Has Hamling improved?

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GetDimmaBack said:
The thing that's impressed me with Hamling is that he's cool under pressure. That's something I haven't seen much of in a player in his first few senior games.
One of those players who takes one grab marks and who always seems to have time.

At this stage, he's more promising than many others we've had from the Cats over the years.

Except for Kenny Newlands*, of course!





*Hope there's a few "older" Catters who remember him!
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Yes- an old favourite :)


(I think you'll find, though, that his surname was not plural ;))

Can't recall him going to you doggies but there's a fair hole in my memory and perhaps I missed that bit.
 
Hamling was always a project player, similar to Mitch Brown, in that you have to give them 3 years just to get big enough. Then assess them over the next few years.

Our list management is just terrible though, old and injured players before young fringe players.

If Anthony Morabito gets delisted I wouldn't be surprised if we picked him up.
 
cynical said:
Hamling was always a project player, similar to Mitch Brown, in that you have to give them 3 years just to get big enough. Then assess them over the next few years.

Our list management is just terrible though, old and injured players before young fringe players.

If Anthony Morabito gets delisted I wouldn't be surprised if we picked him up.
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Beg to politely disagree if I may. Both Hamling and Brown were the first players Geelong took in their respective drafts. Agree that there may have been expectation of a certain number of years before they would be physically ready, but aside from that, I doubt that anyone taken as a club's first pick would be a project player. Also, after being drafted their histories diverged a fair bit. Hamling for whatever reason never got a senior opportunity, and also never had major injury concerns. Brown did have severe injury concerns the first 3 seasons, but even then they picked him for the seniors quite happily in 2011 and he performed well on debut. The irony of course is they got rid of him only after he'd put his injuries behind him (and paid for shoulder surgery late last year, which is a little odd). Shame neither of them could get more of a chance, but that's the way it goes.

As for Morabito, picking him up would be even more insane that keeping what long term injuries we've already got. Missed 3 full seasons from 2011-2013. Played 3 games in 2014 then dropped. Had yet more knee surgery in January, and will miss all of this season as well. He's finished.
 

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Teriyakicat said:
Interesting that Hamling said those two things above- one that he was really really raw (and Wells said, when Hamling was recruited, that the GFC saw him as a 'project player'- though why you'd recruit a project player with your first pick, albeit 30-something, I really don't know)- and the second being that 'every good game I played, there was always good key defenders which didn't miss'. I think that maybe he needed to have more continuity with his 'good games', not just a BOG one game then unremarkable for the next 4 or so games- not that I know how well he played in between his good games but I am sure that, if they had been solid, he'd have been given a chance at senior level.

Just looking at the VFL stats page- in his first season (2012), Hamling played 13 games (averaging 3.6 possessions between rounds 4-8) and was named as the BOG in the second last of those games. In 2013, he played 11 games and was named BOG in his 2nd and 4th games (averaging 8 possessions in his last 8 games, that average being inflated from 6 possessions, by one 16-possession game). And, in 2014, he played 18 matches and was named as BOG in 2 of those, with single votes in another 2 games. From those stats, you can also see that he averaged less than 1 tackle and 2.1 marks per game in his first year but improved to 1.6T, 3.3M the following year and 2.2 T, 4.5M in his final year at the GFC. To me, it just looked like he was still learning to get more involved in the game and the GFC were looking for more consistency from him before even considering him for a senior game- which is exactly what they should be doing with him. If he was comparing himself to other players who were drafted the same year, someone should've told him that he was dreamin'. (“Personally, it was because the blokes I got drafted with were all playing and I was playing reserves,” he said.) Players from the same draft are obviously of differing abilities and have different talents and whether they get their chance to play early can often depend on the needs of the club they signed up with, rather than them being 'game ready'- e.g. the desperation of some of the bottom teams to find a star player that will lead them out of darkness- they will be willing to try all of their new recruits, as opposed to a stronger team which will give a young player more time to find his feet before being thrown in at the deep end. It's a shame that Hamling didn't seem to recognise that.

I haven't seen him play for the Bulldogs yet- I hope that he does well at that club but I don't think the GFC were at fault for letting him go when it appears that he was the one getting a bit ahead of himself, thinking he was ready to play seniors when perhaps he was still a bit behind others at the club but not willing to recognise that or to wait for his opportunity. I was one of those who was disappointed to see him go, as I was quite impressed by his raw talent in the early games that I saw and hoped that he would have made it as a Cat at some stage. Who knows? I reckon by mid-year 2015, he could've taken his pick of positions on the field if he'd stayed, we were in such dire straits!
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Glad we got rid of him, would rather keep gun players like cowan, menzel, simpson, mcintosh, blease, stanley who are going to carry us to our next flag. We are stacked for tall young backman anyway
 
goodoldcats said:
Glad we got rid of him, would rather keep gun players like cowan, menzel, simpson, mcintosh, blease, stanley who are going to carry us to our next flag. We are stacked for tall young backman anyway
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Partridge said:
Beg to politely disagree if I may. Both Hamling and Brown were the first players Geelong took in their respective drafts. Agree that there may have been expectation of a certain number of years before they would be physically ready, but aside from that, I doubt that anyone taken as a club's first pick would be a project player.
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He was pick 32, which is an average pick. Project player is probably the wrong wording but he certainly was going to take a bit longer than usual. 3-5 years as opposed to 2-4

Just don't know what the club was thinking.
 
Partridge said:
Beg to politely disagree if I may. Both Hamling and Brown were the first players Geelong took in their respective drafts. Agree that there may have been expectation of a certain number of years before they would be physically ready, but aside from that, I doubt that anyone taken as a club's first pick would be a project player. Also, after being drafted their histories diverged a fair bit. Hamling for whatever reason never got a senior opportunity, and also never had major injury concerns. Brown did have severe injury concerns the first 3 seasons, but even then they picked him for the seniors quite happily in 2011 and he performed well on debut. The irony of course is they got rid of him only after he'd put his injuries behind him (and paid for shoulder surgery late last year, which is a little odd). Shame neither of them could get more of a chance, but that's the way it goes.

As for Morabito, picking him up would be even more insane that keeping what long term injuries we've already got. Missed 3 full seasons from 2011-2013. Played 3 games in 2014 then dropped. Had yet more knee surgery in January, and will miss all of this season as well. He's finished.
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Wells used the words 'project player' when he was drafted, Partridge. I will look that up for you if I get a chance but I am 99% sure that this is what was said. incomprehensible but perhaps a shallow draft that was made more shallow by the huge amount of picks taken by GWS in the first round.
 
Teriyakicat said:
Wells used the words 'project player' when he was drafted, Partridge. I will look that up for you if I get a chance but I am 99% sure that this is what was said. incomprehensible but perhaps a shallow draft that was made more shallow by the huge amount of picks taken by GWS in the first round.
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I do recall Hammer being referred to as something like or similar to that.

I had as such always thought he would need 3-4 years to get up to speed.

I showed me!

GO Catters
 
cynical said:
He was pick 32, which is an average pick. Project player is probably the wrong wording but he certainly was going to take a bit longer than usual. 3-5 years as opposed to 2-4

Just don't know what the club was thinking.
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This was Wells' take on it:


Geelong recruiting manager Stephen Wells gave the club’s official website a glowing review of Hamling.

“We didn’t see a lot of him until this year because he was living in Broome, but right from the start, when we saw him play in the under 18s with Claremont in Perth, we liked what we saw,” Wells said.

“Over the course of the year Joel demonstrated the skillset that we thought was worthy of drafting.”

The Geelong website said Hamling would play as a mobile forward who could be moved to defence. Joel represented Western Australia at the NAB AFL Under-18 Championships, averaging five marks,” the website said.
“He kicked six goals during the championships and was particularly impressive against the Northern Territory and Tasmania. He tested extremely well at the NAB AFL Draft Combine, recording an impressive time of 2.90 seconds for the 20m sprint, along with a running vertical jump of 84cm, putting him in the top 10 per cent.”
 
Teriyakicat said:
Couldn't find a direct quote from Wells- maybe I dreamed it?

Here are two articles that report Hamling as a project player, so maybe they dreamed the same dream as me....

http://www.geelongadvertiser.com.au...rt-to-vfl-season/story-fnjuhrhu-1226898578691

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2014-02-01/lists-by-positions-defenders-part-one
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Thought it was a club video after the draft by Wells talking about whom was taken.

And i could be entirely wrong wrong wrong too.

GO Catters
 
Teriyakicat said:
This was Wells' take on it:


Geelong recruiting manager Stephen Wells gave the club’s official website a glowing review of Hamling.

“We didn’t see a lot of him until this year because he was living in Broome, but right from the start, when we saw him play in the under 18s with Claremont in Perth, we liked what we saw,” Wells said.

“Over the course of the year Joel demonstrated the skillset that we thought was worthy of drafting.”

The Geelong website said Hamling would play as a mobile forward who could be moved to defence. Joel represented Western Australia at the NAB AFL Under-18 Championships, averaging five marks,” the website said.
“He kicked six goals during the championships and was particularly impressive against the Northern Territory and Tasmania. He tested extremely well at the NAB AFL Draft Combine, recording an impressive time of 2.90 seconds for the 20m sprint, along with a running vertical jump of 84cm, putting him in the top 10 per cent.”
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On exposed form so far at the Doggies you would have to say he's looking AFL quality and seems to be improving with each game. A commentator mentioned he's in the top 10 for spoils.
He also looks assured with the ball and is making good decisions. I thought a potential weakness was endurance and fitness but he seems OK in those areas.

I know we have Kolo coming through but I reckon we erred by not seeing what Hamling had to offer over 5 or so Senior games.
 
Farmer2Goggin said:
On exposed form so far at the Doggies you would have to say he's looking AFL quality and seems to be improving with each game. A commentator mentioned he's in the top 10 for spoils.
He also looks assured with the ball and is making good decisions. I thought a potential weakness was endurance and fitness but he seems OK in those areas.

I know we have Kolo coming through but I reckon we erred by not seeing what Hamling had to offer over 5 or so Senior games.
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You'll get no argument from me on that, F2G. I always liked his marking ability and that appears to have come on in leaps and bounds (so to speak ;)). Am so disappointed that he chose not to compete with his older Cats teammates for opportunities but that's the way the cookie crumbles. :(
 

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I always thought the future of Hamling and to a lesser extent Brown came down to if we were successful in getting Frawley. Was fairly baffled when we missed Frawley but still got rid of them both.

But you'd have to say his improved. Sometimes players like that just need a change of scenery.
 
speedybundy said:
But you'd have to say his improved. Sometimes players like that just need a change of scenery.
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Hamling polled a total of 593 votes in last years VFL best & fairest.
16 votes behind the eventual winner.

In fourth place was Kolodjashnij (591 votes) and fifth place Matthew Sully (584 votes). I reiterate, Hamling hasn't really improved at all. He's playing the same kind of footy we saw him play last year.
The fact he was beginning to show promise by his third year on the list makes the delisting even more perplexing.
Amateurish to some degree.
To let go a young kid like this but bring in someone like Cameron Delaney who will be lucky to play 15-20 games over the next two years, very disconcerting at some of the decisions our club have been making in recent years.
 
Shattered he got delisted before he got a go. But if I do remember he did get close a few times to debut before he got injured. I thought he would be decent as he had some of the best defenders in Lonergan, Taylor and Enright to learn from while practice on Hawkins.

I see him being very similar to Will Schofield.
 
Bobby_ said:
Hamling polled a total of 593 votes in last years VFL best & fairest.
16 votes behind the eventual winner.

In fourth place was Kolodjashnij (591 votes) and fifth place Matthew Sully (584 votes). I reiterate, Hamling hasn't really improved at all. He's playing the same kind of footy we saw him play last year.
The fact he was beginning to show promise by his third year on the list makes the delisting even more perplexing.
Amateurish to some degree.
To let go a young kid like this but bring in someone like Cameron Delaney who will be lucky to play 15-20 games over the next two years, very disconcerting at some of the decisions our club have been making in recent years.
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Delaney is on the rookie list…Hambling wouldn't have accepted that…..we brought in Bews and Thurlow into a very experienced back line…both better than Hambling IMO…..and clearly we have backed Kolo in over Hambling….so Hambling goes…..and has taken his opportunity. Good luck to him.

Doubt he would have got much if any opportunity over those I have mentioned in 2015 at Geelong.

Seems all ok to me….unless Kolo is a dud of course…or leaves to join his bro….:eek:

On Delaney….I see it announced he is in full training now, so lets hope the kid makes it through and can prepare himself for 2016 after a full pre-season and some games in the VFL….having seen some footage of him, he just might make it as an AFL player.
 
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David the Cat said:
Delaney is on the rookie list…Hambling wouldn't have accepted that…..we brought in Bews and Thurlow into a very experienced back line…both better than Hambling IMO…..and clearly we have backed Kolo in over Hambling….so Hambling goes…..and has taken his opportunity. Good luck to him.

Doubt he would have got much if any opportunity over those I have mentioned in 2015 at Geelong.

Seems all ok to me….unless Kolo is a dud of course…or leaves to join his bro….:eek:

On Delaney….I see it announced he is in full training now, so lets hope the kid makes it through and can prepare himself for 2016 after a full pre-season and some games in the VFL….having seen some footage of him, he just might make it as an AFL player.
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Firstly David, Bews and Thurlow you can cross off that list as they are not key position defenders. Key position defenders are those able to play on the 1st or 2nd tall forwards which Hamling was doing alongside Sully and Brown in the VFL last year. That is mainly due to his height of 195cm as opposed to Bews 184cm or Thurlow 190cm.
Rivers, Lonergan, Mackie & Enright are all over 30. Do you honestly believe they will still be steering the ship next season, or the following season?
This is why losing a promising key defender like Hamling can impact us in the coming years, right about the time he may indeed be venturing upto 50 games for the Western Bulldogs, if he's good enough to go on with it.

Yes, we have Jake Kolodjashnij and Cameron Delaney but I want to ask you, apart from his highlights package (created three years ago), Delaney has been battling to do simple things as kick a footy. He has a toe issue which happens to be a fairly debilitating injury for anyone let alone a professional athlete. Played a total of five games in 2012, one more in 2013 before succumbing to the injury.
I have zero confidence he will ever manage to get through an entire season of AFL. It's not rocket science mate, some blokes simply aren't built for high intensity sports and he, along with Marcus Drum, Mitch Clark, Hamish McIntosh, Nathan Vardy, Bille Smedts, Josh Cowan and Dawson Simpson are quite similar in that sense.

I hope I'm wrong, we desperately need some good KPD's at the minute. With only Kolodjashnij fit & healthy, Hamb;)ling playing well and gaining invaluable experience in the AFL (already equaled Delaney's games tally), we sure could use a bit of luck.
 
I know what a KPD is Bobby….

Opportunities are limited as Kolo has found this year, with Rivers playing as well as he ever has, Lonergan signed till the end of next year and playing well, Taylor entrenched as he should be and Enright no certainty to retire this year…the MC saw Kolo as a better option long term and Joel was let go….he wanted to play senior football consistently and Geelong couldn't offer that…the Dogs could and so it happened. No good crying about it.

I don't see that Hamling would have had many opportunities this year given it appears they rated Kolo higher..it was reasonable for him to seek opportunities and Geelong couldn't keep him on a promise of a few games...It happens on a regular basis in the AFL.

As for who will be steering the ship…we have Lonergan, Taylor, and possibly Rivers/Enright next season and a draft to come…perhaps two…before we nominate new players to steer the ship.

Joel might have been a nice option but the timing for him wasn't quite right at Geelong…and like you said, with Delaney back in full training, we are due for a little luck…lets see what transpires..
 
David the Cat said:
we have Lonergan, Taylor, and possibly Rivers/Enright next season and a draft to come…perhaps two…before we nominate new players to steer the ship.
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thing is though, we can't keep on banking on Lonergan or Rivers or Enright to remain as strong as they have because seriously David, there will come a point in which they decline rather rapidly. We saw it happen with Scarlett and a few others back then. When that time comes, we simply can't look to Kolodjashnij and say "here you are boy, take over now" not if he's yet to gather 10 or more games experience. When Lonergan does decline, Hamling will be coming into his own and that's where we take another step back as a list with lofty ambitions for the future. Chris Scott is not managing the transition as well as he did in his first couple of seasons. Kolodjashnij should be upto 20 games by now and that should have started last year.
Hamling should have played at least 3-5 games instead of zero as that way, we may have seen the kind of potential he's showing over at the Bulldogs.

To keep on thinking she's all right and will be alright next year . . . that's just not planning efficiently for the future at all in my opinion.
 
cynical said:
He was pick 32, which is an average pick. Project player is probably the wrong wording but he certainly was going to take a bit longer than usual. 3-5 years as opposed to 2-4

Just don't know what the club was thinking.
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Well, at the end of the day, the club made their decision based on a far more detailed database than the casual observations of us here on BF.
 
Bobby_ said:
same kind of detailed database they used to bring in Drum, Delaney, McIntosh and Clark?
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I'm an amateur and so know little about such things, but I'd humbly suggest that monitoring and measuring a guy within your club at training, playing VFL etc would provide far more detailed info than the limited data available on guys from afar.

Drum - could've been a solid player, and suffered a rare injury......detached retina was it not? Hard to predict that.

Delaney - not much to lose, and they've thought the upside, if he overcomes the injury based on the medical advice they've received, to be worth the punt. Jury still out.

McIntosh.....could've been, but their punt vs medical advice obviously didn't pay off.

Clark......could still be a good pick. Jury still out.
 

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Has Hamling improved?

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