Autopsy Draw

[noise36]

I have watched the Chappy mark and Mooses's goal so many times now, it was the opposite of how these games normally go for for us, normally its in our defense and we are scrambling to stop them stealing the game. i.e. Blues and Power

I had another look at the moment of Sharps kick, definitely no option to give to a teammate as I had first thought, Treacy giving a perfect block on Sidebottom who was charging in, but Maynard had already given up made no attempt to tackle, with the benefit of hindsight Sharp maybe had another second or so to improve his angle but ultimately there wasn't much more he could have done, was just pure luck at that point, given all the luck we had in the minutes prior I think it just ran out, so close but wrong side of the post.

 

[arsesmart]

Fair enough, still need to drop Fyfe.

Fyfe plays a selfless strategic role. Because he's Fyfe opposition attention is warped by his orbit. His contested abilities draw the tacklers and allow our other mids more time space.

There was a classic play the other night, where there was I think a two on two, Fyfe wins the ball, waits until both opposition players are more completely committed to him before handing it over to his teammate who's suddenly freed up in space. Could've easily got it off earlier, made it easier on himself and still be seen as a reasonable play.

His composure in doing that gets hidden in the fact he's delivering the ball under a heap more heat.

 

[arsesmart]

I have watched the Chappy mark and Mooses's goal so many times now, it was the opposite of how these games normally go for for us, normally its in our defense and we are scrambling to stop them stealing the game. i.e. Blues and Power

I had another look at the moment of Sharps kick, definitely no option to give to a teammate as I had first thought, Treacy giving a perfect block on Sidebottom who was charging in, but Maynard had already given up made no attempt to tackle, with the benefit of hindsight Sharp maybe had another second or so to improve his angle but ultimately there wasn't much more he could have done, was just pure luck at that point, given all the luck we had in the minutes prior I think it just ran out, so close but wrong side of the post.

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He definitely had options to improve that shot (even just closing the angle of his body slightly), but as you point out it is highly difficult to do so under those conditions, especially for a player of his experience.

Hopefully that has gone in the bank and Sharp can call on that experience when any similar moments come up.

 

[Vimal Anand]

I think Sharp did his best .if he wasted a fraction of a second , no score and we may even lose that game.

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[Cobbler]

Bit of over analysing Sharp’s kick.

He simply shanked it.

He received. Straightened. Then simply shanked.

 

[s_wd6]

Yeah with all the other scenarios that could’ve happened just gotta be grateful he kicked it when he did, even though he did kinda shank it.

There’s also the possibility that he kicks the goal and Pies have 45 seconds to win it from the centre like they’ve been doing all day and get a quick one. Who knows what could’ve happened.

Also I don’t know how intentional it was but Brayshaw free kick against after the Moore kick out was smart. Slowed it down for a couple seconds to let us get more guys back.

 

[thistimeforsure]

I know it's been done to death but I've just seen yet another bunch of w***er vic journos discussing it last night. I lose my mind their Darcy/Jackson discourse after every game. It's the same thing every time.

Jackson was poor against Collingwood which means that he can't play with Darcy. He needs to be solo ruck. We won't mention his multiple poor games this year without Darcy because he played well last week (even though it was his first good game in over a month) and it doesn't fit our narrative. We also won't mention that the ruck split was 40/60 and Jackson got absolutely monstered every time he went in there. Or that he had 10 HOs, 1 HTA and 1 CLR from 45 ruck contests. No, instead we'll talk about how if he played as a solo ruck he could have had slightly better numbers, and freo are ******* idiots for putting Darcy (8 CLR, 30 HOs, 10 HTA from 66 contests) in there instead. Doesn't matter that it would have been a huge net negative for the overall team performance. It's all about maximising Jackson's personal output rather than team output isn't it?

And then fans and oppo fans latch onto that because that's what they've been hearing and keep parrotting the same s**t.

Depends if you rate HO’s or not though doesn’t it

Fyfe and Darcy’s sluggishness around the ball was horrible and did as much to nearly cost us that game as any other reason


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[DocT]

Fyfe plays a selfless strategic role. Because he's Fyfe opposition attention is warped by his orbit. His contested abilities draw the tacklers and allow our other mids more time space.

There was a classic play the other night, where there was I think a two on two, Fyfe wins the ball, waits until both opposition players are more completely committed to him before handing it over to his teammate who's suddenly freed up in space. Could've easily got it off earlier, made it easier on himself and still be seen as a reasonable play.

His composure in doing that gets hidden in the fact he's delivering the ball under a heap more heat.

Well said.

I read other posts that say Fyfe is too slow and should retire. They are wrong IMO. Obviously Fyfe gets caught in tackles HTB too much and perhaps he will never shake this off, the bullocking instinct from his younger Man-God days will never be fully over ridden. But we can cope with that because his ball use is so smart and creates time and space for other players in tight situations. He is still a great player.

That being said we were hoping that we would get '80% Nat Fyfe' in 2024. I think we have had that at times but he's mainly been at more like 60-70% of his best.

 

[s_wd6]

Depends if you rate HO’s or not though doesn’t it

Fyfe and Darcy’s sluggishness around the ball was horrible and did as much to nearly cost us that game as any other reason


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I don't rate HOs. I rate HTAs and CLR mostly, of which Jackson had 1 of each. Jackson when he's good is able to negate his loss in the actual tap because he follows up his own ball and gets the clearance. He didn't do that. And he also didn't get any HTAs to get our mids the clearance.

He spent a sizeable chunk of his game in the ruck and played poorly. As he does against certain rucks, hence why we need Darcy. You cannot in your right mind argue from this game that Jackson should be our main ruck when everytime he went in there he got monstered. It's not a small sample size either. Before the last 10 minutes or so he had attended almost as many Ruck Contest as Darcy. There's a reason Darcy was rucking at the end and not Jackson.

Darcy had 8 clearances (team high) and 10 HTAs. He had 4 tackles to Jackson's 7. His slugishness around the ground may have cost us some goals, but it's not like Jackson was great around the ground either, and unlike Darcy, Jackson was also bad in the middle.

 

[CapitalA]

Fyfe plays a selfless strategic role. Because he's Fyfe opposition attention is warped by his orbit. His contested abilities draw the tacklers and allow our other mids more time space.

There was a classic play the other night, where there was I think a two on two, Fyfe wins the ball, waits until both opposition players are more completely committed to him before handing it over to his teammate who's suddenly freed up in space. Could've easily got it off earlier, made it easier on himself and still be seen as a reasonable play.

His composure in doing that gets hidden in the fact he's delivering the ball under a heap more heat.

It's not enough, what he provides at the moment does not out weigh his clangers and turn overs imo.

 

[arsesmart]

Bit of over analysing Sharp’s kick.

He simply shanked it.

He received. Straightened. Then simply shanked.

Or just maybe you're under analysing it. There are reasons a "shank" happens, they aren't some random magical thing.

 

[arsesmart]

It's not enough, what he provides at the moment does not out weigh his clangers and turn overs imo.

From looking at it closely I reckon what he does far out weighs any negatives. It seems the coaches tend to think so too.

 

[Jezzitizle]

I have watched the Chappy mark and Mooses's goal so many times now, it was the opposite of how these games normally go for for us, normally its in our defense and we are scrambling to stop them stealing the game. i.e. Blues and Power

I had another look at the moment of Sharps kick, definitely no option to give to a teammate as I had first thought, Treacy giving a perfect block on Sidebottom who was charging in, but Maynard had already given up made no attempt to tackle, with the benefit of hindsight Sharp maybe had another second or so to improve his angle but ultimately there wasn't much more he could have done, was just pure luck at that point, given all the luck we had in the minutes prior I think it just ran out, so close but wrong side of the post.

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Had Amiss in the pocket, imagine him slotting a late winner!

But personally Sharp was in a good position to shoot, much rather him take ownership and have a crack. Good on him for being in the right place.

 

[Madas]

Had Amiss in the pocket, imagine him slotting a late winner!

But personally Sharp was in a good position to shoot, much rather him take ownership and have a crack. Good on him for being in the right place.

The way Amiss was spraying them it probably would have ended up OOF

Jez did the righty and we were the better off for it
Hats off to him
Was as good as a win

 

[FreoMatt]

Well....I'm pretty sure if someone stopped time and offered Sharp the options he'd 100% be taking the goal.

The thing lending most to your theory there would be Sharp preferencing scoring anything higher than, say, taking on the Pies players a little more to attempt greater precision shot (and therefore greater risk of scoring nothing at all).

It was definitely a very difficult shot under that pressure with the defenders rushing at him.

It’s just another example of why players should be able to kick compently on n both sides of the body


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[FreoMatt]

I have watched the Chappy mark and Mooses's goal so many times now, it was the opposite of how these games normally go for for us, normally its in our defense and we are scrambling to stop them stealing the game. i.e. Blues and Power

I had another look at the moment of Sharps kick, definitely no option to give to a teammate as I had first thought, Treacy giving a perfect block on Sidebottom who was charging in, but Maynard had already given up made no attempt to tackle, with the benefit of hindsight Sharp maybe had another second or so to improve his angle but ultimately there wasn't much more he could have done, was just pure luck at that point, given all the luck we had in the minutes prior I think it just ran out, so close but wrong side of the post.

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I think the main issue was the player running at him (I think Dean), just needs to be able to kick it on his left


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[ubiquitous226]

There is absolutely no doubt Sharp made the right choice, he wasn't closed down enough to be intentionally missing, he simply didn't quite execute on the run changing direction.

A shame because he's shown a capability to kick some goals but seems to prefer a straighter run.
We'll take that point though, if he gets too clever we might lose that by a point and we all lose our shit.

 

[Cobbler]

Or just maybe you're under analysing it. There are reasons a "shank" happens, they aren't some random magical thing.

Yep.
Possibly fatigue, moment, perceived pressure, on coming defender. Heaps of reasons.
But, he shanked it.
Someone said he purposely went for the behind? Yeah, nah on that particular comment.

 

[Cobbler]

There is absolutely no doubt Sharp made the right choice, he wasn't closed down enough to be intentionally missing, he simply didn't quite execute on the run changing direction.

A shame because he's shown a capability to kick some goals but seems to prefer a straighter run.
We'll take that point though, if he gets too clever we might lose that by a point and we all lose our s**t.

In a different world a more elite finisher would probably take space inside and snap, but as you say, he’s a straight line finisher. He straightened well enough.

 

[theGav56]

Also, because I'm in a venting mood, Amiss continues to do absolutely nothing.

Treacy in career best form and we barely kick it to him

Darcy and Jackson continue to do absolutely nothing. Combined for 2 marks and 5 kicks. F**k right off honestly, what is that?!?

We really did seem to avoid Treacy.

Anyone at the game have any thoughts?

 

[Fred Ziffel]

Well....I'm pretty sure if someone stopped time and offered Sharp the options he'd 100% be taking the goal.

The thing lending most to your theory there would be Sharp preferencing scoring anything higher than, say, taking on the Pies players a little more to attempt greater precision shot (and therefore greater risk of scoring nothing at all).

It was definitely a very difficult shot under that pressure with the defenders rushing at him.

Put it this way. To score the goal he would have needed an up and under kick to get the ball over the Collingwood player with all the risk that entails. Even if it was not a deliberate intent to take the point, it was the surest way to not lose the match.

 

[ubiquitous226]

Put it this way. To score the goal he would have needed an up and under kick to get the ball over the Collingwood player with all the risk that entails. Even if it was not a deliberate intent to take the point, it was the surest way to not lose the match.

I think he kicked at the right time, he had the angle available to snap it, he just didn't quite execute.

The kick was slightly harder on replay than I thought at the ground or even on a full watch, but it was there to be taken.

I love how the guys got around him afterwards, he was a big reason we were back in that game, we would have loved it he could of kicked it but it was still a very good performance.

 

[Fred Ziffel]

Fyfe plays a selfless strategic role. Because he's Fyfe opposition attention is warped by his orbit. His contested abilities draw the tacklers and allow our other mids more time space.

There was a classic play the other night, where there was I think a two on two, Fyfe wins the ball, waits until both opposition players are more completely committed to him before handing it over to his teammate who's suddenly freed up in space. Could've easily got it off earlier, made it easier on himself and still be seen as a reasonable play.

His composure in doing that gets hidden in the fact he's delivering the ball under a heap more heat.

That has been a characteristic of Nat’s season . We see that in every game this year.
He is the biggest factor in our midfield dominance this year.

 

[ubiquitous226]

That has been a characteristic of Nat’s season . We see that in every game this year.
He is the biggest factor in our midfield dominance this year.

The thing that has been missing the last couple of games is Fyfe's cleanness and ability to hit some ridiculous handballs.
In the first part of this season he genuinely unlocked some serious good looks with his vision and ability to hit the handball.

I think it's part form, and part the other side trying to close that down more as it's damaging.

 

[Bender571]

We really did seem to avoid Treacy.

Anyone at the game have any thoughts?

At the game I thought I saw a few occasions where it was 2v2. Amiss would lead to the HFF near the boundary and Treacy would lead down the middle. The kicker would usually be near the wing would lookup and see the two options and decide down the line to the boundary was safer. When the kicker made their decision the defender on Treacy (looked like Moore when I noticed this) would peel off and head to Amiss to make it a 2 on 1. The Collingwood mids and half backs would push down to cover Treacy. Looked like very good structure and defending by Collingwood to me.