Player Watch Edward Allan

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sr36 said:
I hope you're right. But the old man and the wombat we have running around in the seniors shows that midfield is still played primarily above the shoulders - physical attributes are the icing, but the cake is knowing what you're doing out there.
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He's a inside midfielder currently being played out of his natural position.
Eased in, meaning, with his growing pains he had back related issues.
 

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jathanas said:
Fair appraisal.

Do you think Allan might have had more opportunities if he was drafted by another club?

I haven't seen much of the kid but it would be tough to break into a premiership side which bats so deep in his ideal position.

Perhaps we've also been spoiled by how easily N. Daicos slotted right in (and then made the AFL world his oyster).
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We’ve been injury free through the midfield since the Hawthorn game last year*. I don’t remember seeing a run like that at Collingwood and considering we are the reigning premiers it’s a tough nut to crack our midfield at the moment against say a Fremantle or Adelaide who are giving looks to a bunch of less exposed types through the middle. With exposing players comes inconsistency so I’m fine with Allan biding his time and have no concerns over it impacting his ability to be a high impact player moving forward.

The query for me would be what he’s doing to be that high impact player. What drew me in and I have to assume the club given the eagerness to get him signed long term very early seems to have dissipated. It’s been a subtle shift, but when Fly and other coaches discuss what players are doing underneath they haven’t been including Allan like they were at the start of last year. He seems to drift through matches and is stymied by a chase down tackle or hand in to smother the ball regularly.

The talk of everyone being down and him as a byproduct doesn’t wash with me either. This kid has Curnow like attributes and whilst he doesn’t necessarily need to be dominating the level at 19 I’d like to see periods of AFL quality instead of the odd passage of play. I don’t know what the future holds for him, but I’m pretty confident in suggesting he’s playing within himself currently because he’s capable of more.

*copious amounts of wood being touched.
 
manicpie said:
He did indeed but it's very evident in real life that playing a game, as compared to a ready, set go scenario is irrelevant. I think you know that though
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Whilst it’s quite clearly an accurate emperical analysis to suggest Allan is fast in a straight line from a standing start over 20 metres my question would be has anyone ever seen that on a footy field? It’s the most useless of metrics we take at the combine and has zero correlation to a footballers ability to cover the ground. Take Nick Daicos I bet he wasn’t in the top 10 fastest blokes in his draft year over 20 metres, but chuck a footy in his general vicinity and only Connor Rozee would be his peer for speed throughout the league, IMO. If Allan can find a way to unlock that raw ability he could be anything until then though we need to be patient.
 
Scodog10 said:
We’ve been injury free through the midfield since the Hawthorn game last year*. I don’t remember seeing a run like that at Collingwood and considering we are the reigning premiers it’s a tough nut to crack our midfield at the moment against say a Fremantle or Adelaide who are giving looks to a bunch of less exposed types through the middle. With exposing players comes inconsistency so I’m fine with Allan biding his time and have no concerns over it impacting his ability to be a high impact player moving forward.

The query for me would be what he’s doing to be that high impact player. What drew me in and I have to assume the club given the eagerness to get him signed long term very early seems to have dissipated. It’s been a subtle shift, but when Fly and other coaches discuss what players are doing underneath they haven’t been including Allan like they were at the start of last year. He seems to drift through matches and is stymied by a chase down tackle or hand in to smother the ball regularly.

The talk of everyone being down and him as a byproduct doesn’t wash with me either. This kid has Curnow like attributes and whilst he doesn’t necessarily need to be dominating the level at 19 I’d like to see periods of AFL quality instead of the odd passage of play. I don’t know what the future holds for him, but I’m pretty confident in suggesting he’s playing within himself currently because he’s capable of more.

*copious amounts of wood being touched.
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Its where the JD and Allan comparison also becomes relevant. Josh was a little slow but even in practice matches in his 1st season and even more so in the VFL did a few things that looked like they belonged at a higher level. Havent really seen that in Ed even though I was very keen to so looked hard. Hopefully its coming soon.
 
Gone Critical said:
Its where the JD and Allan comparison also becomes relevant. Josh was a little slow but even in practice matches in his 1st season and even more so in the VFL did a few things that looked like they belonged at a higher level. Havent really seen that in Ed even though I was very keen to so looked hard. Hopefully its coming soon.
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Allan was doing that in the practice matches last year and the talk of him playing Rd 1 was real. Josh though wound up receiving his debut for a team that had very clearly run out of juice and was limping to the line. I don’t see that with our current mix or 2023’s and an 18yo Josh would not have debuted yet if he joined the club in 2022, IMO.

Perhaps another way of viewing it is to profile past premiers and the kids they’ve debuted the years in which they won and then defended their flag? I’m tipping their wasn’t too many handing debuts out to midfielders when they were injury free as a group. It wouldn’t surprise me if we had to go back to Mitchell to find one.

FWIW I think your take is perfectly reasonable and I’ve certainly come closer to it over the past 6 months, but I’m content with things whilst we remain injury free and in the hunt for a flag.
 
Gone Critical said:
Its where the JD and Allan comparison also becomes relevant. Josh was a little slow but even in practice matches in his 1st season and even more so in the VFL did a few things that looked like they belonged at a higher level. Havent really seen that in Ed even though I was very keen to so looked hard. Hopefully its coming soon.
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Yeah, it's the lack of AFL moments that is the concern.

I think our drafting has very much shifted from production to attributes, particularly running, the last few years - Harrison, Murley, Draper, Allan, Ryan. Then TJ , Demattia this year.

I really liked the concept, but early results aren't looking that likely for 2021 and 2022 draftees. Ryan is the one whose shown the most game sense, so the most likely in my opinion.
 
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Gone Critical said:
Josh Daicos got games in his 1st season. His 2nd year he played 10 in a team that went superclose to winning the flag, in front with a couple of minutes left in the GF. So I dont see a huge difference in opportunity. Josh was also one we rate as being slow compared to most of the good players as far as showing out in his 1st seasons. It was his third that really sparked worries.

Ed can make it but he is way off the level Josh got to in his 2nd season. Hopefully he closes that by a long way come the end of 24.
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Much easier getting a game with Buckley's magpies than it is an experienced premiership lineup where the mids rarely miss so not a good comparison at all.
 
Carlthetruth said:
Much easier getting a game with Buckley's magpies than it is an experienced premiership lineup where the mids rarely miss so not a good comparison at all.
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This would be relevant for players putting their hand up for selection with strong VFL performance...

That's not Allan at the moment.
 
manicpie said:
I'm referring to Physical burst whilst from a standing start. He's fine while in the motion of running, it's his lack of core strength that's holding him back.
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He’s too reactive. Needs to start making the play and taking the game on.
 
sr36 said:
This would be relevant for players putting their hand up for selection with strong VFL performance...

That's not Allan at the moment.
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What was the previous 3 weeks? Going along just fine atm, all these negative Nellie's about his AFL potential don't understand development. Nothing like Josh Daicos's start at the club, it's a stupid comparison.
 
Carlthetruth said:
What was the previous 3 weeks? Going along just fine atm, all these negative Nellie's about his AFL potential don't understand development. Nothing like Josh Daicos's start at the club, it's a stupid comparison.
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Bro, he galavants around like a gazelle, he has no core strength and he's not finding enough of the ball. I would like to wait till at least next year before I make a serious judgement but I can't agree that none of us have any idea because your assumptions are just as sceptical and pretty much guess work. No one is going to listen to you and your rude attitude, actually, no one really rates your assessment of junior talent anyway. Humility is your friend on a football forum full of pundits. Your knowledge is just that, your knowledge
 

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Carlthetruth said:
What was the previous 3 weeks? Going along just fine atm, all these negative Nellie's about his AFL potential don't understand development. Nothing like Josh Daicos's start at the club, it's a stupid comparison.
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The previous 2 weeks that I watched were pretty non-descript. He'll get plenty of time, like Kelly got, because blokes of his size who can run like him with decent agility and solid skills are pretty rare.

But at the moment, he's not really doing anything that looks AfL. Usually by now those who become genuinely good have a part of their game that is strong - be it attack on the footy, awareness, reading the ball flight, positioning, ball use, etc ...

If you watched him play and didn't know he was a first round pick with an elite sprint time, no one would be bullish. Hopefully something clicks.
 
sr36 said:
The previous 2 weeks that I watched were pretty non-descript. He'll get plenty of time, like Kelly got, because blokes of his size who can run like him with decent agility and solid skills are pretty rare.

But at the moment, he's not really doing anything that looks AfL. Usually by now those who become genuinely good have a part of their game that is strong - be it attack on the footy, awareness, reading the ball flight, positioning, ball use, etc ...

If you watched him play and didn't know he was a first round pick with an elite sprint time, no one would be bullish. Hopefully something clicks.
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That's a great analysis but I'm not allowed to praise you in case old mate finds out
 
Scodog10 said:
Whilst it’s quite clearly an accurate emperical analysis to suggest Allan is fast in a straight line from a standing start over 20 metres my question would be has anyone ever seen that on a footy field? It’s the most useless of metrics we take at the combine and has zero correlation to a footballers ability to cover the ground. Take Nick Daicos I bet he wasn’t in the top 10 fastest blokes in his draft year over 20 metres, but chuck a footy in his general vicinity and only Connor Rozee would be his peer for speed throughout the league, IMO. If Allan can find a way to unlock that raw ability he could be anything until then though we need to be patient.
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There was a VFL game against Willy, last year I think, when Ed sprinted through the centre and drilled a goal from a long way out.
He's got the ability - maybe it's about him believing he can do it.
He has the (still developing) physical attributes, so he might just need a light bulb moment to take him across the threshold to the next level.
We shall see.
 
JuniorB said:
There was a VFL game against Willy, last year I think, when Ed sprinted through the centre and drilled a goal from a long way out.
He's got the ability - maybe it's about him believing he can do it.
He has the (still developing) physical attributes, so he might just need a light bulb moment to take him across the threshold to the next level.
We shall see.
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He needs to really find a strength and play to it. It's just a bit hard to see at the moment what his strength is going to be to make him a quality AFL player. Is he going to use his size to be a bull? Is he going to use his pace to be a line breaking dasher? He's not really looking likely to be either at the moment.
 
manicpie said:
To be honest he has me in Ambivalance. I really would like to give him this year and next pre season to rapidly improve, otherwise it's as GC said, he might not make it at all
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The question is: is he reactive and playing hesitantly because he is unconfident or is it because he processes situations more slowly - if it's the latter, he probably won't make it, despite how physically awesome he's going to become. But he's got another 2 years after this. Once he's got that core strength he might suddenly click.
 
sr36 said:
The question is: is he reactive and playing hesitantly because he is unconfident or is it because he processes situations more slowly - if it's the latter, he probably won't make it, despite how physically awesome he's going to become.
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I honestly don't know Fonz. I want him to make it because he is the prototype but he doesn't seem to be strong overhead which he will need at that size. If we can't rest him forward then that will go against him
 
manicpie said:
I honestly don't know Fonz. I want him to make it because he is the prototype but he doesn't seem to be strong overhead which he will need at that size. If we can't rest him forward then that will go against him
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We signed him for 4 years - by then es going to bea physical beast. Hopefully it all clicks and he finds his inner Nat Fyfe and bullies players.
 

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Player Watch Edward Allan

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