WSYD GWS - Too Much, Too Soon?

[vinhol]

G

I know that, as a Dees fan, the irony of me posting this is strong - but I'm going to hope that people can just discuss the issue at hand.

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I've just been watching (or trying to watch) the GWS vs West Coast game - but it's a real struggle.

It looks like a crowd of about 6,000 people have come to watch a team be belted to the tune of 80+ yet again. I don't blame the people of Western Sydney, I blame the AFL and the GWS coaching staff for the way they've handed their entrance into the league.

They're barely marketable, they've been dropped into one of the regions of Sydney that didn't jump on the Swans at any point and have been told to become a powerhouse.

After coming out and shocking a few teams last season who saw them as the bye, they've come back in 2013 with second year blues - completely uncompetitive and barely registering their presence.

I'm not sure of it's the loss of Mark Williams, though it's clear as day that Sheedy should have given him the job this year rather than waiting another season for me.

Sheedy's done. His spouting to the media was boring, then comical, then it started raising interest in the game and started getting attention, now it's back to boring.

The Mother's Day crowd of 5k wasn't because of extenuating circumstances, it's because there just aren't enough core GWS supporters to keep watching this team when there are so few reasons for neutral's to get excited.

When you think of GWS and exciting, the only image you really get is Jeremy Cameron - and without Patton his efforts are all the more remarkable - but still not enough.

At least Gold Coast had the Ablett factor, and whilst it would be silly to claim that they weren't going through similar last season, the situations are quite different. The Gold Coast is a very fashionable place, watching the locals jump on board and embracing them this season has been great. The Suns are becoming part of a well-publicised and attractive culture in Queensland. Can you say the same for the Giants?

Sheedy also blames other clubs for not releasing their talent to them, despite his bleating about their picks and all his kids. People probably wouldn't be able to name their first round loot from last season (Whitfield, O'Rourke, Plowman, Corr, Jaksch) because they're just the next selections off a conveyor belt of young draftees.

Attention has already turned to which one of Tom Boyd or James Aish they're more likely to take at this season's draft.

What's more is that they've stunted the competition in the sense that the good sides have remained good for longer, whilst the lesser ones have been down for longer too.

I've got a lot of respect for GWS' core supporters, especially those on here, because they show up to watch a team devoid of culture, history and competitiveness lose again and again.

The chances are, like Gold Coast, GWS will show improvement at some point. But are they marketable? Are they sustainable? Is there any appeal? Feel like Cameron has a big job on his hands, if he turns out to be a flop of a coach like Neeld, the future of the Giants will ride on the AFL's generosity long into the future.

At the moment, watching GWS games is like watching the bye. They just never look in it.

Good post agree with you 100 % btw dees fans can have opinion you don't lose all rights when your team Is crap

 

[Dont be a lemon]

Setting up a team this early in Westie land was a bad idea.

How would it have been easier in the future?

 

[Colonial]

Just need to organise another SL war and coincide it with us getting into the GF. Hmm easy...

No other way it could of been done with the political climate in Sydney, the fact theres a draft, and the only reason people are talking about it is the unexpected success of the Wanderers (yes unexpected. They were avging 8k till they started there winning run of 11 strraight).

 

[bossman111]

I don't know what everyone was expecting. We were given currency to trade, but given GC's struggles early, coming up here to western Sydney would have been a hard sell to any player. This isn't the US - players have to agree to be traded in the AFL.

In saying that, I'm hoping we can add some quality through FA and maybe trading out of this upcoming draft. Add in some hard bodies and the kids will shine.

 

[ferrisb]

I like their long-term approach to developing a list. Have to admit my first impression was they were smarter about it than GCS.

BUT there is long-term list development and there is also brand development. I would say the latter is crucial in this case - with GWS/AFL trying to conquer frontier territory.

Just thinking about the non-AFL teams in Melbourne. We are sports mad, and it was still going to be a bit of a battle for anything non-AFL. Melbourne Victory was always going to attract existing soccer fans, but their EARLY success as well as the Storm's amazing record (salary cap aside) meant that the whole city including neutral fans embraced the teams as their own.

 

[Colonial]

I like their long-term approach to developing a list. Have to admit my first impression was they were smarter about it than GCS.

BUT there is long-term list development and there is also brand development. I would say the latter is crucial in this case - with GWS/AFL trying to conquer frontier territory.

Just thinking about the non-AFL teams in Melbourne. We are sports mad, and it was still going to be a bit of a battle for anything non-AFL. Melbourne Victory was always going to attract existing soccer fans, but their EARLY success as well as the Storm's amazing record (salary cap aside) meant that the whole city including neutral fans embraced the teams as their own.

Ive bolded this bit because it seems that everyone (other teams, NRL, Papers, FFA) seems to think the fans and management of the Giants (and the AFL) want to rule the West of Sydney. This couldnt be further from the truth. We are just after what every other team representing this fine city has. Acceptance as a club in a national competition, THE national competition of Australia's football code.

 

[Sydney Bloods]

who are the Warriors*?

who's talking about instant premierships and measuring success in that way?

how about a little bit of competitiveness. small successes to begin with.

I don't actually know the team's name and CBF looking it up, the new A-league soccer team, I'm pretty sure it starts with W.

In any case what would having a top 14 team achieve? You'd have list cloggers that aren't going to get you anywhere and then what happen's?

A rebuild without ever making finals?

How does that help the team's long term strategy? A road to nowhere straight out? We've already got an example of giving away draft picks for middle of the road or near retirement players.....it doesn't work.

Sure the GC got lucky with a few senior players but the quality of those players simply wasn't there for the giants teams had already battened down the hatches after the GC raids.

What was left was essentially spuds why give up a top pick for a player that won't be on your list when your ready to make finals.

 

[finders]

Totally agree with the OP. The western suburbs of Sydney are NRL heartland. The majority of locals follow one of the local sides and hate AFL.

By the pathetic crowds the RL get in the west it aint much of a heartland.

 

[finders]

"Just thinking about the non-AFL teams in Melbourne. We are sports mad, and it was still going to be a bit of a battle for anything non-AFL. Melbourne Victory was always going to attract existing soccer fans, but their EARLY success as well as the Storm's amazing record (salary cap aside) meant that the whole city including neutral fans embraced the teams as their own."

What a load of crap! Most Melburnians couldnt care less about the other 3 codes esp the rugby ones and most would be hard pressed to name even one player from the Storm or Rebels.

Apart from Victory the rest are averaging 10- 12,000 in a city of 4.2 million and that is with excellent stadium facilities thrown in.

 

[ferrisb]

Ive bolded this bit because it seems that everyone (other teams, NRL, Papers, FFA) seems to think the fans and management of the Giants (and the AFL) want to rule the West of Sydney. This couldnt be further from the truth. We are just after what every other team representing this fine city has. Acceptance as a club in a national competition, THE national competition of Australia's football code.

Valid point GG. Agree with you that it's more about acceptance than dominance. The AFL only needs to be after a 'piece of the pie' in the area, not the whole pie.

Conquer was probably poor word choice. Perhaps 'gain a foothold' would have been more appropriate to what I was trying to get across.

 

[Colonial]

G
Good post agree with you 100 % btw dees fans can have opinion you don't lose all rights when your team Is crap

But it seems you can call for the death of clubs who are also playing crap..

 

[swansfan51]

Once we are competitive the crowds will come, I hear allot of people talking about the Giants and saying they would like them to be good, but they wont spend their hard earned on a team they know will get flogged week in week out.

Fortunately there is already an AFL team in Sydney that is competitive so the people you refer to can go and watch them. They play several games a year right next to Skoda Stadium so location isn't a problem at all.

 

[Colonial]

Fortunately there is already an AFL team in Sydney that is competitive so the people you refer to can go and watch them. They play several games a year right next to Skoda Stadium so location isn't a problem at all.

They also want nothing to do with the Ballerinas. Either way, the guys paying the bills, the AFL, have the patience and the agreements in place. We will be a part of this city quicker than Sth Melbourne, and we wont need a SL war to do it either.

 

[Magnum27]

I was at the game on Saturday, and i agree with others 6k might be stretching the truth. In saying that it is a great staduim to watch football at, however AFL in Sydney is always going to be a struggle. I was at the casino on Friday night and the AFL was assigned to two small screens away from the bars. Was walking back to hotel whilst 2nd half was on, passed numerous pubs and hotels and could not see one screen with the Swans v Pies on it. Very tough ask in an NRL state, and will always be a struggle for them to pull a decent crowd.

I think the club has taken the right path, short term pain for long term gain. If they manage to keep all the kids they will be a very good side in the long term, the only issue they may have is the lack of a ruckman, and may have to offer some of their young mids to get a decent one.

 

[Agent93]

People said the same thing about us when we came in...

But yeah fold them

Freo managed 15 wins in their first 2 years, mainly because they were forced to take mature AFL players rather than a glut of 18 year olds. Made them more attractive to watch given that they actually provided some competition, and therefore some interest.

 

[Tulip]

But it seems you can call for the death of clubs who are also playing crap..

Did I call for the death of your club?

 

[Hawthorn United]

Still too early to judge I reckon but it isn't looking good at this very minute.

This time last year, everyone was saying Gold Coast had gone backwards and GWS has gone past them. Think the GC have actually gone past a few established clubs this year and will only get better with all their quality young players entering their 4th seasons and due for that breakout season.

 

[Lebron James]

We'll be fine. Will just take time. Sydney is incredibly fickle.

And I'm sick of people bleating on about the Wanderers and the supposed culture that they've created, as well as their supposed greater community involvement. They were routinely getting sub 10k crowds before their winning streak.

The fact that we are getting comparable crowds to what they were getting is an amazing achievement when you take into account that Aussie Rules is a foreign concept to alot of Western Sydney, while Western Sydney is soccer's heartland.

 

[RodneyMaynard]

GWS have in my opinion recruited quite well. Bear in mind that their 2 key defenders (Cornes and Davi$) are both currently out, and their number one draft pick and chief forward target Patton is done for the season. They need a 2nd ruckman no doubt, and a quality forward target to take the pressure off of Cameron, but all of this reactionary talk after a few thrashings is a bit much.

It was only a few weeks ago that they outplayed the Bombers and the Demons for three quarters. The last year and the remainder of this year aren't great for building a supporter base, but as the Wanderers proved Sydney loves a winner. If they're still getting 6k when they're playing finals then it might be time to panic.

These thrashings also mean that when they do start winning it will feel earned. I've no doubt that when the Giants start climbing the ladder the same people that are now calling them a failure and a basket case will be moaning that they have been 'gifted success on a silver platter' by the AFL....

 

[blaze036]

Once they are competitive no one will whinge about their on field performances, and the crowds will improve by a few thousand (ala wanderas) and everything will be fine, people just need to calm down.

In 20 years time we will be very thankful that they are in

 

[pinot]

They need to stop getting smashed by 10 goals + week in week out. It seriously does nothing for player development ala Melbourne.

Probably need to trade Pick 1 for a top liner.
Trade a couple of young guns like Greene and Bugg for some old heads less than 26 y.o.

Raid free agency.

 

[vast]

Meh who cares, everyone knows they are here for the long haul coz the afl want them to be.
Until they become competitive everyone will just pencil them in as a win. I remember a lot of people bagging GC for getting B & C graders praising while GWS for going mainly to the draft. Now its the other way around.

In a couple of years when the youngsters mature people will say wow that was the right strategy. The picked the strategy they thought would be best and its one which will take longer to get there, but I think they should stick with it.

They should change their colours though they are horrendous.

 

[Adz]

Let's remember this time last year people were lauding the GWS drafting and critising Gold Coast.
Simply a case of 2nd year blues. And they've been competitive in some games, they actually seem to be better playing away..

I like their colours. GC I can't stand - that guernsey is terrible.

 

[aussierulesrules]

Tasmania or Darwin was always the answer.

To spreading the game into Western Sydney?

 

[Fire Storm]

"Just thinking about the non-AFL teams in Melbourne. We are sports mad, and it was still going to be a bit of a battle for anything non-AFL. Melbourne Victory was always going to attract existing soccer fans, but their EARLY success as well as the Storm's amazing record (salary cap aside) meant that the whole city including neutral fans embraced the teams as their own."

What a load of crap! Most Melburnians couldnt care less about the other 3 codes esp the rugby ones and most would be hard pressed to name even one player from the Storm or Rebels.

Apart from Victory the rest are averaging 10- 12,000 in a city of 4.2 million and that is with excellent stadium facilities thrown in.

Goose of the year award goes to finders. I could pull plenty of posts from right here.....hard core AFL site....where posters mention, name and talk about many Rugby League players.


They are averaging nearly 17,000. Have nearly 15,000 members. Maybe check your facts next time? Not real good with that stuff are you?


What's your address so I can post your award to you?