Hawthorn’s 2019 Trade/FA - Targets/Incoming players discussion only

[killerspud]

But what is the right price ?? $800k is the RIGHT price. Don’t let anybody tell you we can’t fit him in with Cogs and Patton. Utter BS.
And don’t let anybody tell you he is not worth our first pick, particularly if we got something in Pick coming back the other way.

We have seen this football club do almost anything to get a deal done. The reality is we don’t have the intent to do such a deal. It is simple, stubborn and dumb.

The only reason we couldnhave for not getting B Hill is that we want L Whitfield this year.

If we wait a year we could have them both

 

[Topiary]

Can we fit him in with Witfield though ?

Of course we can. We are about to take about at least $2m out of TPP with upcoming list changes, delistings, retirements. When has the modern era HFC not made things happen if it is so motivated. They are smitten for some small minded reason.

 

[Topiary]

Of course we can. We are about to take about at least $2m out of TPP with upcoming list changes, delistings, retirements. When has the modern era HFC not made things happen if it is so motivated. They are smitten for some small minded reason.

The only reason we couldnhave for not getting B Hill is that we want L Whitfield this year.

If we wait a year we could have them both

We don’t want Whitfield this year. Whitfield as an FA next year

 

[MrPremiership]

I'm not fussed here.

If we get Hill, great.

If we don't get Hill, i'm sure I will be equally (if not more) excited about the other A-grader we will get.

#hawthornproblems

 

[Topiary]

A team of 5 elite inside mids isn't going to win you a flag you need jets on the outside

That is exactly what Hill is. An outside jet. He is not icing, he's an essential ingredient for a premiership cake as much as Roughead, Hodge and Rioli were. When we had him in partnership with Issy we won flags. It's like some of you weren't present for the threepeat

This is so right !!! Don’t come on here next year lamenting this. It will just turn my stomach.

 

[RoughysMullet]

It's started already.

Forget him.

Watson worried he will choose us by the sounds of it- what an anti hawk germ he is - worth a late 1st at best..

 

[Judd2Sewell]

He might be very good icing. He might be the best icing. But he is still icing.

He was an important part of the Hawks threepeat but he was nowhere near the engine room of that success. He is not a Hodge. He is not a Mitchell. He is not a Burgoyne. He is not a Roughead.

Until the Hawks find replacements for these blokes they do not need to worry about finishing pieces. And they certainly do not need to lock up $800k of their salary cap long term on finishing pieces. We already have half a team of elite finishing pieces.

It is a fact that there are not enough elite ball winners at Hawthorn currently to get Hill the ball, and when he gets it there are not enough elite forwards for him to kick it too.

Hawthorn need to fix this first.

Very well said.

You don't build a team around Brad Hill. He's there to compliment the core players.

 

[Judd2Sewell]

A team of 5 elite inside mids isn't going to win you a flag you need jets on the outside

That is exactly what Hill is. An outside jet. He is not icing, he's an essential ingredient for a premiership cake as much as Roughead, Hodge and Rioli were. When we had him in partnership with Issy we won flags. It's like some of you weren't present for the threepeat

Is this a serious post? Am I missing something or are you honestly saying that Brad Hill was as important to our threepeat as Luke Hodge was?

 

[Randy Campbell]

Icing or cake.
Both have a role to play.

 

[Brishawk]

Icing or cake.
Both have a role to play.

Neither as good without the other. Eating icing on its own makes me sick. And cake with no icing...ewwww

 

[Topiary]

Very well said.

You don't build a team around Brad Hill. He's there to compliment the core players.

When was this claimed. Aside.......ask Ross Lyon where BHill fits currently into their best regime. I bet he says he is their 2nd or 3rd most important player. Fyffe being the obvious other. I am genuinely thinking I am an outlier re his impact and ability.

 

[Nastyfish]

But what is the right price ?? $800k is the RIGHT price. Don’t let anybody tell you we can’t fit him in with Cogs and Patton. Utter BS.
And don’t let anybody tell you he is not worth our first pick, particularly if we got something in Pick coming back the other way.

We have seen this football club do almost anything to get a deal done. The reality is we don’t have the intent to do such a deal. It is simple, stubborn and dumb.

Is it still affordable if you add Whitfield into the mix, and then think about what some of the youngsters like Sicily could reasonably expect? I suppose beyond him there would not be any young players anticipating the filthy lucre.

 

[Topiary]

Is this a serious post? Am I missing something or are you honestly saying that Brad Hill was as important to our threepeat as Luke Hodge was?

When are we going understand BHill 2019 is NOT BHill 2017 let alone 2015.

 

[Rushed_Behind]

This is so right !!! Don’t come on here next year lamenting this. It will just turn my stomach.

Have you heard we not going after him? Maybe by his manager ruling us out is a ploy to take away the scent.

 

[Judd2Sewell]

When was this claimed. Aside.......ask Ross Lyon where BHill fits currently into their best regime. I bet he says he is their 2nd or 3rd most important player. Fyffe being the obvious other. I am genuinely thinking I am an outlier re his impact and ability.

He's obviously one of the elite wingers, I've not said otherwise and am not arguing as such. In fact I've posted that I think he'd be the third best wingman in the league behind Whitfield and Gaff currently.

But if you are building a side from scratch and want to throw money around you won't be throwing it at an extremely outside wingman - regardless of how good he is as a winger. Hence as others have claimed he's more of an icing player.

The level of offence being taken at comments like this is too much. No one is denying that he's an elite wingman.

 

[tige19]

Is this a serious post? Am I missing something or are you honestly saying that Brad Hill was as important to our threepeat as Luke Hodge was?

This forum throws up all sorts of BS lol

 

[Judd2Sewell]

When are we going understand BHill 2019 is NOT BHill 2017 let alone 2015.

What's that got to do with what I posted?

Answer me this - was Brad Hill as crucial to our treepeat as Luke Hodge was? Which was my question, as it seems that was what killerspud was suggesting.

 

[VandoHawk]

If we land Coniglio, with Mitchell returning and the development of Worpel/O'Meara we definitely have the midfield 'cake' to win the ball and spread well. The only thing that group would lack is a slight amount of pace (which is overrated) and elite disposal.

Hilly gives us both those things - imagine him being fed the ball and delivering it lace out to Lewis/Patton. You can almost bet that Gunston/Bruest will see significant improvement with a strengthened midfield and good ball use.

Additionally imagine the partnership he could form with Scully - they are both two of the hardest running wingman in the competition and would run opposition players into the dirt. It would give us flexibility to use old man Henderson or Smithy (if he sticks around) across halfback or forward where his good disposal can be an asset

He's an improved player from his Hawthorn days and is popular amongst the playing group (his addition wouldn't ruffle any feathers). His current output is 100% better than a speculative higher pick, especially if we get a later pick coming back. I seriously don't see why we would let him go to St. Kilda. Surely he would choose us @ 700 over St. Kilda @ 800-900.

IMO the only reason we wouldn't do the trade is we aren't getting Coniglio and want to use our pick on an inside midfielder. Otherwise it doesn't make sense to me.

 

[play2win]

When was this claimed. Aside.......ask Ross Lyon where BHill fits currently into their best regime. I bet he says he is their 2nd or 3rd most important player. Fyffe being the obvious other. I am genuinely thinking I am an outlier re his impact and ability.

not really, probably the best outside player in the comp. elite endurance, evasiveness and spatial awareness.

it's just hypocritical to think we sold him cheap (so what was his value back then, maybe ~pick 15?), and now not value him as worth at least a top 10 pick. just doesn't make sense. in terms of salary, I always find it funny how big footy posters think they have any idea of a players commercial value or salary - it is always subjectively judged out of context.

 

[Judd2Sewell]

If we land Coniglio, with Mitchell returning and the development of Worpel/O'Meara we definitely have the midfield 'cake' to win the ball and spread well. The only thing that group would lack is a slight amount of pace (which is overrated) and elite disposal.

Hilly gives us both those things - imagine him being fed the ball and delivering it lace out to Lewis/Patton. You can almost bet that Gunston/Bruest will see significant improvement with a strengthened midfield and good ball use.

Additionally imagine the partnership he could form with Scully - they are both two of the hardest running wingman in the competition and would run opposition players into the dirt. It would give us flexibility to use old man Henderson or Smithy (if he sticks around) across halfback or forward where his good disposal can be an asset

He's an improved player from his Hawthorn days and is popular amongst the playing group (his addition wouldn't ruffle any feathers). His current output is 100% better than a speculative higher pick, especially if we get a later pick coming back. I seriously don't see why we would let him go to St. Kilda. Surely he would choose us @ 700 over St. Kilda @ 800-900.

Agree - Hill would be perfect to pair with a dynamite midfield combination of Mitchell, Jaeger, Coniglio, Worpel, Wingard and Shiels. I think with a fit Scully and Henderson chipping in teams wouldn't be able to keep up.

The question is at what price though? If we could fit him in as Tops suggests I would love for him to come back. Though IMO $800k for a wingman that can only play that one position is too much.

 

[Kinghts 24]

I always liked Brad Hill and was very disappointed when he chose to return to Perth. As I recall however, a lot of “supporters” on this and similar forums were very critical of his purported softness and “inability to lay a tackle.” Perhaps, some supporters can really only appreciate midfield “beasts.”
Whilst I would love to have Brad back at the Hawks I am not privy to our recruiting plans and the opportunity cost of using our first round draft pick and $800,000 of salary cap to trade for him. If, for example it cost us the chance of getting Whitfield I would not do it. If hypothetically it cost us the chance to upgrade our first rounder and draft Anderson I would not do it.
Therefore I cannot categorically say it is a great idea to make a play for Hill without knowing what other prospects are in play. Wright and Clarkson do know what “ balls are in the air” trade and free agency wise and obviously better able to make this decision.
I would expect that their judgement is not clouded by stubbornness nor stupidity.

This.

He had more Premiership Cups than career 'hardball gets'.

 

[Manila_Hawk]

If we land Coniglio, with Mitchell returning and the development of Worpel/O'Meara we definitely have the midfield 'cake' to win the ball and spread well. The only thing that group would lack is a slight amount of pace (which is overrated) and elite disposal.

Hilly gives us both those things - imagine him being fed the ball and delivering it lace out to Lewis/Patton. You can almost bet that Gunston/Bruest will see significant improvement with a strengthened midfield and good ball use.

What Vando says is absolutely correct.

Once we have the midfield grunt sorted out, then we get lots of entry into the forward line... Good.

But when rebounding from defense, we need run and carry AND SOMEONE WHO CAN DELIVER THE BALL ACCURATELY TO THE FORWARDS.

Once we get a midfield, then this will be the job of Brad Hill and Tom Scully (and hopefully I. Omith).

 

[Mrzohs]

Agree - Hill would be perfect to pair with a dynamite midfield combination of Mitchell, Jaeger, Coniglio, Worpel, Wingard and Shiels. I think with a fit Scully and Henderson chipping in teams wouldn't be able to keep up.

The question is at what price though? If we could fit him in as Tops suggests I would love for him to come back. Though IMO $800k for a wingman that can only play that one position is too much.

If Smith leaves there will be enough cap space to lure b.hill if we go down that path.
If we choose to give up first rd picks and pursue Whitfield like some have suggested, no chance we can fit him in.

We need elite disposal as good as our midfield will be none of them are elite kicks and burgoyne can't play till his 45 i wish

 

[QuietB]

When was this claimed. Aside.......ask Ross Lyon where BHill fits currently into their best regime. I bet he says he is their 2nd or 3rd most important player. Fyffe being the obvious other. I am genuinely thinking I am an outlier re his impact and ability.

And Freo are 11th

 

[TylerDurden]

Hill is worth a top 10 pick and circa $800k a year.

Will we do it. I doubt it?

My gut is that pick 8 is part of a Whitfield deal now, or we take it to the Draft.