would have checked the B party mobile number in the FF's txt message and we should know if the FM had two mobile numbers. Assuming the records were not removed, the FM would not be able to check the time of FF's txt if her mobile is off and she would receive the txt with the received time-stamp from her own mobile after tuning it back on, where it would appear with the later time. So, why would she bother checking ???. This seems to be an interesting inconsistency.

 

[fazacs1]

His meeting finished before 10am. He then went to the chemist. Then he made a call "around 10:15" (possibly driving at this time) and arrived at the house "around 10:30". Lakewood (or rather the Woolworths) is only 6km from Kendall by road. The trip back would take less than 10 minutes, plus the time he stopped at the general store for newspapers. I don't see any major discrepancy here.

But FF says he went to lake Cathie? in that police statement.

 

[stormbird]

<snipped> And despite FF saying he looked desperately and extensively for William in the backyard and neighbours yards for some time, it must have been less than 30 minutes for him to be in the bathroom when police arrived.

In one section of FF's walk-through he says that up until FM was asking whether to call police (which I suppose would be close to 10:56 am or about 10 minutes before the first police officer arrived) he had searched for 10 or 15 minutes, indicating that it was over an area including the backyard of No.52 Benaroon and some properties in Ellendale Crescent (I think Nos.13 and 15), but he hadn't made it back as far as No.30 Benaroon and the road in that time.

From about 4 minutes in the 5:12 min video: William Tyrrell's disappearance inquest shown police video, Daily Telegraph, 25 March 2019

 

[Poppy Penny]

But FF says he went to lake Cathie? in that police statement.

Good pickup - that’s miles away and just doesn’t make sense.