Analysis Have we really fixed our main weakness this year ?

[Hounddd]

To me, for us to be a real premiership threat, it has to be McIntosh. He can supposedly run all day and is that fantastic height at 191ish cm. From all reports, he's meant to have a more than adequate foot on him. I just feel Batch is too much of a negating slowish type, who couldn't become close to elite as a HBFer. Conca needs to be in the guts, and I feel we will be far better off with Floss joining him. In my opinion, if the club can get Kamdyn going as a rebounding tallish flanker it makes our backline absolute top shelf. With an act of God seeing Kamdyn lock down that role imagine a back line of:

BB: Morris Astbury Grimes
HB: Kamdyn Rance Houli/Floss/Hunt/Drummond

The versatility of that back line gets me stupidly horny.

 

[TJTIGER]

This post on the Bach thread got me thinking. So figured ill air my thoughts and get your input

IMO we have done a stack of work and went through a lot of pain developing the back 6 we have. One of our main weakness was simply the monster forwards used to rip us a new one. It looks like a Fit Astbury and a developing Elton, will go a long way to address it. Thats great but I believe we have a weakness thats even more damaging and that is that offensive half back that can run all day.

We have Houli and as the simple poster I quoted above noted ( which surprised me, he noticed it as he normally is nose deep into his bong) when Houli does not play, our run drys up and we more often lose. We then tried putting lids there but that again was robbing peter to pay Paul, not actually fixing this issue as we lose more then what we gain.

So I had a look at the list and have given my thoughts in maybe what our plan is to correct it.

Lennon- Different player then Houli but could be just as effective. What he lacks in pace, he can make up with ball movement. Why run 60 meters and kick it 30 when you can run 30 and kick it 60. Still a kid with a stack to learn but he has the size and ability IMO to be a really good quality defensive weapon

Hunt- He has played a tagging and mid role at the cats. Good defensive work with good speed. Could actually be a clone to Houli and may very well complement each other but does he have the tank ?
?

Bring in the Clones !!!! (The Frau from Austin Powers)....

Good post, Nice to have more depth in the team...

 

[bigstyletiger]

I don't mind batch as a distributor of the pill. Good overhead intercept mark. Looking like developing into a fine player. Would like to see Lennon on the opposite flank to houli but have thought for a while that it would be nice to have a speedster in the backline. Tough to fit Grimes and Batch though. For me this year is looking really solid.
B Chaplin, Rance, Batchelor/Grimes
HB Lennon, Astbury, Houli

 

[Squibbs]

I don't mind batch as a distributor of the pill. Good overhead intercept mark. Looking like developing into a fine player. Would like to see Lennon on the opposite flank to houli but have thought for a while that it would be nice to have a speedster in the backline. Tough to fit Grimes and Batch though. For me this year is looking really solid.
B Chaplin, Rance, Batchelor/Grimes
HB Lennon, Astbury, Houli

Have to agree with you there. Grimes and Batchelor will definitely need to fight it out for that spot in the backline, especially with Lennon to be played down on the half back flank this year presumably.

 

[Rubber Hips]

Reckon we still lack a quality small crumbing forward...in your face, pile the pressure on...cause turnovers mongrel
Kingy was it but struggled to stay on the park in recent years.
Morris might be it - but will need this season to develop into it - if in fact he is up to the task.

I'm hoping either a Short or Castagna might develop into this sort of player

 

[GoTigers2015]

B: Grimes Astbury Chaplain
HB: Bachelor Rance Houli

Bachelor is still the best option for HBF to partner Houli unless we move Flossy back. Will be good to see Lennon taking over this role long-term but will need to earn his stripes. Not yet convinced on McIntosh but he also looks a really good prospect and hopefully can also get some games under the belt in the VFL and be pushing for selection.

 

[GoTigers2015]

Reckon we still lack a quality small crumbing forward...in your face, pile the pressure on...cause turnovers mongrel
Kingy was it but struggled to stay on the park in recent years.
Morris might be it - but will need this season to develop into it - if in fact he is up to the task.

I'm hoping either a Short or Castagna might develop into this sort of player

You have hid the nail on the head, our weakest area is forward pressure. Kingy played this role well and hopefully Morris can make the position his own. From the new players I would rate Butler the best prospect for challenging as a small forward.

 

[jreesosb]

All interesting posts.
For mine, our main weakness is between the ears

 

[ScallyWag1]

All interesting posts.
For mine, our main weakness is between the ears

The opposition 'loose man in defence' seems to completely bamboozle us, every year. We can get it at half-back and in the middle no probs but the amount of times we put it straight down the throat of a loose defender, allowing the other team to rebound...It drives me nuts.

I actually think (hope), a change in forward line coach might help there, call it addition by subtraction.

 

[Rubber Hips]

You have hid the nail on the head, our weakest area is forward pressure. Kingy played this role well and hopefully Morris can make the position his own. From the new players I would rate Butler the best prospect for challenging as a small forward.

forgot about Butler - let's hope he comes on and makes that spot his own

 

[GoTigers2015]

forgot about Butler - let's hope he comes on and makes that spot his own

"Butters" look like a natural forward, Hope so too

 

[captain cotch 9]

IMO Batchelour will play every game this year.
His intercept marking is just as good as Joel Bowdens. His kicking is good, he needs to improve his decision making though.

 

[TJTIGER]

All interesting posts.
For mine, our main weakness is between the ears

I'd agree but I think the 9 games in a row 2014 showed a new strong belief as a group when they put their minds to it the team is nearly impossible to beat....

 

[TJTIGER]

forgot about Butler - let's hope he comes on and makes that spot his own

I'll be watching Butler with great anticipation. Seems he has the tools to play a number of roles and looks a "Natural" footballer. Seems to me he could play defence, Mid or forward.(Just unsure how strong he is in the air ?)...

 

[GoTigers2015]

I'd agree but I think the 9 games in a row 2014 showed a new strong belief as a group when they put their minds to it the team is nearly impossible to beat....

We cannot rely on Team Spirit alone, need to have the transitional game to beat the top teams.

 

[TJTIGER]

We cannot rely on Team Spirit alone, need to have the transitional game to beat the top teams.

Are you saying we won those 9 in a row on team spirit alone ?
For me the boys improved in almost all aspects of the game but to me one of the most important improvements was the ability to stand single minded & never stop working very hard. They forced teams to beat them as opposed to reducing their output due to being behind on the scoreboard...In 2013 I don't think we would have won quite a number of those games from last season (we would not have been as relentless). To me that's what makes a top 4 or top 2 side. No matter what the score board says you play to plan/structures with intensity till the 4th quarter siren sounds...(like our song says, Fight & fight ...)

 

[GoTigers2015]

Are you saying we won those 9 in a row on team spirit alone ?
For me the boys improved in almost all aspects of the game but to me one of the most important improvements was the ability to stand single minded & never stop working very hard. They forced teams to beat them as opposed to reducing their output due to being behind on the scoreboard...In 2013 I don't think we would have won quite a number of those games from last season (we would not have been as relentless). To me that's what makes a top 4 or top 2 side. No matter what the score board says you play to plan/structures with intensity till the 4th quarter siren sounds...(like our song says, Fight & fight ...)

Sorry not entirely team spirit but was a big factor. The team also worked harder in training and the results showed on the field. Was a great achievement, but many of the wins were against lower ranked teams and the Port loss showed up our lack of midfield depth and quick ball movement and transitional play.

It has been characteristic of how we played in previous seasons. We have always had passion in our team and our supporters most people would agree are most passionate fan base in the league. This is a good thing but we also need a system and players to move the ball fast and clinically. The difference is now that we are getting the players skilful enough to do this. We are ranked equal second in the number of first round picks we have on our list and now do not rely on a small core group of players like we did in the 90s and 2000s.

The most exciting the thing is that we have a lot of young talent that we will replace the more experience fringe players and really make the team a more powerful team. Happy days ahead.

 

[The full package]

Just to make it simple I dont think it was much to do with our back six I think we missed to hard body mids, Tuck and Jacko. As Miles became better we won more, we still need another hard body mid or Thomas to pick up his game.

 

[TJTIGER]

Sorry not entirely team spirit but was a big factor. The team also worked harder in training and the results showed on the field. Was a great achievement, but many of the wins were against lower ranked teams and the Port loss showed up our lack of midfield depth and quick ball movement and transitional play.

It has been characteristic of how we played in previous seasons. We have always had passion in our team and our supporters most people would agree are most passionate fan base in the league. This is a good thing but we also need a system and players to move the ball fast and clinically. The difference is now that we are getting the players skilful enough to do this. We are ranked equal second in the number of first round picks we have on our list and now do not rely on a small core group of players like we did in the 90s and 2000s.

The most exciting the thing is that we have a lot of young talent that we will replace the more experience fringe players and really make the team a more powerful team. Happy days ahead.

Ok...There are a range of reasons why we went down that day. Personally I think the team overall had a shocker. But my own view (as I think I've mentioned in another thread) is that the boys were Physically and mentally down (from the previous 9 or so weeks). Purely from a conditioning point of view (which I have a background in). It is nearly impossible to keep an individual at peak performance for longer than a 2-4 weeks , let alone a team. I think our head of conditioning was in his 2nd season last year (correct me if I'm wrong). So he's still learning about the individuals/team & what works best. So from this position alone if the boys had the knowledge etc they probably still would have finished in a similar way. I think overall they did a great job to put themselves in the final. But I doubt that there would be many around who would have been more disappointed than them(playing group/coaches etc) as to the way it unfolded. Learning for the whole footy department (let's hope) & continued improvement for all...Also on our way there we had to play against 2 or 3 others who were in direct competition with us for that last spot, EFC, W.C & AFC from memory & we proved to be the better team....

 

[jreesosb]

Just to make it simple I dont think it was much to do with our back six I think we missed to hard body mids, Tuck and Jacko. As Miles became better we won more, we still need another hard body mid or Thomas to pick up his game.

I agree with a lot of this. A team MUST have some talented but super hard mids. Tucky was always my fave and then Jackson improved so much he literally won a B&F. Miles is great, just wonderful. Thomas will remain an honest toiler at best, so we probably need one more...

 

[Ned_Flanders]

This post on the Bach thread got me thinking. So figured ill air my thoughts and get your input

IMO we have done a stack of work and went through a lot of pain developing the back 6 we have. One of our main weakness was simply the monster forwards used to rip us a new one. It looks like a Fit Astbury and a developing Elton, will go a long way to address it. Thats great but I believe we have a weakness thats even more damaging and that is that offensive half back that can run all day.

We have Houli and as the simple poster I quoted above noted ( which surprised me, he noticed it as he normally is nose deep into his bong) when Houli does not play, our run drys up and we more often lose. We then tried putting lids there but that again was robbing peter to pay Paul, not actually fixing this issue as we lose more then what we gain.

So I had a look at the list and have given my thoughts in maybe what our plan is to correct it.

Lennon- Different player then Houli but could be just as effective. What he lacks in pace, he can make up with ball movement. Why run 60 meters and kick it 30 when you can run 30 and kick it 60. Still a kid with a stack to learn but he has the size and ability IMO to be a really good quality defensive weapon

Hunt- He has played a tagging and mid role at the cats. Good defensive work with good speed. Could actually be a clone to Houli and may very well complement each other but does he have the tank ?

Conca - IMO, he has the talent. He is not slow, more medium paced, can at times make the odd wrong choice but even though he has not shown it often recently as a junior he was elite in getting in and out of traffic to allow him to seemingly burst from a pack to kick it lace out....my smokey.

Knights- Here is a player IMO I think could be a real weapon if he stays fit. Smart, can read the play and has a disposal that you would bet your mortgage on to hit a fellow team mate. Just knows how to create space for himself. He has limited speed but will that hinder him to much ? IMO worth a crack.

Anyone else ? IMO what killed us, was our run. Shut down Houli who creates and we struggle, we need to correct it and have we done enough work to do so ?

weak

thread about our biggest weakness, and you lack the balls to call out tigs2010

 

[bigstyletiger]

Just to make it simple I dont think it was much to do with our back six I think we missed to hard body mids, Tuck and Jacko. As Miles became better we won more, we still need another hard body mid or Thomas to pick up his game.

True was a big factor. Hence the targetting of Armitage, Trengove and the recruitment of Ellis and Lambert.

 

[thetradesman]

We literally have no run out of defense in big games.

Houli goes missing when it counts, And have we done enough to correct it? No definitely not, how could anyone say we improved it?

 

[Rodney Dangerfield]

Ball movement goes to the shithouse when we struggle.
It does with most teams but the difference between our ball movement when good and bad is frightening.
It comes back to a lot of what's been mentioned in here.
Good points like it being between the ears,run out of defence and work ethic.
What sets Brandon Ellis apart from a lot of youngsters is his courage for running.
A few more like that and we will see a marked improvement.
As also mentioned Chris Knights is the ultimate wild card here.
I don't get my hopes up because rarely does a player so injury prone catch a break,but if he does he's a guaranteed link on the chain to improve this area with smart running and beautiful disposal.
If he stays fit that's huge. Big if though.
Vlastuin will be big here too with his work ethic as will Batchelor with his long accurate kicking.
And of course if Conca has a good run at it he will provide some gut running too I believe.
One last one that I believe makes a massive difference when playing back is Griffiths.
He has a rare ability to clear a line and launch defence into attack.
I'd love to see him back there at times.

 

[Livonski]

Have to agree with you there. Grimes and Batchelor will definitely need to fight it out for that spot in the backline, especially with Lennon to be played down on the half back flank this year presumably.

On that basis you'd take Grimes for his closing speed and telescopic fist. Just that bit quicker over the ground.