How do you Fix Chadstone A.F.C?

[Just a Footballer]

As the old adage goes, you are only as strong as your weakest link.....And though the VAFA is the strongest Local Comp going around, Chadstone remains a black mark against the League...with just 2 wins in their last 5 seasons, what has been done or can be done to at least make them at least semi-competitive? I know every Comp needs someone to finish bottom every year, but something needs to be done when it's the same side year after year, almost never winning or even close to winning a game....

Without knowing the club at all (only seen 1 game), I can't imagine they have much ability in keeping young, fit and reliable talent. Which means each year they can only get players that either have little to no talent or talent with no desire to work hard or be a good team player. Or older players way past their prime who just enjoy a kick and a beer (not always in that order).....Or a decent coach with the patience to attempt to change what I imagine is a poor culture and defeatist attitude.....

Without winning games, it's very hard for a club to get good players, and without good players, it's almost impossible to win games....So how does Chadstone break the cycle? I have an idea...

Do what St Francis Xavier did, go backwards to come forward....drop out of Div 4 and play a couple of seasons in the Clubbies, recruit or keep 35-40 committed players, and develop a winning culture... that way you don't have to merge with another club, and each week you only have to find 24 players instead of 44, so you can be more selective of who plays and who doesn't.......surely the best 24 players currently at Chadstone could win 5+ games in Club XVIII(B) in 2016?? And that would be a good starting point...What has the Club got to lose???

 

[Cosmo21]

As the old adage goes, you are only as strong as your weakest link.....And though the VAFA is the strongest Local Comp going around, Chadstone remains a black mark against the League...with just 2 wins in their last 5 seasons, what has been done or can be done to at least make them at least semi-competitive? I know every Comp needs someone to finish bottom every year, but something needs to be done when it's the same side year after year, almost never winning or even close to winning a game....

Without knowing the club at all (only seen 1 game), I can't imagine they have much ability in keeping young, fit and reliable talent. Which means each year they can only get players that either have little to no talent or talent with no desire to work hard or be a good team player. Or older players way past their prime who just enjoy a kick and a beer (not always in that order).....Or a decent coach with the patience to attempt to change what I imagine is a poor culture and defeatist attitude.....

Without winning games, it's very hard for a club to get good players, and without good players, it's almost impossible to win games....So how does Chadstone break the cycle? I have an idea...

Do what St Francis Xavier did, go backwards to come forward....drop out of Div 4 and play a couple of seasons in the Clubbies, recruit or keep 35-40 committed players, and develop a winning culture... that way you don't have to merge with another club, and each week you only have to find 24 players instead of 44, so you can be more selective of who plays and who doesn't.......surely the best 24 players currently at Chadstone could win 5+ games in Club XVIII(B) in 2016?? And that would be a good starting point...What has the Club got to lose???

It's an interesting question and I think posses another questions, is just playing the game enough? if not how many wins are enough to claim success? Do you have to go up a div or is it just winning a flag?

If you look at Div 4 in particular there is several team who are just treading water with no real difference to Chadstone except (a few) more wins.

Nth Brunswick, Maningham, Lillydale, Boxhill (better year this year) - Even go up a Div Latrobe, Power House and Albert Park.

 

[Max Leader]

Chadstone remains a black mark against the League

Surely your not Fitzgerald from OX.

Look at the facts.

All comps have teams that struggle to win, EFL have Surrey Park and NFL have Heidelberg West.

The ground that they play at doesn't have sewage coming back up into the rooms.
They haven't been involved in a game been cancelled due to violence.
They aren't an A Grade Club that had to forfeit a reserves game
They aren't a B Grade Club that had to forfeit a reserves game in 2015.
XVIII only requires 18-22 players to play, Div 4 usually uses upto 40 players.
This means each week 40 Chadstone and 40 opposition players are playing each week. Far better than XVIII.
No stories of them not being financial.
Don't see many players being suspended from Chadstone.

Not many reasons to think Chadstone are a black mark on the VAFA

Black marks on this comp arise when people take cheap shots at a club that clearly struggles to win games, but put on a game for their and opposition players to have a run around on a Saturday.

The late Tommy Hafey in one of his last engagements said that after recently visiting a youth prison, of the 200 inmates, only 1 was playing a team sport.

 

[bigwaz]

As the old adage goes, you are only as strong as your weakest link.....And though the VAFA is the strongest Local Comp going around, Chadstone remains a black mark against the League...with just 2 wins in their last 5 seasons, what has been done or can be done to at least make them at least semi-competitive? I know every Comp needs someone to finish bottom every year, but something needs to be done when it's the same side year after year, almost never winning or even close to winning a game....

Without knowing the club at all (only seen 1 game), I can't imagine they have much ability in keeping young, fit and reliable talent. Which means each year they can only get players that either have little to no talent or talent with no desire to work hard or be a good team player. Or older players way past their prime who just enjoy a kick and a beer (not always in that order).....Or a decent coach with the patience to attempt to change what I imagine is a poor culture and defeatist attitude.....

Without winning games, it's very hard for a club to get good players, and without good players, it's almost impossible to win games....So how does Chadstone break the cycle? I have an idea...

Do what St Francis Xavier did, go backwards to come forward....drop out of Div 4 and play a couple of seasons in the Clubbies, recruit or keep 35-40 committed players, and develop a winning culture... that way you don't have to merge with another club, and each week you only have to find 24 players instead of 44, so you can be more selective of who plays and who doesn't.......surely the best 24 players currently at Chadstone could win 5+ games in Club XVIII(B) in 2016?? And that would be a good starting point...What has the Club got to lose???

Perhaps get on their committee? Sounds like you have a bunch of great ideas...

 

[Just a Footballer]

Surely your not Fitzgerald from OX.

Look at the facts.

All comps have teams that struggle to win, EFL have Surrey Park and NFL have Heidelberg West.

The ground that they play at doesn't have sewage coming back up into the rooms.
They haven't been involved in a game been cancelled due to violence.
They aren't an A Grade Club that had to forfeit a reserves game
They aren't a B Grade Club that had to forfeit a reserves game in 2015.
XVIII only requires 18-22 players to play, Div 4 usually uses upto 40 players.
This means each week 40 Chadstone and 40 opposition players are playing each week. Far better than XVIII.
No stories of them not being financial.
Don't see many players being suspended from Chadstone.

Not many reasons to think Chadstone are a black mark on the VAFA

Black marks on this comp arise when people take cheap shots at a club that clearly struggles to win games, but put on a game for their and opposition players to have a run around on a Saturday.

The late Tommy Hafey in one of his last engagements said that after recently visiting a youth prison, of the 200 inmates, only 1 was playing a team sport.

First off, I am not Fitzgerald from OX.... don't know who he is....

I mentioned that while all other comps have sides that struggle and finish on the bottom, I am not concerned with them.....I posted about a VAFA Club on the VAFA Board....

I never said that Chadstone was a bad club behavior wise, just that winning 2 games out of your last 80 with seemly no respite ahead does not bode well for the future of this club......Perhaps "black mark" was a poor choice of words, but hardly a cheap shot.....I started this tread to get a discussion going about how "we" as a league, can help Chadstone rise off the bottom and be a club that competes not just merely exists.....

 

[gatorboy]

As the old adage goes, you are only as strong as your weakest link.....And though the VAFA is the strongest Local Comp going around, Chadstone remains a black mark against the League...with just 2 wins in their last 5 seasons, what has been done or can be done to at least make them at least semi-competitive? I know every Comp needs someone to finish bottom every year, but something needs to be done when it's the same side year after year, almost never winning or even close to winning a game....

Without knowing the club at all (only seen 1 game), I can't imagine they have much ability in keeping young, fit and reliable talent. Which means each year they can only get players that either have little to no talent or talent with no desire to work hard or be a good team player. Or older players way past their prime who just enjoy a kick and a beer (not always in that order).....Or a decent coach with the patience to attempt to change what I imagine is a poor culture and defeatist attitude.....

Without winning games, it's very hard for a club to get good players, and without good players, it's almost impossible to win games....So how does Chadstone break the cycle? I have an idea...

Do what St Francis Xavier did, go backwards to come forward....drop out of Div 4 and play a couple of seasons in the Clubbies, recruit or keep 35-40 committed players, and develop a winning culture... that way you don't have to merge with another club, and each week you only have to find 24 players instead of 44, so you can be more selective of who plays and who doesn't.......surely the best 24 players currently at Chadstone could win 5+ games in Club XVIII(B) in 2016?? And that would be a good starting point...What has the Club got to lose???

"Without knowing the club at all".... yep you are a goose.
Good on Chadstone for having a go. Let them play D4 and give 40+ footballers a game each week.

 

[Just a Footballer]

"Without knowing the club at all".... yep you are a goose.
Good on Chadstone for having a go. Let them play D4 and give 40+ footballers a game each week.

Do you know the inner workings of every club you comment on Gatorboy? no body does....Ask anyone with the barest knowledge of sport what they think of a club that has won just 2 games in the last 80 and if they think the club is going well?? what do you think their answer would be? While "having a go" is admirable, surely the point of competition is to play to the best of your best ability and improve each and every day? Would you say Chadstone are doing this? if it was just one season I wouldn't comment, but 5+ seasons of little to no improvement in on field results should at least inspire some discussion about where they are heading shouldn't it???

FYI, I asked for and offered suggestions on how to improve a fellow club in our great League, to which you decided you would rather resort to name calling....

 

[gatorboy]

Do you know the inner workings of every club you comment on Gatorboy? no body does....Ask anyone with the barest knowledge of sport what they think of a club that has won just 2 games in the last 80 and if they think the club is going well?? what do you think their answer would be? While "having a go" is admirable, surely the point of competition is to play to the best of your best ability and improve each and every day? Would you say Chadstone are doing this? if it was just one season I wouldn't comment, but 5+ seasons of little to no improvement in on field results should at least inspire some discussion about where they are heading shouldn't it???

FYI, I asked for and offered suggestions on how to improve a fellow club in our great League, to which you decided you would rather resort to name calling....

I am not the one calling for Chadstone to stop fielding two sides. I have great respect for Chadstone and their coach who is very experienced in our great league

 

[The Valeyard]

Chadstone should go back to clubbies in 2016.

As much as I respect the committee for keeping the club alive for the past 6-7 seasons the only way forward is to go back.

Mt Lilydale have done this successfully on several occassions.

Chadstone need to start developing a winning culture and the only way to do that is in the clubbies.

 

[Just a Footballer]

I am not the one calling for Chadstone to stop fielding two sides. I have great respect for Chadstone and their coach who is very experienced in our great league

I too have respect for Chadstone, and the players who front up week in, week out knowing their chances of winning a game are slim to none.... how nice would it be for the best 20-25 players to play in a side that wins 5+ games in one year?? i know just playing footy is great, but winning once every 2 and a half years can't be that enjoyable can it??? look at SFX, almost folded in March due to lack of numbers and now 5 months later have a flag to fly......it might only be a Clubbies flag (not knocking them), but that gives you something to build on for the future.....hopefully that will lead them back into the Divisions

 

[Brad Goodman]

Chadstone should go back to clubbies in 2016.

As much as I respect the committee for keeping the club alive for the past 6-7 seasons the only way forward is to go back.

Mt Lilydale have done this successfully on several occassions.

Chadstone need to start developing a winning culture and the only way to do that is in the clubbies.

If they've done it on several occasions could you really call it successful?

 

[Mounzer11]

Sometimes just playing the game is all that matters....

Who defines success? IMO, success is purely defined as to what your club is trying to achieve.

 

[Max Leader]

Sometimes just playing the game is all that matters....

Who defines success? IMO, success is purely defined as to what your club is trying to achieve.

Look at Scotch

 

[Rooster 24]

Chadstone should go back to clubbies in 2016.

As much as I respect the committee for keeping the club alive for the past 6-7 seasons the only way forward is to go back.

Mt Lilydale have done this successfully on several occassions.

Chadstone need to start developing a winning culture and the only way to do that is in the clubbies.

I tend to disagree. Mount Lilydale and SFX at least have a school base from which to re-build. Chadstone on the other hand have no such luxury and are located in an area already over subscribed with football clubs. Reducing from 2 sides to 1 could be the death of them.

A couple of suggestions - easier said then done but try and form some sort of alignment with a junior club in the area. Salesian College is 2 decent drop punts away. As I understand it very few Salesian students end up at St Marys these days with the bulk being locals or graduates from Ashy juniors who don’t end up at their old boys clubs. One of the all time greats from my club is a Salesian old boy and the Ambrose brothers from OX were originally from Salesian. While the guns will always want to play at higher level my point is the school produces plenty of good footballers that already play together in a structured inter school competition. Notwithstaing there might be issues with the name I see a real opportunity here. The actual school is based in Chadstone so ‘Salesian Chadstone’ has a nice ring to it and by coincidence the school colors are not that disimilar to Chadstone's. Waverley Sec and Ashwood Sec are enormous schools and while I realise it would take some effort that might also be an option. Kew has successfully tapped into Box Hill sec so speak to Ian Aitken and see how he did that. Surely it cant hurt.

I absolutely dip my lid to them and hope they have some success. Aside from the ‘black mark’ comment, which was rightfully has retracted, I think the topic is fair enough but clubbies is not the answer.

 

[Just a Footballer]

Sometimes just playing the game is all that matters....

Who defines success? IMO, success is purely defined as to what your club is trying to achieve.

So what is Chadstone trying to achieve? surely just 2 wins wasn't in their 5 year plan at the end of 2010....

I know that sometimes success is more than just W/L, but 2 wins in 5 years can't be judged a success in anyones book....

 

[Canada]

I too think this is a reasonable topic and discussion. Rooster has nailed it. Although I hope he doesn't crow about it. Need to align themselves somewhere and with someone. A non school club like Chaddy can't go back to clubbies and expect to survive.

 

[bigwaz]

This thread is an abomination.... They have two senior sides, a FIDA team, and potentially a ladies side next year. So their seniors aren't winning games... big deal.

 

[Peptide]

Clubbies would be the death of them - it would be almost impossible to recruit another 30 players if and when they decided to go back into the comp - if that was the aim.

I would assume, like other perennial D4 clubs that attitude to pre-season, consistent attendance at training and a real will to win would certainly make difference to the win/loss record. I've seen them quite a few times and their best 10 players are as good (or almost) as any going around.

In the end, the success of any club is driven by player attitude to the cause. You can get the best coaches, have money in the bank, but it all amounts to nothing if the players aren't all on the same page.

 

[Just a Footballer]

This thread is an abomination.... They have two senior sides, a FIDA team, and potentially a ladies side next year. So their seniors aren't winning games... big deal.

An abomination?? A touch dramatic. 2 things.1.you are no obligation to reply to it 2. If it is so bad, ask admin to take it down...no skin off my teeth....I would imagine it's a big deal to the players there that wouldn't mind singing the club song more than once every 900 odd days....

 

[Just a Footballer]

I tend to disagree. Mount Lilydale and SFX at least have a school base from which to re-build. Chadstone on the other hand have no such luxury and are located in an area already over subscribed with football clubs. Reducing from 2 sides to 1 could be the death of them.

A couple of suggestions - easier said then done but try and form some sort of alignment with a junior club in the area. Salesian College is 2 decent drop punts away. As I understand it very few Salesian students end up at St Marys these days with the bulk being locals or graduates from Ashy juniors who don’t end up at their old boys clubs. One of the all time greats from my club is a Salesian old boy and the Ambrose brothers from OX were originally from Salesian. While the guns will always want to play at higher level my point is the school produces plenty of good footballers that already play together in a structured inter school competition. Notwithstaing there might be issues with the name I see a real opportunity here. The actual school is based in Chadstone so ‘Salesian Chadstone’ has a nice ring to it and by coincidence the school colors are not that disimilar to Chadstone's. Waverley Sec and Ashwood Sec are enormous schools and while I realise it would take some effort that might also be an option. Kew has successfully tapped into Box Hill sec so speak to Ian Aitken and see how he did that. Surely it cant hurt.

I absolutely dip my lid to them and hope they have some success. Aside from the ‘black mark’ comment, which was rightfully has retracted, I think the topic is fair enough but clubbies is not the answer.

Thank you Rooster for actually contributing a suggestion...that was the whole point of starting this thread, for people to contribute theirs....I never said mine was right or that it might work, hence why I wrote "idea" instead of "fool proof plan"....I think we can all agree that SOMETHING needs to change, and that the status quo isn't working...

 

[heslop]

Firstly, can everyone stop attacking him, maybe he worded one or two things badly, but the essence of this post wasn't bad. I personally, along with all other would love Chadstone to experience more on field success. I dont think clubbies is the answer. I think having a feeder system, with a dedicated committee and staff is the right answer (im in no way having a crack at their committee or associated other roles). Im not saying there has to be a culture change but some fresh new ideas may be attractive. One small step at a time. However, let me say, i have the deepest respect and admiration for the club. For them to front up each week speaks a lot about this teams character, mateship and love for the game, and for that, this club is worthy of being D4 in the VAFA. Never caused a problem from what i've heard.

 

[Red Ross]

SFX would hardly be something I'd want to be basing a plan on.

Pulling out of a competition on the eve of season as it looked like might be a bit tough for the year and then miraculously being able to have plenty of numbers to cut a swathe through club XVIII (2). Ask any D3 clubs their thoughts on them.

Chaddy season after season, suck it up and get going, fronting up each week, rather than just walking away because it might be a bit tough. Obviously things are not ideal, but it seems they are getting a bit better over the last two years. Closing the gap on defeats (and a cheeky win) and 2's winning a few games as well.

Good luck to them

 

[vafaeye]

SFX would hardly be something I'd want to be basing a plan on.

Pulling out of a competition on the eve of season as it looked like might be a bit tough for the year and then miraculously being able to have plenty of numbers to cut a swathe through club XVIII (2). Ask any D3 clubs their thoughts on them.

Chaddy season after season, suck it up and get going, fronting up each week, rather than just walking away because it might be a bit tough. Obviously things are not ideal, but it seems they are getting a bit better over the last two years. Closing the gap on defeats (and a cheeky win) and 2's winning a few games as well.

Good luck to them

Had a look at SFX Team that played in the C 18 Section 2 Grand Final. 12 Senior players from 2014 including some of their very best players. 8 Reserves players + 6 new. No wonder they won it. VAFA gave them the premiership by not putting them in Clubbies Section 1.

THE EYE
​

 

[Just a Footballer]

Couple of things I'd like to clarify,

1."the black mark" comment. Should of explained this better and from the start. I've played in a few leauges around Victoria, and while none are perfect, I think the VAFA is the best I have come across. Yet I haven't seen a side struggle for so long like Chadstone. There is a side in the Bellerine Leauge (Newcomb) who have haven't won in a couple years, and have a % of 5 this season. Their avg losing margin is over 200 points. The Leauge Admin has had meetings with the club to figure out ways to make them competive, and have been quite vocal in the media about their support. Has our Admin done that? Maybe they have and I haven't read about it. so my "black mark" comment was aimed at the Leauge in General rather than Chadstone as a club. Whenever I speak to old team mates from other leauges about how good and deep the standard is in the Ammo's, they always bring up Chadstone and their record. one mate (from the SFL) even said "you can't be the best leauge in Victoria while you have a side like Chadstone playing in it". this comment was made to me not 2 weeks ago, which lead me to start this thread.

2. My suggestion. While it was based on what SFX did this year, it's for different reasons. My understanding is SFX either had to play in the Clubbies or not at all, due to "lack of Numbers". they have actually done ok in the last couple of years, making finals in '13 and finishing 8-10 last year. Hopefully the Clubbies win will get them enough numbers to re-enter as a full side next season. then it will be a case of 1 step back 2 steps forward for them. Chadstone on the other hand, dropping back to Clubbies would hopefully mean a few more wins, and as the old saying goes, "winning is a habit, so is losing". so a year or 2 in the clubbies with 5+ wins each season should hopefully teach them some winning habits. yes there is a risk it could kill the club, but it's a risk worth at least considering. where will the club be in another 5 years? what if it only wins another 2 games in that time? If you had played there are the last 5 years, and someone said " next year, would you rather play in 15 games for 5 wins, or 18 games for maybe 1 win?, which would you choose? you are still playing for Chadstone and you are still playing 4 Quarters of Football every week.....

 

[schwabby]

Interesting thread.until you have been involved at clubs like chaddy It's hard to make comments that either wont offend someone or show youare not fully aware of a clubs situation.
A few points. A competition wouldnt be judged on the on field winning or losing performance of a club rather moreso how a club conducts itself. Chaddy has no problems in this regard. To say that it cant be a good league with a club like chadstone is ridiculous
CLubbies I can understand all arguments for and against but once a club drops back to one team its hard to rebuild both playing stocks and also build a culture around training commitment support staff social functions etc
AS for chadstone we unfortunately dont have the feeder groups school or juniors so rely heavily on mates of mates. Not being successful also makes it hard to attract or retain players. Something like 50 have left in the last 2 to 3 years for Various reasons. It would be great for just one group of guys to accept a challenge and walk into the club abd help out . Box hill nth are proof of that this year to support their core group who have been there for years good on them.
its not an easy fix and theres still hard times ahead but I am proud of the players who have committed to the club in bloody hard times. Never once do we feel sorry for ourselves the trouble is and many clubs who have been stuck in the same division for years wo finals will know this
losing becomes easy
and its bloody hard to change but we will keep trying to attract players instill the right attitudes and play our hearts out every week knowing we are going to struggle. Thanks to all the positive support over the year from so many people not just in d4.