Autopsy Hawks vs Bunnies no more

[Pessimistic]

Maybe it has to be a 5-7 plan. The original Clarkson model.

I mean even from 2008 to 2013 was 5 years but it didn't seem like some huge wait. 2009/10 were tough but 2011 gave hope.

And actually the draft is what gave us the core of the side and then trading augmented that. Surely that's the sensible and logical way to proceed. 5-7 years or so might be the time it takes for GWS to see their side break up too.

I'm not sure anyone can create a flag winning list using FA as a major tool, due to paying overs and effect on existing players.

It's an exciting ride to build a list with a core of highly rated juniors and with the memory of 4 flags fresh in the memory patience becomes easier. Your model could lead to stagnation where there is no real reason for hope. Will this Geelong side win a flag?

When the club traded in TOM and JOM and picked up Vickery I thought great they believe we can top up and go again and like you I thought who wants to wait 5 years but actually it looks like we don't have the core from BH and I realised watching a rebuild can be enjoyable and I'm more patient than I thought.

Of course if box hill weren't 5-0 it would suit your argument better

 

[JustKickIt]

And why do you hope we finish last

He wants St Kilda to get a really good draft pick?

 

[Pessimistic]

The aints will probably have a party

 

[realhawk]

Roughi shouldn't be captain, his not captain material, he doesn't lift when it's required and was hopeless last night. Why is that no one here mentions his name?? That bit when we had the ball on the wing and going into our 50 and decides to pass it back to the wing with a dodgey kick which cost us a goal. That was horrible!!!

Correct call. The general should still be skipper. Let roughy just concentrate on his game. Should be vice captain. Hodge has been the stand out capitan in the competition for the past decade and the brains trust take it off him to pass it to a guy who missed a year with a knee injury and battled cancer. The decion making at the club has fallen through the roof the past year, hence our current situations. They keep doing things from left field thinking that their doing something cutting edge, but all the club is doing is deviating from the tried and true and not perfecting the basics.

 

[Turly]

What's the point in having something valuable doing SFA in the current set up? Footy is a business, teams would give their left nut for him. Ridiculous for us to keep a clear cut top end forward as a floating wingman, half forward, half back, specialist nothing.

So let's trade Jack Gunston? He's been a star for us since 2013. He isn't old and is playing out of position in a team that currently sits in the bottom 4.

 

[thejockey]

With the personal we had I thought we would do well to get within 5 goals

As disappointing as the game panned out, I'm feeling quite positive about our younger and more untried players . There are good signs there
To me they might just be better then I initial thought and definitely how they are rated outside the club

I think we all know the deficiencies in our list and our issues onfield currently and that will take time to correct

Its going to take patience

 

[LuckyHawk]

Correct call. The general should still be skipper. Let roughy just concentrate on his game. Should be vice captain. Hodge has been the stand out capitan in the competition for the past decade and the brains trust take it off him to pass it to a guy who missed a year with a knee injury and battled cancer. The decion making at the club has fallen through the roof the past year, hence our current situations. They keep doing things from left field thinking that their doing something cutting edge, but all the club is doing is deviating from the tried and true and not perfecting the basics.

Hodgey relinquished the captaincy, the club didn't take it from him. Roughie is and will continue to be a good captain.

 

[ZAD1]

Yeah, nah.

O'meara and O'Rourke possibly, but Lovell's shoulder is bit out of left field.

Clearly I was referring to those two rather than Lovell.

 

[realhawk]

Hodgey relinquished the captaincy, the club didn't take it from him. Roughie is and will continue to be a good captain.

That's the media spin the club put on it , either way they should have insisted that Hodge stay capitan.roughy may become a good capitan, but we had the very best, rough just needs to concentrate on playing well.

 

[LuckyHawk]

That's the media spin the club put on it , either way they should have insisted that Hodge stay capitan.roughy may become a good capitan, but we had the very best, rough just needs to concentrate on playing well.

Roughie and his captaincy has been made a scapegoat by desperados trying to pinpoint reasons for our
poor form. I am quite sure the players and club are very happy with Roughie as captain.

 

[Flukey!]

I hope the club is investigating what our boys are drinking at half time....

 

[LuckyHawk]

I hope the club is investigating what our boys are drinking at half time....

Rule out concrete.

 

[hk89]

Correct call. The general should still be skipper. Let roughy just concentrate on his game. Should be vice captain. Hodge has been the stand out capitan in the competition for the past decade and the brains trust take it off him to pass it to a guy who missed a year with a knee injury and battled cancer. The decion making at the club has fallen through the roof the past year, hence our current situations. They keep doing things from left field thinking that their doing something cutting edge, but all the club is doing is deviating from the tried and true and not perfecting the basics.

I tend to agree that it was stress Roughy could probably have done without, however if Hodge was captain again, and retires at the end of his year, that meant no transition with Hodge still able to help out with on field leadership while the new captain finds his feet. In hindsight there may have been better choices, but I think they did need to go with the change this year. Realistically Hodge is largely still playing the same on field leadership role he always has been, so we are not missing out on that, we've perhaps just put a little too much on Roughy's shoulders at this stage of his career given what has unfolded for him over the last couple of years (which would have been as draining mentally as it was physically). A very difficult decision to unfold now though.

 

[hk89]

Rule out concrete.

Not convinced...they certainly seemed weighed down by something!

 

[flinchfree]

Maybe it has to be a 5-7 plan. The original Clarkson model.

I mean even from 2008 to 2013 was 5 years but it didn't seem like some huge wait. 2009/10 were tough but 2011 gave hope.

And actually the draft is what gave us the core of the side and then trading augmented that. Surely that's the sensible and logical way to proceed. 5-7 years or so might be the time it takes for GWS to see their side break up too.

I'm not sure anyone can create a flag winning list using FA as a major tool, due to paying overs and effect on existing players.

It's an exciting ride to build a list with a core of highly rated juniors and with the memory of 4 flags fresh in the memory patience becomes easier. Your model could lead to stagnation where there is no real reason for hope. Will this Geelong side win a flag?

When the club traded in TOM and JOM and picked up Vickery I thought great they believe we can top up and go again and like you I thought who wants to wait 5 years but actually it looks like we don't have the core from BH and I realised watching a rebuild can be enjoyable and I'm more patient than I thought.

Not me.
I think we've still got plenty of very good talent in the squad, minus more engine parts to go with Tom.
Don't mind the new backline taking shape, very happy with the overall talent up forward, need 3-5 new onballers and running players to be as good as anyone in the comp.
GWS are not that far ahead of the pack, you just have to win first use against them before they run and spread.

I'll take Dusty (shudder inside writing that) and Whitfield, May or Lever in FA and or trades, bring in some new draft/rookie picks and feel VERY good about next season.

 

[Dank You Steven]

He was AT the gold coast game.

Well there you go!

 

[PhatHQ]

How will it make 2018 better?

Why finish 15-16 & have no draft picks in the first Rd anyway???

If we finish last the PSD chip comes into play.....
if we're not going to play finals & we are going for a rebuild, balls deep on a rebuild or end up perennial 9thmond with a half arsed list.
"Managing" players this season & start any surgeries now for 2018 will put us in the best possible position to say 2017 was an anomaly but we have Rough healthy & we are coming full steam ahead with the new look Hawks built on youth & not rolling with aged superstars.

 

[Manila_Hawk]

In my opinion....

1. There are a lot of new faces in the team
2. In the first half, Collingwood played tentatively, always looking backward for an option. That suits our style and we covered them easily
3. After half time, Collingwood changed to the "play on at all costs" approach.
4. As has been the case for a year now, our coaching and our playing style has not adapted. We are all at sea.... Looking lost...

Until we address point 4 above, we will continue to get hammered. Sadly.

Naming and shaming individuals is pointless in my view.

As a team, we need to adapt.

 

[Pessimistic]

If Cyril. Or TOB plays the result changes and bucks and his 'quality' midfield don't look quite so smug

 

[Off The Couch]

If Cyril. Or TOB plays the result changes and bucks and his 'quality' midfield don't look quite so smug

That's not a guarantee - those ins may have changed how the first quarter got played

 

[Pessimistic]

I saw the game Clarko saw. Nearly all the pies goals followed turnovers from poor entry into our fwd line. Or poor attempts by forwards

We lost one forward too many

 

[Spursfan]

I saw the game Clarko saw. Nearly all the pies goals followed turnovers from poor entry into our fwd line. Or poor attempts by forwards

We lost one forward too many

Killed us all year so far, unable to stop opposition transition from our own half.

 

[Spursfan]

If Cyril. Or TOB plays the result changes and bucks and his 'quality' midfield don't look quite so smug

God I hope they resign him. My opinion of them dropped after saturday, a top 8 side contender would've beaten us by 8-10 goals.

 

[beta_condition]

That's not a guarantee - those ins may have changed how the first quarter got played

I'd back hawthorn to win with Stratton, Frawley, Birchall, Cyril, O'Brien, Ceglar, O'Meara and Brand in the team. Collingwood should of nailed us, the first half says more about them than their comeback.

 

[thejockey]

I saw the game Clarko saw. Nearly all the pies goals followed turnovers from poor entry into our fwd line. Or poor attempts by forwards

We lost one forward too many

Yep. In the 3rd quarter against the tide we fluffed 2 easy chances and then the roughead brainfade

Kick two of those 'gimmes' and at worst we halt there momentum and go into 3/4 time with a bit of a break

Would have been deflating onfield